23109VC

I am in the market for a TL-S.

I test drove an auto and a stick. to me, subjectively, the stick seemed a bit quicker, but had a bit more torque steer.

i have driven a lot of stick cars,a nd honestly, I was not really thrilled iwh the stock shift in the TL. i liked the auto with paddle shifters more.

the auto i drove seemed toh ave minimal torque steer. a few articles I've read online and video revies I've watched have made it seem like the torque steer is SO BAD.. one was like OH MY GOD THE TORQUE STEER IS HORRIBLE.... but when I drove the auto...it was hardly there. and i pusehd the car pretty hard on the test drive. i wasn't driving it like i was at a track day, but I drove the car on a twisty section of road and had fun. i noticed no torque steer. from a dead stop, i punched it and maybe noticed a bit.

anway, one online article claimed the AUTO had more torque steer than the stick. b ut my impressions were the reverse.

which is it? does the stick or auto torque steer more?


and what gives wtih those articles. to me, the TL-S was an amazing ahndling car. FWD or RWD. it stuck like cRazy on the freeway onramp i took and I was cooking. now granted, if you are an evo or sti owner and you try to flog a TL-S like it's some rice burner on an autotrcoss trakc, yeah, it's not up to that as wel as a dedicated sports car...but for a sedan, it kicks ass.

i used to have an S60R, which is an AWD sport sedan with 300hp and I think the TL handled better.

Xpditor

My 5AT has NO torque steer. Well, I can induce some by cranking the wheels all the way right or left and flooring it.

After hearing all the Chicken Little hysteria like you, I decided to test it.

From a dead stop, I took my hands off the wheel and stomped it in D.

Nadda. It went straight as an arrow without touching the steering wheel. (Try that in a Maxima but make sure your insurance is paid up.)

The 6MT has more because it has an LSD (limited slip differential). IOW, if it detects one wheel moving faster than the other, it corrects. When you go around a tight corner and accelerate hard, one wheel IS going faster than the other. You can feel the LSD fighting for grip and equality but, technically, that is not torque steer. It does feel similar though.

I haven't tried my straight line test with a 6MT. Someone try it and let us know.

But remember: the sky is not falling. Breathe.

SouthernBoy

I have one of each: my '04 manual and my wife's '05 automatic. From a standing start on a straight piece of road, there is no perceivable torque steer from either one unless one of the drive wheels begins to lose traction.. and then the manual has an edge because the LSD will step in and correct this factor. Under full throttle acceleration, they will both lose traction with my manual completely losing it and spinning both tires most of the way through first gear (with the VSA off).

About the only time I am ever aware of any torque steer in my manual is if I get into the throttle a bit while making a turn. And the same would go for my automatic TL. Torque steer is largely blown out of proportion by testers and I would bet it's due to the fact that the TL (at least both of mine and especially my manual one) have excellent throttle response.

neuronbob

The torque steer hysteria for the 3G TL is exactly that: hysteria. I noted only minimal torque steer during my three years with the 3G TL (5AT). No worries!

fish008

The MT will be faster than the AT that is for sure. But if you don't like the shifter in the TL-S I really cannot imagine any stick that would be better. Honda and BMW make the best MT gear boxes. No slop, tight, smooth, real positive feel - I can't imagine there are many better. If you're not accustom to the hydraulic clutch it can seem weird at first but it is nice after while. The MT might seem to create more torque steer to you but I think the LSD is worth a little pull.

korrupted

I haven't encountered torque steer.
And I've floored the accelerator.

6spMike

My 06 manual will torque the steering wheel around if you accelerate kinda hard (1/2 throttle or more) from a stop over rough pavement. That's the only time I've seen it.

Bearcat94

I get a little in my TL-S 5AT from time-to-time.

As mentioned before, it's not much (just a little steering wheel twitch to the right thats easy to catch), does not always occur and is often associated with traction loss at one or both wheels.

How come none of these reviewers ever say,"We mashed the gas on this 300+ RWD sedan and the back-end wanted to kickout if traction was less than perfect. It was a terrible feeling and would frighten less experienced drivers."? They sure don't hesitate to bitch about FWD Torque Steer.

