So I got Sued by DUVAL ACURA for $440......
10-17-2006, 06:47 PM
#121
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Amazing story TallDarknFugly, I got pissed off just reading it. I'm glad to hear things are coming together on your end, and don't worry, I'm sure your satisfaction will grow as that crooked dealership wriggles.
Just to recap some points, definitely make it a priority to contact Acura Corporate to complain as well, approaching them in an amicable way and letting them know you're going to the media will light a fire under their asses to punish this dealership as a whole. No doubt the media outlets will be contacting them for an opinion, so they won't want to appear soft on the dealership especially if there are felony charges being filed. I'd be disappointed if a single individual gets fired and charged, when it's obvious this had to include the collusion of several.
With your civil court findings (were there transcripts kept? A stenographer?), dealer documents, etc., you should have plenty to file a police report with. Even with just the dealership as a suspect, that's more info than most police reports. It'll be up to a detective to determine who had access rights to the electronic signature, etc. In fact, my first instinct would be to hold off on the media at least a week or two so the police report can get moving. Once the report is taken, it'll have to go to an investigation bureau, etc. and I would think that if the dealer gets a heads up via the media that they're being investigated, you can bet stories are going to be concocted/documents destroyed before a police detective ever shows up at the dealership to interview them. Better to catch them unawares. Unfortunately, investigations of fraud at a business like this can often take months because what you want to do is find other possible victims and get an idea for just how rampant or institutionalized the fraud is. Which is why on the other hand, the media exposure may help because it may bring other victims out of the woodwork.
Anybody else on the forum who feels they may have been defrauded by Duval, even a little bit, and has the paper trail to back it up should contact TallDarknFugly and maybe even supplement his police report with the info to help bolster a case. The more public interest in a case, larger the victim pool, the more likely the DA is to file it quickly and aggressively.
Know what, the bottom line is, don't stop what your doing, keep at it until this dealership pays the way it should. It may be an ardous process, but it's extremely important stories like this get told! The media loves the idea of the crooked car dealership, it's an American tradition! Good luck!
Just to recap some points, definitely make it a priority to contact Acura Corporate to complain as well, approaching them in an amicable way and letting them know you're going to the media will light a fire under their asses to punish this dealership as a whole. No doubt the media outlets will be contacting them for an opinion, so they won't want to appear soft on the dealership especially if there are felony charges being filed. I'd be disappointed if a single individual gets fired and charged, when it's obvious this had to include the collusion of several.
With your civil court findings (were there transcripts kept? A stenographer?), dealer documents, etc., you should have plenty to file a police report with. Even with just the dealership as a suspect, that's more info than most police reports. It'll be up to a detective to determine who had access rights to the electronic signature, etc. In fact, my first instinct would be to hold off on the media at least a week or two so the police report can get moving. Once the report is taken, it'll have to go to an investigation bureau, etc. and I would think that if the dealer gets a heads up via the media that they're being investigated, you can bet stories are going to be concocted/documents destroyed before a police detective ever shows up at the dealership to interview them. Better to catch them unawares. Unfortunately, investigations of fraud at a business like this can often take months because what you want to do is find other possible victims and get an idea for just how rampant or institutionalized the fraud is. Which is why on the other hand, the media exposure may help because it may bring other victims out of the woodwork.
Anybody else on the forum who feels they may have been defrauded by Duval, even a little bit, and has the paper trail to back it up should contact TallDarknFugly and maybe even supplement his police report with the info to help bolster a case. The more public interest in a case, larger the victim pool, the more likely the DA is to file it quickly and aggressively.
Know what, the bottom line is, don't stop what your doing, keep at it until this dealership pays the way it should. It may be an ardous process, but it's extremely important stories like this get told! The media loves the idea of the crooked car dealership, it's an American tradition! Good luck!
10-17-2006, 10:01 PM
#122
Desi TL Limo
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I have big dreams for this. I hope it gets the same mileage as the "stolen sidekick" episode from a couple of months back, minus the mob hysteria of course.
I commend you sir, and thank you for taking the time to pursue this instead of just dropping it like most people do, which needless to say perpetuates the problem and other people face the same.
I commend you sir, and thank you for taking the time to pursue this instead of just dropping it like most people do, which needless to say perpetuates the problem and other people face the same.
10-17-2006, 11:33 PM
#123
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I've been doing some research and asking questions and right now this statute I just read is giving me the confidence to sue the dealership. Now based on the fact that the forgery came up DURING the case that was already in session and so wasn't tackled, I think I should be able to take it back to court..... at least on that count.
Wish I read this before.....
Wish I read this before.....
