Ethernaut05

Local shop; great reputation..they totally came in at a very fair price. I want to put subs in trunk in a ported box; i'm looking for a bass that I can feel; not one necessarily that rattles doors/windows in my development! I want clear, precise not muddy bass.

Travis from Gig Harbor recommended RF Subs/amps..and i'm onboard. The gentleman at the shop recommended two 10" P2D2-10s and a RF 500-1BD 500w amp from RF...in a ported box with a PEQ control knob up front.

Whats your thoughts? You think RF is a good brand? Why two 10s? Why not one with a 300w amp? Won't that box take up a TON of room in the trunk!? I was going to get a custom side enclosure from Gig Harbor but they kinda assured me that a flat out box pointed back will give more punch then a side mounted 'stealth' box?

I don't wanna pay JL prices..so that's out for now. Let me know and I really appreciate it! Also..what to do about the bluetooth/internal mic for noise reduction?

Thanks!

eggyhustles

Low end RF subs? eh. The amp is cool, though. What prices are you getting these for?

If trunk space wasn't a huge concern, ssa dcon 15 would've been my choice.

Ethernaut05

Hey Eggy! Thanks for the reply. The SSA's look cool. I kinda had my heart set on the RFs ever since another member on here talked me into it. The 15 would be HUGE! I would like to have a small amt of trunk space reserved for those occasional Costco runs..

He's installing two P2D2s the 500W amp, a dual custom ported enclosure; the PEQ bass knob; the Raptor line output conv..all for under $700.. It's less installed then if I ordered all those things from Crutchfield.

Why two tens vs one 12? i dunno? Still can't find any reviews on the P2D2-10s

eggyhustles

Those should sound cool in the "right" box...who's to know how they're box making skills are, though and what that box will be tuned to. 1 dcon 10 ported will occupy 1.25 cubic feet. Wont have a gob of output, but it'll sound great & you'll buzz the mirrors for sure.

Ethernaut05

ok..let's say i'm up for the dcon..why not the xcon..which ONE ten would YOU choose? Can i just wire up a 300w amp then? the RF one? and forgo the more expensive 500w..where would YOU get the box from? thanks eggy.

eggyhustles

The xcon is a 1750w sub. You'll have to dump a huge chunk of change into your electrical to support that + a stout front stage.

The xcon is a completely different animal compared to the dcon. Next up after the dcon is the icon. That would be even better and would work well with 600-700w...but for efficiency's sake, lets stick wit the dcon.

The dcon only needs around 250-300w to perform well. It'll handle more, but it doesn't need it at all. Box wise, i'd get it made online.

ohsixMTee

iTrader: (2)

I installed 2 P2D210's in my wife's car mated with an Alpine 500 watt mono amp and it sounds really good.....in my opinion they are great subwoofers for you buck.

ohsixMTee

iTrader: (2)

If you do go with two make sure you choose an amplifier that will run stable at 2 or 1 ohm(s) otherwise you will have to wire them to a much higher resistance level.

Ethernaut05

awesome responses. I'm a little confused (not hard). I love the Dcon subs..the youtube vids i saw on them look great, although you never really get a good feel for the sound via youtube! I'm half tempted to just go with the Fosgate 300 watt amp with the two P2D2-10s from RF..they seem like good subs with a great sound, plenty of power. I wonder if one of those tens would leave me hungry for more? I'm also curious...how would those two RF 10s sound in a ported box NEXT to one ported xcon 10? what amp would I need for that? I should prolly just call SSA up and get their recommendations on what amp/sub I need. The audio shop told me if I want my own equipment put in it's no problem. THey DO build their own boxes. I wonder what ya'll think about car-audio shops quality on shop built boxes vs custom builds at home via blueprints? or websites?

Still searching these many billion threads to find out why one would install ONE ten vs two or why not ONE 12? Dunno.....oh well.

eggyhustles

I'd only consider the xcon if i was willing to spend the money on the project. You'll need to supply it with around 1500-2000w + have an electrical system to support it. Oh, and have a stout front stage to keep up.

I wouldn't even bother with the 10, either...they work in small enclosures, so opt for the 12 or 15 sealed.

Trunk Monkey

iTrader: (1)

How about post up your budget for amp/subs AND install. We will get you fixed up. Also..what are your goals? Pure loudness, sq, what??

