Hello.


I have a non-navi 2005 TL with the OEM deck, amplifier and rear speakers still in tact. I had a sub installed (Alpine MPV-M500 Amp + 2-12" sub speakers) with an AudioControl LC2i tapped off the factory sub speaker wires (factory sub unplugged).


I had the front speakers replaced with Focal PS 165 components because I blew the front passenger OEM speaker.


I previously had a 4-channel amp installed by my local car audio shop, but had it removed because first, it did not really improve the overall volume situation and when the deck was powered off I could hear an annoying whine...so I had them remove it.


As it stands, my system works fine, especially the sub setup...I am okay with the overall sound but find I am lacking in general volume. After reaching 30 on the head the factory amp just cannot properly power the speakers.


So, I am back to the drawing board looking to upgrade my amp...when speaking to my local car audio shop, they are recommending that I keep the factory amp to power the centre speaker and tap the front/rear speaker wires coming out of the factory amp to go into a new amp. When I explained the previous whine issue, they recommended the clean sweep before the amp...but that adds a $400+ extra price tag to this endeavour which I would rather not spend if I do not have to.


My questions are as follows:
- where are bass/treble levels, balance, fade etc. processed, in the head unit or the amp?
- in concert with the above question, if I remove the factory amplifier, do I lose bass/treble level, balance, fade etc. control? Other than losing the centre speaker, what other cons are there to removing the factory amp?
- any idea why I would get a whine when the system was shut down?
- lots of pros and cons to the Cleansweep...is that hardware as good as it purports to be??? Has anybody experienced it picking up random noise (read this in a review somewhere).
- Any current Cleansweep users...there is an option to use the head unit volume only or use the Cleansweep gain button to control overall volume level...what are the pros and cons of each direction?


I apologise for the long post...I have spend quite a while researching the above and want to make sure I do this correct the first time.


Thank you in advance.

 

To further complicate things, my OEM deck CD changer crapped out on me...I have a USA Spec PA-15-HON-3 that I connect my iPod to play music from...from what I understand, the Cleansweep works by inserting a CD into the car to generate tones so that it can perform its magic to level the signal...does no CD player mean I cannot get the Cleansweep programmed correctly??? Could I covert the CD to MP3, dump it on my iPod and program the Cleansweep that way?


Thank you for any help in advance.

 

you do not need a cleansweep. you need an amp that works properly with the low signal coming from the factory head unit. I agree keep factory amp for center channel and rear fill. new amp to your components. The JL amps work well with the TL signal. some of the Alpines too. you can search. otherwise you need a line driver. do not take the signal after the factory amp

 

Thanks so much for your response pohljm...


A few questions about your recommendation:
- Have you personally had success with a decent JL or Alpine amp in your TL?
- Can you make a recommendation on model of either? What would I look for from each manufacturer?
- Just for my information, why are you so vehement about not taking the signal after the factory amp??? In almost all my research that I can recall you are the first to recommend this approach...


Thanks again for your insight...

 

I run an XD700/5. the XD amps work well with the signal. there are 4 channel and two channel XD's. I run 4 channels bridged.

If your trying to improve your sound, then using a signal after it has already gone thru a super cheap crappy amplifier and picked up all of the noise associated with that poor amplifier is really an awful way to begin. Now your going to amplify that signal again with all of the noise too. Always use the best source you can. That would be the pre amp signal from the HU. I have no problem using the factory amp to drive the center channel and rear fill.

 

pohljm


I did some further digging into why you have had success going straight from the OEM deck into a new amplifier and found this thread:


https://acurazine.com/forums/audio-b...ential-816968/


It did not make sense to me (to your point) why one couldn't simply replace the amplifier and run straight from the source...then I read about differential-balanced signals. Not only does it make sense that the output from the stock HU appears to have a weaker signal, but why other people not using amplifiers that had differential-balanced inputs (of which JL amps do) had noise/ground issues.


I also decided to dump the installer I have been using as well...their response to tracing noise issues was "unfortunately you have to throw money at it"...to which my response was "see you later"


I contacted another installer and will have them install either an XD400/4v2-4 channel amp (leave centre on old amp) or like you, move to the XD700/5v2-5 channel amp and run everything.


Thanks again for your reply, I appreciate your time and learning from your experience.

