Stage 2 spec clutch kit
02-24-2014, 09:22 PM
#43
Three Wheelin'
iTrader: (3)
You might as well have run a stock clutch then because the stock pressure plate is not going to hold past 400wtq for long with oem clamping force. Have you ever seen the Power Rev Racing (p2r) disc reviews? I know a few owners personally who have seen it fail. Point being, it is designed for a stock pressure plate and gives way at low mileage with no misuse/abuse. It's a 6 puck and is ceramic i believe.
Last edited by gerzand; 02-24-2014 at 09:28 PM.
02-24-2014, 09:55 PM
#45
02-24-2014, 10:36 PM
#46
I am not looking to track this. Unfortunately my life toy is not this car. It is a Toyota with massive cams and a supercharger. So, I do see your point. If I was building this for more, I would of over built it and put a twin disc in. But with SPECs let down what I am supposed to do? This is my daily and I haven't had a car since 12/21. I mean you see the videos. I am not doing something weird or out of the norm to check these parts for fitment.
My big concern and beside my obviously shot flywheel was to bolster it enough to were I am not worrying about it blowing up in 50K. The OEM pressure plate has taken a ton of abuse from me. My issues are on the delay valve in the slave cylinder and two getting rid of that horrible dual mass.
My big concern and beside my obviously shot flywheel was to bolster it enough to were I am not worrying about it blowing up in 50K. The OEM pressure plate has taken a ton of abuse from me. My issues are on the delay valve in the slave cylinder and two getting rid of that horrible dual mass.
02-25-2014, 12:26 PM
#48
Three Wheelin'
To those of you that have the spec flywheel right now - you didn't have any issues with bolt clearance and ring gear? Please share.
02-25-2014, 10:50 PM
#49
Three Wheelin'
Dont like that LUK self-adjusting design clutch, looks flimsy. Likely why the Spec stages are rated so much higher than Clutchmaster's.
My Spec stage 2 = 480 lbs*ft
From an e-mail with CM for an 07 TL type s:
FX250 - 325 lbs*ft
FX350 - 395 lbs*ft
According to the guy I'm talking to, these are "low and safe estimates"...still these are their stage 2.5 and stage 3.5 ratings, much lower than spec's stage 2 ratings. Not that I plan on going that far, or most of us for that matter, just shows the difference in strength on the different design pressure plates.
My Spec stage 2 = 480 lbs*ft
From an e-mail with CM for an 07 TL type s:
FX250 - 325 lbs*ft
FX350 - 395 lbs*ft
According to the guy I'm talking to, these are "low and safe estimates"...still these are their stage 2.5 and stage 3.5 ratings, much lower than spec's stage 2 ratings. Not that I plan on going that far, or most of us for that matter, just shows the difference in strength on the different design pressure plates.
02-26-2014, 02:08 PM
#50
Okay so here is the updates. The CM/AASCO flywheel works like a charm! I know you are looking at me a little weird but the CM flywheel did have an AASCO part number on the back of it. So that solves that. So the car STARTS!
My problem they are having now is that in the air the car will shift into gear but you put the car on the ground and it wont go into any gear..... Any help on that one would be nice because they are a little stumped right now.
My problem they are having now is that in the air the car will shift into gear but you put the car on the ground and it wont go into any gear..... Any help on that one would be nice because they are a little stumped right now.
02-27-2014, 06:28 PM
#52
So Big enough person to admit that I am stupid. learning more about my pressure plate and getting the right wording down.... also never listening to a Honda tech anymore either.
So the part I was trying to get rid of was the SAC. Think that happened was it was engaged and started to operate and my shop is unsure how to reset the pressure plate.
So the part I was trying to get rid of was the SAC. Think that happened was it was engaged and started to operate and my shop is unsure how to reset the pressure plate.
02-27-2014, 09:40 PM
#53
Three Wheelin'
Cam, mine fits just fine.