I hate cars

One thing to remember, more excursion equals more distortion no matter how good the sub is. More expensive subs won't have as much disortion as excursion goes up but it will increase no matter what. This is one way you can partially level the playing field, use two cheaper subs instead of one expensive sub that will have more excursion.

I'll always stuff the largest subs in the car that will fit, it doesn't matter if it's for SPL or SQ. When people see my two 15s the only response I get is how loud it must be but that's not the purpose. With a pair of large speakers, they have no visible excursion during normal listening and very linear and distortion free. Lots of cone area is always a good thing.

The box won't fix a bad sub but it will determine most of the frequency response. A small box high Q setup will give more of a boomy sound while a large box will give a deeper, quicker, more SQ type sound and require a little less power in the lower frequencies. If you have limited space for a box, you're better off using a smaller/or fewer subs in the right sized box than two subs in a box that's too small.

You can always go IB. I have 90% of my trunk space available with 2 15s, less than 200w to hit full excursion, digs deeper than the boxed setups and amazing SQ, tight, detailed, etc. It's really the best of all worlds. It will be about as loud as a sealed box in the mid frequencies and louder on the low end. It won't be as loud as a ported setup. I can never go back to a box after running several subs like this.

The sub Eggy mentioned should do well in an IB setup and looks like a great overall sub. That one might be next on my list to try in the IB.

Some people like distortion. It took me a while to get used to the lower distortion subs. They sound colder to me and you don't realize how loud they're actually playing until you try and talk over them. Distortion makes subs and all speakers sound louder than they actually are. While they sounded cold to me, after wathing a live band play with the drums unamplified, I was amazed at just how real my bass is. The warmer sounding setups sounded good but were not as true to real life.

Ethernaut05

WOW..awesome response to my posts re: sub layout in the TL-S I own. I'm a total newbie and after I read your post I"m all over wiki, and a dozen or so forums and some damned scientific forums reading about what all the terms you mentioned were like IB and SQ etc.. So..that was enlightening. So..I don't know if tech savvy audiophiles like yourself would even ever bring your car to an audio shop or do all the work yourself?

I'm not sure if I found an example on here of what a IB setup looks like. But here, I ask you this; granted I AM A NEWBIE so be gentle here! If you wanted to max out no more then $750.00 would you do the two Rockford 10's P2s? with the 500W amp? Do you do ONE 15 ? If so just tell me what brand do i buy..? Do I trust the shop to build my enclosure?

I'm not looking for the loudest system..I am looking for a kick in the ass but I want SQ over loudness. I'm not looking to shatter windows..I just want a sweet ass setup that will last.

Tell me how I ask this shop to proceed? Rockfords all the way? two tens? one 12? one 15? (how would that look in my trunk! that's HUGE!?) I'm needing a little more direction on this one.

Point is; I"m ready to pull the trigger NOW on this; fall is coming and that is time for me to crank up the Thievery Corporation CD and start feeling some hitting bass!

Thanks again!

Trunk Monkey

iTrader: (1)

Do you think you'd be able to install this?? It could save you a bunch of money and you'll be able to get better stuff. We can help ya through it. Even if you had a shop install the amp kit and run the wires to the trunk, running wires from factory amp to trunk and installing everything is very simple. I will say that you might be disappointed with the factory comps when you add sub(s). It will likely drown out most of the vocals if you listen to rap, etc or listen loud. I would think about upgrading comps VERY soon also.

Where are you located at?? There's a few decent setups on here for sale and I'm looking on DIYMA for you too. I would buy used with that budget. You'll be able to get something 10x better than P2's and a small amp.


