Brake Rotor Upgrades
02-25-2009, 07:28 PM
#1
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Brake Rotor Upgrades
Im dying to know what is the best Rotor upgrades for an 06 TL dynamic package with the Brembo Calipers already.
I've narrowed it down to EBC, Brembo and Rotara....
any suggestions? Websites you recommend?
Big B
I've narrowed it down to EBC, Brembo and Rotara....
any suggestions? Websites you recommend?
Big B
02-25-2009, 07:42 PM
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Racing Brake 2-Piece Rotors.
02-25-2009, 08:21 PM
#3
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www.excelerateperformance.com josh aka excelerate on this forum so you can pm him with any questions. also marcus aka Mrheeltoe on the forum you can pm him too. I'm drawing a blank on his website as i've never been on it, but just about everyone knows it i assume so someone can chime in here.
Last edited by 05BlkTL; 02-25-2009 at 08:25 PM.
02-25-2009, 09:03 PM
#6
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I got the ROTORA slotted and drilled with the ROTORA pads and they stop great. The only thing I hear is the ABS whining and clacking trying to stop the car from 80mph. It was interesting the first time I said BRAKE TEST!
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02-26-2009, 07:47 AM
#8
I bought a set of STOPTECH slotted and drilled rotors along with rotora pads from Josh @ excelerate and they are going on today. my OEM rotors and pads (more so the pads...rotors had no sign of warpage) were at the end of their life after 83k on my 05. Im gonna see how this setup works for me and ill let you know but i dont think ill have any regrets.
02-26-2009, 07:46 PM
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I have Rotora slotted rotors and the H2 ceramic pads waiting to go on. I still have a little bit of life left on my stockies, plus i'm being lazy and haven't felt like changing em yet. I've heard good results with these so that's what i'm expecting.
02-26-2009, 08:14 PM
#10
the questions I still ponder are:
- will any of these solutions perform as well as the stock brembo setup in the TLS?
- are they as smooth (free of noise) as stock?
- how long will the pads last?
02-26-2009, 08:19 PM
#11
the questions I still ponder are:
- will any of these solutions perform as well as the stock brembo setup in the TLS?
- are they as smooth (free of noise) as stock?
- how long will the pads last?
2. Yes they can be. If you get certain pads it may be noisier but the ROTORA H2 Ceramic pads are pretty quiet.
3. Similar to factory pads, but again that all really depends on the driver and driving conditions.
02-26-2009, 09:59 PM
#12
if the ceramic pads won't last any longer than the brembos, then to me it probably wont be worth it to me. I am not an aggressive driver and do about 80% HW and 20% city, so I presume my brembos will need to be changed around every 25k miles or so. On my old TL I went 50k before I turned in the lease and the brakes were in pretty much perfect condition.
How will the rotora sloted rotors work with the stock brembo setup?
How will the rotora sloted rotors work with the stock brembo setup?
02-26-2009, 10:10 PM
#13
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if the ceramic pads won't last any longer than the brembos, then to me it probably wont be worth it to me. I am not an aggressive driver and do about 80% HW and 20% city, so I presume my brembos will need to be changed around every 25k miles or so. On my old TL I went 50k before I turned in the lease and the brakes were in pretty much perfect condition.
How will the rotora sloted rotors work with the stock brembo setup?
How will the rotora sloted rotors work with the stock brembo setup?
02-26-2009, 11:17 PM
#15
if the ceramic pads won't last any longer than the brembos, then to me it probably wont be worth it to me. I am not an aggressive driver and do about 80% HW and 20% city, so I presume my brembos will need to be changed around every 25k miles or so. On my old TL I went 50k before I turned in the lease and the brakes were in pretty much perfect condition.
How will the rotora sloted rotors work with the stock brembo setup?
How will the rotora sloted rotors work with the stock brembo setup?
02-27-2009, 11:27 PM
#18
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1. Easy repair- you can change the mating surface for less money and not the hub in the event of warpage or wearout.
