type-s09

so our stock cats would bolt up to this J-pipe? if so then the e-shift cat will bolt up...3-shift cats+atlp j-pipe= HP!

aznbo187

iTrader: (1)

Yep, that's the plan!

Let's see some more votes, come on!

type-s09

o yeah im all for it...id say we could see 30-40 whp from e-shift cats/ATLP J-Pipe/Cat-back exhaust
E-shift=20-25whp
ATLP=5-10 whp
Greddy EVO2=9whp
Thats 34-44 whp..thats a great improvement..im down but i would want the cat to be removable and with a test pipe option...with exhaust and high flow cats the 3rd cat delete will be awful raspy and loud

tlaspecteinss

iTrader: (1)

How bout the thought of eliminating the 2 cats completely by bolting up
pipes to those flanges. I know it wouldn't be great for inspection but I'm
sure there is a way to keep the sensors, maybe foulers. At that point the
third cat would be optional really because of the big gain from the removal
of the other 2. But if this option is already available someone just fill me in
cause I was getting the sense that these j-pipes bolt up to the 2 cats from
one of the posts I had just read. Just my

type-s09

that would loose power...since its a single tube coming out of the head and not a standard 3-1 header like most v6s are there would be a great lack of backpressure...a header system creates back pressure when the 3 collect into one thus only needing the one cat..the 3 cats develop backpressure to keep the motor breathing correctly..now supercharged cars would like the now cats because backpressure is not needed...

tlaspecteinss

iTrader: (1)

I see what your saying so from my stand point the best option would probably
be machining that little manifold that is casted on and then just have a header
made which at that point wouldn't be too hard.

mrlunecy

iTrader: (1)

Cool man...hey, are there supposed to be gaskets between the j-pipe and all 3 connections to the cats? Cuz when I dropped in the e-shift cats, I saw NO gaskets between any of the connections and none were supplied. just wondering...

Eoanou

I would have loved for that to happen.

type-s09

aznbo! heres the solution to everyones wants...
Make the J-Pipe where it will bolt up to a bone stock TL and use the factory cats...then have 2 options..1.a high flow cat that bolts in...2. A test pipe that bolts in...that way everyone will be happy...the people that want to run stock cats(3) with the j-pipe..the people that have e-shift cats can bolt them right up and not waste there $1200...people that want the (2) factory cats and one high flow on bottom...and people who want only 2 cats...that is the way you should make it and it will yield the most sales tremendously...because basically with these cars people are very picky on what they want..i konw unless you make a j-pipe that bolts up to the stock cats i wont get one because i want to use e-shift cats to yield the max gain....so think bout it and im sure everyone would agree
Example not real prices:
Basic J-Pipe $400
Test Pipe$75
High Flow cat $200

kjelly

mrlunecy, you should have installed gaskets with your gaskets. My Procats didn't come with any, but I bought my from A of E (I think). It's mentioned in the initial discussion of the Procats started by nitrotiger...

JamminTL

Word! There should be gaskets there.

aznbo187

iTrader: (1)

Back on topic guys!

Why is it such a close poll!! I'm going in next week for the prototype and discussing the first article...so I need to know for sure which design you guys want!

dr_brains510

#3 all the way....if not that then #1.

type-s09

i cant believe my proposition isnt being looked into..aznbo you will sell teh j-pipe to members who want 3 different things..its worth the $100 more for flanges

aznbo187

iTrader: (1)

Trust me, your propositions has been one of my priorities in the back of my head for a while! The thing is, it's conflicting with what I want to accomplish as well for those that want the 3rd cat deleted.

Here is why:

For the 3rd cat delete j-pipe, which in my opinion will enable use to a design that theoretically can net the most gain throughout the entire power band, I wanted to incorporate a design that will reduce any reverse flow and anti-scavenging effects. This is achieved by increasing the length of the secondary runners (j-pipe). It will enable us to maintain the original gas velocity for much longer and keep any interference further away from the ports.
It's important because if the exhaust/header system is limited to it's ultimate flow, either by size, interference, or friction it will induce build up of residual exhaust in the cylinder, contaminating your fresh combustion and resulting in a weaker combustion, that has a considerable influence on torque and power.

