drjoe

I switched to synthetic oil during my last change, and my maintenance minder is now suggesting it's time for A12 service. It has only been about 3 months (maybe 3000 miles). My question is, this is about how long it takes for the maintenance minder to come on with regular oil -- does the maintenance minder take into account synthetic and should I obey it?

BG74

I don't think the maintenance minder has any idea what oil is in the engine. Also, it doesn't monitor oil quality (as in a BMW)...it's solely based upon mileage and some algorythm that calculates driving style.

I'd just ignore the MID when it comes to synthetic oil changes. I like to change mine every 4000 miles, regardless of conditions or what the MID says.

Bearcat94

Please explain how the Maint Minder would know what kind of oil you're using.


:troutslap

blueracer17

It doesn't.

drjoe

right, my idea here was simply that it was actually minding oil quality, rather than just running a proxy for mileage.

so, is that what everyone with synthetic is doing -- ignoring the minder and just going on mileage? and if so, how many miles before a switch?

and does the frequency of oil changes affect the warranty at all?

01tl4tl

the book says 7500 miles so as long as you do that you are covered
Keep those receipts and log it on your acura.com account
Most synthetic users are going 7500, or more with analysis-
gen2 mod fsttyms1 goes 12-15k miles on synthetic all the time and at 200k his engine looked new inside

Bearcat94

Here's what my book says:


2007 Owners Manual Pg 284.

https://techinfo.honda.com/rjanisis/...707O00283A.pdf


Are we using the same book?

BTW - I have no issues with extended intervals with Synthetic. I'm just not sure if there's a difference between your "book" and my "book" and which more "official".

drjoe

so, what are we saying here? two questions:

1. what is kosher for the warranty?
2. what are people doing who use synthetic -- do you heed the minder, and if not, then what?

vinnier6

iTrader: (1)

what book says 7500 miles...i have looked everywhere in my 07 book and all it says is follow the mid...i know my accord said every 7500 miles and that was with conventional oil...i used mobil one and i changed oil every 10k...i plan on doing this with my type s, but for now it only has 1500 miles on it and the mid says 80% life left...when i do make the switch i will reset the mid when the time comes...

Bearcat94

I did find in the Gen2 Owners Manual a 7500 mile Oil Change Interval.

The 2007 Owners Manual is pretty clear - whether using Synthetic or not, follow the MID.

drjoe

yeah, follow the minder is what mine says.

but if the car isn't actually monitoring oil quality, but just going on miles for the most part, then it would seem to be quite a waste to switch to synthetic.

also, if i am doing my own oil change, or air filters for that matter, how do i "prove" that i've done this on schedule to preserve the warranty?

Bearcat94

Although I don't know the MID Maint algorithm, my guess is it uses the following:

- Number of Engine Revoluitons
- Temp
- Mileage
- Avg Speed

Possibly others. In combination you should be able to discern between, say, Lots of Highway miles at moderate temperature and Lots of City/Stop-and-Go miles in high temperatures.

The former (highway miles) would probably trigger service later than the Stop-and-Go driver.

SodaLuvr

Synthetic oil doesn't always extend the oil change interval, contrary to popular belief on internet forums.

Depending on the driving conditions, the oil may have to be changed at the same interval anyway due to contaminants.

vinnier6

iTrader: (1)

Thats bs...synthetic oil if far superior to conventional motor oil, and i cant think of a driving condition that wouldnt allow me to extend the drain time of my oil...

NedShneebly

I will say the TL manual's maintenance section is lacking data in a way that almost ties you two the dealership service department and the MID reminder.

My 03 Pilot's maintenance section lists exactly what should be performed at a specific time/mileage interval. It even has seperate columns for normal and "Extreme" (Florida) environments.

sixsixfour

I use synthetic and have followed the MID to a point - I change the oil at around 15-20% oil life remaining. with that, I changed oil 3 times this year.

Bearcat94

It doesn't tie you to the dealer so much as it ties you to the MID. Most (all?) of the maint items are listed, just in a different way and in multiple places - the Owners Manual, Acura Owners Link, etc.

Your '03 Pilot does Maint "the old way". The Gen2 Acura TL has the same type of Maint section (miles/time, service; Normal and Severe Schedules).

The fact is Engines are, generally, more efficient and durable now than ever before. If you don't *need* to change your oil every 3,000 miles, why spend the time and/or $$ to do so?

Won't be long and we'll all have sensors actually measuring fluid health and recommending change intervals. IIRC, BMW has or soon will have something like this on the market.

drjoe

so then, is there really a meaningful advantage to switching to synthetic?

SodaLuvr

It isn't. Synthetic oil does provide superior oxidation resistance compared to conventional oil and sometimes contains a more advanced additive package. However contaminates such as condensation and fuel dilution are huge problems with short trip driving and both synthetic and conventional oil will need to be replaced on a more frequent basis. Even if you do not operate the vehicle under such service, be aware that some engines may have issues with fuel dilution and as a result, substantially shorten the life of the engine oil due to the fuel that gets dumped into the oil.