23109VC

so should I noticed MORE torque steer on the AT or the MANUAL?

the dealer HAS a manual...in the color i like... black exterior with the two tone interior. really slick looking. maybe I hsould test drive it again...

i do like the auto though. i've had sticks....and part of me wants a stick shift b/c it's sportier...but part of me...as I age..I'm 35 now, wants the auto.

for 90% of my driving, the auto is the way to go. for that 10% of the time that I'm alone, on a road with minimal traffic, or on a twisty road or offramp/onramp....then I would want the stick, row the gears, and have fun.

maybe i need to test driv ethe manual again to see what I like.

i wonder what the ratio of sales is? i'm guessing they sell more autos than sticks.

is the stick much faster?

camporealer

I don't think Torque Steer is enough of an issue with this car to be a deciding factor in the MT versus AT decision.

I have an AT and I have only noticed Torque Steer a few times. Mostly when I was accelerating hard to get on the parkway. It was minor and easily controled.

I am not really impressed with the Paddle SHifters. I find it takes too long to change gears, so I usually leave it in "D" and go.

I used to drive a 5 spd Mustang GT. The daily commute in stop n go traffic finally wore me down. I believe that in the NYC area the AT will usually retain a little more resale value and be easier to sell down the road. (Just basing this on rumors and my experience sell the Mustang GT... May not be a representative sample )

You can't go wrong with either choice... So Enjoy.

Bearcat94

Manual is faster 0-60. IIRC, something like 5.7 sec to the 5 AT's 6.1 sec. Anyhow 3 or 4 tenths diff.

Regarding the "shift lag" in the 5AT SportShift, you've just gotta learn to anticipate it. It's the electronics, not the Paddles themselves. You'll see the Gear Number change in the dash almost instantly, but the actual gear change lags a little bit.

I agree with the above comment, the diff in Torque Steer between the 5AT and 6MT shoud not be enough to be the deciding factor. And that the 5AT will be easier to sell later.

SouthernBoy

Based upon a few things you've mentioned in this post, I would suggest that you go with the automatic. You have shown that you have some hesitation with a manual which tells me that you are not fully committed to getting one. This is typical of people who use the excuse of driving in traffic for not getting a manual transmission. This is not to say that they may be wrong in their decision, just that they are not 100% solid in their move to a manual transmission. You could find yourself making excuses and wishing you had gone for an automatic.

I would also suggest that age has absolutely nothing at all to do with one's choice of transmission and for the most part, neither does lifestyle perceived or otherwise. I am a number of years older than you chronologically, but mentally, I am stuck somewhere around 24. I still like the things of my youth: cars, guns, boats, Rock 'n Roll, and not acting my age. I wouldn't dream of buying a personal driving machine with an automatic transmission, but that's me.

Good luck in your decision and let us know what you finally do get.

VQPower37

buy a manual ... i got an automatic and am now regretting it a lot!!

allykahn

iTrader: (1)

That 10% is reason enough for me . Having driven an auto and owning a 6spd, IMO they are two different cars.

Don't let age sway your decision. I'm 40 and wouldn't think of driving an auto, unless I had to.

Select which car is best for you.

calgary2800

I have test driven the TL-S in auto and stick. In my life I have never encountered two completely different cars depending on the tranny. In auto, it is nothing special, just not enough low end torque. But in the stick holy shit, does it come alive and it just rips. No comparsion in the excitment department at all.

teomcdohl

I thought the auto was a slick shifting car, drove wonderfully...

I've only driven sticks since I've had my license - I got it when I was about 16, I'm 22 now.

Traffic doesn't bother me with a manual, but to others it might. Additionally, it will be MUCH easier to sell an automatic. Not many people want to drive a stick.

Ultimately the decision is yours.

BTW, I had a hard time getting used to the 6MT on my TL-S. Anyone else have this problem? More-so from shifting from first to second... just the fact that the clutch has a low release point I guess. Either way, its almost 500 miles on the car, and I'm getting almost to the point where I was with my old car - comfortable to do any driving, and getting a good feel of the gears.

Anyone else feel like that with the TL-S gearbox?

(On another note, I drove the TSX 6MT and I thought it drove really nice - had no problems with that gearbox, although that was only a test run)

SouthernBoy

Every once in a while, someone will submit a posting along the lines of, "Why would anyone want a manual in a luxury car. A manual just does not belong in the TL".