The 2006 Florida Statutes
Title XXXIII
REGULATION OF TRADE, COMMERCE, INVESTMENTS, AND SOLICITATIONS
Chapter 559
REGULATION OF TRADE, COMMERCE, AND INVESTMENTS, GENERALLY
View Entire Chapter
559.72 Prohibited practices generally.--In collecting consumer debts, no person shall:
(1) Simulate in any manner a law enforcement officer or a representative of any governmental agency;
(2) Use or threaten force or violence;
(3) Tell a debtor who disputes a consumer debt that she or he or any person employing her or him will disclose to another, orally or in writing, directly or indirectly, information affecting the debtor's reputation for credit worthiness without also informing the debtor that the existence of the dispute will also be disclosed as required by subsection (6);
(4) Communicate or threaten to communicate with a debtor's employer prior to obtaining final judgment against the debtor, unless the debtor gives her or his permission in writing to contact her or his employer or acknowledges in writing the existence of the debt after the debt has been placed for collection, but this shall not prohibit a person from telling the debtor that her or his employer will be contacted if a final judgment is obtained;
(5) Disclose to a person other than the debtor or her or his family information affecting the debtor's reputation, whether or not for credit worthiness, with knowledge or reason to know that the other person does not have a legitimate business need for the information or that the information is false;
(6) Disclose information concerning the existence of a debt known to be reasonably disputed by the debtor without disclosing that fact. If a disclosure is made prior to such reasonable dispute having been asserted and written notice is received from the debtor that any part of the debt is disputed and if such dispute is reasonable, the person who made the original disclosure shall reveal upon the request of the debtor within 30 days the details of the dispute to each person to whom disclosure of the debt without notice of the dispute was made within the preceding 90 days;
(7) Willfully communicate with the debtor or any member of her or his family with such frequency as can reasonably be expected to harass the debtor or her or his family, or willfully engage in other conduct which can reasonably be expected to abuse or harass the debtor or any member of her or his family;
(8) Use profane, obscene, vulgar, or willfully abusive language in communicating with the debtor or any member of her or his family;
(9) Claim, attempt, or threaten to enforce a debt when such person knows that the debt is not legitimate or assert the existence of some other legal right when such person knows that the right does not exist;
(10) Use a communication which simulates in any manner legal or judicial process or which gives the appearance of being authorized, issued or approved by a government, governmental agency, or attorney at law, when it is not;
(11) Communicate with a debtor under the guise of an attorney by using the stationery of an attorney or forms or instruments which only attorneys are authorized to prepare;
(12) Orally communicate with a debtor in such a manner as to give the false impression or appearance that such person is or is associated with an attorney;
(13) Advertise or threaten to advertise for sale any debt as a means to enforce payment except under court order or when acting as an assignee for the benefit of a creditor;
(14) Publish or post, threaten to publish or post, or cause to be published or posted before the general public individual names or any list of names of debtors, commonly known as a deadbeat list, for the purpose of enforcing or attempting to enforce collection of consumer debts;
(15) Refuse to provide adequate identification of herself or himself or her or his employer or other entity whom she or he represents when requested to do so by a debtor from whom she or he is collecting or attempting to collect a consumer debt;
(16) Mail any communication to a debtor in an envelope or postcard with words typed, written, or printed on the outside of the envelope or postcard calculated to embarrass the debtor. An example of this would be an envelope addressed to "Deadbeat, Jane Doe" or "Deadbeat, John Doe";
(17) Communicate with the debtor between the hours of 9 p.m. and 8 a.m. in the debtor's time zone without the prior consent of the debtor;
(18) Communicate with a debtor if the person knows that the debtor is represented by an attorney with respect to such debt and has knowledge of, or can readily ascertain, such attorney's name and address, unless the debtor's attorney fails to respond within a reasonable period of time to a communication from the person, unless the debtor's attorney consents to a direct communication with the debtor, or unless the debtor initiates the communication; or
(19) Cause charges to be made to any debtor for communications by concealment of the true purpose of the communication, including collect telephone calls and telegram fees.
History.--s. 18, ch. 72-81; s. 3, ch. 76-168; s. 1, ch. 77-457; ss. 1, 6, ch. 81-314; ss. 2, 3, ch. 81-318; ss. 1, 3, ch. 83-265; ss. 7, 13, ch. 93-275; s. 819, ch. 97-103; s. 1, ch. 2001-206.