To be sure, we flipped the whole assembly upside down and sure enough, there's a few millimeters of play between the bolts and clutch.
The ring gear will be checked against the starter next week, when she goes in the shop.
This photo is hard to tell, looks like the clutch is popping up, but it's not - it's perfectly flush against the friction plate:
To be sure, we flipped the whole assembly upside down and sure enough, there's a few millimeters of play between the bolts and clutch.
The ring gear will be checked against the starter next week, when she goes in the shop.
This photo is hard to tell, looks like the clutch is popping up, but it's not - it's perfectly flush against the friction plate:
03-03-2014, 04:54 PM
#54
Well after the snow and the ice, ITS BACK. The car runs great. Have that new clutch break in smell. But yes the pressure plate is a LUK but tension is upgraded. Feels about the same rev speed as the SPEC the one time I drove it. Other wise besides the SAC install being wrong when they installed it the first time, the Clutchmasters/AASCO parts fit correctly the first time.
Now I know you all are a bit confused why I keep saying AASCO. Here is what I got from Clutchmasters with the flywheel. Look familiar?
Now I know you all are a bit confused why I keep saying AASCO. Here is what I got from Clutchmasters with the flywheel. Look familiar?
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thisaznboi88 (03-03-2014)
03-13-2014, 09:56 PM
#55
Three Wheelin'
Alright...looks like we can count one more victim courtesy of Spec fuck me not a happy camper right now.
Cam, my spec clutch fits fine, but here are my problems:
1. There is no recess for the pilot shaft on the backside of the FW, so the FW doesn't mount flush with the crankshaft, instead it mounts only on the pilot shaft.
2. Because of (1) above, the FW bolts are pushed away and thus, only engage a couple of threads (there is a space between FW and engine). Scary.
3. Also because of (1), the ring gear is pushed forward horizontally and nearly hits the starter - not good.
4. The ring gear fits, but yeah, it does have issues and clearly NOT cut right. The starter will likely stick, just a question of how often?
Cam, questions for you:
a) On your video of the CM, I don't see the FW bearing in the FW. Does it come with a new bearing or not?
b) Does it have a recess on the backside for the pilot shaft?
c) If it doesn't have the pilot shaft recess, that would explain why it came with that spacer, but did you put that inside the FW?
Thx
Cam, my spec clutch fits fine, but here are my problems:
1. There is no recess for the pilot shaft on the backside of the FW, so the FW doesn't mount flush with the crankshaft, instead it mounts only on the pilot shaft.
2. Because of (1) above, the FW bolts are pushed away and thus, only engage a couple of threads (there is a space between FW and engine). Scary.
3. Also because of (1), the ring gear is pushed forward horizontally and nearly hits the starter - not good.
4. The ring gear fits, but yeah, it does have issues and clearly NOT cut right. The starter will likely stick, just a question of how often?
Cam, questions for you:
a) On your video of the CM, I don't see the FW bearing in the FW. Does it come with a new bearing or not?
b) Does it have a recess on the backside for the pilot shaft?
c) If it doesn't have the pilot shaft recess, that would explain why it came with that spacer, but did you put that inside the FW?
Thx
03-13-2014, 10:53 PM
#56
1. Ya, spec like to press in the pilot bearing on the wrong side. you will need to press it out and put it on the front side (clutch side)
2.Once the Bearing is on the other side it should fix this issue, however I bet it is going to be an extremely tight fit like mine was. Honda (still not one of my proud moments) put grease and used a plastic hammer to get it on my crank.... really not happy about that. A flywheel should just slide on.
3. Fixed by issue one.
4. The starter on my car was never able to disengage. Even after they shimmed it, it had a difficult time disengaging and would stick for a short time (about 1 full second)
A)the pilot bearing does come with the flywheel, they stuck it on my alignment tool so it wouldn't get lost.
B) the flywheel slide on perfectly with not issues onto the crank.
