nfnsquared

Looking on the passenger side near the MT transmission case. Front of car is to the right. I found this when changing my MT fluid today.

NE14RoxCJ

Can you find a really wet spot? If you can get a good sample of the leaking fluid, you should be able to determine whether it is engine oil or gear lube. I don't recall what type of fluid the MT uses. If it is like other gear oil, it stinks like hell. If it's more like engine oil, then you may have a rear main seal leaking. Might be worth popping a cover off.

nfnsquared

No really wet area, pretty much what you see is it. Nothing is dripping on the floor. I didn't even know it was there until last night when I changed out my MT fluid. I don't think its MT fluid, I think it's oil, but if it's oil I don't know where it would be coming from.

I wiped it off and am going to check it again in a few days. Maybe it's nothing. At any rate, whatever it is, it's not leaking much at all. The oil hasn't dropped at all on the dipstick between oil changes and I just drained over 2 qts of MT fluid out. It's been 48K miles and 3 years since I last looked there. Not sure when the leak started.

nfnsquared

Ahhh....I did have the PS TSB done about a year ago. I wonder if they spilled PS fluid all over the place?

acuratech239

iTrader: (2)

Pretty sure it has nothing to do with the P/S hose recall, for many reasons.

I second NE14RoxCJ, rear main seal. This is of course without actually looking behind the cover and up at the seal itself. Take his advice and remove the cover and look up at the seal

nfnsquared

Yeah, after reading through the PS TSB, I doubt it.

Rear main seal, that's what scares me. OK, which cover do I remove? Is that cover that's in the picture? (I'm pulling up the service manual right now). I have an accuracare extended warranty but I haven't paid attention to the fine print. Any idea if it covers seals?

One more thing I forgot to add to my original post. The plastic cover underneath (removed in the picture) the leak is bone dry.

NE14RoxCJ

Granted, it's not excessive. But, there isn't supposed to be anything coming out of our car aside from condensation from the AC. It looks like the cover in the pic should allow you to look inside the clutch housing and see if there is a leak in there. I doubt you will be able to SEE the rear main, but you should be able to see if it's coming from that general area. You should call and find out if the rear main seal is covered under your warranty. That would not be a DIY for much of anyone. Then again, I really enjoy a good challenge, so if it were mine, the engine would be laying on the shop floor.

NE14RoxCJ

I hate to revive this thread, but I am having this exact same leak. Like the OP, I just had the power steering hose recall done and thought it could be some spillage. I pulled that cover off and found oil all over the lower portion of the opening. Is this the rear main or the oil pan gasket?? nfnsquared, did you take this to acura to get it fixed??

240sx acura tech

well that going to be a rear main seal or transmission input o-ring. the trans will need to be removed and you need to replace both of them. it about 12 hours of work. 30 dollars in parts.

Majofo

That sucks.

nfnsquared

Wow, I didn't even put 2 and 2 together when we were discussing your other thread.

No, I haven't done anything. I haven't looked at it since June, but nothing has dripped on the floor and I'm not losing oil. In fact, I still never have to add oil between 7,500 mile oil changes. I totally forgot about that leak. I'll take another look in the morning....But now I'm wondering if that is related to the PS hose change procedure......

Anyone else who's had the PS change done, do us a favor and check for oil leaks in the same area....

240sx acura tech

it has nothing to do with the recall

nfnsquared

So you're sure they couldn't have screwed up the seal when they were jacking the engine/transmission (pg 8 of the TSB)?

acuratech239

iTrader: (2)

I agree with 240sx. I have done hundreds of the recalls, and there's no way where we jack that it could damage the seal. If you could visually see how and where the rear main is, and is installed, I think it would make more sense to you too (I'm not questioning your intelligence, please don't get me wrong!). I'm just saying I have to agree with him.

Additionally, I change the oil on many of these cars I have done the recall on, and have yet to see one with a rear main seal leak. In fact, I can't recall the last time I saw a rear main seal leak on a (3rd gen) TL. I just did one earlier this week on an RSX, but that thing was beat so it was no surprise.

That said, for those of you with a possible rear main seal leak, you do have a little bit more to be worried about if you have a 6MT, as that oil can work it's way on/into the clutch assembly, which over time can ruin that too. But at the same point, it sucks to do that repair since the part is $11 and the labor, as stated, is easily over 10 hours...