2. Heat dissipation, the heat will better dissipate and will prevent warpage
3. Low-weight - moving mass like tires, rims brake rotors and even lug nuts can have a big impact on performance. If something 40 pounds is removed, it can be like removing 200 pounds from the car itself. The 2pc rotors are a bit lighter and the stock 5AT rotors are very heavy, the 6MT ones, that are even larger must be heavy.
02-28-2009, 07:45 AM
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is not about show (2 pc rotors), but about 2 things:
1. Easy repair- you can change the mating surface for less money and not the hub in the event of warpage or wearout.
2. Heat dissipation, the heat will better dissipate and will prevent warpage
3. Low-weight - moving mass like tires, rims brake rotors and even lug nuts can have a big impact on performance. If something 40 pounds is removed, it can be like removing 200 pounds from the car itself. The 2pc rotors are a bit lighter and the stock 5AT rotors are very heavy, the 6MT ones, that are even larger must be heavy.
1. Easy repair- you can change the mating surface for less money and not the hub in the event of warpage or wearout.
2. Heat dissipation, the heat will better dissipate and will prevent warpage
3. Low-weight - moving mass like tires, rims brake rotors and even lug nuts can have a big impact on performance. If something 40 pounds is removed, it can be like removing 200 pounds from the car itself. The 2pc rotors are a bit lighter and the stock 5AT rotors are very heavy, the 6MT ones, that are even larger must be heavy.
Who cares if "you can tell without the wheels off"? It's not about the "Show", it's about the "Go"; not everyone has the same priority, though, and that's OK.
02-28-2009, 11:09 AM
#21
Burning Brakes
is not about show (2 pc rotors), but about 2 things:
1. Easy repair- you can change the mating surface for less money and not the hub in the event of warpage or wearout.
2. Heat dissipation, the heat will better dissipate and will prevent warpage
3. Low-weight - moving mass like tires, rims brake rotors and even lug nuts can have a big impact on performance. If something 40 pounds is removed, it can be like removing 200 pounds from the car itself. The 2pc rotors are a bit lighter and the stock 5AT rotors are very heavy, the 6MT ones, that are even larger must be heavy.
1. Easy repair- you can change the mating surface for less money and not the hub in the event of warpage or wearout.
2. Heat dissipation, the heat will better dissipate and will prevent warpage
3. Low-weight - moving mass like tires, rims brake rotors and even lug nuts can have a big impact on performance. If something 40 pounds is removed, it can be like removing 200 pounds from the car itself. The 2pc rotors are a bit lighter and the stock 5AT rotors are very heavy, the 6MT ones, that are even larger must be heavy.
1. Ease of repair- hard to argue there. Of course, I only do rotors once every 5-7 years, tops, so saving 10-15 minutes getting a rotor off isn't a huge deal.
2. Heat dissipation- given the better vane design of the Brembo rotors over the 5AT stock pieces, I'm skeptical that you'd see a benefit anywhere, except on a road course.
3. What is the "low weight" of the 2 piece rotors as compared to the 6MT rotors? RB website says 12-16% reduction, about 2 lbs, tops.
4. Where has the weight been removed? i.e. making the hub lighter is less beneficial than making the rotor lighter, since the rotational mass is further out on the rotor. However, making a rotor light can be VERY problematic. RB's site shows it all in the hub.
If the 5AT brakes feel like my '02 TL-S brakes do, then they need help. However, and particularly for road-driven cars, let's not forget the two main factors that go into better braking-
1. Rotor diameter- bigger is better. Longer lever arm= much better pedal modulation.
2. Swept area- the amount of pad touching the rotor surface.
Without affecting these two, I wouldn't mess with the factory Brembos, other than changing pad compound for less dusting, assuming it won't reduce brake feel.
02-28-2009, 07:57 PM
#22
is not about show (2 pc rotors), but about 2 things:
3. Low-weight - moving mass like tires, rims brake rotors and even lug nuts can have a big impact on performance. If something 40 pounds is removed, it can be like removing 200 pounds from the car itself. The 2pc rotors are a bit lighter and the stock 5AT rotors are very heavy, the 6MT ones, that are even larger must be heavy.
