Does anyone have any experience with ceramic pads. I am interested in how they perform compared to stock. Any difference in brake dust. Also, I am considering upgraging my front brakes to the stock acura brembo calipers and rotors found on the 6MT version. Please submit a PM>
Thanks Mark

 

The brembos woiudl require alot of work and money to get. A Rotora Big Brake Kit would give better results and cost far less then trying to get the brembos.

 

i'm sure most of you know, drilled slotted rotors, ss lines, bigger rotors generally do not help braking ability. they are mostly for cosmetics.
-drilled/slotted-keeps pad cleaner and cools better, but CANNOT be resurfaced and reused after several pad changes. this is bad b/c deposits from old pads do not let the break-in compounds of the new pads to properly burn off on the rotors. so you'll end up replacing rotors every year or so. also, do not road race with drilled rotors.
-bigger rotors-increase surface area, BUT adds unsprung weight and counteracts benefit of bigger surface area.
-ss lines-more for pedal feel, if u're concerned with brake fade, get ATE blue brake fluid or Motul RBF600 Dot4.

if you really want added braking ability setup, you have 2 options.
-OEM blank rotors and better brake pads. SS lines and ATE/Motul fluid are extras. Hawk HPS and Axxis Ultimate pads are the best for daily. Axxis outperforms Hawk a bit but gets REAL dusty.
-Wilwood/Brembo brake setup-bigger rotors, BUT aluminum center hat so less unsprung weight vs. weight of bigger solid rotors and even OEM rotors. 4 piston calipers, and all the benefits and cosmetics.

Axxis Ultimates are great ceramic daily driving pads, but get really dusty. theres always a compromise. less dust=less braking ability, vice versa.

i use Axxis ultimates for my hard stop n go driving on my turbo'd RSX. its a daily driver, and i've taken it to the 1/4mi couple of times. performs just great.

 

hmph... Porsche, BMW, Mercedes..... have crossdrilled rotors... and most of the sport sedans stop quicker than the TL........

I guess they are completely cosmetic.

Didnt that racy TL that won those races have a stock setup with drilled rotors?

 

sorry didnt clarify, i meant OEM replacement stock sized slotted/xdrilled rotors. cosmetic yes, completely, no. they cool better and keep surfaces of the pad fresher. but you do NOT want to road race in them. drilled rotors can take the beating of daily driving and 1/4mi tracking, but NOT the extremes of road racing.

those brake systems you mentioned have the aluminum hats i was talking about. if u look at Rotora's kit, its a one-piece system. more rotational weight. bigger does not always mean better.

no matter what rotor they use, it does not affect stopping ability or distance. the main thing affecting braking ability is overall weight and the pads.

 

Porsche, BMW, and Mercedes rotors are molded with the holes in them so the grain of the metal aligns around the holes. Cross drilled rotors are drilled after the rotors are molded so the holes go through the grain of the metal thus making it easy for for cracks to develop around the holes.

 

^very good point!

 

Sorry but no. ROTORA offer's 3 kits. They offer a 1 pc 13" kit with an iron disc and hub but they also offer two 2 pc systems. The 2 pc systems have an iron rotor with aluminum hub, one 13" and one 14", along with the 4 piston caliper, SS brake lines, etc. So Brembo and Wilwood are not hte only options and the price tag they carry is a hefty one. ROTORA offers the same 2 pc system for almost $800 less than Brembo.

I am just going to use the info on www.stoptech.com b/c they do have some good info and some of these statements made are incorrect:

The brakes don't stop the vehicle - the tires do. The brakes slow the rotation of the wheels and tires. This means that braking distance measured on a single stop from a highway legal speed or higher is almost totally dependent upon the stopping ability of the tires in use - which, in the case of aftermarket advertising, may or may not be the ones originally fitted to the car by the OE manufacturer.

Repeated hard stops require both effective heat transfer and adequate thermal storage capacity within the disc. The more disc surface area per unit mass and the greater and more efficient the mass flow of air over and through the disc, the faster the heat will be dissipated and the more efficient the entire system will be. At the same time, the brake discs must have enough thermal storage capacity to prevent distortion and/or cracking from thermal stress until the heat can be dissipated. This is not particularly important in a single stop but it is crucial in the case of repeated stops from high speed - whether racing, touring or towing.

 

yes, i was referring to the one-piece as an example. not to point out Rotora specifically and slander its name. and yes, forgot about the tires. (ashamed of myself for that)

as for my "options", the BBK option was general to ALL aluminum hatted 2-piece kits.

Heat in the disc/calipers does not affect braking ability. The stock brake rotors are too small, thin and retain too much heat. The heat is transferred to the brake calipers which in turn heats the brake fluid beyond its boiling point. When the brake fluid boils the gas bubbles in the brake lines compress and absorb the pressure placed on it from the brake master cylinder. The brake pedal gets spongy and you experience brake fade.

Brake fluid is the main reason why heat is a bad factor. Brake fade AFFECTS braking ability. lets say you change the fluid to ATE/Motul with higher boiling points. Honda fluid has a wet boiling point of 284*F. Motul has wet point of 421*F. Honda fluid boils a lot easier under extreme use and you'll notice brake fade easily. With Motul, the fluid doesnt boil as easily and braking system stays stable, not matter how hot the rotors/calipers get.


thanks for bringing more clarity on the subject.

 

No problem on the ROTORA issue. I just didn't want ppl thinking that ROTORA didn't offer the same as Brembo/Wilwood. They also do so for less of a price tag. No need to thank me; we're all here to help and you have some good info to contribute.