Title XXXIII
REGULATION OF TRADE, COMMERCE, INVESTMENTS, AND SOLICITATIONS
Chapter 559
REGULATION OF TRADE, COMMERCE, AND INVESTMENTS, GENERALLY
View Entire Chapter
559.72 Prohibited practices generally.--In collecting consumer debts, no person shall:
(1) Simulate in any manner a law enforcement officer or a representative of any governmental agency;
(2) Use or threaten force or violence;
(3) Tell a debtor who disputes a consumer debt that she or he or any person employing her or him will disclose to another, orally or in writing, directly or indirectly, information affecting the debtor's reputation for credit worthiness without also informing the debtor that the existence of the dispute will also be disclosed as required by subsection (6);
(4) Communicate or threaten to communicate with a debtor's employer prior to obtaining final judgment against the debtor, unless the debtor gives her or his permission in writing to contact her or his employer or acknowledges in writing the existence of the debt after the debt has been placed for collection, but this shall not prohibit a person from telling the debtor that her or his employer will be contacted if a final judgment is obtained;
(5) Disclose to a person other than the debtor or her or his family information affecting the debtor's reputation, whether or not for credit worthiness, with knowledge or reason to know that the other person does not have a legitimate business need for the information or that the information is false;
(6) Disclose information concerning the existence of a debt known to be reasonably disputed by the debtor without disclosing that fact. If a disclosure is made prior to such reasonable dispute having been asserted and written notice is received from the debtor that any part of the debt is disputed and if such dispute is reasonable, the person who made the original disclosure shall reveal upon the request of the debtor within 30 days the details of the dispute to each person to whom disclosure of the debt without notice of the dispute was made within the preceding 90 days;
(7) Willfully communicate with the debtor or any member of her or his family with such frequency as can reasonably be expected to harass the debtor or her or his family, or willfully engage in other conduct which can reasonably be expected to abuse or harass the debtor or any member of her or his family;
(8) Use profane, obscene, vulgar, or willfully abusive language in communicating with the debtor or any member of her or his family;
(9) Claim, attempt, or threaten to enforce a debt when such person knows that the debt is not legitimate or assert the existence of some other legal right when such person knows that the right does not exist;
(10) Use a communication which simulates in any manner legal or judicial process or which gives the appearance of being authorized, issued or approved by a government, governmental agency, or attorney at law, when it is not;
(11) Communicate with a debtor under the guise of an attorney by using the stationery of an attorney or forms or instruments which only attorneys are authorized to prepare;
(12) Orally communicate with a debtor in such a manner as to give the false impression or appearance that such person is or is associated with an attorney;
(13) Advertise or threaten to advertise for sale any debt as a means to enforce payment except under court order or when acting as an assignee for the benefit of a creditor;
(14) Publish or post, threaten to publish or post, or cause to be published or posted before the general public individual names or any list of names of debtors, commonly known as a deadbeat list, for the purpose of enforcing or attempting to enforce collection of consumer debts;
(15) Refuse to provide adequate identification of herself or himself or her or his employer or other entity whom she or he represents when requested to do so by a debtor from whom she or he is collecting or attempting to collect a consumer debt;
(16) Mail any communication to a debtor in an envelope or postcard with words typed, written, or printed on the outside of the envelope or postcard calculated to embarrass the debtor. An example of this would be an envelope addressed to "Deadbeat, Jane Doe" or "Deadbeat, John Doe";
(17) Communicate with the debtor between the hours of 9 p.m. and 8 a.m. in the debtor's time zone without the prior consent of the debtor;
(18) Communicate with a debtor if the person knows that the debtor is represented by an attorney with respect to such debt and has knowledge of, or can readily ascertain, such attorney's name and address, unless the debtor's attorney fails to respond within a reasonable period of time to a communication from the person, unless the debtor's attorney consents to a direct communication with the debtor, or unless the debtor initiates the communication; or
(19) Cause charges to be made to any debtor for communications by concealment of the true purpose of the communication, including collect telephone calls and telegram fees.
History.--s. 18, ch. 72-81; s. 3, ch. 76-168; s. 1, ch. 77-457; ss. 1, 6, ch. 81-314; ss. 2, 3, ch. 81-318; ss. 1, 3, ch. 83-265; ss. 7, 13, ch. 93-275; s. 819, ch. 97-103; s. 1, ch. 2001-206.
10-18-2006, 10:45 AM
#125
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Originally Posted by TallDarknFugly
I've been doing some research and asking questions and right now this statute I just read is giving me the confidence to sue the dealership. Now based on the fact that the forgery came up DURING the case that was already in session and so wasn't tackled, I think I should be able to take it back to court..... at least on that count.
How did it go with the police? Did they take your report and agree to give you a copy? Did they give you any feeling for whether this will be pursued as a criminal matter?
I wish you the best of luck with this. I have little respect for car dealerships in general, but it appears that Duval Acura is at the very bottom of the heap.
Most importantly, thank you so very much for your service to our country. Again, good luck with getting this matter settled to your satisfaction.
10-18-2006, 09:16 PM
#126
Desi TL Limo
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I emailed them off their website for the hell of it saying I have received some information that they carry out some fradulent activities there (just that one line). In response got a bogus email back (which doesn't even have my phone number that I never furnished included in the response). Looks like the fabrication isn't just on documents but on email too! LOL
I've forward this message to my General Sales Manager Kevin Snyder and he would like to discuss this with you, I notice that you furnished your phone number as being 404-420-4903 and he will be contacting you to get a little more details about your e-mail hopefully you can take out a few minutes to talk to him and let him know the circumstances surrounding this Purchase and why you feel the way you do so hopefully we can resolve this so you dont feel that way about Duval Acura. Thanks for your e-mail and if you need us for anything else please let me know.
Michael J Pawelski
Internet Sales Manager
Duval Acura
11225 Atlantic Blvd.
Jacksonville Fla. 32225
Direct Line (904) 899-5736
Cell # (904) 993-3205 is the Best Way to Contact Me.
mpawelski@duvalacuradealerspace.com
I've forward this message to my General Sales Manager Kevin Snyder and he would like to discuss this with you, I notice that you furnished your phone number as being 404-420-4903 and he will be contacting you to get a little more details about your e-mail hopefully you can take out a few minutes to talk to him and let him know the circumstances surrounding this Purchase and why you feel the way you do so hopefully we can resolve this so you dont feel that way about Duval Acura. Thanks for your e-mail and if you need us for anything else please let me know.
