Throttlebody mod
03-14-2006, 05:51 AM
#1
10th Gear
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Throttlebody mod
Just got my A-spec suspension installed today and also found out about a neat little mod you can do to the throttle body to keep it cooler. Jtso from the TSX forum showed me this mod. I guess the TSX guys have been doing it for a while unbeknownst to the TL forum. The mod consists of rerouting the coolant line that flows through the throttle body. Apparently coolant is run through there to warm the air perhaps for colder climate areas. By removing the inlet and outlet lines and connecting them to each other instead you end up with a much cooler throttle body. Verified this after driving around for about 30 minutes on the freeway. Throttle body was only warm to the touch instead of hot. Just requires a couple of hose clamps and a coupler. No more than $3 in parts. I will post pictures soon. Driving impression were slightly more responsive throttle in the lower rpms. When doing the mod make sure to clamp off both hoses and put a rag underneath to catch any coolant drippings.
03-14-2006, 11:07 PM
#4
Originally Posted by CleanCL
yes, but this is a bad idea for people in colder climates. i''m in NY, i'd bypass it real quick at the track or dyno just to see what happens, but wouldn't drive around like that in the winter.
03-14-2006, 11:20 PM
#7
well i have heard that condensation can build on the throttle body and cause freezing, BUT it's not necessarily a very common thing. it's good to hear people doing this in colder climates. i may try it but it's one of the few things that worries me. i'd like to see a few more examples of this before i actually do it.
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03-14-2006, 11:30 PM
#9
.:KCCO:.
ya but where is it? is it on the aem intake? is it right at the connection between the intake and the engine? i k now the op is going to put up pics, but anyone else have an idea. i just dont know about the throttle body portion
03-14-2006, 11:34 PM
#10
When you installed your Injen intake....you most likely put this on. It was the coolant line relocate part of the install.....you remember the small white connecting barb that came with and the line you cut.....I think this is what they are talking about.
03-16-2006, 03:15 AM
#13
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Couldn't figure out how to post pictures but I found some on this forum that do. If you look at pictures 9. 10. and 11 of this link https://acurazine.com/forums/motorsports-news-7/wrc-some-one-maybe-back-130633/ it shows the coolant line being bypassed by the throttlebody. I connected the two hoses to each other using 90 degree elbows but I will probably just put in a new hose going from inlet to outlet. MichealBenz, you are right about the AEM CAI instructions for doing a coolant bypass. I guess for those of you not planning on a CAI right away you can do this modification initially.
03-16-2006, 11:16 AM
#14
One on the right for me
^-do those pictures work for you? They are not hosted anymore or my link wont connect me. If you have pics to host go to www.imageshack.us its really easy and all you have to do is copy the link they give you once a pic is uploaded
03-16-2006, 11:21 AM
#15
Originally Posted by subinf
^-do those pictures work for you? They are not hosted anymore or my link wont connect me. If you have pics to host go to www.imageshack.us its really easy and all you have to do is copy the link they give you once a pic is uploaded
03-16-2006, 12:47 PM
#16
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Originally Posted by Pure Adrenaline
It runs fine in the cold weather. I've bypassed the coolant feeed to both throttle bodies throughout this winter and I haven't had a problem with them freezing or anything... and my car's seen weather as cold as nearly 0 degrees.
Ditto. We had a bunch of us TSXers do it in all over the winter climate (me Ohio, a few in Canada, NY, etc). Never had a single issue at all. Lowest temp recorded in Cincinnati, OH was 19F when I left for work in the morning.
The only time you really notice a diff. is after a driving on the highway and you get off to a stop. Then you kick it into traffic... there is a little more HP and torque than I was used to having. For us TSXers, every bit of HP and ft lbs we can get is a good thing.
03-16-2006, 01:09 PM
#17
Originally Posted by moda_way
Ditto. We had a bunch of us TSXers do it in all over the winter climate (me Ohio, a few in Canada, NY, etc). Never had a single issue at all. Lowest temp recorded in Cincinnati, OH was 19F when I left for work in the morning.
The only time you really notice a diff. is after a driving on the highway and you get off to a stop. Then you kick it into traffic... there is a little more HP and torque than I was used to having. For us TSXers, every bit of HP and ft lbs we can get is a good thing.
