I just joined this forum but I've been reading the posts for awhile now and the thing I've noticed is that, even though the TL is a serious performer, other than the odd G35 comparision, hardly anyone compares the TL with other performers.

Here's my situation.

I am currently driving a 2002 Grand Prix GTP (please keep the bashing to a minimum... ). Whatever else you can say about the GTP, it has some serious oomph under the hood carrying 240hp, 280 ft-lbs@3800rpm . Needless to say, its take-off at the line is sweet, and the supercharger gives it nice passing power at pretty much any speed.

Now my lease for the GTP is expiring and I've decided to move on to bigger and better things and so have decided on a 05 TL (mainly based on what you guys have been saying over what the G35 folks say) that I'll order this week (NBP/Camel, AT w/NAVI).

May main concern is that I've become spoiled with the GTP and so I'm wondering if anyone can comment on the TL's take-off at the line and responsiveness while driving at different speeds--things that I always took for granted. The 270hp, 238 ft-lbs@5000rpm is just too hard to gauge against the GTP's stats.

When my friend had a CL Type S, he was never able to take me from a stand-still and so I won every race due to the take-off (we always raced safely... ), but I know the TL is beefed up from the CL-S.

Any comments on what I might expect?

 

By order of the great poobah in the sky, all performance comparisons, otherwise known here as "VS" threads, that originated here were moved to Cars & Bikes Forum or, in the past, those that dealt with racing other vehicles on highway or streets were moved to Ramblings. Now, all VS threads go to Cars & Bikes, so you will find them there.

I will leave this thread here as long as the replies deal with the TL's performance, but if it evolves into a VS thread, I will have to move it also.

 

I would consider the TL's power "refined."

You will not have the grunt that your GTP had...
(American vs Japanese = American always more low end / Japanese always more high revving...)

But your power delivery will be more refined throughout the powerband...

As we all get older we seek; nay we crave a little more refinement... a little more luxury...

And the TL, my friend delivers it all for an all inclusive price, which betters most of it's rivals...

Good luck with you decision...

Cheers
Salut
Ciao

 

If you want stop light boy-racer fun, buy one of those styling-impaired GTOs. The V8 sounds amazing and it will jump off the line but it does look like a Chevy Cavalier and an Olds Alero had an accident. ZERO styling. As for specs, are you talking autos on the GTP vs. CL-S? The 2004 GTP at 260hp w/ AT does 0-60 in about 6.6. The 2004 TL w/ AT, 6.3. The real fun is having a GTP try to keep up with you at high speed with some nice twisties. There is no comparison, the TL would run away from it. The top speed on the TL is about 15-20mph higher as well. I won't even go into quality/reliability comparisons.

 

Why not just go for a test drive and judge for yourself?

 

I did, but even though I'm 34, I look ~25 (not just tooting my horn...) and so all *three* dealers where I test drove seemed very reluctant and not that interested in trying to sell to me, and so even though I got to drive the car, opening it up was out of the question. I guess around here if you look 25 and are looking at a $45k-$50k car (Canadian), you're supposed to have your old man with you otherwise the dealers think you just want a joy ride...

 

one things I have to say about those nice new GTOs and GTPs... they are only 4 speed automatic you will lose more power @ transmission

 

To me...I always like Japanese styling...other than the vette and viper..but then again its whats in the hood that makes it a beast. IMO...the GTO/GTP is a GTO/GTP...a TL is a upscale class car..you can never go wrong wit luxury and thats something the GTO lacks..as well as time sequence...yes the TL is fast in the 0-60 range...but if u really want a fast car get a SPORTS CAR not a SPORTS LUXURY SEDAN. The adrenaline in a TL is outstanding...once u sit in one...u will feel the passion to keep driving the car.

 

No comparison, the TL is faster at any speed. Thats the sweetness of the TL its never out of breath. Its got plenty of juice below which increases as the RPMS rise. You start with a smile which simply gets wider as the engine spools up. No Detroit iron feels that way.

 

I think the GTP might be quicker off the line - until the TL reaches 4000 rpm in first gear. After that, the TL's computer always finds the sweet spot to shift at. You have to keep the revs up on a TL engine to get that power, whereas the GTP probably has a lot more grunt in lower RPMs.

On the highway, the TL is a beast. Again, the computer makes the best shift for a given speed - but the RPMs will be high.

 

You can get the GTO with a 6 speed, fyi

 

http://www.pontiac.com/specs/specs_c...=models_prices

shows...

Standard 4L60-E 4-speed automatic transmission
Available Tremec close-ratio 6-speed manual

we both are correct... however, it would suck for those who drive an auto... my point is that pontiac needs to work on its automatic trans...

 

Your Grand Prix has considerably more low end torque that translates into more grunt at low RPMs. You will notice the difference versus the TL's 238 ft/lbs of torque, at a higher RPM than the Grand Prix's IIRC.