Michael J Pawelski
Internet Sales Manager
Duval Acura
11225 Atlantic Blvd.
Jacksonville Fla. 32225
Direct Line (904) 899-5736
Cell # (904) 993-3205 is the Best Way to Contact Me.
mpawelski@duvalacuradealerspace.com
10-24-2006, 01:38 PM
#130
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Hey Talldarknfugly,
It's been a week since you've posted here ... I don't know about everyone else but I'm dying to hear what's happening with you. I'm hoping to hear that you were totally vindicated, written up in the newspaper, and awarded a fat cash settlement. Or failing that, at least got a great big apology from those jerks at the (st)ealership.
Don't keep us in suspense!
It's been a week since you've posted here ... I don't know about everyone else but I'm dying to hear what's happening with you. I'm hoping to hear that you were totally vindicated, written up in the newspaper, and awarded a fat cash settlement. Or failing that, at least got a great big apology from those jerks at the (st)ealership.
Don't keep us in suspense!
10-24-2006, 10:44 PM
#131
Senior Moderator
Where are you?
10-25-2006, 12:18 AM
#132
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Sorry guys, I've been out of town. Been a busy week and I expect a busier one in the next 2. I promise you guys will hear the last of this. I just made a decision to stop putting my every step on this site as THEY may have been alerted already. Would be kinda messed up if they knew my moves before I made them. Anyway, bottomline is I have some serious moves to make right now. I'm a couple of days away from my detachment from the military so I've been job hunting and interviewing and still going to school and stuff. I figured I dont hate these guys enough to neglect other essential moves I need to be making, BUT as soon as I settle down and digest my first freedom brew, you'd best believe I'll start the inquisition
If I get the exact job I think I just netted, I'll be most comfortably financially situated enough to get a real lawyer and let loose on Duval Acura. I'm trying to learn from my mistake. If I had a lawyer at first, they'll most certainly be licking their wounds already.
One thing's for sure. It's not over and you'll know when it is. Thank you all for your support. Just going thru this thread gives me more confidence. I appreciate all the advice, kind words and well wishes.
If I get the exact job I think I just netted, I'll be most comfortably financially situated enough to get a real lawyer and let loose on Duval Acura. I'm trying to learn from my mistake. If I had a lawyer at first, they'll most certainly be licking their wounds already.
One thing's for sure. It's not over and you'll know when it is. Thank you all for your support. Just going thru this thread gives me more confidence. I appreciate all the advice, kind words and well wishes.
10-25-2006, 09:56 PM
#133
Senior Moderator
You raise a good point, TDF. It's probably a good idea to lay low as far as this thread is concerned.
10-27-2006, 01:49 PM
#134
Pro
Originally Posted by neuronbob
Holy crap.
You NEED to report this to Acura Corporate. Immediately. Acura should not tolerate its dealerships stealing from customers. Forgery is a FELONY! The people involved should pay with jail time. Press on with the charges, brother, you can't let them get away with that.
Oh yeah, and the TV story will be precious.
Sounds like yet another warning for those of you living in JAX to stay away from this particular dealership.
You NEED to report this to Acura Corporate. Immediately. Acura should not tolerate its dealerships stealing from customers. Forgery is a FELONY! The people involved should pay with jail time. Press on with the charges, brother, you can't let them get away with that.
Oh yeah, and the TV story will be precious.
Sounds like yet another warning for those of you living in JAX to stay away from this particular dealership.
I bought my 2 cars there in 01 and 05. I never had a problem with them. I really liked Duval Acura. Mainly with the service guys. Now when I go there for service, it will be weird after reading this post.
10-28-2006, 08:42 PM
#136
Originally Posted by TallDarknFugly
I doubt there's ANYTHING JAG can do about it. Acura's a civilian entity.
Believe it or not, this kind of treatment is common around military bases cos it's so easy to exploit us. We really have little or no say when businesses come against us like this. That's why these guys threatened to call DFAS and request that they allot my paychecks to their account. Cos it's that easy. When you're in the military, if any business says u owe them, it's not hard for them to force the money out of your account. As easy as a phone call. And that's what Acura's representative was banking on when he was trying to intimidate me into dropping my counter-claim. I just laughed and told him I'll be oujt of the military in a couple of days so he should try some other threat. But yeah, the military can pretty much allot your own money to your spouse/ex/business claimant/whoever feels they have dibs on it. Cool stuff. That makes it easy for leeches like this to threaten and screw with us.
@ Orangina- Not sure. Dont really know much about the law.
Come to think of it, I'm not sure if the guy that representerd the dealership was a lawyer, btu he did seem like one.
Believe it or not, this kind of treatment is common around military bases cos it's so easy to exploit us. We really have little or no say when businesses come against us like this. That's why these guys threatened to call DFAS and request that they allot my paychecks to their account. Cos it's that easy. When you're in the military, if any business says u owe them, it's not hard for them to force the money out of your account. As easy as a phone call. And that's what Acura's representative was banking on when he was trying to intimidate me into dropping my counter-claim. I just laughed and told him I'll be oujt of the military in a couple of days so he should try some other threat. But yeah, the military can pretty much allot your own money to your spouse/ex/business claimant/whoever feels they have dibs on it. Cool stuff. That makes it easy for leeches like this to threaten and screw with us.
@ Orangina- Not sure. Dont really know much about the law.
Come to think of it, I'm not sure if the guy that representerd the dealership was a lawyer, btu he did seem like one.