3. Low-weight - moving mass like tires, rims brake rotors and even lug nuts can have a big impact on performance. If something 40 pounds is removed, it can be like removing 200 pounds from the car itself. The 2pc rotors are a bit lighter and the stock 5AT rotors are very heavy, the 6MT ones, that are even larger must be heavy.
03-01-2009, 10:37 PM
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After I posted that, I saw your "little boost" line. Oops!
Good Idea.
Kennedy runs 2-peice RB and Michael Benz runs 2-peice Rotora.
'Nuff said.
.
03-02-2009, 06:16 AM
#25
"It's not about the "Show", it's about the "Go"
Isnt it really about the STOP? or Slow
Isnt it really about the STOP? or Slow
03-02-2009, 06:46 AM
#26
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contrary to general pop; i went w/ IRotors cross/drilled w/ HP pads all round. loving every minute of it. browse the net, you'll see what i'm talking about. sorry about blurry pics
https://acurazine.com/forums/album.p...pictureid=9652
https://acurazine.com/forums/album.p...pictureid=9653
https://acurazine.com/forums/album.p...pictureid=9652
https://acurazine.com/forums/album.p...pictureid=9653
Last edited by rooki; 03-02-2009 at 06:48 AM.
03-02-2009, 06:59 AM
#27
Burning Brakes
1. on the street
2. on our type of vehicle
You are not getting $600+ worth of performance out of those rotors. Show me hard data that says otherwise- stopping distance. High temp, high speed brake fade is nearly irrelevant on the street, because the car isn't driven hard enough to overrun the factory setup- particularly the Brembos.
03-02-2009, 07:46 AM
#28
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And?? Let's see hard data. My point is simply that-
1. on the street
2. on our type of vehicle
You are not getting $600+ worth of performance out of those rotors. Show me hard data that says otherwise- stopping distance. High temp, high speed brake fade is nearly irrelevant on the street, because the car isn't driven hard enough to overrun the factory setup- particularly the Brembos.
1. on the street
2. on our type of vehicle
You are not getting $600+ worth of performance out of those rotors. Show me hard data that says otherwise- stopping distance. High temp, high speed brake fade is nearly irrelevant on the street, because the car isn't driven hard enough to overrun the factory setup- particularly the Brembos.
03-02-2009, 09:41 AM
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And?? Let's see hard data. My point is simply that-
1. on the street
2. on our type of vehicle
You are not getting $600+ worth of performance out of those rotors. Show me hard data that says otherwise- stopping distance. High temp, high speed brake fade is nearly irrelevant on the street, because the car isn't driven hard enough to overrun the factory setup- particularly the Brembos.
1. on the street
2. on our type of vehicle
You are not getting $600+ worth of performance out of those rotors. Show me hard data that says otherwise- stopping distance. High temp, high speed brake fade is nearly irrelevant on the street, because the car isn't driven hard enough to overrun the factory setup- particularly the Brembos.
You don't need "$600+ worth of performance", you need the differnce between Stock and Aftermarket. At ~$625 a set plus pads, assuming you DIY them, that's about what you'd pay the dealer to install new (maybe marginally higher). So, in my book, cost is between a wash and a small premium.
Guys like you will never accept an answer unless it's the one you want. Where do think this is, the Brake Performance Institute of America? -
How about this: You show that data for the Brembos.
Serioulsy, "I want hard data .... blah, blah, blah". You know it either does not exist or is propietary - either way, you won't get it, so you can always lay back and say, "Show me the data .... ." You get anecdotes and generalizations (lighter is better, etc) and that's about it.
At best you might consolodate a bunch of internet source information, but actual one-on-one controlled (even modest control) test data -
Kennedy? - Only one of the most knowledgeable, careful and technically competent individuals on this board. If it's "Kennedy Approved", you know it's good and you know he did the research.
Micheal Benz - In addition to "Kennedy-like" qualifications, he won his SCCA Regional Class Championship in - you'll never guess ..... a TL (
), a car wholey unsuited for quick, short couses. Not just some "G-Stock" classs either, he won in the "anything goes" class.If you want to do your own research, knock yourself out. I'd start with the Racing Brake web site and expand from there. Post any findings, as I am sure others would be interested.