The only time you really notice a diff. is after a driving on the highway and you get off to a stop. Then you kick it into traffic... there is a little more HP and torque than I was used to having. For us TSXers, every bit of HP and ft lbs we can get is a good thing.
03-16-2006, 01:24 PM
#18
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Originally Posted by CleanCL
i agree, but my thought process is.. why are the coolant lines there if they appear to serve no purpose but hinder HP/TQ?
They are put there for the potential of the throttle body freezing, so all manufacturers are preventing a problem that doesn't normally exist. You sacrifice a few HP/TQ to do that.
03-16-2006, 01:36 PM
#19
2004 SSM/EB/5AT/Navi/RSB
How much gain can one reasonably expect by doing this? Has anyone dyno'd this beyond a "butt dyno?" It seems to me that, if the gain is worthwhile, the manufacturer would've designed a thermostat into the works such that it only runs the coolant through the TB when it's actually needed.
03-16-2006, 06:53 PM
#20
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Originally Posted by bluenoise
How much gain can one reasonably expect by doing this? Has anyone dyno'd this beyond a "butt dyno?" It seems to me that, if the gain is worthwhile, the manufacturer would've designed a thermostat into the works such that it only runs the coolant through the TB when it's actually needed.
03-16-2006, 07:21 PM
#21
2004 SSM/EB/5AT/Navi/RSB
Originally Posted by moda_way
It is less about gains than it is about keeping what you already have.
03-18-2006, 10:36 AM
#22
To those who are concern about the functionality of the TB (sticking) under cold weather condition, perhaps a little info on the design of the TB would ease your mind. Below are some pics of a TSX DBW TB which is very similar to the TL. In fact, you can bolt a TL TB to the TSX.
Coolant cover: The cover on the left is where hot coolant goes in and out. It's just a hollow chamber. The cover on the right is another empty chamber. There is a small hole inside probably being used as vent hole for the drive motor.
Drive assembly:
DBW internal:
Drive gear: Note the two spring sets. One if for normal throttle plate return from open position, one is for returning from completely closed postion. The TB does a startup self check and closes the plate completely for a second, then returns back to the normal position. These springs have high tension.
Drive motor:
DBW control module:
TB normal position:
TB plate adjustments: Note the adjustment screws at the top inside 12 o'clock and bottom outside 5 o'clock positions.
Now let's analyze the possibility of the TB freezing without the coolant lines. Freezing point is 32 degrees F. If the car is exposed to freezing temp, the coolant doesn't get warm the second the engine is started. In fact the engine heat under the hood will reach above 32 degrees very quickly. The throttle plate is driven by an electric motor and the return is controlled by the high tension spring. Therefore, throttle sticking is not likely to be an issue.
Coolant cover: The cover on the left is where hot coolant goes in and out. It's just a hollow chamber. The cover on the right is another empty chamber. There is a small hole inside probably being used as vent hole for the drive motor.
Drive assembly:
DBW internal:
Drive gear: Note the two spring sets. One if for normal throttle plate return from open position, one is for returning from completely closed postion. The TB does a startup self check and closes the plate completely for a second, then returns back to the normal position. These springs have high tension.
Drive motor:
DBW control module:
TB normal position:
TB plate adjustments: Note the adjustment screws at the top inside 12 o'clock and bottom outside 5 o'clock positions.
Now let's analyze the possibility of the TB freezing without the coolant lines. Freezing point is 32 degrees F. If the car is exposed to freezing temp, the coolant doesn't get warm the second the engine is started. In fact the engine heat under the hood will reach above 32 degrees very quickly. The throttle plate is driven by an electric motor and the return is controlled by the high tension spring. Therefore, throttle sticking is not likely to be an issue.
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03-18-2006, 10:43 AM
#23
Originally Posted by JTso
To those who are concern about the functionality of the TB (sticking) under cold weather condition, perhaps a little info on the design of the TB would ease your mind. Below are some pics of a TSX DBW TB which is very similar to the TL. In fact, you can bolt a TL TB to the TSX.
Coolant cover: The cover on the left is where hot coolant goes in and out. It's just a hollow chamber. The cover on the right is another empty chamber. There is a small hole inside probably being used as vent hole for the drive motor.
