mfragoso1980

I need some help thought hooking it up can someone get me location of the stock amp and the wire scheme for what speakers are what colors and what is +/-.

As soon as I'm done Ill post pics and review.

ed99

Can't wait to hear some results from you.

GoBig

yes, let us know if there's an improvement.

mfragoso1980

My attempt was unsucessful but I am going to have it done this coming wenesday. Ill post review once completed.

Silver Sultan

What are your rims and tires? By the way I had a 8 inch Momo sub installed and an Alpine amp. I disconnected the stock sub and it sounds amazing. My friends who own TL's love the sound. The bass is rock solid, deep, and tight. I love being able to control the sub output. I just bought everything from crutchfield and had a local installer put it together. I wish I had the skills to put it together on my own.

msmith

Hi! I work for JL Audio and I wanted to offer some technical advice on integrating the CleanSweep into your TL. We did one here at JL Audio (belongs to an employee).

We used the inputs to the factory amplifier (rather than the outputs). We did not use the center channel (it still is connected to the factory amp to provide the NAV and Phone voice functionality). Simply turn the center channel level on the head unit all the way down so that it does not try to play with music (the nav and phone will still behave normally). We also connected an Ipod to the aux. input of the CleanSweep.

Obviously, the system is no longer 5.1 capable... if you played a DVD-Audio disc the center information would be lost, but it sounds ten bazillion times better than the stock setup. The one we did used XR 6.5-inch coaxials all around (no dash speakers) and a pair of 10-inch subs off an e6450 six-channel amp. The other factory function lost is the subwoofer level control. Fader still works. Balance, bass, treble all work. Bluetooth phone works perfectly, steering wheel controls work.

Here is all the wiring data to achieve a successful result:

Amplifier Input Side 20–pin connector
LF Speaker + green to left front + input of CleanSweep
LF Speaker – blue to left front - input of CleanSweep
RF Speaker + black to right front + input of CleanSweep
RF Speaker – grey to right front - input of CleanSweep
LR Speaker + white to left rear + input of CleanSweep
LR Speaker – yellow to left rear - input of CleanSweep
RR Speaker + orange to right rear + input of CleanSweep
RR Speaker – red to right rear - input of CleanSweep
Subwoofer + red/blue NOT USED (do not disconnect)
Subwoofer – white/dk. green NOT USED (do not disconnect)
Center Front Speaker + Brown NOT USED (do not disconnect)
Center Front Speaker – White/lt. Green NOT USED (do not disconnect)

We calibrated the CleanSweep at Volume setting "30"
The knob was installed in the center console (you don't absolutely need the knob mounted up front unless you will be connecting an Aux source, but it's a good idea to put it in).

Hope that helps... Thanks for purchasing a CleanSweep!

Manville Smith
JL Audio, Inc.

GunnmeTaLCURA04

sorry to sound like noob. but whats a clean sweep? I am going to buy an Alpine amp v12 5 channel. Does this go for my plans?

plans are:

5 channel amp:
1 FR + F. right tweeter
1 FL + Front left tweet
1 RL
1 RR
1 Sub - stock, until it blows.
center leave with stock. and if possible bridge stock so center gets louder too.

same for all speakers. keeping them till they blow.

ComptechType-S

MSmith,
I have changed all of my spkrs and added L.O.C's (one for the 4 ch amp and another for sub amp). If i install a "Clean Sweep" only on my 4 ch amp can i still maintain control over my sub (through the HU)? Or would that be a waste because of what the clean sweep does to clean up the signal? With my amp being a class D mono block amp does it really need a super clean signal?

Thanks!

msmith

No, you wouldn't really want to do that because you need the CleanSweep master volume control to control the volume for all the channels and because of the EQ correction. You could add an inline volume control before the sub amp input if you want that functionality. If the system is properly set up you really don't need a sub level control, by the way.

Best regards,

Manville Smith
JL Audio, Inc.

msmith

If you're not replacing the stock speakers, the CleanSweep doesn't make sense. The factory EQ curves are put in to compensate for the stock speaker's response.

CleanSweep is intended for those who wish to replace the stock speakers and add aftermarket amplifiers. It simply makes the factory head behave like a clean aftermarket head and allows an aux. source to be piped in.