By the way, this is IB (link below). In simplified terms, it's taking MDF to make a baffle board (usually over 2" thick for rigidity) and securing it somehow. You need to seal if off from the cabin so that cabin and trunk are 2 separate parts. It'll make sense if you see the pictures below. This is a great way to retain plenty of trunk space, get amazing SQ and still have plenty of output. You don't need to run any high rms amp's either so it's very easy on your electrical. It cuts down on rattles and will dig very low for rap, etc and hit highs like no ones business. If I had the time and a damn garage...I'd be all over IB. At 105+ everyday for over a month now, its hard to work on the car. There's a Tempest X2 over at DIYMA right now for $175 shipped. Good IB sub

https://acurazine.com/forums/showthr...nfinite+baffle
https://acurazine.com/forums/showthr...nfinite+baffle

I hate cars

You have to watch that Tempest in IB. I ran one for a couple months. It's a HT sub and it requires a TON of eq to make it sound right. Amazing low, low bass but doesn't want to play past 50hz. It does have a TON of excursion. Xmax of 27mm and xmech of 38mm. Basically 3" of total excursion but again, unless you only listen to rap it might not be the best choice. Toward the end I was getting the low end tamed but it was requiring -10db at 20-32hz and +10db at 50 and up.

Ethernaut05

@trunk/I hate cars; I'm so happy I"m a member of this incredible forum. Nothing is impossible in here! You guys reel me in then you totally lose me with tuning subs and such based on hz and excursion..i'm lost in this sea of SQ and other symbols! Now when ya'll say comps I'm assuming you mean component speakers? In the TL-S I understand they are very good OEM? Now that statement prolly surely makes me a noob?!

I AM willing to do this install myself..if you tell me that it will be better then a shop..I KNOW that when you work on your own stuff it's usually always with more care and love then any stranger..that's why I built my own deck; a 1000sq ft. Trex deck. I never even knew how to operate a power tool before that.; But I joined a home improvement forum and spoke to guys like you who coached me through..and I know every inch of that deck and know it's better then it had to be!

NOW..lets say...$700-$800 I listen mostly to DANCE>HipHop>Rap>Electronica/Club>R&B>Techno ; so maybe that can help guide some decisions. I have and will continue to use these many thousand threads to help myself if you truly think I can do this from the beginning to the end??? I don't wanna F*&K my car up!

What amp is out there? what sub? IB? boxed/ported??? It's difficult for me cuz it's like asking people what's the best food? Dry Aged Steaks? Sushi? Chocolate? It's SO Damned subjective. That's part of the huge-confusion for me. ONe says this is a great amp the other says it's not great...or it needs tuning (I highly doubt I can 'tune' a sub)

Trunk; if you find a killer product for me..and some others agree..i'm 100% on board. I'm sure i can find a step-by-step install guide somewhere in here!

I will spend more if it's a win win for me...but sounds like i should pocket the loose change for a future comp upgrade!?!? On that token; I hope a 500w amp would suffice for future upgradeS?

Ok..back to basics? one sub; two subs? ib sub? two smalls, one large? lol..craziness; gotta love it! Thanks all for your time!

Ethernaut05

"Now I have the Acoustic Elegance IB15s and I've never heard anything this good. They'll play to 150hz easily and dip below 20hz with authority. Very, very little power required also."..I hate cars
You had me at Hello!! WOW..that says a lot. Gotta tell you...let me know how I can get onboard the IB band wagon..I want in. If it sounds that good and takes up less space why so FEW people doing it!? What kind of $ would I be spending to put two AE IB15s and what amp I'd need for those?

geekybiker

The install is more complex. IB requires a custom fit baffle board and you sealing the rear deck. Throwing a seal box in the back is dead easy. I'd love to do IB as well, but making the baffle is putting me off. Maybe IHC or someone can put together a template? AE IB15 are about $175 now I think? Its not listed on the site. Another popular choice is the FI IB3. If comes in a 15", or you could do a single 18" with it. I'm not sure about the fitment in trunk. 18" is a huge huge speaker.

Ethernaut05

I'm up for the task. The IB sounds very wicked cool. (no not from Boston). I'm almost 100% sure there is a template for this and now that i've accumulated a ton of power tools; I wouldn't mind using them to do this! The AE's sound awesome; but one 15? two smallers:? How bout an amp? which for what? I did read in another page that the author says when using IB systems the bass should come from the front and not the rear! SO..I don't know how u over come that one? ALso why are the subs pointed forward in the IB system?

geekybiker

You can do 1x15" 2x12" or whatever. Most subs designed for IB work tend to be larger. Its all about the cone area. (The SD spec on the speaker). For an amp- I assume you don't have anything now? Get a class D amp that accepts balanced input. I think kicker makes the cheapest ones Ive seen. You don't need a ton of power for IB.

