tmandel

Not sure I understand why the fix would be temporary. Does a good solder joint go bad?

edit: I'm not doubting -- just wondering....

samc777

Well its been a week and is used everyday for conference calls on the way to work, so far so good. If it fails again I plan to reflow some of the larger solder joints by hand as I suspect that the problem will be found at the solder pads.

I have a good feeling about this one. As I mentioned above it was obvious that the solder had reflowed over the entire board on both sides. I would suspect that those people who have a failure after a month or so did not get a good reflow when they baked the card in the oven. When baking the card an accurate thermometer is a must and you must also visually confirm that the solder is melted. Most home ovens have very poor temperature control and swings of 25 to even 40 degs F are common. A non contact laser thermometer will help and is available at the usual tool shops for around $30.

Next report will happen after one month but I'm ready to call this one a fix!

Dave

YeuEmMaiMai

RoHS forced a reformulation of solder that is not nearly as flexible as the old lead solder is. Over time due to lack of flexibility, the joints will crack and eventually fail. the fix is to re-solder the joints and then the HFL will work again for a time. The REAL fix is to locate the failed area and remove the new crap and re-solder it with lead based solder.

This is the same issue that caused the original Xbox 360s to start dropping like flies

samc777

Couldn't agree more with you!!

I looked all over mine trying to discover where the solder break(s) may have been but no luck, couldn't find it. However I would be willing to spend some troubleshooting time on a failed unit if someone has one to donate to the cause. If you have one sitting around gathering dust that you are willing to part with let me know. I have read that Acura now charges then pays back $50 per unit as a core charge on all new purchases so I may not get any offers but lets wait and see. Somebody somewhere has got to have an old one sitting in their toolbox???

Dave

sockr1

iTrader: (5)

I removed mine and have it laying around. Would you be willing to troubleshoot it and send it back if you do find a better fix? I would pay for shipping both ways of course and if you damage it no big deal I'm not buying another one so don't need the core charge.

Mne has already been repaired once via Joel at Godin Tech but it failed again after 8 months and then drained my battery

samc777

Godin Tech appears to have a very good repair record based upon what I have learnt so far and I was sorta thinking that they would know where the exact solder failure is occurring.

I now have two spare failed HFL units that I obtained locally so I'm ok for now. I'll let you know how it goes.

Dave

sockr1

iTrader: (5)

please let me know what you find out!

mraurora

I'm curious what you find as well.

samc777

Ok folks, so the story continues.

Sorry to report that after ~2 months or so my "cooked in the oven" HFL unit once again became intermittent. I had great hopes but as many others reported, mine also became flakey.

So I bit the bullet and purchased a new HFL unit from an online Acura Dealer. Price $256 plus a $50 core charge. Shipping $8.

Installed and setup and it has been perfect. Used daily for business use and works flawlessly. A simple job that anyone can do with an aptitude for mechanical issues.

So that is it. The oven fix failed. Since Acura is now accepting the failed core units I would guess that somebody has figured out exactly what chip is failing. If we could find out that info then a DIY fix would be possible for those able to solder small SMT chips.

Dave

Abeyance

Sorry to resurrect this thread, but I'm struggling to find the right part number for a 2007 TL (Base w/ Nav).

The above mention 04397-SEP-305ZA number is found on all the parts sites, but the price is close to or over $600 and no one has a picture of what you're getting, so I don't even know if that's the right part.

I did a search for "Telephone Assembly" and that leads to part 39770-SEP-A12ZB, which is around $250. That's closer to the cost many were quoting, but based on the parts image, it looks like this is for two trim pieces.

I saw something related to searching for "CONTROL UNIT, HCI", but that appears to be a part of the headlight system..?

I pulled my unit out and the only numbers on it are 1402915C03W806 (on the connector) and HFT07-013a (on the back side), neither of which produce results on the parts sites.

I guess I'll go try heating this thing with a heat gun or baking it in the oven, but I'd honestly prefer to just get a new one if I could figure out what to order. Any help in that direction will be greatly appreciated!