10-28-2006, 08:50 PM
#137
Originally Posted by TallDarknFugly
Sorry guys, I've been out of town. Been a busy week and I expect a busier one in the next 2. I promise you guys will hear the last of this. I just made a decision to stop putting my every step on this site as THEY may have been alerted already. Would be kinda messed up if they knew my moves before I made them. Anyway, bottomline is I have some serious moves to make right now. I'm a couple of days away from my detachment from the military so I've been job hunting and interviewing and still going to school and stuff. I figured I dont hate these guys enough to neglect other essential moves I need to be making, BUT as soon as I settle down and digest my first freedom brew, you'd best believe I'll start the inquisition
If I get the exact job I think I just netted, I'll be most comfortably financially situated enough to get a real lawyer and let loose on Duval Acura. I'm trying to learn from my mistake. If I had a lawyer at first, they'll most certainly be licking their wounds already.
One thing's for sure. It's not over and you'll know when it is. Thank you all for your support. Just going thru this thread gives me more confidence. I appreciate all the advice, kind words and well wishes.
If I get the exact job I think I just netted, I'll be most comfortably financially situated enough to get a real lawyer and let loose on Duval Acura. I'm trying to learn from my mistake. If I had a lawyer at first, they'll most certainly be licking their wounds already.
One thing's for sure. It's not over and you'll know when it is. Thank you all for your support. Just going thru this thread gives me more confidence. I appreciate all the advice, kind words and well wishes.
11-11-2006, 01:46 PM
#139
Racer
Good luck sticking it to these guys, sounds like they have it coming. Dealers that take advantage of people like this need to be held accountable for thier actions. Good job standing your ground an letting them know thier behavior is unacceptable. Would be interesting to see if there are other guys they've done the same thing to and get a class action suit going.
11-11-2006, 02:08 PM
#140
One on the right for me
Originally Posted by bTwix
Good luck sticking it to these guys, sounds like they have it coming. Dealers that take advantage of people like this need to be held accountable for thier actions. Good job standing your ground an letting them know thier behavior is unacceptable. Would be interesting to see if there are other guys they've done the same thing to and get a class action suit going.
I'm having a hard time finding any recognizable damages.
11-11-2006, 02:29 PM
#142
One on the right for me
Originally Posted by Mindworm
>>I'm having a hard time finding any recognizable damages.<<
Forgery is a F.E.L.O.N.Y.
There's a definite case.....
Forgery is a F.E.L.O.N.Y.
There's a definite case.....
class action for a CRIMINAL matter? Don't confuse criminal matters with civil matters.
11-12-2006, 01:03 AM
#144
Racer
Originally Posted by subinf
I'm having a hard time finding any recognizable damages.The general thought was that the Duval dealership was specifically targeting people in the military, as a class, by taking advantage of thier ability to intimidate them with threats to call DFAS to garnish thier wages. If you could establish that the dealership made a regular business practice out of intimidating people in the military to pay additional money past the agreed amount there might be a case.
Originally Posted by TallDarknFugly
I doubt there's ANYTHING JAG can do about it. Acura's a civilian entity.
Believe it or not, this kind of treatment is common around military bases cos it's so easy to exploit us. We really have little or no say when businesses come against us like this. That's why these guys threatened to call DFAS and request that they allot my paychecks to their account. Cos it's that easy. When you're in the military, if any business says u owe them, it's not hard for them to force the money out of your account. As easy as a phone call. And that's what Acura's representative was banking on when he was trying to intimidate me into dropping my counter-claim. I just laughed and told him I'll be oujt of the military in a couple of days so he should try some other threat. But yeah, the military can pretty much allot your own money to your spouse/ex/business claimant/whoever feels they have dibs on it. Cool stuff. That makes it easy for leeches like this to threaten and screw with us.
Believe it or not, this kind of treatment is common around military bases cos it's so easy to exploit us. We really have little or no say when businesses come against us like this. That's why these guys threatened to call DFAS and request that they allot my paychecks to their account. Cos it's that easy. When you're in the military, if any business says u owe them, it's not hard for them to force the money out of your account. As easy as a phone call. And that's what Acura's representative was banking on when he was trying to intimidate me into dropping my counter-claim. I just laughed and told him I'll be oujt of the military in a couple of days so he should try some other threat. But yeah, the military can pretty much allot your own money to your spouse/ex/business claimant/whoever feels they have dibs on it. Cool stuff. That makes it easy for leeches like this to threaten and screw with us.
The damages recognized would be the average amount other people in the military were forced to pay, above the agreed on amount, when getting thier car repaired at the Duval dealership.
Maybe individual suits would need to be brought by each person who was intimidated out of money by the dealership. It just seems that if the dealership makes a practice out of doing this to all military folks that there should be some way to stand up to them as a group.
My
11-12-2006, 07:50 AM
#145
Bears Rule!(Well, kinda')
I didn't read the highlighted part of the post. My bad. From a class action standpoint, I agree that you'd be hard pressed to find recognizable damages. I was so focused on the fact that a company would have the stones to actually forge someone's signature that my brain temporarily went on the fritz.
Sorry.
Sorry.
11-12-2006, 01:19 PM
#146
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Originally Posted by Mindworm
I didn't read the highlighted part of the post. My bad. From a class action standpoint, I agree that you'd be hard pressed to find recognizable damages. I was so focused on the fact that a company would have the stones to actually forge someone's signature that my brain temporarily went on the fritz.