NE14RoxCJ

I too have a hard time seeing a rear main seal leaking because of jacking the engine with a block of wood. Now, a pan gasket.... That looks like it is very possible. The engine is still fully attached to the car with the exception of the rear engine mount. If you put a jack under the oil pan and lift, how much weight are you lifting? The first 1/2 inch, maybe a couple hundred pounds? After that, you're lifting ~2/3 of the car's weight. I don't think the oil pan or gasket were meant to be put under that kind of pressure.
I see from the service manual that this engine does not use a replacable gasket. Only a thin layer of sealant to seal the pan to the block. And that job looks a hell of a lot easier than removing the transmission to change the rear main seal. Any thoughts on that?? I'm going out to look at my situation shortly (after my coffee and a call to ACS).

Bender

Wipe/spray it off really good then check again. It looks like oil blow back from a leaky seal. You really need to get under there with a flash light to find it. Either way, it's not an emergency nor will it hurt the engine if your oil levels are ok.

NE14RoxCJ

Ahh. This isn't a pic of my car, but I'll be under there with a light and a camera in a little while. Mine is not blow back at all. Mine is a steady flow of oil coming from inside that cover. I'm going to pull the cover off again and do like you said, clean/spray/wipe.

jpoole

For what it's worth, I had a rear main start leaking on my wifes Honda Pilot(J35 but still similar) after I changed the timing belt It leaked pretty good for about 8k miles and then started leaking less and less The Pilot now has 155k miles(40k since I changed the belt) with nothing more than an oily area just like the above pic. No drips, no loss, nothing.....crazy!

Bender

I think the oil probably plugged the leak. Nice not having to take it to a shop for those seals. Real expensive for a cheap part.

jpoole

lol...I had thought of lots of reasons but had overlooked that one-thanks!
I don't let others work on my stuff. I still haven't had the wiper and power steering hose recall done on my TL 'cause of that. I was going to fix the seal myself.

NE14RoxCJ

I wish I had kept that going, too. I could have fixed the PS pump noise with a $1.53 o-ring and avoided all of these issues I've had. I just wish they would give us the recall parts and let us do the work ourselves. I'll NEVER take my car back to Riverside Acura in Little Rock, AR. Probably won't take it to anyone, for that matter.

AMUA6

iTrader: (7)

I gave .69 for my P/S O-Ring

240sx acura tech

to tell you the truth. the car never leaves the ground. it take about 20 mins for 04,07, 08 tl's and 30mins for 05-06 tl's.

Bender

It's to bad more tech's are not like you. My experience has been awful.

First time I went to service in down town Savannah, there was a fat old guy in the waiting room sleeping, I assumed he was a customer . LOL WRONG, he woke up and said, and I quote, "ok time to get back to work". I called the Acura main number to file a complaint and they suggested I drive to Augusta. So forgive me if I am a bit cynical of dealerships. They never fixed a damn thing and I still have the rear clunk and all the other B.S.

I was used to fixing Jeeps in my driveway and spent 30 grand to not have to do that anymore. But I still have to. I have 0 confidence in anyone handling my car but me.

NE14RoxCJ

That's good info. That hose runs through the rear lower motor mount, right? Do you have to jack the engine up to move that mount?? I can see how this could all be done from up top except for that part. Seems like using a lift would make it a lot easier. Im going to work on the car this weekend. I'll probably start with the oil pan since it'll cost nothing and can be done in a couple of hours, max. If that doesn't fix it, I guess I'll be pulling the transmission next week... I still couldn't see exactly where it's leaking today when I looked at it. It either didn't leak at all on a short drive up the road or it soaked the entire area after I took it out on the highway.

240sx acura tech

if it wasn't a six hour drive i would tell you to come to austin and i would do it for you. tht trans and even the oil pan will be impossiable on the ground or jack stands. don't waste your time with the oil pan. they only leak at the back by the axle. oh and u just bend the hose a little and it slides right out past the mount.

NE14RoxCJ

Hmmm... Impossible? The oil pan looks pretty easy. Even the FSM only says to remove the exhaust pipe and the pan bolts. That seems pretty simple from the position I've been in the last few days with a jack and stands. Now, the trans... That would be a little more difficult, but I recently took part in a trans swap on a Honda oddessy van with a couple jacks, stands and an engine hoist. Dropped the engine/trans and sub-frame out the bottom. Probably not as easy as with a lift, but far from impossible.

Anyway, Hopefully I'll be heading to a lift today to see what we can figure out. Thanks for the input. I'll keep that in mind.

Bender

Hopefully it is something simple like they forgot to tighten the pan bolts.

