hoTLanta

FYI,

Just some software I happened upon. Anyone seen this before or better yet, try it at all? Maybe a watered down version of this can run on the embedded windows environment? Looks like you can explore the iPOD contents and stream audio from it. Like I said before, just some ideas.

http://www.redchairsoftware.com/anapod/

gt1

hoTLanta if you mean to run this software on Navy, forget about it. Navi is not even Intel CPU base, and no one has been able to hack it yet.

hoTLanta

Noone you say? Bysin did......

https://acurazine.com/forums/showthread.php?t=21434


Its true that the navi is not your typical Intel based PC. Here in the original thread started by bysin over in the TSX forums he exlplains the basic specs of the NAV computer(SH-4 processor and windows ce which is what my girlfriends iPAQ pocket PC runs on. I am 90% sure that applications can be written for it.

DO, or DO NOT, there is no TRY........lol

gt1

It is long way from replacing a BMP image to running programs. I've seen many people to come here with hacking claims, but none of them have achived anything. You are another one.

zax123

I was just thinking... I don't know if I remember correctly... but when I was playing with bysin's technique of extracting files from the navi system, I think I remember the calendar application being a stand-alone .exe. If someone could write a program for SH-4 and compile it, we could perhaps simply replace the calendar.exe with that program and run it from there? The new program could have a link to run the calendar program if necessary. I dunno, just an idea.

hoTLanta

Disclaimer *I NEVER CLAIMED I HACKED ANYTHING*

Replacing the BMP is the tip of the iceberg. I just tried the BMP replacement last week. The bin files on the navi disc are basically a file archive, just like the ones on your windows install at home. Noone has the source code but alot can be achieved through hex editing(sometimes undesired).

If anyone actually wants to TRY something instead of discouraging people on the forums. Here is a link to get started. This is a link to the CE homepage. I havent tried the test kit yet, but I will try it some at work tonight if I get time. I will post if I come up with anything. I believe the different bin files on the navi disc are for which model car you have.

Ex: My TL is using version BNHH401A.BIN which is defined in the diagnostics menu(version).

My goal is to get the navi app running on my pc at work in a virtual SH4 environment. We will go from there.

hoTLanta

oops, forgot my link

http://msdn.microsoft.com/embedded/g...e/default.aspx

gt1

I am discouraging people so they wouldn't waste their time trying to achieve impossible. OK, let's say you will write a Anapod clone software for a navi and run it. I can bet $100 that you will not, but we are in "if and "would" territory here. How will this software of yours get an album and artist info from iPod? Does Music Link transmit it to the head unit? I don't think so. Even if it does, how do you know if head unit will understand it and send it to the Navi? I am sure it will not.
Our head unit and Honda CD changers were designed without CD-Text capabilities and thus have no facilities to process and display title info from iPod, and no software will fix it.

gt1

I think I remember someone trying to replace calendar.exe with tripcomputer.exe from Honda or Acura bin file and it didn't work.

jjh1234

Although I agree that it is probably impossible for us to modify the operating system to display the info, I believe that Acura could do it if they wanted. Rememner that the music link uses the same connection to the head unit that the XM does, and the xm is able to transmit song info and the HU displays. I believe all the hardware is there. Maybe we can keep our fingers crossed for an update from Acura.

Maybe we should start a letter/e-mail/phone campain to Acura requesting this feature.

What do ya think?

jjh1234

zax123

I agree that we probably couldn't get iPod information to display on the navi screen, but Acura probably could if they wanted to. I was just thinking we could get other things running on the Navi platform perhaps. I really have no idea though. I think setting up an SH4 emulation test environment is very difficult...

gt1

Music Link uses Honda CD changer command set. I am pretty sure that it is not capable of text. otherwise they woudl include this feature in Music Link. Rquesting the feature will not do any good- car companies tend to rely on their own market studies. In any case, it will not do us any good- any upgrades will be only for future models. I am confident that with 2007 refreshment or, in the worst case, with 2009 redesign TL will get a proper iPod interface and MP3 capability, but we are stuck were we are.
So what do you think- am I being pessimistic or realistic

rstark

My , you are extremely pessimistic. Your posts discourage anyone willing to attempt to program. Chill out and see if someone is able to hack the code. Reverse engineering takes time and if you're going to shoot down anyone willing to try, then you've accomplished zero hopes for everyone else.

hoTLanta

No hes right, noone should bother trying, we should wait 4 years before hooking our ipods up right. By then we might even have 11gen iPODs, that are so small you cant even see them!!!!