Well first off, the TL is not a luxury car. Technically it is classed as a luxury performance sports sedan. Yes the word luxury is in there, but so is the word "car" when speaking of a Z06 Corvette. if we say that a manual does not belong in a TL, we must also say one does not belong in a 3-series BWM too, because that is the classification of cars in which the TL is aimed. Now for the actual facts and aesthetics.

Without getting into a TL, examine one from the outside when parked next to an automatic TL. In my opinion, Acura designers did a commendable job of laying out the shifter placement, appearance, and style for the manual TL. In other words, it is pretty because it is unfettered and business-like. Get into it and feel the movement of the shifter as you row through the gears. While not as short as an after-market shifter, it is excellent for a stock piece of equipment, with a great feel and look about it. Plus it sits just high enough to feel reminiscent of two-seater sports machines of the past. And it's smooth and nearly effortless.

Once you get used to the clutch action, it is really quite nice. A reasonably short travel and even though the take-up is shorter still with a fairly abrupt initial engagement, you get used to it and actually kinda like it.

Personally, I think the manual transmission most absolutely belongs in the TL and without it, this car could never completely assimilate itself into the ranks of performance sports sedans.

gauravp123

hey guys - so def the MT has more torque steer. I have an MT and I feel it the most when I'm stopped at a T intersecation for example, about to make a 90 degree left turn onto a main road, have to accelearate a bit harder since traffic is moving at 50-60mph and once I do that, I do definitely feel the torque steer kick it and I'm like "WOAH WOAH" lol but I've gotten used to it...I bought a FWD car with a large amount of HP going to the front wheels so I should expect it

SouthernBoy

Yep.

007TL-S

alway's slightly abit more torque steer in the 6speed manual! ...... My 98' Integra type R had Plenty!

ragin

Here's an apples to orange comparison: My 06 MT TL has more torque steer than my 03 Auto TL-S.

type-s09

mine has no torque steer..and the torque steer in a turn when you give it gas is the LSD pulling the car through the turn...thats why you want some kind of acceleration while heavy turning...
the 3rd gen autos shift slowly because the Drive by wire system actually takes throttle out between shifts..it almost sounds like a manual...the autos also fall out of vtec which sucks balls...the 2nd gen auto gearing and shifting technique was much better than the 3rd gen..but it is also the most problem tranny known

23109VC

my 2007 MDX falls out of VTEC if you drive it hard.

you get into the VTEC and it wails.... for a big ol SUV it pulls hard when you rev it hard.. BUT...when you push it hard, and it shifts, it does momentarily fall out of VTEC..and you have to wait a second for it to get back itno it.. that is kind of annoying if you are trying to drive hard.

the only othe VTEC car I've owned was a 1999 Prelude SH. didn't really ahve too bad of torque steer IIRC, but it was a 5 speed and if I shifted right, once I got into VTEC in first gear, and shifted fast, I could STAY in VTEC allt he way to 150mph..

bottom line, on my old prelude, i could get into vtec, shift fast, and STAY in VTEC.

on the TL-S....is it like my MDX...where if contantly falls out of VTEC between shifts??? that does suck.

T Ho

I've got an '06 6mt, and it doesn't torque steer that bad. In fact, with the LSD, you don't get the characteristic wheel yank that's typical of torque steer, but instead the whole car kinda steps out one way or the other if a wheel starts to lose traction.

I also have an '02 TL-S- auto, obviously- and the lane-change-on-the-throttle torque steer (think pulling out to pass on a two lane road) can be a bit rough.

The manual makes the '06 so much more fun to drive. I couldn't imagine daily driving the auto. I used to love the '02, now I can't stand it.

SouthernBoy

Boy, do you and I think alike on this one!

I bought my '04 manual July 17, 2004. It was built in July and had been in the dealer's inventory for two days.

To this day, I still get excited about driving it and will look for excuses to take it out.. or just sometimes, take a "TL moment" for a bit of a nice drive. Out here in western Prince William County, I'm close to some really nice roads with some really nice drives for the gearhead.

Since I have one of each, an '04 manual and an '05 automatic (the wife's), I can use either at my whim. My wife's automatic is nice and as far as automatics go, I'd probably rather drive this one than most.