C)Spacer that it came with is only to go between the flywheel and the flywheel bolts to protect the face of the flywheel. If you notice the spec flywheel there are cycles on the face of it from the bolts. what will happen over time if the bolts will dig deep into the flywheel with constant removal. <-race application and constant rebuilds. With that spacer I showed it takes the pressure for the bolting up process and better distributes the pressure evenly. Makes me want to get rid of my fidanza on my Toyota for a CM Twin clutch. :P
Hope this helps. Since it is all apart I would double check that starter comparison. My AASCO/CM still had a slight gap but the SPEC was the teeth were no where near.
Beyond that, everything is running fine. My gas milage has gone up considerably. I guess a broken dual mass can cause many issues....>.> woops. Response time is high, less gas in all gears for the same power. Engine does complain with the throttle body when under 1.5k unlike the old stuff. I am guess I couldn't hear it before because the engine was using more gas -> more engine noise. But I am still breaking it all in, and I get to break in my new TWM finally with it (packed thick grease, shouldn't have used a high heat application type). But this right here, this is what I was aiming for when I wanted to improve my daily driving experience. Making this AGAIN, the better choice over a WRX STi.
2.Once the Bearing is on the other side it should fix this issue, however I bet it is going to be an extremely tight fit like mine was. Honda (still not one of my proud moments) put grease and used a plastic hammer to get it on my crank.... really not happy about that. A flywheel should just slide on.
3. Fixed by issue one.
4. The starter on my car was never able to disengage. Even after they shimmed it, it had a difficult time disengaging and would stick for a short time (about 1 full second)
A)the pilot bearing does come with the flywheel, they stuck it on my alignment tool so it wouldn't get lost.
B) the flywheel slide on perfectly with not issues onto the crank.
C)Spacer that it came with is only to go between the flywheel and the flywheel bolts to protect the face of the flywheel. If you notice the spec flywheel there are cycles on the face of it from the bolts. what will happen over time if the bolts will dig deep into the flywheel with constant removal. <-race application and constant rebuilds. With that spacer I showed it takes the pressure for the bolting up process and better distributes the pressure evenly. Makes me want to get rid of my fidanza on my Toyota for a CM Twin clutch. :P
Hope this helps. Since it is all apart I would double check that starter comparison. My AASCO/CM still had a slight gap but the SPEC was the teeth were no where near.
Beyond that, everything is running fine. My gas milage has gone up considerably. I guess a broken dual mass can cause many issues....>.> woops. Response time is high, less gas in all gears for the same power. Engine does complain with the throttle body when under 1.5k unlike the old stuff. I am guess I couldn't hear it before because the engine was using more gas -> more engine noise. But I am still breaking it all in, and I get to break in my new TWM finally with it (packed thick grease, shouldn't have used a high heat application type). But this right here, this is what I was aiming for when I wanted to improve my daily driving experience. Making this AGAIN, the better choice over a WRX STi.
03-13-2014, 11:01 PM
#57
Three Wheelin'
Thank you sir!
03-16-2014, 07:41 PM
#59
Three Wheelin'
I have the spec flywheel and stage 2 clutch. They fit together fine, no issues there like what cam experienced with his stage 3 clutch.
So, right now, we moved the bearing to the other side which solved the fitment and alignment issues, but the ring gear is cut wrong, as several others have stated.
Spec says I have a bad unit and they are going to overnight me a new one Monday or Tuesday. Very curious to see if they cut a new ring gear or not...
The S is also getting the timing belt service, new plugs, and all the performance bolt ons below in my sig.
I hope they finally recognize and fix this for us, I'm not crazy about the OEM self-adjusting clutch type, I'd rather have a traditional pressure plate design. We'll see how it goes, I also don't want the loud ass screech every time I start the car from the starter not disengaging. Fingers crossed.
So, right now, we moved the bearing to the other side which solved the fitment and alignment issues, but the ring gear is cut wrong, as several others have stated.