 

You can see what I did in my build thread here

https://acurazine.com/forums/audio-b...-fever-854353/

 

phhljm


Thank you so much for your link and input...I learned quite a bit from your post...


Last few questions:
- why did you install your amp under the seat? Was that to minimize the distance from the HU to the amp? Does this mitigate noise?
- how was the amp secured under the seat?
- any issues with it getting disturbed, kicked, knocked around?
- did you ever end up replacing your rear speakers?


Thank you so much for all your help.


Tim.

 

Just to add some more for you to consider; you should decide if you want to enjoy multichannel music or if you are going exclusively with 2 channel. The TLs have the pretty cool DVD-A capability and I find that I enjoy the discs that I have. I saw that your disc changer crapped-out so maybe you are going to pass on the DVD-A capability.

Because I wanted to have the multichannel setup I was not going to be able to fit my equipment under the seats so I went with a trunk setup:



Most quality amps will have balanced inputs and most will also have selectable single ended inputs as well. Just make sure that you follow the amp's convention for balanced input wiring. There is an installer in the Silicon Valley named Bing and he runs Simplicity in Sound; he is the master of high end TL installs and he recommended using a pre-amp from the TL's head unit to run the signals into the trunk area. I chose to go this way and I can't tell you if it was necessary; it's just the way I went.



If you do go with just a 2 channel system then the recommendations about keeping the factory amp for the center and surrounds is good advice. The CleanSweep is used primarily to take out any equalization that the factory headunit applies to the signal. The TL headunit has been shown to have a pretty flat output and doesn't require the CleanSweep for that. If you are happy with your sub setup then you could just go for a two channel amp and you probably could find one that fits under the passenger seat. Use the head-unit's pre-amp output before the factory amp. If you are going 2 channel and you are up for replacing your sub amp then I would recommend getting a 4 channel amp (with 2 channels bridged) and driving the sub from a low passed front L/R signal instead of using the head-unit's subwoofer output. This will give you better ability to blend the subs and your main speakers.

Good Luck.

 

i also have my amp under the front seat and the crossovers under the passenger seat. i have a JL 3 channel amp however i still have slight noise issues with the JL inputs (hiss/white noise constantly but gets drowned out at volume 5 or so until there's a pause in the music or quiet spot). i've tried my amp along with a brand new JL 3 channel amp (mine is used), as well as 2 ground spots with the paint ground away. i have tried a few different line drivers (my front signal is taken pre stock amp) as well as a variety of noise filters with no luck. i even used new cables draped over the seats to avoid picking up noise but the noise is coming from the stock wires somehow when i take it just before the stock amp. i'll prob take it to a shop soon since not having something perfect bugs me.

back on topic, i just use heavy duty velcro to hold down the amp under the seat and it does more than enough to hold it down.

there are no issues with it getting knocked, i've had people sit behind me and they didn't even know it was there.

i don't see any reason to replace the rear speakers unless you want more work

i ran my sub post stock amp using a line out converter because i wanted head unit control over the sub levels and didn't want to install and mount a remote knob for the sub control....plus i was getting the same noise issues when i hooked up the sub pre stock amp and the sub had a constant buzz which sounded horrible.

make sure you add sound dampening to the doors, that makes a huge improvement even on stock speakers.

i plan on putting up my audio thread soon, it's a very basic system (fronts and sub on a 3 channel amp) but i had to learn a lot on my own and learned more along the way trying to solve this noise issue (unsuccessfully).

 

Check your private message

 

Nice Zapco amps in this install, you definitely know what you getting

Its hard for me to help you guys out since I'm not using any of the OEM head unit in my car, everything is ripped out, I think the best way to get where you want to be and make your system sound good, You will need a DSP Digital Sound Processor. You could fed the connection of high input in to a DSP like MS8, Alpine H800, helix, just to name a few.

You will use that signal from a processor in to amplifiers,
One thing you need to know about JL amps and Alpine small foot print.

If your looking for quality and want to spend some money on good amps, get Mosconi, Zepco, Zed, Ground Zero, old school sound stream or rockford fasgate, just to name a few, also arc audio

make sure you go with Class AB amps..

I really dont like Calss D amps.. even though they are smaller foot print and produce the power, but they are just not for me, others may like them..

Some people say, all amps sound the same, when power is created. well they are so wrong.