Drive assembly:
DBW internal:
Drive gear: Note the two spring sets. One if for normal throttle plate return from open position, one is for returning from completely closed postion. The TB does a startup self check and closes the plate completely for a second, then returns back to the normal position. These springs have high tension.
Drive motor:
DBW control module:
TB normal position:
TB plate adjustments: Note the adjustment screws at the top inside 12 o'clock and bottom outside 5 o'clock positions.
Now let's analyze the possibility of the TB freezing without the coolant lines. Freezing point is 32 degrees F. If the car is exposed to freezing temp, the coolant doesn't get warm the second the engine is started. In fact the engine heat under the hood will reach above 32 degrees very quickly. The throttle plate is driven by an electric motor and the return is controlled by the high tension spring. Therefore, throttle sticking is not likely to be an issue.
Coolant cover: The cover on the left is where hot coolant goes in and out. It's just a hollow chamber. The cover on the right is another empty chamber. There is a small hole inside probably being used as vent hole for the drive motor.
Drive assembly:
DBW internal:
Drive gear: Note the two spring sets. One if for normal throttle plate return from open position, one is for returning from completely closed postion. The TB does a startup self check and closes the plate completely for a second, then returns back to the normal position. These springs have high tension.
Drive motor:
DBW control module:
TB normal position:
TB plate adjustments: Note the adjustment screws at the top inside 12 o'clock and bottom outside 5 o'clock positions.
Now let's analyze the possibility of the TB freezing without the coolant lines. Freezing point is 32 degrees F. If the car is exposed to freezing temp, the coolant doesn't get warm the second the engine is started. In fact the engine heat under the hood will reach above 32 degrees very quickly. The throttle plate is driven by an electric motor and the return is controlled by the high tension spring. Therefore, throttle sticking is not likely to be an issue.
03-18-2006, 12:09 PM
#24
Man of God.....
I agree "Excellent Post and Great Information!" Love the pic's!!! I live in Minn. I would like to keep the functionality of the warm water. Has anyone seen a petcock (or valve) I could put here to switch between summer and winter position! Now that would be the BEST of both worlds!! A solenoid (12v) with a switch in the cab would be nice! 
03-18-2006, 05:18 PM
#26
Originally Posted by Spiritman
I agree "Excellent Post and Great Information!" Love the pic's!!! I live in Minn. I would like to keep the functionality of the warm water. Has anyone seen a petcock (or valve) I could put here to switch between summer and winter position! Now that would be the BEST of both worlds!! A solenoid (12v) with a switch in the cab would be nice!
What you will need is a couple of valves, fittings, hoses and clamps.
Before coolant bypass: The typical stock configuration with hot coolant flowing through the TB.
Valve and fittings: You will see how it is placed in the diagram later.
Bypassed flow path: Valves closed
Normal flow path: Valves open
03-18-2006, 05:55 PM
#27
Ryan Christopher
The only real purpose is to warm the air before it enters the motor. By warming the air it helps with emissions. I had a STR 70mm TB on my Prelude. It was made without coolent pass in it. In the 3 years I had it, I never once had a problem with it. Given I live in the south, but it still gets cool down here. I personally wouldn't worry about doing the mod any place I lived( north or south). It is not very likely that the throttle body would EVER freeze closed, unless you ran through a monsoon then went straight to freezing temps. If anyone has ever played with nitrous, you will know that it is extremely cold, as is any condensed gas, and when I say gas, I mean periodic table gas, in this case Oxygen. If sprayed on a surface, nitrous will form a icy film. This is also why they use bottle warmers, to excite the molocules in the bottle so it will flow faster. When using a fogger system, you are spraying it right before the TB, this does not freeze the TB open. Any one that has used N2O will understand. The gain on something like this is nominal, but when you are trying to get every little pony out of a NA motor, you do everything you can. If you don't feel comfortable doing something like this, don't. But this is a place for us to discuss options that can be done to the car to help improve performance, and that is what we are doing!! Again, if you think that it would cause a problem, don't do it, but for the rest of us, I am sure it will be something on the mod list for most ofus shortly.
Jason
Jason
03-18-2006, 08:24 PM
#29
Man of God.....