We are planning to run the two pipes as far back as where the 3rd cat would have been before branching them together. This will prevent any pressure traveling back into the valve and also keep any pressure variations further away. Furthermore, by 'branching' the two pipes together towards the direction of the flow, the layout method assists in making sure the exhaust flow is going into the right direction.

Basically, I wanted to delay the Y-flange, or 'branching' of the pipes until where the 3rd cat originally would have been. This isn't possible if I just produce one j-pipe with two options. Maybe I'll just make both, if there is enough interest. But that's just the easy way out...

04accordcpe

iTrader: (3)

im a little confused, are you trying to say people with the procats and people with the stock cats, cant share the same jpipe?? or am i not understanding...

there are only 2 different designs you can really go with, (besides what size piping and bends to use of course)... either make one that includes the 3rd cat (which i recommend), or one that deletes it. also, its been proven that procats + jpipe will loose power. so if your gonna have both, you better be FI.


^^ you mean like this? \/ 2.25 secondaries to 2.50 collector (3rd cat delete)




^^ you cant run them any longer than this, unless you cut your catback further down. if you do that, might as well go true dual..... this was a one of a kind jpipe that was made for me awhile back, but i ended up selling it since i was planning on going true dual (but it that fell through ). thats when i decided on getting another jpipe, but this time retained the 3rd cat.

this is mine right now \/ 2.5 secondaries to 2.5 collector (using 3rd cat)


^^not as attractive as the first one, but just as effective. how often do you look under the car anyways?

to be honest with you, my current one gives the same exact performance throughout the powerband as the first one, with the 3rd cat to boot. both gave the same thing, coming from two totally different designs. the ONLY thing i dont like about either one, both changed the sound of my exhaust. i loved the way my comptech catback sounded before, nice, deep and toned. i even put in a hi flow resonator to try and duplicate it, but was not successful. so now, i might be getting rid of this one and going back to the stock jpipe. yep, im choosing sound over performance for now.


ive had both designs and TRUST ME making the secondary piping longer will not effect anything. you guys are making this way more complicated than it is. if it was a set of headers then id understand... just design a pipe that doesnt have any crush bends, has a nice Y pipe design where the 2 pipes merge (very important IMO) and gives the option of using the 3rd cat.

04accordcpe

iTrader: (3)

this is what im talking about \/ see where the 2 secondarypipes meet? one pipe going into another. very restrictive

04accordcpe

iTrader: (3)

this is what im talking about \/ see where the 2 secondarypipes meet? one pipe going into another. very restrictive



now look at this design \/ much better IMO

aznbo187

iTrader: (1)

bluesap,

types-09 means that those with, and without the e-shift cat's are able to share the same j-pipe.

Anyway, I've seen the j-pipe you have before on the forums, and it looks quiet interesting. I'm not surprised that you didn't gain much from one design over the other. The exhaust function is quiet different in boosted cars, in which if I recall correctly yours is.

Let's see. The exhaust system is meant to scavenge and clear the head of any combustion remnants after the piston completes combustion and is approaching TDC (top dead center). As the piston is moving up, depending on when the the intake and exhaust valves are timed open, you would hope that all the gases release from the exhaust valve, so that the intake valve fills the cylinder with a fresh air charge without any residuals left in the cylinder. This is an ideal case if the piston were moving down creating a vacuum, and sucking in a fresh charge, and hopefully all this while the exhaust vacuums the remainder of the residuals out. Maybe on full throttle with a wide open inlet valve, this may be a possibility, but at different circumstances, for example at half throttle or less where the intake doesn't have the ability to pressurize the cylinder, you will hope that your exhaust system does a good job of scavenging the most it can.