Sorry.
Sorry.
Thats ok. I think it all happened to all of us. You were just late to the party.
11-12-2006, 09:54 PM
#148
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Wow, what a story... I think you should tar and feather those fucking morons at the dealership.
Congrats on the win!
Congrats on the win!
11-24-2006, 10:16 PM
#149
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cliffs? i dont feel like reading all that but I live in Jacksonville, FL and was just recently looking at Duval and OP Acuras' websites and I heard from few friends that Duval Acura offers lower prices... hmmm wonder why... ha ha...
any good experiences with Orange Park Acura anyone?
any good experiences with Orange Park Acura anyone?
11-24-2006, 10:31 PM
#150
Racer
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Class actions are not easy to put together and they require a judge to decide that they are deemed classes.
I would not put my hopes on that situation because you'll need to find a TON of plaintiff's to attempt joinder.
I would not put my hopes on that situation because you'll need to find a TON of plaintiff's to attempt joinder.
11-25-2006, 12:18 AM
#151
'06 750Li Sapphire/Creme
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Charlotte, NC
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Originally Posted by TallDarknFugly
Sorry about the long story guys 
This is Duval Acura in Jacksonville, Florida. Hopefully this thread will help someone in here dealing with anything similar now or in the future. Duval Acura has always treated me kinda funny. I have no clue why. Beats me....... could be my age, race, my ugly looks, or they just dont like me. Maybe I stink. I don't know, but they've always treated me like scum until I stopped using their services early this yr.
I had an accident in June. June 19th to be precise. Ran over some metal rod on the highway that ripped 3 of my tires and messed up 2 rims when it split. Duval Acura was the closest dealership to the accident scene so that's where my vehicle got towed to unfortunately. I'd learnt better than to deal with Duval Acura a long time ago and under normal circumstances would have driven to Orange Park dealership about 20 miles further.
I called my insurance and had to wait 2 days for them to inspect the vehicle before any work gets done on it. They showed up on the 21st and in my absence conducted their evaluation with the service rep. I was then contacted by the rep and told it was going to cost $2,400 to replace 2 rims and 3 tires on the vehicle. I thought this was an outrageous price to pay for factory wheels and tires so I opted to replace the whole set with some aftermarket 18" Motegi's which came up to $1,800 before taxes. I specificaly asked what was included in the $1800 quote and was told by the service rep and the parts store rep TOGETHER that it included labor, balance, rotation and installation. Then I was also given a C.O.D bill reflecting said price. My insurance deductible is $1000, but given the price drop from factory wheels to the after-market wheels, I would only have to tender roughly $500 to supplement insurance check of $1400.
To cut the long story short, I was told 3 days later on the 24th that my vehicle was ready for pickup. I showed up, tendered $500 and was given my vehicle along with a reciept stamped "PAID Jun 24, 2006" nad scribbled on "Balance due from Insurance company". 2 days later I recieved the check made out jointly to Duval Acura and I. I immediately went to the dealership and paid the check in. On my way out, the service rep stopped me and told me we were'nt done yet. He had another document for me. He got on the computer and commenced to make up another bill from scratch, while fiddling around on his calculator I asked him what he was doing and he told me I still had another bill to pay which came up to $440 supposedly for labor. I refused to take it. I was dumbfounded. How do u make up a bill after the fact? After working on the vehicle and getting paid?
The assistant manager was called and he commenced to talk to me like I'm some 3rd class retarded citizen. All along, I'm the one being civil. He then walked out on me while I was talking and left me with the rep. I spoke to the rep for a sec and told him it's getting late. I'll be back another day and we'll sort this out. I cant even pay u right now if I want to cos I havent been paid yet. He asked me to wait while he runs that by the asst mgr so I did. He came back and told me the manager said he should seize my vehicle. lmao.... My own vehicle? I laughed at this point and told him the key's in my pocket. He's free to seize it whenever he's ready. I'm a non-violent guy, but I'm no pushover either at 6"7, 250lbs. I was curious to see how they intended to seize my vehicle. Either way, I left because it started getting dark.
Next day, I went to the Orange Park dealership and spoke to the manager over there seeking proffesional opinion on what I should do. He said I owed them nothing and shouldn't give them anything. Period. Made sense. Either way, I had to go to the dealership and sort it out so they dont fool around with my credit. I went there and tried to speak with the asst manager and he was being indignant once more. He threatened to call my insurance company and get me locked up for insurance fraud if I refuse to pay. I refused to and he got on the phone, called up my insurance company, and sure as the sky's blue, this guy reported a paying customer who bought a $36,000 car from them of commiting a felony- over $440. Insurance company told him off. Told him I didnt do anything wrong and I gave them the check I was issued so they have nothing to do with this. In either case, I was entitled to do whatever I pleased with my insurance check. The asst mgr got frustrated and referred me to the Manager.