Spec says I have a bad unit and they are going to overnight me a new one Monday or Tuesday. Very curious to see if they cut a new ring gear or not...
The S is also getting the timing belt service, new plugs, and all the performance bolt ons below in my sig.
I hope they finally recognize and fix this for us, I'm not crazy about the OEM self-adjusting clutch type, I'd rather have a traditional pressure plate design. We'll see how it goes, I also don't want the loud ass screech every time I start the car from the starter not disengaging. Fingers crossed.
03-20-2014, 10:48 AM
#60
Three Wheelin'
Update: my mechanic received a new flywheel from Spec today. Slightly delayed due to Spec not having ring gears until yesterday.
My guy said it looks much better, and that the ring gear now looks like the OEM one.
I'm going to the shop today after work, and will post photos here tonight for you guys.
Right now, seems like we will go ahead and install the Spec flywheel and clutch. Fingers crossed.
My guy said it looks much better, and that the ring gear now looks like the OEM one.
I'm going to the shop today after work, and will post photos here tonight for you guys.
Right now, seems like we will go ahead and install the Spec flywheel and clutch. Fingers crossed.
03-20-2014, 09:49 PM
#61
Three Wheelin'
Alright, so new flywheel's ring gear has more angle on the angle cut on each tooth, looks like OEM, even slightly more angle than OEM unit. We test fit it against OEM flywheel and starter, teeth engage good, no gaps. Everything will be installed tomorrow.
Both Spec flywheels, old defective on bottom, new one on top, notice the angle cut on the teeth:
New Spec flywheel engagement with OEM flywheel (Spec on bottom, OEM on top):
All 3 flywheels, defective on top, new Spec middle and OEM on bottom:
Both Spec flywheels, old defective on bottom, new one on top, notice the angle cut on the teeth:
New Spec flywheel engagement with OEM flywheel (Spec on bottom, OEM on top):
All 3 flywheels, defective on top, new Spec middle and OEM on bottom:
03-20-2014, 09:52 PM
#62
Three Wheelin'
Ps: also much much lighter. We didn't weigh it, but I think OEM is ~28lbs and Spec is 14lbs.
Spec came through!
Spec came through!
Last edited by FamilyGuy; 03-20-2014 at 09:54 PM.
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thisaznboi88 (03-20-2014)
03-22-2014, 11:28 AM
#64
Three Wheelin'
Thx cam, shame they didn't get your stage 3 working. Weird that it didn't fit.
New rear main seal:
Spec flywheel installed:
Spec Stage 2 clutch installed:
New rear main seal:
Spec flywheel installed:
Spec Stage 2 clutch installed:
03-24-2014, 12:57 PM
#65
Three Wheelin'
Cam does the CM/AASCO FW stick at all with the starter?
How is it now after a week or two?
How is it now after a week or two?
03-25-2014, 01:52 PM
#66
Three Wheelin'
Ok, picking car up tonight.
My mechanic said the starter still sticks. 1st time he started it, it stuck for ~15sec. After a few more starts it's down to 1sec or less.
I'm giving spec one week for this to go away or it's going back. Hope it's not damaging my starter too.
My mechanic said the starter still sticks. 1st time he started it, it stuck for ~15sec. After a few more starts it's down to 1sec or less.
I'm giving spec one week for this to go away or it's going back. Hope it's not damaging my starter too.
Last edited by FamilyGuy; 03-25-2014 at 01:54 PM.
03-25-2014, 10:40 PM
#67
Three Wheelin'
Alright - picked up the car tonight.
Starter was sticking for ~1/2 a sec the first 2-3 times I started it while there, and...that's pretty much it! Went out for a bit tonight after I got home and it's virtually gone now!
Luv the quick revs, it's a pleasure to drive, and this clutch grabs good.
