JuamPs 69

That is why my numbers of 290whp/262tq will give low 13 secs on good tires....My time will be based on a good 60 ft with tires...Tq and Hp will take care of the miles...Not to mention that MT is at least 100 pounds less than AT transmissions...If I run a 13.5@105 Im happy...In my opinion...extremely well driven I can pull a 13.3/13.2 on bad ass tires about 106/107mph...My car with me in it is 3,759lbs...numbers and videos will be posted on december when i return from Afghanistan...

JuamPs 69

To DAVE B...remember that a car may have a weight of 3,600lbs...Include driver and gas...Gas is about 7lbs per gallon...So numbers are correct it is close to 3,800 to 4,000lbs on the cars depending on how much you weigh and how much gas you put in...that is why the trap speeds are around what you are saying...Good rule of thumb...a trap speed of 100mph is about 13.9 secs...99mph 14.0/14.1secs this is on FWD cars...this is only based on my experience...
Think also if those cars were AT...they will have a harder time to make good numbers...They might be modded up the ass...but a lot of people you see them on the strip with 19 inch wheels sound systems etc WTF...that will not help...gain the speed or the times...

I hate cars

I wish I would've had my car dyno'd when I was running mid 10s. I bet the hp would be extraordinarly low for the ET and weight due to the torque. At least I would've had something to compare to now.

Yonkers914

iTrader: (1)

I honestly beleive ur not gonna trap anything higher than 103ish theres no way ur gonna trap 106-107 with ur mods it doesnt matter what tires u have on ur car. and when "CBR" ran that 13.3 he only trapped 103 it is possilbe u can match his numbers on a good day but thats about it. but good luck

JuamPs 69

Yeah you are probably right..."CBR" ran 13.3 having what mods on his car? was he Automatic or Manual?

Yonkers914

iTrader: (1)

He was a 6 speed manual and his mod's were=
tire setup was a road race tire
single outlet exhaust
Intake
crank pulley
header and down pipe
and ported lower intake plenums

He ran a 13.39 at 103mph and 60ft was a 1.9 which is really good. and many people forget that the track he went to (capitol raceway) like most MD tracks are great for timeslips lol the track is only like 20feet abovesea level!!! which is insane!!!

greco9885

iTrader: (1)

again


OP, what gear did you dyno in?

greco9885

iTrader: (1)

agree

MIR is especially awesome for times

any NJ track not so much

I hate cars

By far the biggest mod in that list is the tires. Only applicable on the 6mt since the 5at doesn't have traction issues on regular tires. Being able to drop the clutch does have it's advantages.

greco9885

iTrader: (1)

you would be surprised. im running bridgestone re-11's and when i went to the track with libert, i spun slightly off the line and spun at vtec

I hate cars

Well my TL pretty much sucks in the power department. On the NT05s with the Konis fairly stiff in the front I sometimes get a tiny chirp and that's it. I would imagine the TL-S 5at is a little more traction limited. I'm really glad my trans is holding up at this mileage but sometimes I wish I had an excuse to try out a higher stall convertor.

anx1300c

iTrader: (2)

+1

Good numbers and all, but in stock form the TL-S 6MT traps 100mph. A 37 whp gain is not going to add 6 or 7 mph to the trap speed of a 3500 lb car. 103 is more like it.

JuamPs 69

Yeah I stand corrected I'll be around 103mph give and take...Was CBR forced induction? Sound like it...from single exhaust to downpipe that is a hint right there...GRECO By the way, sorry not to answer your question earlier...for your knowldege rule of thumb dynos for this car in MT is in 4th Gear 1:1 ratio...Automatic transmissions 5 speed is in 3rd gear..
So I did it in 4th gear. I am currently working on what tires to buy for the track still undecided between 2 products...Either Nitto or BFGoodrich Drag Radials

greco9885

iTrader: (1)