Now the manager too, tried to intimidate me by talking about calling the cops, stripping my vehicle of all 4 rims and tires and calling my insurance company to report fraud. Once again, in my presence, this guy called my insurance company. Another rep answered and he reported that I was commiting insurance fraud. At this point I got up and warned him about making such allegations, stating that it had batter be the last time he muttered those words to anybody concerning me or we'd sort it out in court. The lady then told him I hadn't commited any crime too. At this point he tries threatening to sue me and said I signed the document giving them permission to fix the vehicle for $2400 while pointing at a document. I asked him to show me the signature and he flipped to the page where it was supposed to be only to realise they never did give me any documents so my signature wasnt there. You'd think at this point these idiots would leave me alone.
I got a subpoena for a later date to a small claims court and enclosed were their "evidence exhibits". My reciept had just been doctored. The stamped payment date had been adjusted and written over to reflect the 26th, instead of the 24th when I paid it. This was done so the bill could match with the second bill they gave me after the fact. This wasn't the end of it. Later on in court these guys tendered "evidence" to support their claim. They had my signature on a document giving them permission to fix my vehicle for $2400. Upon further inspection I realised "Oh sh*t! That is NOT my signature." It was FORGED! I challenged them on it right in front of the judge and they claimed it was my signature. I showed them other documents with my signature and they fessed up on it. They said it was my signature, that I had signed it the day when I paid for my vehicle. Ladies and gents, these guys extracted my digital signature from their signature database, and superimposed it on this document giving them permission to work on my vehicle! And I made them admit to it in front of the judge! Another funny thing is, I had signed the signature on the 24th, and the document was dated on the 27th. My vehicle started getting fixed on the 22nd. So how did I sign an agreement for them to fix my vehicle 3 days AFTER it was fixed and returned to me?
I won the case. I dont have to pay them sh*t. At this point I'm just sooooooo pissed off and infuriated I'm actually putting together a piece for the local news here. Jacksonville is a military town and I happen to be in the military. I'm meeting with the base newspaper agency to put in this story. Hopefully it will headline and people will be warned about doing business with these guys. I'm not stopping there either. I'm going to NBC, Fox, anybody who cares to listen and I'm exposing these theives for who they are. Better Business Bureau too. And then I'm pressing criminal charges on the forgery count. After some research I realised it's actually a Felony class A or B which could net whoever did it up to 20yrs incarceration. For all the time I had to spend running around looking for a lawyer I couldnt afford, and the time off work and stress, they will pay. I mean, I'm so broke I had to represent myself in court. I represented myself in court and still won against their lawyer. That's how obvious it was that they were scheming! They think it's over. I'm just waiting to speak with the Judge and make sure I'm not doing anything illegal by taking this up with the media before I do so. It's f**king ON!
This is Duval Acura in Jacksonville, Florida. Hopefully this thread will help someone in here dealing with anything similar now or in the future. Duval Acura has always treated me kinda funny. I have no clue why. Beats me....... could be my age, race, my ugly looks, or they just dont like me. Maybe I stink. I don't know, but they've always treated me like scum until I stopped using their services early this yr.
I had an accident in June. June 19th to be precise. Ran over some metal rod on the highway that ripped 3 of my tires and messed up 2 rims when it split. Duval Acura was the closest dealership to the accident scene so that's where my vehicle got towed to unfortunately. I'd learnt better than to deal with Duval Acura a long time ago and under normal circumstances would have driven to Orange Park dealership about 20 miles further.
I called my insurance and had to wait 2 days for them to inspect the vehicle before any work gets done on it. They showed up on the 21st and in my absence conducted their evaluation with the service rep. I was then contacted by the rep and told it was going to cost $2,400 to replace 2 rims and 3 tires on the vehicle. I thought this was an outrageous price to pay for factory wheels and tires so I opted to replace the whole set with some aftermarket 18" Motegi's which came up to $1,800 before taxes. I specificaly asked what was included in the $1800 quote and was told by the service rep and the parts store rep TOGETHER that it included labor, balance, rotation and installation. Then I was also given a C.O.D bill reflecting said price. My insurance deductible is $1000, but given the price drop from factory wheels to the after-market wheels, I would only have to tender roughly $500 to supplement insurance check of $1400.
To cut the long story short, I was told 3 days later on the 24th that my vehicle was ready for pickup. I showed up, tendered $500 and was given my vehicle along with a reciept stamped "PAID Jun 24, 2006" nad scribbled on "Balance due from Insurance company". 2 days later I recieved the check made out jointly to Duval Acura and I. I immediately went to the dealership and paid the check in. On my way out, the service rep stopped me and told me we were'nt done yet. He had another document for me. He got on the computer and commenced to make up another bill from scratch, while fiddling around on his calculator I asked him what he was doing and he told me I still had another bill to pay which came up to $440 supposedly for labor. I refused to take it. I was dumbfounded. How do u make up a bill after the fact? After working on the vehicle and getting paid?
The assistant manager was called and he commenced to talk to me like I'm some 3rd class retarded citizen. All along, I'm the one being civil. He then walked out on me while I was talking and left me with the rep. I spoke to the rep for a sec and told him it's getting late. I'll be back another day and we'll sort this out. I cant even pay u right now if I want to cos I havent been paid yet. He asked me to wait while he runs that by the asst mgr so I did. He came back and told me the manager said he should seize my vehicle. lmao.... My own vehicle? I laughed at this point and told him the key's in my pocket. He's free to seize it whenever he's ready. I'm a non-violent guy, but I'm no pushover either at 6"7, 250lbs. I was curious to see how they intended to seize my vehicle. Either way, I left because it started getting dark.