NE14RoxCJ

I don't think they loosened the pan bolts. Now, I'm thinkin I may wait until Monday and talk to the service manager about the whole thing. They're closed for the weekend, so I can't even get any of their sealant if I wanted to do the work today.

nfnsquared

We've got another case of an oil leak at the seal after PS work:

https://acurazine.com/forums/showthread.php?t=759836

Just another coincidence? I'm beginning to wonder?

NE14RoxCJ

Uh oh.... Those pics look TOOO familiar...

acuratech239

iTrader: (2)

To quote the OP in the thread just mentioned:

My response in that thread was:

To anyone mentioning the P/S hose recall, where does he say he had the power steering hose recall done? Unless I am missing something...

The OP in that thread later confirms he only had the pump replaced, not a P/S hose recall done.

Additionally, to change a power steering pump, you don't have to jack up on anything whatsoever. You just undo the two 10mm bolts the hold the line on to the pump, undo the clamp and hose on the other line, and finally remove the two 12mm bolts that hold the pump onto the engine. Not to mention the pump is on the opposite side of the rear main seal...

240sx will back me up on this

nfnsquared

Well, he only confirmed that the pump was repaired. He didn't say one way or another about the TSB, at least not yet. Let's see what he says about the TSB.

Also, he had 2 motor mounts replaced. If they replaced the rear mount, they could have improperly supported the engine.

NE14RoxCJ

Yeah, I saw the motor mount part. I guess if they had to repair or replace the PS pump and the recall hadn't been done yet, they would probably go ahead and do that too. Either way, I wish someone could explain how a car can go in for service clean and come out pouring oil and it not be caused by whatever service was done? Motor mount replacement requires supporting/lifting the engine in most cases. How many techs are going to drag out that engine support/balance beam set-up and not just slide a jack under the oil pan???

gotkilled

iTrader: (1)

i believe they only repaired the two front motor mounts but they ended up replacing all of them for good measure i believe. as for the ps tsb, it was already completed by the previous owner when the tsb was issued.
Your 2005 Acura is included in the 04-08 TL POWER STEERING HOSE Campaign.
Description 04-08 TL POWER STEERING HOSE Date 02/27/2008 Type Recall Customer Letter Status Fixed

acuratech239

iTrader: (2)

gotkilled - Thank you for clarifying.

To everyone else, I'm not trying to argue here. And I agree, it does raise the question on how a car can go in leak free, and come out after the repair with a leak from something. But I guess what I'm getting at is I still can't understand how jacking on the oil pan would cause a rear main to leak. I mean even if someone argued that the crank may shift just a little up/down, left/right, since the trans is still bolted to the subframe and car, it still wouldn't make sense. I say that because the trans is bolted to the engine with like eight or nine big ol 17mm bolts, and two 14mm bolts at the pan. Essentially, the engine/trans combo move as one assembly. Add to that that I have dropped engine/trans combos together from just holding the engine up with a cherry picker, I would think that would cause more stress then this.

Unless the tech(s) who are working on these problem cars are doing something totally different (and wrong), as compared to, say, myself and 240sx, then I still can't see the connection between jacking on the oil pan, and a rear main seal leak. But bottom line, I agree, the timing of the leak right after the service does make you scratch your head...

Let's see how it plays out.

240sx acura tech

like i said before the car never leves the ground. as you can see the oil is dirty. has grim in it. it been leaking for awhile.the rack is behind the engine so a ps fluid would travel towards the back no the front.

NE14RoxCJ

I don't want to hi-jack nfnsquared's thread. I hope he gets better results than I did. I'll be pulling my transmission out this weekend to R&R the rear main seal. The dealer wanted $1123 to do the repair. I don't know how the leak developed immediately after the PS hose recall, but I do know that it was NOT leaking before. If anyone cares, I've updated my post on "PS Hose Recall Gone Bad."

nfnsquared

That's not what the TSB says to do on pg 8. If they followed the TSB, then the car did leave the ground.

My leak has not reappeared. Maybe I got lucky, maybe it was something else, maybe it fixed itself, maybe I'll be screwed in another 2oK miles. I don't know.

I'm not going to mess with anything right now. It's not using a drop of oil and never has. I'm really puzzled where that how theat leak developed and then stopped. Anyhow, I'll be interested to hear if any other cases develop.

NE14: Good luck on your work coming up. I'd double check with them on the price of that seal. Sounds like they may be ripping you off on parts....but if their tech is a screwball and the seal does indeed cost $900, I guess I'd save myself the $276 and do it myself.

Bender

What do they charge like 40-50 bucks an hour for labor?