actually for MT 4th gear is 1.25:1 and 5th is 0.98:1

so you should really be using 5th gear to dyno

auto:
First Gear Ratio (:1) 2.70
Second Gear Ratio (:1) 1.61
Third Gear Ratio (:1) 1.07
Fourth Gear Ratio (:1) 0.69
Fifth Gear Ratio (:1) 0.49

manual:
First Gear Ratio (:1) 3.93
Second Gear Ratio (:1) 2.48
Third Gear Ratio (:1) 1.70
Fourth Gear Ratio (:1) 1.25
Fifth Gear Ratio (:1) 0.98
Sixth Gear Ratio (:1) 0.77

EL19

iTrader: (4)

Cbr is NA buddy, downpipe=jpipe and its cheaper for us to make single outlet exhausts. Plus duals add weight.

JuamPs 69

Well thats nice to know about him being NA...Anyways...I've been on this business for a while now...4th gear is the call for the dyno not 5th...Anyways what do you guys know or recommend? I was thinking about getting the AEM FIC...Whatcha think?

Inaccurate

Why is the overall effective gearing ratio not used versus using just the transmission gear ratio?

I heard people mention about tire diameter in other threads being able to affect dyno results. If so, then a person should be using the overall effective gear ratio to determine which gear they should dyno with.

The Final Gear Ratio (aka, axle ratio) for the 6MT is 3.285.
Whereas for the 5AT, it is 4.428.



For example -


5th in 6MT = 0.975 x 3.285 = 3.203 Overall Ratio
3rd in 5AT = 1.021 x 4.428 = 4.521 Overall Ratio
This is a 41% difference.


Whereas *if* the 4th gear was used for the 5AT, the comparision in dyno results would be much comparable between the 6MT and 5AT.
5th in 6MT = 0.975 x 3.285 = 3.203 Overall Ratio
4th in 5AT = 0.666 x 4.428 = 2.950 Overall Ratio
This is a 8% difference.


Note - Figures for the 5AT are based on the Base TL, not the Type-S, in my example.

JuamPs 69

Cool post Inaccurate...Any word on using the AEM FIC for the Type S? Is it worth it?

Dave_B

I don't think you'll see 13.5s. That takes some seriously good traction. I'd recommend not wasting your time with drag radials and rather going straight for 26" slicks. Lots and lots of Maxima guys use 26" slicks and get high 1.6 and mid 1.7 60 foots with a lot less power. Assuming favorable density altitude conditions and on street tires, my guess is you'll run 13.9-14.2@101-103mph with a 2.1 to mid 2.2 60 foot. If the car gets 105mph traps then it's probably putting down a legit 290whp. Otherwise, that dyno might be a bit optimistic. There are lots of 290 and 320whp G sedans/coupes/Zs out in Southern Cali because there's a shop with a very optismistic dyno. We have 5 Dynojets here in Kansas City and a two of them pump out wildy different numbers than the other three. IMO, the dyno is good for two things:

1) Verifying gains and losses, assuming you use the same machine

2) Tuning

Dave_B

The ideal gear to dyno is the one that results in a ~1:1 overall ratio. Swaying from this ratio does impact numbers somewhat, but nothing very significant. Its usually 2% to 3% in either direction.

I hate cars

With that in mind, I'm not sure why we shoot for a 1:1 trans ratio when the 6mt and 5at have drastically different final gear ratios...

JuamPs 69

Hey...Anyone knows anything about the AEM FIC? I mean it retards timing which is not for naturally aspirated cars but so far it seems to be the best option for the other things fuel, ignition, vtec controlling etc...Any suggestions on what is the best product out there?

libert69

iTrader: (7)

The overall opinion around here is that the aem fic will do next to nothing for a NA car

BostonSilverTypeS

^1+ what libert said, AEM FIC for NA TL will do nada!!!(Hondata is you seeing this hurry up with a flash tune for our TL's)wishful thinking thats all....