Kidding, he doesnt bother me.

Ive been doing alot of research and application gathering. If anyone else wants to try, I think we can mount the .bin files from our NAV dvd right into the Windows CE Platform Builder, FOUND HERE (evaluation version, 120 days I think).

*warning* The install for this evaluation version takes a long time because it downloads cab files from MS during install.

THIS PAGE is filled with tutorial video downloads and links to other very helpful resources.

If I can mount all the images seperately, and find one that has a working calendar app, then we might be able to simply rename the bin file to the one that our car loads, burn to disc and load it. So we can at least get that working.

Windows media player 10 is available in an embedded/mobile version and could possibly be added. Started from the same screen used to start the calculator app. This app also displays track info. My girlfriend has this app on her Pocket PC, an iPAQ rx1955 and it works flawlessly.

Anyway, Ill update when I have more news or ideas.

If anyone knows some of the hardware specs(EX. available disk space for bins to be stored) or even the protocol used between NAV and XM, I would appreciate if they could post them.

gt1

I am discouraginf people of blowing hot air and making empty promises. Some things just can't be done. One example is MP3 player in Navi, another one is getting our radio to display the titel info from iPod. If radio could do it, Honda would implemet it- it would only require few lines of code in Music Link CPU.

gt1

OK, I did a quick dissection of Music Link. This is what I found so far:

Connection to iPod

• FireWire Power
• FireWire Ground
• 3.3V Output
• Audio L Output
• Audio R Output
• Audio Ground
• Serial Tx
• Serial Rx

IC chips and my suggestions on their purpose

• NEC uPD72042BGT- IE Bus driver (to communicate with radio head unit)
• MC4558- Amplifier (to amplify iPod audio higher voltage)
• Phillips HEF4066BGT- Quad bilateral switch (to switch audio between iPod and XM)
• ST831-4- reset (to reset processor on power up)
• Microchip PIC16F876A- Single chip computer (This chip talks to the car and iPod and makes them understand each other. It contains all secrets of Honda communication protocol)

I have datasheets for all chips and uploaded them for all interested parties to see: Datasheets

ITL

good stuff...it's all about the TX/RX

gt1

I agree. This is just a guess, but I think that when iPod is connected, Music Link sends a command to go into AiR ("OK to disconnect") mode over the serial link. If serial wires are cut, we should be able to use iPod's own controls, but not ones on the radio or the head unit.
DOes anyone know about PIC programming?

zax123

Guys, why do you need to leave the serial lines connected at all? That's what I'm confused about. If you want to use the iPod controls, you are basically turning the Music Link adapter into a very expensive AUX adapter. Or if you want to be more specific, you are turning it into EXACTLY this:

http://www.logjamelectronics.com/bli...ink1dmxv2.html

which can be had for $79.95...

Why not just return the Music Link and buy this unit?

hoTLanta

I agree. Use THIS ITEM with the Blitzsafe and you have the same thing you are trying to accomplish. Ok, minus charging.

jjh1234

BECAUSE THAT UNIT DISCONNECTS THE XM RADIO!!!!

gt1

For me- two reasons:
-I am still going to try to figure out how to retain both iPod and car controls.
-I bought this adaptor for OEM quality in performance and craftsmanship

dan.....k

iTrader: (1)

zax123

Sorry about that guys, I didn't want to upset you. There is also a PIE X3 adapter which will maintain XM radio and at the same time give you an AUX input which could be an iPod. If you are trying to maintain both iPod and car control, then I understand your plight. As far as OEM quality and craftsmanship goes, I think it's fair to say that the quality of the aftermarket AUX adapter is probably up to par with that of the OEM. As it is, not very many people are fully satisfied with the craftsmanship of the OEM unit. In any case, I don't want to start a flame war and I wish you good luck. I'm just trying to let other readers know that there are less expensive alternatives to the Acura Music Link.

gt1

You are wrong here. Many people, myslef included, aren't satisfied with features of Music Link, but so far every one mentioned that sound quality is excellent. When using multinput units with additional cables and adaptors for charging you still end up spendind more than $100 for equipment ofunknown quality. I paid $190 including shipping, but I gained a simple one box plug and play install with no surpises, high audio quality and even some hope of getting the steering wheel controls. May be I overpaid a little, well, people spend much more on installation charges.

colberto

A few pages back, we were talking about blocking PIN #21 on the IPOD. Some folks have ordered extention cables so they would not hack and ruin the original installation of the Music Link.