The bass coming from the front is more an issue of crossover and processing. Don't worry about it just yet. Subs tend to point forward in IB because that leaves the more protected basket of the speaker pointing into the trunk. Much less likely to poke a hole in a cone accidentally someday that way. Also you get to see the cone through the ski-hole then.

Trunk Monkey

iTrader: (1)

^ Good info here OP. If you do IB, cone area is king. I would definitely do a pair of 15's as they won't look stupid back there and they'll sound plenty loud for those days you want to have it that way. Most people associate 15's with being loud and that's it. Same as when people assume 10's are for tight bass and 15's are for low bass and getting loud. I understand what you mean about being overwhelmed on forums but you'll begin to get the hang of what brands are good and what's not. What model's are good and what's not within those brands..etc etc.

One thing I will tell you is that AE (Acoustic Elegance) makes some great IB subs but they take a looong time to get to your hands. If you're looking to do something now, you might want to go with a FI IB3 15" or another brand as they'll be ready to go in no time at all. I think the owner at AE had a few problems but he's slowly getting back on track and figuring it out. I have a feeling i'll be going IB in my next car as it's just a huge space saver and sounds awesome to try something like that.

eggyhustles

I'd go ported with the dcons

No one has tried them IB yet(that i know of)

Ethernaut05

what amp you talking here Eggy? Sure I can prolly find one here in AZ? How bout with the AE line? IB system amps?

Trunk Monkey

iTrader: (1)

SSA Dcon is a sub. AE is another brand that makes subs. As far as an amp, that just depends on if you go 1 or 2, sealed, ported, or IB.

http://www.soundsolutionsaudio.com/

I hate cars

I agree that AE is not a brand you want to go with if you need the subs now. Supposedly the lead time is only 3-4 weeks but that's what I was told too and it took 5 months. Worth the wait but if you need it now I would go with something else. I used a 12W6 in this configuration and it sounded very, very good. There are two 12w6s for sale right now on DIYMA.

I would decide on the sub and the type of enclosure before deciding on the amp. If you had two AE 15s, 500w would be enough for both. If you go with a pair of 12s in a sealed box, you would need a solid 1,000w or more for your typical small box 12s.

I don't like to tell people to experiment with different subs IB that others haven't tried because the spec may look IB friendly but it can still sound bad which was the case with the Tempest X.

A ported box will give more output but will require eq to flatten out the boost at it's tuning frequency or it can sound sloppy. I really like ported boxes because you have less excursion for a given SPL but it will require EQ to get the best SQ out of it and the box will be a little bigger than the equivalent sealed box. Ported has the potential to sound better and louder than sealed when done right.

IB is a lot like a sealed box except with much more low end and usually better transient response and a flatter frequency response when running large subs. People run lots of cone area in IB because it's so easy to hit full excursion at low frequencies with very little power. Lots of cone area in IB is no more important than in sealed except with a sealed box it requires a ton of power to hit full excursion while it's so easy in IB that people tend to push them a little harder. I've seen some tests where IB requires 10x less power at 20hz than a typical sealed box at the same level.

Again, the large subs are going to be just as "tight" in the upper bass range but with a lower Fs value, they're going to hit the low frequencies much easier with less power required. The only downside to a large sub is the space it takes up but there are many advantages both in SQ, efficiency, and SPL.

jda123

I ordered an AE sub 2 months ago and have not gotten it yet. It took me 3 weeks to get an FI.

If you go IB, then do a pair of 15s. A single 15 is not very impressive in my car output-wise. It is as explained above very well - to compensate for the lower output, I crank it up and it starts to sound bad.

I hate cars

I think I would have been happy with a single AE sub but I like the fact that there's practically no excursion when using two. One very good thing about these subs is you can use them out past xmax and they sound just as good as at low volumes. They get louder but no change in the overall sound. You can use them right up to xmech and still have great SQ. Of course, you have to expect a 6 month wait time and if they come in sooner, that's a bonus. I've had mine ordered for a few weeks now as well.

I think the right single 15 would be impressive. You'll have the same or more low end than a 15 in a sealed box and as long as the Le is dealt with and flux modulation is kept in check, it will be just as loud up high as well.