Best regards,

Manville Smith
JL Audio, Inc.

ComptechType-S

Im in on the clean sweep!! Any chance of us getting a group buy on these bad boys

ed99

So with the clean sweep will replace a line converter too??

VelfarreClubber

I believe so

msmith

Yes, the CleanSweep eliminates the need for line converters.

King of Pain

I plan to upgrade my audio sometime in the near future. I plan to replace all speakers, including the center with CDTs components, add 1 or 2 10" subs to the back. This would be amped through a six channel jl e6450 and mono e1200. I am trying to understand what functionalities that are still avialiable to me after I install cleansweep and amps. You mentioned that you left the center channel connected to the factory amp inorder to maintian phone and navi function. Do the functions happen before or after the stock amp? If I was to send the center channel through the new amp would I lose phone functions?? I thought these functions happened before the amp in the HU.

Also, You mentioned that you turn down the center channel and lost 5.1. Since the center channel is still amped throught the stock amp does this not still maintain 5.1 ? The other channels are going through the new amp and cleansweep. The Balance may need to be adjusted or is the different in channel output too great?

I do not understand why the sub level control is lost since this happens in the HU, regardless of what amp is used. Does this function happen at the output from the HU or the output from the amp?

I am assuming that either coaxials or components will work with cleansweep. I just put the crossover after the amp to split the signal to the door and dash speakers.

Sorry for the long post. I'm just trying to understand and plan a good install. If anyone has a wiring layout for the TL stock audio system can you send it to me.

msmith

The CleanSweep only has four-channels, so you couldn't input 5.1 into it. If you leave the center channel connected to the factory amp... Since the CleanSweep is designed to act as a master volume controller... the level of the center would remain fixed if you turned it on and the rest of the system would fluctuate in volume with the CleanSweep control. If you inputted an aux. source the center would still play the OEM source while the rest of the system played the aux. source.

In practice, the TL images better with the center turned off when listening to stereo material. If you use a good pair of coaxes (don't use the lousy dash locations) you can get excellent imaging.

The sub level control needs to be implemented after the CleanSweep... many amps now offer remote level controls which could be used.

Hope that answers your questions.

Best regards,

Manville Smith
JL Audio, Inc.

jtlaw

I'm glad you got one. I've been waiting for these to hit the market. If you don't mind me asking, how much did you pay for it?

Booker357

I'm interested in upgrading my current sound set up, just the speakers and amps. Is there a 2 channel cleansweep? You could use the 4 channel for the front and back and the 2 channel for the center and sub. Also, does the Subwoofer channel need a clean sweep on it at all or can you just route it's signal directly to a amp? The proposal placed here are very interesting and I appreciate the input.

msmith

Booker, there is no 2-channel CleanSweep at the moment. It is theoretically possible to link two CleanSweep's together so they operate off the same master volume. In order for this to work in the TL, we would need to find out if the center signal is full-range (the CleanSweep needs a full-range signal).

You've got me thinking now, I'm going to try it and report back to you guys. It would be kind of pricy to use two CleanSweep's but it would retain the 5.1 functionality. Let me run a few tests.

As it stands currently, the solution I posted gives you full functionality with stereo source material.

Best regards,

Manville Smith
JL Audio, Inc.

msmith

Just finished measuring the center and subwoofer signals in the TL...

LFE channel (subwoofer) signal is low-passed (not full-range)
Center channel signal is full-range and equalized.

This brings up the possibility of using two CleanSweeps with a special volume control adaptor so both will run off one volume knob (or maybe off the OEM volume). The only sticky issue is summing the subwoofer signal into the main signals... will have to do some further testing on that issue. Maybe we can keep the 5.1 functionality after all? Hmmm.

Manville Smith
JL Audio, Inc.

mfragoso1980

What a wonderful product. Thanks for the wiring help. I was able to hook up everything in under 3 hours. Sounds great and straight forward.

I only hooked up a Jl amp and sub but I think this would probably be more suited to those changing internal amp and speakers. Its kinda pricey for just a sub and amp hookup. I only bought it because I want to leave my options open for the future.

Great Job JL AUDIO!!!