Superunknown

I don't know what that first number is about. It isn't linked to any vehicles or diagrams on the usual OEM part vendor sites. There's a post here indicating it was a new part number, but Delray currently shows the "old" number, in stock and all.

The bezel and HFL module are sold together as an assembly. 39770-SEP-A12ZB is what you want.

samc777

This is what you want.

The online image looks like a piece of plastic trim but the card does come with it. Note that the trim plate is available in a few colors so be sure to order the correct color.

Note also the $50 core charge. By the time you mess around with return shipping, insurance etc and your time it is almost a wash...

Telephone Assembly, Hands Free *NH556L* (Grayge) - Acura (39770-SEP-A12ZB)

List Price: $352.65

• You Save: $98.74 (28% off)
• Sale Price: $253.91
• Core Charge: $50.00

Dave

Abeyance

Thanks guys, the assist is much appreciated, will get one ordered shortly.

Joecop67

I've got a hot air machine, I may try to reflow the solder on mine. It is not recognizing any voice commands and I can't pair it with my iPhone 7 plus. I showed up once in my Bluetooth settings but wouldn't pair.
In the meantime, I've asked the kids and the wife fir the BT45-HON3 kit for Christmas.

Abeyance

While I was waiting for a reply to my original message, I used a heat gun on it for 5-10 minutes. About half the time on Low (750 degrees) and half the time on high (1000 degrees), just slowly and continuously moving the airflow around the board from about 2 inches away. After it cooled off I reinstalled it and was surprised to see it actually worked! I honestly don't expect it to last, but it will be interesting to see how long it does, and I'll report back when it quits again.

capper

Good idea!

Efu2d

Hello,

I am trying to learn how to replace the HFL on a 2006 RL. there several postings on the TL, cant find anything on an RL !
I bought the Service Manual as well (OMG $$$), and there is nothing on replacing the HFL only diagnosing it, can anyone point me in the right direction?

Efu2d

peter6

Using service manual from this link:
https://acurazine.com/forums/second-...t-11-a-734029/

I found out that HFL should be behind "right kick panel":

Also:
https://www.justanswer.com/acura/888...cura-2005.html

samc777

Well I see its been almost 2 years since my HFL oven bake job failed on our 2007 Acura TL Type S and I thought an update would be in order.

Since replacing the HFL module the phone has been perfect on the TL, no problems and as reported before, it gets a ton of use for the West Coast morning rounds of phone in confo calls on the drive to work..

However, the real reason I am writing is to report that that our 2007 Acura MDX HFL just died suddenly last month. No intermittent drops, no annoying dropped calls, no nothing, it just died instantly one day. When trying to pair it would state no phone found. The blue tooth link had failed on the card.

So I tried the oven bake job but no luck. A complete waste of time.

So I sat down at my computer and did some research After my research, the advertising on my screen trying to sell me a new HFL was nothing short of shocking. It makes me realize what all those people do who ride the Google buses to work out here on the West Coast. So with a click here and a click there I had a new replacement HFL in my hand the following morning.

With new part in hand I started the installation. This time the blue tooth link appeared and the phone finally linked up. It did take a number of tries before a successful connection was achieved. Don't give up is the message here. If at first you don't succeed try, try, try again. Its been a month now and all is still good.

Dave

Halzop

Joecop67

drmcdono

I need this part fir my 2008 Acura TL (base w/o navigation). I have been unable to find this assembly anywhere for less that ~$350 + shipping. If anyone can suggest some online stores, that would be great. Thanks!

matcrosbie

just so your aware, most dealerships will charge you an arm and a leg for replacement parts. I just called today and it was $700 plus tax just for the part

Father of Seven

I have not tried yet. But did fix my home furnace this way! $0.25 plus free catalog and $5 shipping!


How to repair the HFL Bluetooth Module for ACURA TL 2006 in 20 minutes

I just repaired my Bluetooth Unit for my 2006 ACURA TL. So I thought I write up this blog to help others who like me know nothing about how to fix cars, fix this unit in 5 minutes at a cost of less than $2. The cost to do this repair at the dealership is about $400.