Ethernaut05

Man..finding reading material on IB setups is like reading the build sheet for a freaking communications satellite!! Found one pretty wild read here http://ibsubwoofers.proboards.com/in...lay&thread=413
Otherwise great stuff on the DIYMobile site...comes down to pretty much EVERYONE unanymously agreeing that IB (done CORRECTLY) sounds fantastic!!

Now my question is: Can a noob (a TOTAL noob) (although I'm learning quickly) do a custom IB setup in my 07 TL-S? would I need a subsonic filter to ensure proper tune!? I STILL cannot find a build list and walkthrough on AZ for IB setup.

I'm ready to roll with this and would love to take you with me on this bass-journey! I'm all in with everything I've read on the AE IB-15's (if I can find them preowned) otherwise I can wait. The FI IB15's also sound good but a runner up. Still not sure what amp you'd all recommend to power two IB 15s? And lastly, can my TL accom two 15's in a IB setup in the forward 'notch' of the trunk?

ANyone live near PHilly? Delaware? Otherwise I gotta give it to SSA. I wrote them a letter and the vicepres personally wrote me back re: DCONs and amps..so I'm keeping that option open. Two DCON 10s or 12s in a ported box will take up A TON more space and require a TON more power then the iB setup while perhaps still not reaching the same SQ.??
Thanks!

I hate cars

Sorry I forgot to post my pictures when I got home yesterday. I can give you a link with a couple until I get home again. They are the unfinished pictures, right now, the subwoofers are invisible, it looks like I have a stock trunk with no system. https://acurazine.com/forums/showthr...nfinite+baffle
The subsonic will allow you to run more power to the subs without fear of damaging them from over excursion. I set mine at 20hz because that's right at the limit of human hearing. It won't cut into any of your music but it limits material that's below the human range of hearing that would only cause over excursion and you wouldn't be able to hear anyway.

There are a couple builds lists on here but I can't find them with the slow work computers. I'll look for them when I get home.

Ethernaut05

You DA MAN HatE! I cannot wait.

The saga continues....in the meantime Aaron from SSA is ready to hook me up on a combo deal with a set of DCON 10s, the Incriminator Audio 5.1 OR the Sundown SAX-125.2 (class-a/b) Amp. What's your thought on that?? More traditional sub layout with ported box. He recommended Audible Customs to do the custom build.

Look forward to those links Hate: and everyone's input on the DCONs?

Trunk Monkey

iTrader: (1)

dcon's are great budget woofers and 10's will get plenty loud for you and still sound decent. I definitely wouldn't get either one of those amps as you'll be quite a bit under the power they like and you can pick up something for cheaper. Maybe he meant the Sundown 100.4 as that would give roughly 300 per sub @ 4ohms, but either way you will be able to help the budget by picking up a used amp at DIYMA or something. I hear the Dcons like ported so you'll be looking at a 2.5cuft box for 2 10's or roughly 4cuft for 2 12's. The 12's are only 10 bucks more a piece so if you went this route I would decide if the extra space lost is worth it.

Other players in the game...
Arc Audio: http://www.woofersetc.com/p-7336-arc...subwoofer.aspx
Dayton HO: http://www.parts-express.com/pe/show...number=295-460

I hate cars

This was during the construction phase so ignore the sloppiness and wires everywhere. When you pop the trunk now you see no evidence of a system. I have cloth that matches the factory carpet behind the subs and you only lose about 7" so to most people it looks like a factory TL trunk. I built a flimsy frame for the cloth to stretch over and it's removable if you want to shove stuff under the speakers for more space. If I can build this stuff with my lack of skills, anyone can.

On the inside I removed the plastic frame around the skipass to open it up more on the advice of Niebur3 on here. It has black cloth over the skipass from the back side so with the armrest down it looks factory, no evidence of subs. You can play it with the armrest up if you want to carry 3 passengers back there and it still sounds good but you lose a little output. It's not really a problem because there's so much overkill already built in.





Here's the baffle I built. It's just two 3/4" MDF sheets. One with two 14" holes for the subs to sit in and another with two 15.5" holes that's glued and screwed to the other one for support. After it was installed I added additional bracing. Cut it roughly to the shape of the trunk and then seal up the gaps however you want. There are several effective ways of closing the gaps.





