Vtecne

To whom it may concern,

I am very unhappy and disappointed with my 2004 TL with Navi

My problems so far

1) Horrible Bluetooth, it works when it feels like it.
2) Bad Navi, it works when it feels like it also. So far I have been to the open ocean more than ten times and flown over complete towns more than 20 times while driving my TL.
3) Fading Brakes. Fixed by resurfacing them but now I don’t trust them. The brakes are still unacceptable.
4) Bad tires, the infamous El42 that vibrate in the morning and at night. I went I head and purchased new tires to fix the problem at a cost of $800.
5) Recurring alignment issues. I purchased an alignment contract
6) Chronic cabin noise made by plastic rubbing with each other. “Not fixed” and the dealer won’t do anything about it
7) Ashy faded dashboard. “Not fixed” and the dealer won’t do anything about it.
8) Bad windshield wipers. They stop working without prior warning, I was driving on the highway when a thunder storm hit. When I went to turn the wipers on “Nothing” and now the car has been sitting at the dealer for the past week. This is unacceptable. This is also the straw that broke the camels back. I had it with this car.


I initially purchased the car due to its safety rating, safety features and reliability. I have owned 5 different Hondas that I had purchased brand new (From the Civic Ex to the awesome S2000). My current TL is a joke. In the past 15 years I have never had any major issues with my cars. Honda is about to loose a repeating customer due to the fact that this car keeps having problems. I can not trust the car to be safely used by my wife or my self while transporting our baby daughter. Buyers beware.

Best Regards,

Neil Espendez

3PUTT

sorry to hear all your problems. i, myself, own a 2004 TL 6MT w/ NAV. i am loving every minute of owning it. so far, my nav and my bluetooth works great. i still have the stock brakes. the dashboard has been taken care of with the McGuire's NXT vinyl cleaner. i originally had the HPT tires, which i sold and replaced with the Falken Ziex 512 (245/45/17). i only use them during the winter months. i use my 18" set during the rest of the year. not much rattling here. the only thing that has bothered me is the seatbelt hitting the B pillar which i have fixed by just fastening it while i drive. my wipers have been changed already. the car has seen 2 winters and i replaced them a few months ago.

so, you see, most of your complaints are easily addressed by actually doing something about it. good luck!!

NCSUlax47

waaa

AMIC

Sorry you've had such a bad experience, but just because you had a myriad of problems doesn't mean that you should title your thread buyer beware and try to discourage others from buying a TL. There are tons of people here, including myself who have had no problems. A lot of issues were fixed with the '05s. Sounds like you should visit a different dealer if you're not getting the level of service you expect.

Adobeman

So, not a single thing good about the car ? I seriously doubt that.

1) Horrible Bluetooth, it works when it feels like it.
Document it and get it fixed
2) Bad Navi, it works when it feels like it also. So far I have been to the open ocean more than ten times and flown over complete towns more than 20 times while driving my TL.
Document it and fet it fixed
3) Fading Brakes. Fixed by resurfacing them but now I don’t trust them. The brakes are still unacceptable.
Must not be an MT. In an MT you can crack your skull on the steering wheel if you brake hard
4) Bad tires, the infamous El42 that vibrate in the morning and at night. I went I head and purchased new tires to fix the problem at a cost of $800.
Yes, they suck when they are cold. For like what, 5 whole minutes until they warm up? They are OEM shoes. Get over it.
5) Recurring alignment issues. I purchased an alignment contract
WTF's an "alignment contract"
6) Chronic cabin noise made by plastic rubbing with each other. “Not fixed” and the dealer won’t do anything about it
Document it and fet it fixed
7) Ashy faded dashboard. “Not fixed” and the dealer won’t do anything about it.
Who's not taking care of the interior ?
8) Bad windshield wipers. They stop working without prior warning, I was driving on the highway when a thunder storm hit. When I went to turn the wipers on “Nothing” and now the car has been sitting at the dealer for the past week. This is unacceptable. This is also the straw that broke the camels back. I had it with this car.
Agreed. That shouldn't happen on a new car.

Sounds like your dealer might not be treating you right. Tell them you want do discuss your issues with their district manager directly.

So perspective buyers, do your homwork and remember more "unhappy" owners will post than "happy" owners. When is the last time you called any company's customer servive department to say "I love your product"? Get it ?