GoBig

Any chance of a 5.1 capable Cleansweep instead of 4.1 (sub is .1)?

msmith

It's possible we may do a 5.1 version in the future, GoBig.

How many of you guys listen to DVD-Audio discs in your cars on a regular basis? I'm just curious what the ratio of CD to DVD-A listening is among TL drivers.

Best regards,

Manville Smith
JL Audio, Inc.

VelfarreClubber

Not very often, unless there is more albums out. but it would still be nice to retain oem features

King of Pain

I have 6 DVD Audio discs. I listen to them regularly. I will probably buy more because I enjoy their sonic qaulities. I wish there was a better selection of current releases. Unfortunately, I think it may be a dying technology. VelfarreClubber is right though, it would be nice to retain the OEM feature.

Craig Treusdell

Manville -
Mostly cds (5 custom dvd-a discs with ~180 songs/disc in stereo), tried a few dvd-a titles but have only been impressed with the TL factory disc, waiting to try Blue Man Group on dvd-a

You mentioned a few things that would be nice with a followup:

1. JL employee's TL - 4-XR6.5 coax and 2-10" subs -- which subs and enclosure specs? I want a little more bass but can't decide to replace the factory 8" sub in IB or glass a box in the trunk's rear-most driver side pocket, haven't measured the volume available yet. Had 2 JL10w4s in my prior Honda Accord in sealed box with the 500/1 -- too much space and not enough bass (poor box choice on my part), not looking for as much this go-around. Suggestions for IB 8" or pocket sub?

2. Does JL have anything that would fit in the center channel location with little mods?

3. JL employee - Why the e6450 amp over the slash series? Smaller for 6 channels or what? Employees not paid enough? Or that close in quality to the slash series?

4. In another similar thread you mention stock hus are using DSP to correct speaker response. My '02 Accord with a 6-disc used passive correction. I found a signal prior to the eq (resistors and caps) and soldered some cut rcas to it. Spec'd it on a scope and all 4 channels had a flat response (wild response after the eq), with no noise. Do you know if the TL uses DSP or passive? I'm not as eager to pull this hu and solder to it.

5. The rears looked fairly flat. Can you post the center and sub response after the eq? I was wondering if an Alpine 3402 parametric eq could do similar corrections without having to bypass the center/sub/5.1/volume knob.

Thanks

msmith

1) He's using our dual 10W6v2 ProWedge system (CVS210RG-W6v2). A single 8 in IB is not enough for most people... I would go with the enclosed approach. A single 10W6v2 would do a beautiful job with a 500/1. This is what I run in my car. You only need about 0.65 cu.ft. net for it to do a great job.

2) One of our 4-inch TR's would probably fit in the center, but I have not tried it. The whole idea of using a much smaller center speaker than the left/rights is kind of bobo, if you ask me. The car images great in stereo with no center ch. with just a mild tweak to the wiring of the front speakers.

3) What's wrong with an e6450? It's actually a very nice amplifier. He probably chose it for budget reasons... despite the employee discount. He's got to make that TL payment every month.

4) Most all OEM head units use DSP processing now for the simple reason that it has become cheaper to use a single DSP chip for all audio processing (vol, bass, treble, fade, bal, EQ, etc.) than to use discrete analog circuitry. Even Toyota Corolla radios use DSP now.

5) While the max deviation of the rear channel response is within a 3dB window, the shape is such that it is plainly audible and detracts from sound quality. You could use a parametric filter to correct it... you would need 3 bands to attack that error effectively. Also, remember that the rear signals are assigned to the surround channels on 5.1 recordings so if you used them as main signals it would sound very weird with 5.1 recordings.

Best regards,

Manville Smith
JL Audio, Inc.

NewMexiCat

Manville:

I'm considering a similar install from my local JL Audio dealer. Do you mind telling me where you decided to locate the CleanSweep and the Amp in your install?

Thanks!

tfe691

Can the factory volume controls be retained. In my tsx i had an audiocontol 3.1 with the volume about 3/4 way up and used factory volume controls?

msmith

We located the CleanSweep in the front of the trunk next to the new amplifier.