Has there been anyone yet that has simply tried to block this pin? I keep hoping for an answer that it either works or doesn't...so we could move onto other possibilities.

colberto

A few pages back, we were talking about blocking PIN #21 on the IPOD. Some folks have ordered extention cables so they would not hack and ruin the original installation of the Music Link.

Has there been anyone yet that has simply tried to block this pin? I keep hoping for an answer that it either works or doesn't...so we could move onto other possibilities.

gt1

Pin21 idea is dead- this pin is not connected to Music Link at all. AiR mode is set by command from Music Link over the serial interface. I will try to block the interface for a few seconds after iPod is connected and see if it will help. If not, I will explore possibilities of blocking this command by reporgramming PIC, but this is a long shot.

JustinZ

well,

i have an older ipod and it it has the remote connector, cant we just wire up those connectors to the music link and get it to trigger those instead of from the dock?

that way it wouldnt force it into the AiR mode

jjh1234

I plan on disconnecting (or maybe adding a switch) the serial connection once I get my parts from ipod_connector@hotmail.com. Been waiting since 1/16. Let's go!!!

jjh1234

dhartung02

I got my parts in today. I am planning on using a cat 5 cable as the wire for soldiering. It is going to be a difficult soldering job, but i will see what i can come up with.

Hopefully we all can make some progress in this!

jjh1234

Just got mine too. Man, those pins are friggin' small. Cat 5 is a good idea. I am probably going to bend out the pins I need. Going to start with audio only. See if it works without the serial. I'll worry about charging if the audio works.

jjh1234

jjh1234

Bad news everybody. I ruined the first connector while trying to solder to it. I figured that I would do some experimenting with the OEM Music Link connector before I continued. I used a very thin piece of cash register receipt paper to insulate the serial link pins (11,12,13).

As I suspected, I regained control of the iPod, but the Music Link seems to mute the audio input from the iPod if the serial link is not established, so I had no audio.

I blocked the audio pins (2,3,4) just to verify I had the pin orientation correct. The iPod was in OK TO DISCONNECT without audio, so I was correct that pin1 is on the left side of the iPod when plugged in.

I don't think it will be possible to keep control of the iPod with the Music Link.

My only workaround is to choose a "DISC 5" selection, disconnect the cable from the iPod and cue up whatever album/playlist/song I want to hear, then re-connect the cable. The Music Link treats whatever you selected as an album and plays everything you cued up.

jjh1234

dhartung02

What i dont understand is....I did it....i dont know how i did it, but i used the ipod while it was plugged up through the music link. It IS possible. there has to be a way.
What if we just disconnect the serial recieve, or the serial send?
any difference?

jjh1234

Maybe if we just disconnect the serial receive, the iPod won't get the AIR mode request, but may still send enough info to the Music Link to keep it alive. I don't think I can be that precise with my paper insulator. I don't have the motivation to try soldering another connector. The recepticle is 10x worse. You gonna give it a try?

dhartung02

im gonna see if i cant tinker with it tomorrow.....i dont know if my soldiering skills are up to it though....lol we shall see

pbradley303

Hello guys.. i really appreciate all the work towards this solution. I just had the music link installed to my 04TLNav. My primary motivation was for the sound quality. I didn't realize i would give up control over the iPod controls. Big Bummer.. I've also found when listening to an audio book or podcast, it doesn't retain the track position when returning to the iPod after disconnecting. It also seems to reset some of the iPod settings after disconect (ie . Shuffle, EQ, ect..)

Keep up the good work!

JustinZ

the repeat all option that gets enabled really pisses me off, I dont want to hear the same song again

dhartung02

Well i went ahead and started on the female end, because i new i wouldnt have any problem soldiering it. Well i started bending out all of the pins i wanted, and got about half done soldieing it and the soldiered pins began to break. They are just too small for me to soldier by hand.

Im sorry everyone, i just dont have the experience to soldier those by hand. Maybe someone else can do it.....or figure something else out, hopefully!!!

JustinZ

i remember when i used to solder smaller pins

i would use tin foil in a V shape to slide into the pins so only 1 was at the isolated solder it that way and then go 1 by 1, no need to bend anything