Lore

Alignment contract is probably one of thoe deals where they will perform an alignment on your car anytime you need one for the life of the vehicle.

Ashy faded dashboard - the easiest way to take care of this is to get some Aerospace 303. It makes it look FANTASTIC after a little application.

ElmerHiggins

Those are some major issues and Acura surely needs to own up to them, I agree, the service level of acura dealerships is very lacking. learn from lexus!

Pro Stock John

Good luck on your next purchase. TL is a very nice car maybe you need a $55K Mercedes to be happy.

Vtecne

Good Idea....

Vtecne

Thank you all for your inputs and some of the sarcasm. I guess I expected too much from Acura. I love my TL but it has too many problems. I should have had waited for the 05 instead of buying the 04. Or even better yet for the 05 RL. In the past Honda/Acura never failed me but now its reputation is in question in my eyes. It does not mean that all Hondas and Acuras are bad but it seems I got a car made on a Friday at 4:30 PM when closing time was at 5:00 PM.

loud_whispers

Okay. number one..

half of the problems you listed were rattles and interior complaints. Probably so slight and are deaf to the naked ear.

Alignment issues-
How scratched are your rims? How many curb marks do you have on them? tell me the truth.. I bet there's a curb on every wheel. How many potholes have you hit? Is there alot of road crown where you live? Ok well, all of these things play as factors of alignment issues with ANY CAR.. The tires may not be the greatest, but 80% of the time.. the tire and alignment issues are caused solely by the driver.

Fading brakes-
What the hell do you mean "you don't trust them"? How the hell can you not trust them? Would they fail state inspection? NO.. Because you heard a little squeek? or you had a pulsation at the brake pedal and steering wheel? Well, if you had the pulsation, then do NOT blame it on the brakes themselves..you must drive ride the brakes like a 15 year old girl on the corners of downtown atlantic city. That's another DRIVER ERROR that causes parts to fail..

Bad windshield wipers-
Okay well that should be addressed as warrantable.

Ashy faded dashboard-
Was you dashboard "ashy and faded" when you bought it? Probably not, because otherwise you wouldnt have bought it. You park directly in the sun too much GET A WINDSHIELD VISOR to prevent the sunlight from ruining the dash. Or get your windows tinted if they are legal in your state. And use treatment on the interior more often. Will happen with any car if you don't maintenence it.

Horrible bluetooth-
Get a more compatible phone.
Every other car make has problems with bluetooth.. Don't blame acura alone.

Bad Navi-
I work on these cars everyday. deal with them everyday. I havent seen too many Navi problems at all. If you do have a Navi problem, then your either not using it right, or it has a defect, GET IT FIXED.



ALL OF THESE AREN'T MAJOR ISSUES.
Go buy a FORD and come back to me. Tell me how safe you feel in those cars. Im an Acura tech.. this is the only time i get to give you STUCK UP, SNOTTY NOSED customers a real piece of my mind. You don't know how many times i would love to let some of these customers have it because of all their complaining about these STUPID problems.

Like i said, go buy a domestic made car and come back with what your comparison is. I would take these stupid ass complaints over any of the recalls that those cars have.

good luck buddy.
I would love to be able to afford a TL.

Greg-ster

You're the type of person that makes me hate my acura dealer.

This is the only place where I can give service advisors a piece of my mind. Asshole.

WDP05EBONY

When you take into account the price of the vehicle in comparision to a similarly equipped high end vehicle it is a bargain even if there are a few rattles.
Why is it that some customers are getting their EL42 tires replaced under warranty for the flat spot issue and some aren't?

Vtecne

First of all I live inSouth FL not potholes and no curb rash on my rims (I know how to park and drive). What exit are you from? NJ streets are full of pots holes not here.

Fadding brakes were because the rotors were warped by a manufacturing defect.

Bad wipper module should never happen to a new car. That might be acceptable to you ....but
Not me.


I park in a Garage at home and at work... keep assuming dumb stuff. You know what assuming means?

Bad Navi also unacceptable. It happens once in a while and it's hard to replicate the issue.

If you want my TL so bad I sell it to you at trade in value. PM if interested. I am Serious it's not a joke. It has 21k antracite out/ gray int. 5AT Navi.