Not unless you are operating the vehicle in a way that would raise oil temperatures to beyond what conventional oil can handle. Track use is probably when I'd use synthetic oil.

Only under condition where I'd consider using synthetic oil was if I lived in an area where it remained < 0F for

vinnier6

iTrader: (1)

its all about suspension...and synthetic motor oil can suspend contaminants much better than conventional...

the great motor oil debate has been on for many years...i have been using mobil one for 20 years...you should use whatever oil you like...

SodaLuvr

I'll use whatever oil the OEM did the validation testing on, and that would be the latest API rated conventional oil.

It may suspend it, but the oil is still damaged from those contaminants and its ability to protect has been compromised.

vinnier6

iTrader: (1)

the api can bite me...so can the epa for that matter...

SodaLuvr

So you trust the crooks at the additive company?

I don't think a lot of people understand and appreciate the amount of work that OEMs and the EPA do to ensure the quality of the licensed and/or approved products on the shelf. They constantly monitor the products and test them for formulation changes that may affect performance.

You do not get the same protection from an unlicensed product.

vinnier6

iTrader: (1)

...they are all goverment run with their hands out looking for more money....i trust the race track...

SodaLuvr

???

I'm not seeing the connection.

I hate cars

For what it's worth, I run Amsoil synthetic and use their EAO20 filter. I still follow the maintenance minder but if for some reason I go over by a small amount I don't sweat it like I would on a dino. I'm still not convinced all the small contaminates floating around won't do some damage, that's why I don't take it out to the 35,000 or 25,000 mile (depending on which oil I'm using) OCI that Amsoil claims. Take it for what it's worth... The synthetic is still lubricating well past the OCI I'm sure, but in suspension or not, I don't want contaminates in my oil.

darksom1

Pennzoil Platinum Plus, K&N filter every 5K! MM or not!

blueracer17

Royal Purple, Pure One filter every 5000 miles. I have to ask, why is the MOD being so confrontational? Seems like he wants us all to do what he does. You do things your way, I'll do things my way and more than likely our cars will die about the same time (under normal driving conditions). Engines are not the weekness in todays cars.

antlive

I used moble one on my 2nd gen tl and I always changed my oil around 9.5k to 10k and I put 200k+ on it and it was still running like new... I'm using moble one in my 3rd gen tl and I think I will stil follow the same routine..

timmahh

I got yelled at for using a K&N oil filter

But.. 10/22/07 changed to Mobil 1 synthetic; 12/23/07 changed oil again [still mobil 1 5w-20 synthetic]

so like.. 2 months and i had to change the oil?!?!?!!?

I do drive alot.. about 12k miles since July 31st when I got the TL

I hate cars

You guys running the 5-20 might want to look at the reason our cars are spec'd for the light oil in this country. Hint....CAFE and the .5mpg difference it makes. Compare it to what the same car runs in Europe. For a relatively warm climate I wouldn't think of running the 5-20. I'll probably run a 10-40 when summer comes around.

antlive

me too, y did someone yell at you? also, y did you change it so quickly, was it because of the maintance minder?

timmahh

Yeah.. Maint. Minder told me it was time for B2 service; I got in trouble because i'm not using OEM parts that were designed for the car, and should the K&N oil filter fail and cause a problem it won't be covered under warranty

Brettg

What ever happend to Michael Wan the oil guru?

He said syntethetic oil was a waste in the TL, its all in the additive package.
Some of the oils he liked (from analisys results) were havoline, mororcraft synthetic blend, and others.

I have been using the mobil 1 filter and the havoline oil and changing it at about 20% on the mid, that has always been around 4 to 5 thousand miles I think.

Running synthetic and changing it at 3000 or 4000 miles is just a huge waste of money in my book, and how many people really expect to have the TL to 300,000 miles on it?
The old camery had 220,000 miles of collage kid abuse (no oil, no oil changes, overheating, etc) when we SOLD it to another collage kid, it did not smoke, burn or leak oil.
So if people can drive around with a quart (not reading on dip stick) and have the motor go past 220,000 miles, what happens if you just keep oil in it (any type) and change it every 5000 miles?

Turbo cars need synthetic, and race cars maybe...

Does anyone know of anyone who actualy wore out a motor?
Not something breaking, not some defect, but wore a motor out when they had regular oil changes?

I had a friend with a real long commute, who had 300,000 miles on a buick before it was paid off, and it did not smoke or burn oil...

Brett

I hate cars

I run a good synthetic for several reasons. It flows better at cold temps, requires less VIIs for a multi-weight comparable to multi-weight dinos, and holds up longer. I change synthetic according to the maintainence minder usually unless I'm extremely bored. The first few changes with dino oil I changed at 50% and 0%. I absolutely don't run a 20wt because it's only for CAFE standards and I don't mind losing .5mpg for a longer lasting motor. I'm probably going the try the German Castrol next time since it has a higher HTHS number or even a 10-40 this summer.

These days the motor usually outlasts the car but my luck is so bad I'm not giving the motor any excuse to fail. I have $150 worth of fluid in the transmission, a filter, and a cooler. Might not be worth it but it helps me sleep better at night. Maybe it's my OCD lol.