I was getting the BOOTING UP message when I would go try to get to the phone menus and the buttons on the steering wheel would not work.

The area where the bluetooth is housed right next to the homelink garage door opener was getting warm even when the car was off for days. My battery is luckily OK however my battery is only 2 months old but others have had issues with their battery in similar cases so if you have this issue and dont fix it, your battery could just die while the car is sitting there since the unit basically is shorting the wires.

Keep in mind I have not soldered anything since I made my TV PONG Game back in 1980s. I never repair anything on my car, always at the dealer, I cant even change my oil. So if I did it, anyone can do it.

Disclaimer: I take no responsibility that this may work for you or not. I take no responsibility for any damaged caused to your car or any harm to you. If you don't agree, stop reading.

I bought the 220uF 25V 22uF 50V high temp capacitor from my local frys electronics store for $1.49. I also bought a solder gun for $4.99 because I didn't have one. I also "picked up" about 1" of solder iron from the trash on the floor carpet at the electronics store near where they had all types of solder wire on the shelf (lol). Here is the capacitor on Amazon (corrected link) if you want to buy it online. I also bought a since I didn't have one.

Here are the pictures of my 20 minute fix:

Step 1. Remove the black piece containing the lights and sunroof switch (I think Microphone is in this as well). There are lots of videos on youtube on how to pry this open, there are no screws. Push the tiny button and unplug the two black and green connectors.










Step 7. Bend the legs on the capacitor and cut them as shown. One leg shorter than the other one. Note which leg is closer to the WHITE STRIP on the capacitor. The longer leg is the one by the white strip. This is important![img]file:///C:\Users\Mom\AppData\Local\Temp\msohtmlclip1\01\cl ip_image001.jpg[/img]



Step 8. Solder the capacitor on the board. I did it really quick, I don't know what heat could do to the rest of the stuff on the board so the solder gun only hit the board 2-3 seconds at most. See the connections made on the capacitor legs:[img]file:///C:\Users\Mom\AppData\Local\Temp\msohtmlclip1\01\cl ip_image002.jpg[/img]


Step 9. Place the daughter board back on, push it all the way through. Place the two boards back in the plastic trim. Watch out for the clip I marked by the arrow. This board does not get screwed on. Then put the black cover back on and put the three screws back on with the T10 screws. [img]file:///C:\Users\Mom\AppData\Local\Temp\msohtmlclip1\01\cl ip_image003.jpg[/img]

Step 10. Go back to the car, plug in the bluetooth green connector, screw the grey trim back in the car with 4 hex screw. Plug in the black connector and pop in the black piece that holds the lights. Lastly, plug in the green connector and put the sunroof switch back on.

Superunknown

I thought it was settled that the root cause was BGA solder joint failure, a common problem with RoHS-compliant electronics from the 2000s. What does a cap have to do with this?

peter6

Father of Seven

Where exactly is the solder failure? What is BGA?
I repaired a solder failure on a relay swith of my clothes washer! If the "final answer" is clear in your mind post the link. Thanks.
​​

thoiboi

jdmvette

thanks, will have to try this

dadsnave

Target Audience:
Folks whose vehicles do NOT have factory navigation.*

My Qualifications:
- Electronics Engineer with decades of experience
- Audiophile, both home and mobile, for even longer
..(my first, after-market, car stereo was self-installed in early 70s
...and had six Jensen "Triaxial"/3-way speakers)

Terminology (for clarification for non-geeks):
Let's start by calling a spade a spade -- HFL is Honda/Acura's marketing/parts term for what is fundamentally a bluetooth module.
Since Acura is a Honda subsidiary, the same problem exists for both car lines. (So will hereinafter refer to Honda/Acura as H/A.)