Best Regards,

Neil Espendez

WDP05EBONY

I took a look as to the trade in value on kbb.com. After entering the mileage and rating the vehicle as poor condition as you have stated, the resale value according to kelly blue book is an actual "trade in value" is "no value". Is that offer still open?

Vtecne

Funny...

nikko

Vtecne is right! Why should we put up with all these problems after we payed so much money to get a better quality car?
Some of the problems vtecne listed here were part of my 6 month old TL as well!
These problems shouldn't be here in the first place! If Acura will not address them soon enough, more and more people will walk away from these cars....btw I just traded in my 2005 TL a few days ago....among other things I couldn't take anymore the symphony of rattles.....I am free now...no TL for me ever again!

DMZ

I have to agree 1000% with you on #6 !!!

They were part of my roof rattle issues for which I've had a total of 8 dealer visits in the 1st year alone. Now after 14 months, I too am experiencing these plastic rubbing against each other noises throughout the interior. And as of last week, the orchestra has been joined by the passenger seat headrest rubbing against the seat. It's really quite annoying, disheartening, and blatently obvious that Acura had to cut corners on the assembly line to offer a car with everything the TL's got for the price.

I got rid of an '89 Honda Accord SE-i Coupe last year (bought brand new) which had no where near the # of rattle nor plastic rubbing issues........EVEN AFTER 15 YEARS AND 142,000 MILES!!! Furthermore, the aftermarket ASC sunroof I put in it not only auto-closed when you turned the ignition off, but suffered only TWO rattles in all that time...from nothing more than loose screws.
.
.
.
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mark 3M bra man

I work with many dealers in the STL area with my clear bras. I do the work coordinating with service dept. It makes me feel good that one of the service dept. that have the least cars being worked on is Acura/Honda. I see most of the service dept. packed with customers dropping off the cars for service including BMW, Merc, Porsche, Lexus, domestics. They all have problems. If you have problems, it seems that if you would have something else, you would not. But, the grass is always on the other side.

Nonetheless, it is not an excuse for not having the issues fixed.

By the way, it seems to me like you need to change your Acura service center.

mio

Acura should really think about its quality!

loud_whispers

you guys really need to shop around and look at other make/model vehicle recalls.
You people pay $35k for a car with a rattle issue? Most other recalls and TSB on other makes are life threatening.

I can see people bitching about paying 35k for a car with suspension issues.
overheating issues, transmission issues(like older TL's).

BMW is a non-stop issue. Lot's of TSB's and complaints from customers. Porsche, Jaguar, Saab with their loss of brake assist because the check valves malfunction..

you guys need to think about that.
Complaints of rattles.. you really have to listen to how petty you people are..

As a service technician, sometimes they get a little annoying.. most of the time we can fix the rattle or whatever noise you're hearing.. sometimes we can't.. The ones that we can't fix are very slight and cannot often be duplicated. It's so faint that people like myself who owns a 2001 integra cannot notice.

There should be no question on Acura's quality. It's the best damn car you can get for your money IMO.

you people take our car's for granted. They are highly advanced machines. Maybe they slacked a little on the interior rattles because they were busy building a 270hp V6 that gets awesome gas mileage and is ULEV. The tighteness of the steering and suspension. How well it takes turns and handles.

you guys seem to be concerned with RATTLES?

come on..
spare me.
turn the radio up and enjoy it's ride.

loud_whispers

i wish you luck with your next car, because if your complaining of TL issues..then just wait and expect "the whole other world" of problems involving other dealers and model makes. Your the type of person that thinks NOTHING is good enough.

So you might as well start putting down every other make of car before you actually see what the car's like.

good luck buddy..
BTW what is the trade in value for it?

Vtecne

28K to 29K

Vtecne

chill_dog

I think most people here would agree that the TL is a great car...that's why we bought it. The fact that the TSB's for the TL are for rattles vs. exploding spark plugs or something, I think, is a testament to how good of a car it really is...no serious problems.

However, rattles can get annoying. The once-in-a-blue-moon ones I have I can live with...it's the constant ones that bother me. If I'm forced to have my windows up, I have a constant rattle from the left tweeter and instrument panel...every pebble in the road sets them off. Ever see Office Space? It's like the big fat lady that answers the phone and puts everyone on hold with the same line and tone all day long. Not a serious problem, but annoying as hell.

philipKY

khungerf

I love the TL and do not have rattles right now. .only 500 miles.
However, should the car develop consistent rattles then I expect them fixed. Other cars that cost 35k do not rattle . .I have driven a few.