I have wondered if this warm water would help heat the car up faster. Like in sub zero temp's. When you want the heat to flow into the cab ASAP! Also Do you get as good a mix at sub zero? I mean does the fuel atomize as well?
03-18-2006, 11:59 PM
#30
Originally Posted by Spiritman
I agree "Excellent Post and Great Information!" Love the pic's!!! I live in Minn. I would like to keep the functionality of the warm water. Has anyone seen a petcock (or valve) I could put here to switch between summer and winter position! Now that would be the BEST of both worlds!! A solenoid (12v) with a switch in the cab would be nice!
03-19-2006, 02:24 PM
#31
Man of God.....
Ya man!! That would work! (conceptually)......
I wondering now after reading the posts here. That maybe I don't need this? I did have a CAI on my 2k RSX never gave me any trouble. So .........
I wondering now after reading the posts here. That maybe I don't need this? I did have a CAI on my 2k RSX never gave me any trouble. So .........
03-19-2006, 03:36 PM
#32
Originally Posted by JTso
To those who are concern about the functionality of the TB (sticking) under cold weather condition, perhaps a little info on the design of the TB would ease your mind. Below are some pics of a TSX DBW TB which is very similar to the TL. In fact, you can bolt a TL TB to the TSX.
Coolant cover: The cover on the left is where hot coolant goes in and out. It's just a hollow chamber. The cover on the right is another empty chamber. There is a small hole inside probably being used as vent hole for the drive motor.
Drive assembly:
DBW internal:
Drive gear: Note the two spring sets. One if for normal throttle plate return from open position, one is for returning from completely closed postion. The TB does a startup self check and closes the plate completely for a second, then returns back to the normal position. These springs have high tension.
Drive motor:
DBW control module:
TB normal position:
TB plate adjustments: Note the adjustment screws at the top inside 12 o'clock and bottom outside 5 o'clock positions.
Now let's analyze the possibility of the TB freezing without the coolant lines. Freezing point is 32 degrees F. If the car is exposed to freezing temp, the coolant doesn't get warm the second the engine is started. In fact the engine heat under the hood will reach above 32 degrees very quickly. The throttle plate is driven by an electric motor and the return is controlled by the high tension spring. Therefore, throttle sticking is not likely to be an issue.
Coolant cover: The cover on the left is where hot coolant goes in and out. It's just a hollow chamber. The cover on the right is another empty chamber. There is a small hole inside probably being used as vent hole for the drive motor.
Drive assembly:
DBW internal:
Drive gear: Note the two spring sets. One if for normal throttle plate return from open position, one is for returning from completely closed postion. The TB does a startup self check and closes the plate completely for a second, then returns back to the normal position. These springs have high tension.
Drive motor:
DBW control module:
TB normal position:
TB plate adjustments: Note the adjustment screws at the top inside 12 o'clock and bottom outside 5 o'clock positions.
Now let's analyze the possibility of the TB freezing without the coolant lines. Freezing point is 32 degrees F. If the car is exposed to freezing temp, the coolant doesn't get warm the second the engine is started. In fact the engine heat under the hood will reach above 32 degrees very quickly. The throttle plate is driven by an electric motor and the return is controlled by the high tension spring. Therefore, throttle sticking is not likely to be an issue.
03-20-2006, 10:23 AM
#33
Ak Ting Up
Question ?
Is it possible that the coolant flow is keeping the mechanisms 'cool' in the summer? It gets 90 degrees + here in Atlanta with 70%+ humidity in the summer.
03-20-2006, 11:00 AM
#34
Originally Posted by AcuraVic
Is it possible that the coolant flow is keeping the mechanisms 'cool' in the summer? It gets 90 degrees + here in Atlanta with 70%+ humidity in the summer.
05-30-2006, 03:11 AM
#37
Import and Domestic owner
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Originally Posted by Selucid
I live in Cali so i dont have to worry about freezing. Does anyone have a step by step guild to reroute the coolant? I cant seem to find an online install guild for the AEM cai.
04-27-2008, 01:15 AM
#40
Originally Posted by MichaelBenz
Is'nt this step two or three is the AEM CAI install instructions? I seem to remember that they even give you a connector fitting and clamps? I will have to check this out! Thanks!