Car pulls good too, but can't really report on the lightweight flywheel alone, since I had a bunch of parts installed at the same time. All I can say is it pulls hard and I'm luving the exhaust note, though it has a tiny amount of rasp even with the HFPCs, but not enough to bother me. Sounds mean as fuck though, like it's angry, when I punch it, and just god awfully good when driven normally, intoxicating, you don't want to stop driving it.
Starter was sticking for ~1/2 a sec the first 2-3 times I started it while there, and...that's pretty much it! Went out for a bit tonight after I got home and it's virtually gone now!
Luv the quick revs, it's a pleasure to drive, and this clutch grabs good.
Car pulls good too, but can't really report on the lightweight flywheel alone, since I had a bunch of parts installed at the same time. All I can say is it pulls hard and I'm luving the exhaust note, though it has a tiny amount of rasp even with the HFPCs, but not enough to bother me. Sounds mean as fuck though, like it's angry, when I punch it, and just god awfully good when driven normally, intoxicating, you don't want to stop driving it.
Last edited by FamilyGuy; 03-25-2014 at 10:45 PM.
03-25-2014, 11:38 PM
#69
Three Wheelin'
Edit: full throttle engagement could mean WOT in general or shifting at full throttle, not sure. I'll take it easy though.
Last edited by FamilyGuy; 03-25-2014 at 11:40 PM.
03-26-2014, 08:55 AM
#71
Three Wheelin'
I'm not sure I have the will power to keep it under 3k
It drives so smooth right now
It drives so smooth right now
03-26-2014, 10:33 PM
#72
Three Wheelin'
Well, after just over a full day and night, this clutch is a pleasure to drive and shift. Shifts smooth, OEM feel, with a ~10-20% firmer pedal. Just perfect. Starter no longer sticks at all. Loving the lightweight flywheel as well.
The following 2 users liked this post by FamilyGuy:
Acura TL Builder (01-02-2019),
thisaznboi88 (03-26-2014)
03-26-2014, 11:47 PM
#73
The following 2 users liked this post by gerzand:
Acura TL Builder (01-02-2019),
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03-27-2014, 12:00 AM
#74
Three Wheelin'
05-16-2014, 10:12 PM
#75
Three Wheelin'
So after a few thousand miles love this flywheel / clutch, much much better than the factory setup.
For fun, I followed this: http://store.uucmotorwerks.com/artic...-HOW-WORKS.htm
And using this for an 07 Type S:
M(oem) = 43.0lbs
M(spec) = 26.2lbs
R(fly) = 6.0"
R(tire) = 12.6635"
Diff = 3.285
Gears:
1 = 3.933
2 = 2.478
3 = 1.700
4 = 1.250
5 = 0.975
6 = 0.770
Virtual weight loss per gear:
1st = 331.566lbs
2nd = 141.752lbs
3rd = 75.608lbs
4th = 48.595lbs
5th = 36.144lbs
6th = 24.130lbs
Virtual performance gain:
1st = 33.16hp
2nd = 14.18hp
3rd = 7.56hp
4th = 4.86hp
5th = 3.61hp
6th = 2.41hp
For fun, I followed this: http://store.uucmotorwerks.com/artic...-HOW-WORKS.htm
And using this for an 07 Type S:
M(oem) = 43.0lbs
M(spec) = 26.2lbs
R(fly) = 6.0"
R(tire) = 12.6635"
Diff = 3.285
Gears:
1 = 3.933
2 = 2.478
3 = 1.700
4 = 1.250
5 = 0.975
6 = 0.770
Virtual weight loss per gear:
1st = 331.566lbs
2nd = 141.752lbs
3rd = 75.608lbs
4th = 48.595lbs
5th = 36.144lbs
6th = 24.130lbs
Virtual performance gain:
1st = 33.16hp
2nd = 14.18hp
3rd = 7.56hp
4th = 4.86hp
5th = 3.61hp
6th = 2.41hp
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