You act like people take their car for granted but we spent A LOT of $$ money on it. .we are not taking the car for granted we want the car to behave/sound like we spent 35k on it.

When a service person does not think fixing a rattle in 1 year old car is important then they are taking my 35k for granted. .and I worked damn hard for that money.

Ok. .off the soap box now. .sorry. .

-Lee

nikko

BMW quality problems? C'mon man you're kidding me....haven't you read latest JD Power and Assoc. overall quality report ?
BMW is on 3rd place while Acura is on 10th (even behind Hyunday).
I wouldn't hold my breath on Acura quality...it's not what it used to be.

oncesir

Those surveys leave alot to be desired for accuracy. EVERY car is gonna have an issue or 2 upon release. I am also an Acura tech and I see first hand what the TL's probs are. One thing that definitely makes a difference is the dealer. I have test drove a few TL's for rattles that required removing dashboard parts to fix. But I guarantee that BMW and MB all have the same problems. The TL is far from a "stay away" model of new cars. If you think Honda/Acura has quality probs go buy a GM product. You will appreciate every day in your Acura.

UCONNTL

My boyfriend's father is on his 3rd 745 in 3 years. The latest car has turned its' windshield wipers on at a speed faster than the highest speed on the knob, indicated that all 4 tires were flat at the same time (when they weren't), and set off other false alerts in the car. He had to turn the car off and back on 2 times before it was back to normal. For the past 2 months his cruise control hasn't worked. The dealership needs a special tool to fix it, which they do not have and cannot locate at any other dealership in the area. Could you imagine spending over $80,000 on a car and not have cruise control and then have the BMW service reps tell you they can't fix it?

Every manufacturer has its' problems. It's just that the bad ones are talked about and that's what people see. If every TL owner posted daily about how their car was functioning - whether it be good or not so good - I think that would make it more realistic as to how the ratio of problems to no problems actually is.

I do agree that the service dept should listen to the customer and not automatically assume rattles are "normal." I would recommend finding another service dept or maybe giving Acura a call to see if they say that the problems you're experiencing (wipers, NAV, etc.) are "normal." Good luck.

SSMTL04

I love the car. Yes I hear rattles going over some bumps, but thats not gonna kill you.

The only thing that pisses me off are the TIRES!!!!!!!!!!!!! HOW MUCH WORST CAN THEY GET??? THEY ABSOLUTELY SUCK. Thats an issue Acura needs to address. I'm going to try to have my Acura dealer replace my tires with the Pirellis PZero Nero M+S. I'd be willing to play the difference.

Other than the tires, the TL is a great car and everyone should just sit back and enjoy it=)

Donte99TL

I have an 04 5at navi and love it. No major problem at all. But I am sorry to hear about your problems. Hope you get them fixed and get something you like. good luck.

mxtt

What an asshole.

The Chad

I'm researching getting a TL, and I have some comments.

I currently own a Honda S2000, and lately the rattles in it, especially when the top is up, is getting quite annoying. With this car, the suspension is so stiff and the roads are so bad around here that the car is literally rattling itself to pieces. The build quality is excellent, and the car is superb, but it wasn't meant or built for the daily driving that it does, so even though it's a 32 grand car, I don't say much. Besides, I drive with the top down 90% of the time.

In switching to a TL, I'm looking for a luxury-sport car. I want something that'll be comfortable on long trips, but relatively sporty, and quick on the fast highways that I occasionally drive.

The TL is an excellently equipped car. However, I would expect a car of this caliber to not have the rattles that come with an economy car. Acura is supposed to be Honda'a premium brand. They are supposed to be set apart from Hondas not only with premium price, be a better, more refined car. That's difficult for Honda to do because Hondas are all fantastic cars built exceptionally well.