It's different because you have a supercharger. It's true that a bigger exhaust diameter will be more beneficial in your setup, because you are able to reduce pipe friction that would be present with a smaller pipe diameter. But you don't need to worry about scavenging and eliminating the most residuals possible like the naturally aspirated engines. That is because with the supercharger, you are almost always at pressures above atmospheric in the intake path. This pressurizes the intake chamber so that when the intake valve opens, the fresh charge flows into the cylinder and forces out the residuals through the exhaust valve. It doesn't rely on scavenging properties of the exhaust because it's already pressurized to flow in the right direction, and flush out residuals on it's way making each stroke 100% efficient.

I believe if my ramblings are right, the naturally aspirated crowd will be the one to notice a bigger gain from this setup, versus the forced induction guys.

But when it comes down to it, I'll look at the votes and I'll try to make a decision that will hopefully make both groups happy. Which makes us all happy gruppies.

aznbo187

iTrader: (1)

I definitely feel you on that first pipe. Seems like the shorter runner just is ready to cause so much interference in that little intersection. Second one looks a lot more logical, but I'd still like to see something that doesn't use a pre-made universal Y-joint.

stillhere153

iTrader: (1)

remember when I aimed you and said you should just have a 3rd cat emulator, make it look like its got a 3rd cat for the guys who need them...

fireboy232323

make it so that our car makes sexy noises. whooo. so when the girls be watching my **** be poppin, you know wut I am saying shon?

poppin poppin...

type-s09

wtf? american gangsteR?

FiveLiterCheater

I actually lol'd after I read that...

Eoanou

I had a reaction that was more along the lines of what type-s09 had.

WTF who is this guy!?










Back to the topic, I think you should arbitrarily pick a design which you like best. But bear in mind that the J-pipe will alter the exhaust note pretty significantly.

crazymonkeytl

lets get after it

HQTL6SPD

I hope it's in a good way!

skyy406

So when can I buy one? I dont care what you choose...

Richie v6

Hey, does anyone know how much power gain is to be expected with a properly made j pipe?

aznbo187

iTrader: (1)

I believe around 5whp and 5tq is a good number, but we will see.

Eoanou

Is there anyway this could be coupled with cats for N/A?

type-s09

im all for the 3rd cat delete if it doesnt make the car sound like shit, doesnt throw CEL, and looses power

aznbo187

iTrader: (1)

You guys are not making the polls any easier with these similar results. lol.

ib18c1

iTrader: (6)

even though i beleive full straight pipe would benefit more, I prefer to have it with the hi-flow cat....thanks Cali

PS: just casted my vote

HQTL6SPD

I deleted my 3rd cat with a resonator. Now the car smells normal like most cars on the road, mostly just at startup. Then you can barely smell it. Now Im just LEV.

Honda abuses these poor cars with restricitons. Next thing you know, they'll have "SMULEV."
(super mega ultra low emission vehicle)

The low-end torque increase was very very nice.

aznbo187

iTrader: (1)

UPDATE

Looks like most of you guys would like to retain the cat.

This will go into production soon, and it'll be listed on the site.

Since there is more interest in keeping a cat, the j-pipe will have the option of keeping the OE 3rd cat, or using the high-flow cat.


Let's get those last minute votes in!

TylerT

iTrader: (1)

"Retain 3rd Cat w/ high flow cat". Would this particular J-pipe be legal in CA?

aznbo187

iTrader: (1)

Technically speaking, no because you are altering admissions. But, if you look at the 3rd cat, it's surrounded by a removable heat shield. I was thinking about creating the high-flow 3rd cat with mounting points, so when you install the new high-flow cat, you can simply take the heat shield of the OEM cat, and put it on the new high-flow cat. It will look identical, and pass smog.

jdmitr22

i vote remove 3rd cat. we have 2 already haha. or at least make an option, of like without cat, with highflow, and with testpipe.

aznbo187

iTrader: (1)

That's what it will be.

3 options.

J-pipe with OE Cat.
J-pipe with Hi-flow Cat.
J-pipe without 3rd Cat.