The factory set up is very nice, but I guarantee you, in "normal" driving it can be over-run. Take a cruise up through NC66, TotD or Cherohala Skyway and tell me you don't get any fade. They are VERY good brakes, but that does not mean you can't find better.
03-02-2009, 11:05 PM
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But how does the TL/TL-S perform in the same test with, say, Racing Brake 2-Peice rotors? No data. Cannot be compared via reliable, semi-controlled testing.
And what about those occasional mountain/canyon/back-road runs - do the Brembo's fade and increase stopping distance? Yes. How much? More or less than, say, Rotora 2-Peice?
Personally, I think the factory Brembo's are an excellent braking system for this car. I am not arguing against them. Are they the best brakes available? Probably not.
Besides all that, though, the OP asked for the "best" rotors. IMHO that'd be a 2-piece set up. Someone else, with a different perspective, might say the $55 NAPA rotors are "best" and, for them, they'd be right.
03-03-2009, 11:05 AM
#35
racing brake 2 piece rotors here! they kick ass, i have the ET 500 pads and SS lines as well, for me it was about performance. the brake dust is very, very minimal. hardly any! my stock set-up, jesus! i had to clean my wheels every day. oh, and if yo are concerned if you could tell if they are two piece or not. all you have to do is open your eyes. depending on your wheel choice of course
03-03-2009, 02:52 PM
#36
racing brake 2 piece rotors here! they kick ass, i have the ET 500 pads and SS lines as well, for me it was about performance. the brake dust is very, very minimal. hardly any! my stock set-up, jesus! i had to clean my wheels every day. oh, and if yo are concerned if you could tell if they are two piece or not. all you have to do is open your eyes. depending on your wheel choice of course
03-03-2009, 05:13 PM
#37
Hi Speed, i dont remember the exact cost. i got them from Heeltoe automotive, a vendor here on Azine. no shipping since i lived near by. Racing Brake rotors are im sure built to very high standards and guidelines. they are of very high quality. if you ever looked at one you could see that just from the construction. im not at all worried about the bolts and flanges.
if anyone should worry is all the guys that buy those cheap Ebay rotors from mickey mouse companies Racing Brake is a well established co. thats all they do is make high performance brake systems. the name says it all
if anyone should worry is all the guys that buy those cheap Ebay rotors from mickey mouse companies
Racing Brake is a well established co. thats all they do is make high performance brake systems. the name says it all
03-03-2009, 08:00 PM
#38
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03-04-2009, 02:42 PM
#39
True. And the TL/TL-S does very well in those tests - top 1/3 of similar sedans. Typically a limited number of 60 - 0, 70 - 0 or 80 - 0 "panic stops". Definelty applicable to what a user may encounter day-to-day.
But how does the TL/TL-S perform in the same test with, say, Racing Brake 2-Peice rotors? No data. Cannot be compared via reliable, semi-controlled testing.
And what about those occasional mountain/canyon/back-road runs - do the Brembo's fade and increase stopping distance? Yes. How much? More or less than, say, Rotora 2-Peice?
Personally, I think the factory Brembo's are an excellent braking system for this car. I am not arguing against them. Are they the best brakes available? Probably not.
Besides all that, though, the OP asked for the "best" rotors. IMHO that'd be a 2-piece set up. Someone else, with a different perspective, might say the $55 NAPA rotors are "best" and, for them, they'd be right.
But how does the TL/TL-S perform in the same test with, say, Racing Brake 2-Peice rotors? No data. Cannot be compared via reliable, semi-controlled testing.
And what about those occasional mountain/canyon/back-road runs - do the Brembo's fade and increase stopping distance? Yes. How much? More or less than, say, Rotora 2-Peice?
Personally, I think the factory Brembo's are an excellent braking system for this car. I am not arguing against them. Are they the best brakes available? Probably not.
Besides all that, though, the OP asked for the "best" rotors. IMHO that'd be a 2-piece set up. Someone else, with a different perspective, might say the $55 NAPA rotors are "best" and, for them, they'd be right.
03-04-2009, 03:13 PM
#40
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