Anyways did you solve your CEL issue if not minor suggestions

- are the sims installed in the right bunghole of the pipe
- since you didnt install it and the mechanic did, any chance he forgot to use the spacer

BTW good luck with getting 13.5..... Im thinking best you will see will be around 13.7ish but good luck either way

Nice dyno numbers by the way

greco9885

iTrader: (1)

not worth tuning any NA car. it is a waste, only tune FI cars because there are some serious gains.

stillhere153

iTrader: (1)

for the record I made 280/240

JuamPs 69

Cool I cancelled the AEM FIC order...Too many question marks...Regarding the CEL still working on it...Now it is the big debate about getting the proper tires...26 inch slicks it aint gonna happen...I do not want to hurt axels or anything like that...its my daily driver car...I will be heading home in 3 weeks for a quick break...By then I should have everything set up to go the track and come out with my expected results...ANy other suggestion on tires? Thanks guys

JuamPs 69

By the way...I guess we are all power hungry...Any advice without making it FI...on how to break the 300whp line? I guess I have all the bolt ons except for the pulley...What other things have been tried on the 08 Type S to break that power?

I hate cars

Drag radials.

JuamPs 69

Does anyone know what was the whp of CBR 169 when he ran 13.3@103? I saw he had the intake runners dones and the lower manifolds polished...Just curious what kind of power he was putting down

greco9885

iTrader: (1)

nitrous

a nice 65shot and u will run 12's with drag radials and a 1.7-1.9 60'. theres a video on youtube with a guy using nos and ran 12.4 and i think it was a base tl

you have such an advantage being manual

Sonnick

Good luck hitting 13.5. That is my goal as well. Make sure your motor mounts are still good. My mounts are shot and I get crazy wheelhop even when punching it in 1st gear. I've heard great things about both the Innovative and XLR8 mounts. These mounts should undoubtedly help 60' times and save drivetrain components as well. I'm not sure if broken mounts affect trap speed, but I'd think at least a little bit because of the movement of the motor in between hard shifts.

I only trapped 100.2 with my added PCDs/3in exhaust/ported IM, yet 100.82 with I/Jpipe. I'm blaming in on my motor mounts because the car is definitely quicker. My 60' was worse (@ 2.347 because I didn't launch) but I still ran the same 14.04 as my previous best. It doesn't make sense since I trapped less, so I'm assuming it was because of my mounts. Oh, and I had an unknown CEL.

Basically, 13.5 is entirely possible, but it's not easy. You need to have a sub 2.1 60' in order to do it.

EL19

iTrader: (4)

He put down a little over 270whp last I checked. I just put down 263whp in my Accord on the same dyno. Him and I just ran and were neck and neck the whole way. Accord only has CAI & RV6 longtube jpipe

Sonnick

^^ Very nice!! You gotta get some speedo vids up! I wonder how a run between us would turn out...

AtlM5

^^what kind of dyno?? Seems like it's reading way high...

greco9885

iTrader: (1)

263whp out of a 3.0l is alittle ridiculous

EL19

iTrader: (4)

Yea I have a 3.0 If you check the avatar you will see I have an 09 Accord with the 3.5 6MT 240whp

Sonnick

Why? I put down 255whp a few months ago with full bolt ons. My friend dyno'd on a Mustang dyno and did 233whp. He then did a pull on the same Dynojet that I did, on the same day as his 233whp pull on the Mustang, and dyno'd 204. I did 3 pulls @ NRG tech on Long Island. Greco where are you on Long Island?

My numbers are uncorrected, but it was also about 85 degrees and humid...

greco9885

iTrader: (1)

well my mistake

what were ur numbers at nrg, that place has a rep for breaking hearts, their dyno is almost dead on

way up north in suffolk

EL19

iTrader: (4)

No beef

I see their sketicism seeing as though I stated I made those numbers with only 2 mods. But you made some awesome numbers for the 3.0.