Yes, you can still use the factory volume if you don't mind the bass boosting at low volumes and a degradation in signal to noise compared to the CS volume (more hiss). Just set the CleanSweep volume at a high level and use the factory knob or steering wheel controls.

DeathtoToasters

OK so here are my questions.....

With my new '05 TL since it is NOT a BOSE system, I can use my 300/4 and my 500/1 with the cleansweep I can keep the factory head unit and look?

Wow...this is progress. Where can I get a clean sweep?

Second set of questions. Does anyone know if a JL Audio Sub would fit in the same area as the current sub without cutting anything?

Any recommendations for replacing speakers?

Thanks

King of Pain

I have done some research on this since I am planning to do the same thing sometime soon. Here's what I found. Yes you can use your amps. You need to convert the line level out from the HU to RCAs. The stock amp is on the passenger side footwell. This is probably the best place to convert your wires, then run the RCAs to wherever you put your amps. I'm not sure of the wiring diagram. The cleansweep goes between the HU and the amps. Cleansweep just came out. I think I saw it on eBay already. The stock sub on the rear deck is 8". It's probably a good idea to go with a bigger sub in the trunk. I am going to do some custom 10" enclosures in the left and right sides of the trunk behind the wheel well.

I was using CDT Audio components in my 02 Accord and you can't beat the sound quality for the price, about $200 for the set. JL Audio makes some good coax speakers too. I guess speaker choice is really up to what sounds good to you. I had a pair of Fockford 10" subs in the back.

Somethings to remember and some obstacles. Since the TL is a 5.1 DVD Audio configuration you will need to do something with the center channel if you want to keep the 5.1 configuration. The best way IMO is to amp the center channel too. I have been eyeing the JL Audio e6450 amp. It is 45W X 6 channels, this amp should be able to power all 5 speakers. Your 500/1 should be fine for the sub. The Hands free link for your bluetooth phone comes from the center channel (I think). The cleansweep processor is only four channel. It would be perfect if they built a five channel cleansweep. Not only would this be good for the TL but also for future in-car 5.1 dolby digital theatre systems. There are some DIY posts for playing movies through the navi screen. Done the right way you could create a killer 5.1 dolby digital theater system in the TL.

That's a hint to msmith

I have a bluetooth phone and I want to keep my 5.1 configuration. That's my dilemma before I upgrade.

Hope that helps

DeathtoToasters

WOW that explains alot. Thanks for all that.

I guess I am not so concerned for the 5.1 since I probably have not utilized it yet. So I don't know what I would be missing.

My whole goal with replacing the 8" sub is the ability to not take up any more room then is already being used.

You mentioned having to locate the stock amp. Would I not just bypass the stock amp with the clean sweep? OR does it need some sort of amped signal, and that is why we are tapping in to the wires AFTER they pass through the stock amp.

Thanks again for the help.

elduderino

Manville, I'm curious what your response is to this question:

Why insert a Clean Sweep into a single-ended preamp output?

Did you RTA the OP of the TL OEM HU and find that it was EQ'd?

Did you want an EQ?

I'm curious. For many Acuras, it seems an un-needed $400 add-on that solves a problem we don't have.

tfe691

Huh? can you put in laymans terms please. I want to know your opinion on this. And what else would you suggest.

elduderino

Well, here's the deal:

1) Acura systems use a "single-ended" preamp output. That means that it's the same signal carried by an RCA cable, it just doesn't have an RCA end on it.

The Clean Sweep is designed to interface with head units that don't have "single-ended" outputs - speaker wire outputs or balanced line outputs, which Acura's don't use.

So that type of interface, which would be useful, say, in a 2005 BMW X5, is not needed by an Acura owner.

2) Other Acura systems lack any sort of signal equalization (i.e., built-in "tuning" for the car) inside the HU. When they have it, its in the amp or another external device.

The Clean Sweep is designed to have an equalizer inside to reverse the effects of such equalization and give you as flat a frequency response as possible.

But that feature is not applicable if the signal is already flat. So I was asking if JL has actually RTA'd (measured with an audio analyzer) the signal to the OEM amp. I am open to believing that the signal is EQ'd, but in the absence of evidence I am more inclined to believe that the signal was flat until it got inside the amp, and there was an EQ circuit inside the amp.