The TL has a better top end. 270 hp. versus 240 in the GP, and makes peak hp at a higher RPM (I know this without checking based on the hp/tq #s of each car). Once the tach edges past 4000, you will notice a lot more grunt versus the tendency of the GP to run out of breath at higher RPMs. The TL is much happier in the upper part of the rev range, so keep it there and you won't be disappointed.

Bottom line, you have to work a bit harder to get max performance out of the TL, but if you do you will get more than the GP gave you in stock form. Obviously, the factory-supercharged GP has more cost-effective modification potential, but you don't sound like a guy who wants a 400 hp GP with questionable long-term reliability.

 

Well put!

 

GTP is torquey u will miss it ........... this becomes evident going up a hill the car struggles overall i love my car but comming from an 4.3 L V6 SUV from GM i can say that. Plus i drove the new GTP's before i bought my car this car(loved the boost meter and HUD). But the main reason i got the Acura is because it will get the girls(lux) while the GTP will get the guys(supercharger). Its corny joke i know. ANd dont hate on me I love my car and wouldnt change it for the world

 

Excuse my language... but,
Fuck that...
So what about your age or how old you look... there are 25 year old millionaires nowadays... with computers and the stock market some young bucks have made many bucks... So who's to say you're not one of these folks...
No matter what your age... when I test drive a car I test drive a car... You need to tell the salesman to shove it (politely of course) but a test drive is just that... a session in a vehicle you would like to purchase, if you do not test the brakes, acceleration, and handling (90 degree turn fast) then how are you to know what everyday with this car is going to be...
Now if you drive like a granny (sorry to all grannies out there) then the normal test drive will do...

The only thing I have to say is when you take your test drive like that, know that you are subject to all rules of the road and responsibilities for accidents or tickets you may get...

But woulnd't you feel better about your purchase, knowing that you were a better, more informed customer who go what he/she wanted rather than settle for something not knowing exactly if the braking on the car you bought was spongy which you did not test during the test drive but rather found out seconds after almost killing a family of four crossing the street...

Sorry for the tirade... and the length of this post...
Respect and be courteous to salesmen but, don't take shit from them... (any car salesmen on this board... flameon...)

Peace
Salut

If you want to see how bad they can be treated check this out...
http://acura-tl.com/forums/showthread.php?t=97156

 

Interesting. I actually make it a point when I'm looking at cars to dress like a grub (e.g. sweat pants or dirty jeans and a t-shirt) to see how well I'm treated. I've been doing this since my mid twenties. Believe it or not, most salesman (especially those at luxury dealerships incl BMW) have treated me very well despite my appearance. In fact, if I'm not able to take a test drive by myself (without a salesman as a passenger, that is), I don't bother - I won't buy the car since I know I won't be as comfortable test driving it and I won't get the feel for the car with that joker riding shotgun. If they say it's for insurance purposes, I know they're full of it since most places just give me the keys.

 

I'm actually pretty surprised that your GTP could take the CL-S - I'll assume that's an automatic, since an MT one should be faster than your GTP even with a novice driver. In any case, I think what you may miss, as most have stated, is that torquey feel (i.e. being pushed back in your seat). Although the TL has plenty of torque, it won't match the low-end stuff you're getting now. The TL will be faster, but it may not seem like it - the power delivery will be smoother, the engine will be much quieter, and power will continue to develop as you enter higher RPMs.

That being said, the TL offers much more than this - and much more than the GTP could ever offer. Refinement, luxury interior, classy exterior, excellent handling, a sporting yet comfortable ride, etc.

One other thing - although many people talk about "torque steer" in the TL, it's not the same torque steer that I remember when driving GMs that I owned previously (incl a 3800, and a few 3100s). Those always pulled to one side on acceleration - regardless of the condition of the road or even if you were accelerating very quickly. My 6MT TL only dances like that when accelerating hard on bumpy roads, and I've heard that it's minimal in the AT.

 

I'll chime in here because I own a GTP as well. 2000 GTP with quite a few mods.

I've done:
3.4" Supercharger Pulley (Stock is 3.8)
Cold Air Intake
Cat Back Exhaust
PCM

I have yet to drive the TL, but might go check it out tomorrow.

As far as reliability goes, I have only had 2 problems with the GTP. That's IT!
1) Driver's Window Switch failed at about 60k. $45 later and I fixed it with a new one.
2) AC Blower Motor failed at 72k. $80, a 1/2 hour on my back underneath the dash, and that was fixed.


That, my friends, is it! So for reliability I would give this car an A+.

As for the torque, with the mods I've done, the takeoff power is unreal. It's a monster.

I'm afraid that once I test drive the TL, I'll be disappointed with the power.

I recently got to drive a friend's G35 Coupe, and was NOT impresssed with the power in the least.

Didn't really like teh car either.

I'll let you know my thought once I've test driven the TL.