I'm upset that one Acura tech on here is calling the average TL driver a rich snob, and talks about how the should enjoy the engine of their car instead of worrying about such things as rattles. Well, I personally don't think the engine in the TL is anything special. It doesn't have Honda's i-VTEC technology as of yet, and doesn't rev to the sky like a 4-cylinder VTEC engine would. The engine in my S2000 is absolutely fantastic. If you're looking for a performance Honda, that's the car to get. People don't buy the TL for all performance. They want a refined ride and some quality creature comforts. On a new car, you shouldn't have to "turn up the radio" to solve the problem. Now, if the rattle is hardly perceived, then yes, the owner is nitpicking, but if it's loud and obnoxious, then he/she has a right to complain about it.

It's funny, because I've also been hanging out in the TSX forum, and they don't complain nearly as much about rattles. Is it because TSX owners are generally younger, and don't tend to nitpick about things as much? Or is it because it's assembled in Japan, and the TL is assembled about 30 minutes from my house?

Rattles are easy to hide in a loud car like an S2000, especially with the top down and radio up. In an enclosed car without much outside noise, they become much more noticeable.

If all people have to complain about are rattles, then Honda is building a damn good car here. But people need to realize this isn't a sports car, and with so many mentioning rattles (even if they aren't complaining about it), maybe it's something to be addressed?

Sure, every manufacturer has it's problems. Look at Mercedes-Benz build quality lately. If anyone is going to get it right first, it'll be the Japanese (either Honda, Nissan, or Toyota).

I just think we all need to calm down. The thread was meant to get under the skin of people and is a medium for the owner to vent his frustration.

Rick-H

I have had my 04 TL for 14 months. . . I took it back to the Acura dealer ONE time-- for its first oil change. Not one problem. I still feel the "quality" of the TL is not as good as my previous car (a Lexus)-- but it really has been trouble free so far, and it's more fun to drive than the Lexus. Would I'd buy another TL:-- probably not. . . maybe an RL or back to a Lexus. But I have no complaints about the TL. (other than the key/key fob)

DMZ

I too have had my TL for 14 months. EIGHT dealer visits for roof rattles, 2 for vibration buzzes coming from the dash & A pillar rattles - replacement of the seat memory module & driver's side tail light assembly........total of TEN altogether combined. I still have to go back for a new rattle that started within the last month that sounds like a bottle of pills shaking around on the right of the passenger compartment - perhaps the glove box area PLUS the friction sound of the passenger headrest rubbing against the seat when I have a passenger, and https://acurazine.com/forums/showpos...99&postcount=7. Then there's https://acurazine.com/forums/showpos...4&postcount=18

Uaddawise....da car's jusssssssst fine

ediddy

well since the car is made here i think that where is the quality can be an issue.....as far as rattles goes i have not experienced that...but I can say the stock tires are bad and would recommend replacing them when they wear out......that is one part of the car where honda saved their money is on the tire choice.......but overall the car is awesome has good power, looks killer, and you gets lots of car for your money......and people are right if the car rattles really loud then that should be addressed.........i think the people assembling the car here in the good ol USA should pay more attention to quality assurance.......love my acuras!

nick04tl

i agree with you a 100%. there are so many complainers. i am an acura tech also but i also own an 04tl 6spd. we have such a good stereo system but i guess a lot of tl owners prefer to drive around with no radio. i have gone on numerous road tests with customers for sometimes noises that i need to break out the chassis ears to be able to find and hear. it gets old after a while. i could see if you have a somewhat loud noise that you can hear when the radio is on then i have no problem fixing it. that would be really annoying.

i think acuras quality is a lot better then say a bmw audi vw. and it is probably the same as infiniti. i have worked for a couple of these car lines so i can knowledge to back it up. when i was at infiniti all i did was recalls on the g35 back in 03. i believe it was like 5 different recalls. so in that respect the tl's safety quality is far superior to the g35. the one thing that is common accros the board is rattles so what ever car you buy it is prone to rattling. i have fixed rattles at every dealer i have worked at.

taschroth

For the dash use 303 Protectant found at ACE HArdware. Will NOT make it shiney and WILL restore factory color and one application lasted a year so far! The finish will even out in a day or two after application, be patient!

IT WORKS GREAT! Do NOT use Armor All!

jcle225

Okay, people like you make me hate my dealership. I understand both sides, you as the tech hear clients complaining all day will make anyone lose their minds. Then again, for the clients, we work hard for these cars, and want to be sure these cars are in top notch condition and that it was worth each penny.

jcle225

sorry to post in this thread again, but i just read your input..if you were in front of me right now i'd shake your hand. Well said my friend.