RANT start...
H/A are not honest about the massive volume of bluetooth module failures in this era of vehicles -- including the car my son owns, a 2007 TL. There is a ton of anecdotal evidence indicating that it is not a question of if, but rather a question of when, the bluetooth module will fail -- likely rendering your car unreliable because it will suddenly not start intermittently. You'll then waste your time, energy, and money: jump starting the vehicle, having the battery tested, having the alternator tested, yada-yada-yada... All to no avail!

When the bluetooth module dies, not only will you no longer have bluetooth connections with your phone -- eventually you'll likely enjoy a dead battery (overnight, if not in a couple of hours). Not going to repeat all the info here regarding the root cause (as it is can be acquired by some googling), but, in a nutshell:

The bluetooth module failed (likely due to bad solder connections on the circuit board) and the car's computer sees the module as requiring a reboot, and an infinite loop of rebooting commences -- and continues until the battery is dead.

Yes, this was certainly in the early days of vehicle-to-phone bluetooth connections, but failures are failures. If it wasn't ready for prime time, it should not have been marketed and installed! The reliability testing team failed.

The fact H/A has refused to acknowledge the problem, much less offer to rectify it, is disappointing. There is no other way to describe it except bull$hit! Shame on you H/A!!!
...end RANT.

Potential Silver Lining:
Eliminate the bluetooth problem AND, at the same time, get better-than-factory navigation for around $400!
(Preemptive acknowledgement: Yes, I do realize than not everyone has an extra $400 lying around, but don't forget to take into account your costs in time/money to get the old one working.)

Replace the H/A factory bluetooth/radio garbage with an aftermarket dash unit that has Apple-CarPlay and/or Google-AndroidAuto functionality because:
- it will provide a much more up-to-date version of bluetooth than H/A's now 10+ year old technology
...(your mobile phone isn't likely 10+ years old)
- you will gain lifetime maps updates and live traffic for free via:
.... Apple Maps, Google Maps, or Waze
.... (with IOS 12, Apple now even allows you to use Google/Waze via CarPlay)
- safer, hand-free, voice-controlled inbound and outbound texting
...(my personal fave during commutes)
- all of the factory speakers, including the subwoofer, can be connected and fully functional
...(and sounding great!)

Heck, if you're willing to spend another $50 or so on an optional third-party interface module, the existing buttons on your steering wheel can control the new in-dash unit!

For 2017 Christmas present, I had a Pioneer AVH2330-NEX installed in my son's TL. It looks factory, and has worked great for more than a year. 2018's newer 2440 ($350) seems identical, but you can still find 2330s for $300.

[Tried to insert photo here, but not allowed because I'm a newbie on this sight.]

NOTE: As more and more functionality gets integrated into newer cars' dashboard screens, it is becoming much trickier to replace a factory unit with an aftermarket unit. The good news is -- at least for 3rd gen TL owners -- it works like a charm. No functionality is lost.

Just google how to disconnect H/A's junk bluetooth module so it stops stress-testing your poor battery. Head over to your reputable, hopefully-local, after-market car stereo shop. (Shout out to CarTunes in Michigan -- been dealing with them for decades -- they're FAB!) And chat with a salesperson. You've got nothing to lose (except problems), and much to gain.

Enjoy!


* The only reason I specify non-nav, is because I have no experience with replacing 3rd gen TL with factory nav with an after-market system.


Preemptive note: All trolls ignored -- they are damaged human beings who need help, not our attention.

dadsnave

Regarding heating/baking solutions:
Yes, it is low cost. Whether it is worth trying depends on how much you value your time. (Now, if I were retired and had time for piddling...) Not to mention the frustration after celebrating success, only to experience subsequent recurrence days or weeks later. Recurrence is particularly likely where there are extreme temperatures -- cold or hot. As the board contracts and expands... (In fact, it may simply be the expanding/contracting of the board during the heating cycle that temporarily causes components to "reconnect" (i.e., touch) enough to become functional.)