Next day, I went to the Orange Park dealership and spoke to the manager over there seeking proffesional opinion on what I should do. He said I owed them nothing and shouldn't give them anything. Period. Made sense. Either way, I had to go to the dealership and sort it out so they dont fool around with my credit. I went there and tried to speak with the asst manager and he was being indignant once more. He threatened to call my insurance company and get me locked up for insurance fraud if I refuse to pay. I refused to and he got on the phone, called up my insurance company, and sure as the sky's blue, this guy reported a paying customer who bought a $36,000 car from them of commiting a felony- over $440. Insurance company told him off. Told him I didnt do anything wrong and I gave them the check I was issued so they have nothing to do with this. In either case, I was entitled to do whatever I pleased with my insurance check. The asst mgr got frustrated and referred me to the Manager.
Now the manager too, tried to intimidate me by talking about calling the cops, stripping my vehicle of all 4 rims and tires and calling my insurance company to report fraud. Once again, in my presence, this guy called my insurance company. Another rep answered and he reported that I was commiting insurance fraud. At this point I got up and warned him about making such allegations, stating that it had batter be the last time he muttered those words to anybody concerning me or we'd sort it out in court. The lady then told him I hadn't commited any crime too. At this point he tries threatening to sue me and said I signed the document giving them permission to fix the vehicle for $2400 while pointing at a document. I asked him to show me the signature and he flipped to the page where it was supposed to be only to realise they never did give me any documents so my signature wasnt there. You'd think at this point these idiots would leave me alone.
I got a subpoena for a later date to a small claims court and enclosed were their "evidence exhibits". My reciept had just been doctored. The stamped payment date had been adjusted and written over to reflect the 26th, instead of the 24th when I paid it. This was done so the bill could match with the second bill they gave me after the fact. This wasn't the end of it. Later on in court these guys tendered "evidence" to support their claim. They had my signature on a document giving them permission to fix my vehicle for $2400. Upon further inspection I realised "Oh sh*t! That is NOT my signature." It was FORGED! I challenged them on it right in front of the judge and they claimed it was my signature. I showed them other documents with my signature and they fessed up on it. They said it was my signature, that I had signed it the day when I paid for my vehicle. Ladies and gents, these guys extracted my digital signature from their signature database, and superimposed it on this document giving them permission to work on my vehicle! And I made them admit to it in front of the judge! Another funny thing is, I had signed the signature on the 24th, and the document was dated on the 27th. My vehicle started getting fixed on the 22nd. So how did I sign an agreement for them to fix my vehicle 3 days AFTER it was fixed and returned to me?
I won the case. I dont have to pay them sh*t. At this point I'm just sooooooo pissed off and infuriated I'm actually putting together a piece for the local news here. Jacksonville is a military town and I happen to be in the military. I'm meeting with the base newspaper agency to put in this story. Hopefully it will headline and people will be warned about doing business with these guys. I'm not stopping there either. I'm going to NBC, Fox, anybody who cares to listen and I'm exposing these theives for who they are. Better Business Bureau too. And then I'm pressing criminal charges on the forgery count. After some research I realised it's actually a Felony class A or B which could net whoever did it up to 20yrs incarceration. For all the time I had to spend running around looking for a lawyer I couldnt afford, and the time off work and stress, they will pay. I mean, I'm so broke I had to represent myself in court. I represented myself in court and still won against their lawyer. That's how obvious it was that they were scheming! They think it's over. I'm just waiting to speak with the Judge and make sure I'm not doing anything illegal by taking this up with the media before I do so. It's f**king ON!
11-25-2006, 12:22 AM
#152
'06 750Li Sapphire/Creme
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Charlotte, NC
Age: 61
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Originally Posted by subinf
I'm having a hard time finding any recognizable damages.
11-25-2006, 12:56 AM
#153
A happy customer tells 2 friends
An unhappy customer tells 11 million!
An unhappy customer tells 11 million!
11-25-2006, 05:21 AM
#154
One on the right for me
Originally Posted by ndabunka
Lost wages from trying to defend himself is a valid actionable issue. Demation fomr their use of the "insurance fraud" and about a half a dozen other issues would qualify.
Unless you have a 1983 suit you can't recover any fees for defending yourself. I'd be really interested in seeing what you come up with for the 6 other issues. I've told him that unless the small claims court was a informal judgment against the dealer, he cannot bring another suit against them. But please explain what you have in mind.
11-25-2006, 10:48 AM
#155
Instructor
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Jacksonville, Fl
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Originally Posted by Chopsie
Wow, what a story... I think you should tar and feather those fucking morons at the dealership.
Congrats on the win!
Congrats on the win!
This created big problems a couple of weeks later when my car was stolen from my driveway. Lucky the police recovered it with only a broken wheel because the joy rider lost control and hit a curb. Thank god there was no one hurt and nothing else was damaged. By the way State Farm covered me on my home owners and made sure that the car was properly repaired. It cost them about $5,000. Other than that no problems.
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acura, acurazine, arrakis001, claims, court, creditors, crooks, dfas, duval, garnishment, pawelski, small, sue, sued, talldarknfugly