You can face the subs forward or backward. It won't make a difference in sound unless you cross your subs over high like I do. If you plan to go past 80hz, they should have the cone toward the front.

The neat thing about this setup is you're only adding about 45lbs total with the two 15" subs and the baffle.

I hate cars

For what it's worth, my old sealed box with two 12s came out to that second crease in the carpet toward the rear of the car. The same subs in my bandpass setup came out just past that last crease so I couldn't flip it up to get to my amps with the box in.


Also, if you want an amp that will accommodate any setup you throw at it and you won't have to upgrade or change if you change your setup down the road, look at the Zed Leviathan. It's the only 6 channel that I know of that does 150wx6 and 300x6 at 2-ohm. You can use it as a 4 channel for your highs and bridge it for 600w for the subs. If you decide on the IB setup, 600w is all you will ever need.

I own a very high end McIntosh amp, a JL 6450amp, a $100 Interfire amp, and now the Zed. I'm not sold on so called "SQ" amps. The only thing you need to look for is decent quality with a low noise floor and of course, the features you require. I can't hear a difference between the high end McIntosh and the $100 interfire. Those two are extreme opposites in price and reputation and I can hear no difference. The speakers I have pick up every detail in the music, you notice things in the music that you've listened to your whole life and that you never heard before. If I can't tell a difference in amps with these speakers, you're really not going to tell a difference with the average $200 set.

Where I have noticed a huge difference in SQ is jumping up to a more powerful amp even if you don't like to listen to it loud. Eggy on here told me early on to run a powerful amp and I didn't listen, I had to go through trial and error but I wish I had listened. Having a ton of headroom even if you don't turn it up helps out the dynamics in the music tremendously. Being able to play the softest passages but keep up without distortion on the really loud passages which can be 30x louder that the softest notes requires lots of power. I have mine bridged right now to deliver 300w to each door speaker even though I don't listen to it very loud that often. There's a big difference in SQ between a 75w amp and a 300w amp. The Zed will give you all the power you could ever want. It's pricey but it's one of those things you will never have to upgrade. It's also very flexible with many options for highpass, lowpass, etc.

Trunk Monkey

iTrader: (1)

Zed Leviathan

IHC- So you have your amps mounted in the spare tire space?? Any pics of this?? I really thought about doing this as it'd be out of the way but the fear of getting no air down there is the only thing that worries me. I swear, with my luck, the day I take that out and put the amps in...I'll get a flat tire lol.


Ethernaut05- Unless your willing to wait 2-3 months for subs, I would looks elsewhere from AE. I VERY highly doubt you'll find some AE 15's or SBP15's....ever lol. And if you did, you would have to be one of the first people to see that for sale add! Great subs but you have to be willing to wait. Great for people with other stuff to play with or try...but just letting you know. There's a few other tried and true IB subs that could work for you.

FI IB3
Image Dynamics IDq 15's (ID is no more so these might not be found. I hear the Arc Audio sub is damn close to the IDq though)
Dynaudio Esotar
JL 13w6
Dayton makes an IB sub

I hate cars

The Zed amp is the best I've ever owned including the McIntosh. It's the most efficient amp on the market and the most powerful 6 channel out there. It stays cool and sounds great due to the available power. I can't see myself ever running anything else.

The Zed eliminated the McIntosh since it was so huge. It fits under the seat barely. At one time in the trunk I had the MS8, an old Infinity 300 Digital amp in the spare tire well, a McIntosh, and an Interfire. Going to order a second Zed Friday which will take it down to only 2 amps for the entire system. Not bad considering there are 8 fully active channels to run with a couple of them bridged and a ton of power to each channel.

The final goal is to have both Zeds under the seats and the MS8 under one of the subs on the trunk floor which would be behind the false wall and the spare back in. I want a system with zero compromises that looks stock and would be hard to steal.

The AEs are the best IB subs out there. He could do what I did and get something cheap until they get here. I got the Tempest X and it was ok since it was temporary.

IDQ15v2 is a great IB sub and cheap. I've personally heard these in Neel's car.

The Esotar gets great reviews IB but I think it's over a grand. I'll probably give it a try one day.

I have a hard time recommending subs I've never personally heard. A guy just tried a 10W3 IB which looked like it had the right specs for IB, I told him it would probably sound good and it sounded horrible to him. Same with the Tempest X. Great specs but just didn't sound good on anything but rap.