Think about it. The same heat -- regardless of how it is being supplied -- that is "fixing" the problem in one spot, may at the same time be creating problems elsewhere. Unless you can identify and focus exclusively on the failed solder joint(s) and thoroughly melt the solder -- on BOTH the board AND the component -- you will have a weak mechanical connection at best. If you try to "shotgun" the fix by heating the entire board to the point of solder melt, it is possible that other, previously "good", solder joints could be compromised.

If you still wish to experiment since you feel there is nothing to lose, do not move the board until it has cooled. If you heat the board up enough to melt the solder, don't bump/jostle it. If any surface mount device moves even a smidge, game over!

Joe User

Heyo dadsnave!

Thank you, thank you, for writing-up your experience. Like everyone else, my HFL died (R.I.P.), except it never occurred to me that I could replace the entire radio unit, hahaha! I totally agree with all of your reasons why.

Would you help me with a few simple questions?

I looked up the fitment and parts at Crutchfield; they're under the impression that the subwoofer and front middle speaker would be no-go; did you have to do anything special to make it work such that no functionality was lost?

I'm also having a tough time visualizing the fitment; does it look odd with the "cut-outs" (from the original radio knobs) on the metal side-trim?

Is the entire adventure straightforward enough that a tyro (me) could do it without too much risk of destroying everything? As a reference point I found removing the dead HFL was fairly easy, although the video how-to made it seem like major surgery.

Lastly, I've PM'ed my contact info; if you're still unable to post pics and if it's not too inconvenient, would you send me a few pics of your results? Thanks!

dadsnave

Crutchfield is half right. Front-center = NO. Subwoofer = YES (it works fine). Regarding the technical aspects of making sure the sub worked, I left it up to the experts at my local shop. They did mention that is was not plug-and-play -- they had to splice some sort of connector onto the sub's factory wiring. But I assure you -- it works! NOTE: Installation was included in the price, not extra to make sub work.

Regarding disconnection/removal of the original bluetooth module, it is a piece of cake. Biggest risk is creating pry marks on the plastic around the headliner when removing the trim. Just use a wide, flat plastic or wooden object (no screwdrivers) and you should be fine.

Regarding cosmetic appearance, pix posted below so you can decide for yourself. (Functionally, I feel it is a no-brainer!)

Joe User

Heyo again dadsnave!

Wow, it looks excellent!
Although I'll miss the center speaker, it's a small give-up for the modern functionality. Given the cost of the HFL part, the outdated software, and the attendant problems when it suddenly starts to fail, I'm surprised there aren't more discussions like this, where the entire radio unit is replaced. I'll add to the thread in about one month on my results. Alright, good luck everyone!

buhhriii

are you getting a dash message to check the HLF??

MyGuti

no such message exists, especially for HLF

Donnie Milk Jones

peter6

Yes.

The only functionality that you are losing, when disconnecting HFL, is HFL itself - meaning that your phone will no longer connect to the car.
But if HFL goes bad, and starts draining the battery, it doesn't connect anyways.

petulo

I did the "baking method" in my toaster oven for 10 min at 390 F. After that, I removed the board and let it cool to room temp.
The HFL has been working like new for more than one month. I live in Florida and leave my 2008 TL parked outside on the sun sometimes for hours. I noticed that the area where the HFL is installed gets hot, just like the rest of the car. So far so good.

Prior to this fix, my HFL started to malfunction periodically until it stopped working. I never had the battery drain problem some folks reported.
I called Acura HFL helpline with no help. I went to the local dealer, who admitted that there have been problems with HFLs. He offered me $500 for a new HFL + $75 labor with a $50 refund for the malfunctioning HFL.

I searched this forum and found several folks who shared this "bake out" method and I want to thank them all for saving me the $.

Best regards!

Happy 2008 TL owner.

PHILTRUONG

Hi, guys!
My HFL keep booting up and does not link to my phone for couple months. So, I take it out and give it to the electronic guy, named David ( 714-786-0269 ).He changed 2 capacitors, baked smaller board for 5-10 mins, charged $40.00. Brought it home and installed back to the unit. Works perfectly.