If the signal is flat out of the HU, then the Clean Sweep is not needed to reverse any OEM EQ effects.

3) I have not yet tested the 3G TL. However, the TSX has a clean and undistorted single-ended preamp output all the way to 40 on the volume control. I have had IASCA-winning installers tell me that the TSX is the cleanest-sounding OEM HU they've ever worked with. I'd put my OEM HU TSX system up against any Clean Sweep car for SQ comparison (it has $800 of MSRP gear in it).

So "cleaning up the sound" is also not an issue, if the 3g TL HU is as good as the TSX HU (and I beleive that it is). I've heard a 3G TL with all aftermarket amplification and I didn't hear any distortion in it at all that I would associate with a crappy HU preamp signal.

In conclusion, I wouldn't want to recommend the JL Clean Sweep to anyone as a $400 solution to a problem that they don't have... so that's why I asked for RTA (audio analyzer) information. That's the only reason that anyone who doesn't work for JL would want to put one of these in their car.

msmith

Why not? I'm not sure I understand the gist of your question.

Yes, we did and yes, it is equalized. I posted measurements in this thread: https://acurazine.com/forums/ramblings-12/good-excuses-118874/

We simply wanted a flat response from the source and a clean, linear preamp with an aux input. That is the purpose of the CleanSweep. You could, of course, add an EQ to make acoustic adjustments, but with good speakers and a good install it is not really necessary.

If a system has flat signals available, a CleanSweep is not absolutely necessary but it can still clean up the audio by acting as a very high-quality preamp. It also gives you a clean, line-level aux input.

The TL's head unit outputs are not severely equalized like some others I've seen (Acura MDX for one), but it still benefits from the response correction CleanSweep provides.

Best regards,

Manville Smith
JL Audio, Inc.

tfe691

This ? is for elduderino,
If i understand you , rca's can be soldered on to the left and right channels before they get to the stock amp?

If this is true do you know what the voltage is coming out of those wire from the hu?

elduderino

I don't know what the voltage is, but I suspect it of being similar to the TSX - like a non-4V HU.

But since Manville had already posted quality graphs (since the merger I was unaware that the 3G TL forum had it's own damned audio section until yesterday - argh! My sincere apologies for not having seen your earlier post! I have a lot of info to go through...) I would say that you do want to insert some kind of signal correction on the fronts. I hereby officially restrict any past comments of mine about to Clean Sweep to non-3G TL owners.

Thanks for the detailed reply, Manville. I was familiar with the purpose of the CS - I've drawn those block diagrams on a dry-erase board too - but I've discouraged using it in the TSX over and over again since the HU OPs are single-ended, it's flat, and it's clean.

Unfortunately, as Manville knows, it's impossible to depend on an educated distribution channel in the 12V world any more. JL does a better job than any other 12V supplier of educating their channel, but there are still plenty of 19-year-old kids who are put out on the floor with insufficient training and meagre experience who will try to sell a device like a Clean Sweep to people who honestly don't need one - mostly because it makes noob installers feel more comfortable about interfacing with OEM HU's - an installation task that for years was seen as impossible to do well by old-timer installers.

This OEM HU interface issue is a challenging one, and I think JL Audio has made great strides in addressing the main issue - installer resistance. Most of these installers wouldn't know single-ended from balanced differential if it ran over their foot, and they have no access to an o-scope, little access to the shop RTA, and often no access to a voltmeter. In such an indirect-distribution-channel environment, a product has to be very well designed from an implementation standpoint in order to get used successfully in the field. Any of the typical install/adjustment assumptions made by a double-E will come back and bite you in the ass. ("Then the installer will simply use a tone generator and their oscilloscope..." : )

Manville, is this form factor smaller than what I saw at CES?

msmith

Form factor is the same as what was shown at CES.

Many of the Bose systems have flat diff/balanced head unit outputs (as you know). While CleanSweep serves no function to correct the freq. response in these applications it still acts as a great preamp and aux-source input (albeit an expensive one). You can hear an improvement in these cars too, although it is nowhere near as dramatic as when the OEM signal is equalized (as in the Gen3 TL).

Thanks for the comments.

Manville Smith
JL Audio, Inc.