One thing to keep in mind, the low distortion subs take a little getting used to. They sound a little colder but once you get used to them, you realize they're more life like.

Ethernaut05

Ok..I was all over the AE site and their store no longer even LISTS the IB series for sale!? wtf? Does this mean I need to email the web guy there?? Or; perhaps turn my focus to the FI IB3?? sounds like a good match? The Zed Lev is pricey at close to $600; issue with me is I need a course on basics..that's why I feel like this is over my head. Band pass, Cleansweep, what is a MS8, do I need to 'tune' my IB system? I am feeling less and less confident now..too many terms.

I would need constant support through the build, a complete build sheet for this dual 15" install and a place to buy the amp the speakers, etc..(I know where to buy MDF) but not where to get high quality wiring. etc etc..I love the earlier repost on the walkthrough but that was for a standard box setup..this is for IB..

finally; our cars have that internal mic for noise reduction and I would have to disable that; which I hear can jack up bluetooth? Would I need to do specific things to address that? DIYMobile has a ton too and i joined there as well...still looking for that hand-holding "step 1, step 2, etc...buy A, B, C..etc."

I hate cars

We can walk you through it no problem. I only have a minute but I'll get into more detail later.

The MS8 and such are processors. They will allow you to tune the system using eq, time alignment, and individual level adjustments. Not required but it can transform how it sounds. With the MS8 I have an actual sound STAGE. The music sounds like it's coming from a live band out on the hood. You can't hear each individual speaker, the sound is out in front of you and up high like it's coming from a stage. On a well recorded live disk, you can hear where differerent instruments are placed and where the singer is standing (or moving).

With a processor, your amps only need a minimum amount of features. All of the bandpass, lowpass, highpass, etc are taken care of by the processor. If you are going to run a processor, all you need is a basic amp.

Search for some of my posts from only a year ago and you'll see I was right where you are now.....over my head. It's overwhelming at first and one day everything just clicks. I learn something new almost every day but I have the hang of it now.

AE doesn't list the IB15, you have to reach them by e-mail, phone, or preferably on their forum..

The Zed is pricey, it took me a month to get the money for it but I have a bad habit of buying stuff just to upgrade a year later. With this amp, you won't be upgrading.

Hang in there, it will become easier and easier.

eggyhustles

For a new guy, IB shouldn't even be an option. There is no air spring on the driver, the only thing controlling it is the suspension and the genius behind the volume knob.

sealed or ported would be safer, imo.

Ethernaut05

there actually is an awesome total IB walkthrough from ELECTRODYNAMIC...not shabby total build list and everything else. I think I'd be able to manage..I just don't want to do a half ass job. Meaning I don't want to get the amp wiring sub installed and have it sound like S*&T!

EGGY: I have that forward section of my trunk I'd be willing to sacrifice AND Aaron the VP at SSA has been awesome in getting intouch with me quickly. I'd love to see two of those 10"DCONS in there.. He gave me a vendor for a ported enclosure..do you think it's possible to get it in a 36wx16h space? I don't wanna go more then 24-36 deep if poss.

You think the Minotour is overkill for 2x10dcons? Sounds like the DCONS would just be wired up to the amp and the box made and installed..bada-boom-bada-bing. The IBs sound touch and sound like they may need a lot of tweeking?

Safer...for da noob! lol

I hate cars

That's where the subsonic filter comes in, it adds that safety net. Set it at 30hz/24db and you'll be almost as safe as a sealed box. After you get a feel for it, start bringing both numbers down.

I was one of those people that thought you did not need response below 30hz because most music rarely even gets into the 30hz range. One thing I learned after I went with an IB that will go down to 7hz if you take the SS off, impact is just as important as what you hear. If you want a true SQ system, it has to have the full response and that includes down to 20hz which most systems won't produce. You get an impact down there that you mostly feel rather than hear but it adds so much to the music that contains that material. Plus it seems like it plays the more common 35hz-50hz rap stuff effortlessly.

If you were to cut it off at 30-35hz with the SS filter, you wouldn't require a pair of 15s, a 12 or pair of 10s would be fine. The huge cone area of the dual 15s is to reproduce the super low material that IB does so well.