But my manual '04 TL is a whole different animal. It's quicker. It's more responsive. The fun factor is always there because it is not a pretend-a-manual. And it has a real manually operated clutch as manuals do. And the one thing an automatic will never have is the solid and direct connection through the drive train you have with a manual and the feeling it transmits to the throttle and through the small of your back.

Automatics have their place. They're great for towing or for folks who have lost the use of or are missing a leg. But that's about where it ends for me. If the TL did not come with a manual, I'd be driving something else.

TeknoKing

SouthernBoy, so you are suggesting only people with missing limbs drive an automatic?

You should live in actual rural city like NYC with traffic as a constant, I would love to see how much you will enjoy the manual sitting everyday for over an hour to pass a 3 miles stretch. I love manual, but just the idea of frustration of having a quick car with a manual being stock behind every slow mo on planet earth, thus to alleviate this frustration I went with an automatic.

I wish I had scenic fun roads around me

korrupted

URBAN Tekno.
If you drive everyday in NYC it's definitely not fun with manual.
You get Lock-Knee.
worst was 9-11, took me 9 hrs to get home, 25 miles.

TeknoKing

Korrupted, u right, URBAN, I'm sick, freaken weather, can't think straight. Thanks.

Are there any nice roads by us? All NYC people should gather up and go for a nice drive =]

korrupted

At least you're not at WORK today!!!.
LOL Taconic, is nice, SS Pkwy is nice when it's not jammed or filled with Troopers.
It would be nice, check with

SouthernBoy

I never suggested anything of the sort. I simply said that automatic were great for folks "who have lost the use of or are missing a leg". And they are.

Hell, I have no desire to live in New York City. I don't even like Washington DC so why on earth would I even consider New York City? I like the fact that I have a reasonably large single family home with some room between my neighbors and me. I can't even imagine living in a large metropolitan city. Besides, for a Southern boy like me, that would be going in the wrong direction.

I wish you did too, sir. I'm sure you would enjoy them immensely. One thing about Virginia. I has some the best roads and the best drives in the country. I can see the Blue Ridge Mountains from my town (though I much prefer the Southern sea side areas - as in the low country).

Merry Christmas to you, friend and may you find a nice secluded and peaceful road on which you can stretch your car's legs.

TeknoKing

I AM at friggin work, lol.


SoutherBoy, NYC is not that bad all, we don't live on top of each other lol

I love the quiet rural areas, but I can't live without the urban sounds of sirens, lol. I'm definitely a city boy, I like the lively environment.

TeknoKing

getting back to the torque steer, I do feel it from the start if I accelerate hard into a curve, as long as I don't rev to high it is comes out fine.

I guess once you adopt to your car's maneuvers, you will be able to compensate. My previous rwd was a totally different feel, instead of pulling it was pushing, and on slippery roads I didn't have as much as confidence on steep curves the way I do with the TLS.

If I lived down south, I wouldn't consider on purchasing a FWD.

Xpditor

Thank you!

And Merry Christmas to all.

TeknoKing

Yes, reviving the thread.....

08TLS-Auto.

For the past week, I've noticed as I accelerate above average, 4000rpms from start or 5mph, I really have to hold on hard to the steering wheel and try to fight the torque steer, as the wheel wants go left/right, but after the car picks up speed the torque steer is not there what so ever....

What are my options of dealing with this? And yes, I'm still running shitty michelin oem tires.
Front psi 36, rear 33. Only 5K miles on the car.

Is it the VSA fighting me?

Tripnbeats

I dont know what to say.....i had some torque steer probs in the past but i recently had brand new 08 type s rack put in the car and seems to be gone or really minimal.

jcondon

Taconic up by me at least is fairly rutted. I used to drive it everyday but, now only a couple times a month. Well I do drive a small part of it more frequently but, that barely counts. I really don't like the Taconic but, looks like they are FINALLY starting to patch it up a bit.

TeknoKing

Please restrain yourself to stay on the topic.....thank you.

Torque-Steer

BEAR-AvHistory

VSA fights with you if you have a 6MT because the LSD & VES don't talk to each other. Should not be an issue in a 5AT.

stillhere153

iTrader: (1)

tires for 1... suspension is another... sticky tires and no preload = nulled torque steer

TeknoKing

tires i understand...the suspension part I hardly doubt, TL-S suspension should be able to handle 4K rpms from start without a problem.....