Hi guys,

As noted in my signature, '07 TL base 5AT w/115k on the clock. Owned for 8 yrs., purchased in 2017 w/60k on the clock. Timing belt was replaced in 2015.

Problem: rough idle on cold start; goes away and smooths out pretty quickly (1 mi from house) and doesn't continue for rest of day (12 mi commute round trip; car sits in parking garage for 8 hours).

I've got a quote of about $1,100 for a tune-up which includes replacement of spark plugs (NGK/Denso, not coilpacks) and induction service. Does that sound reasonable to folks?

Is the induction service necessary?

I'm not a wrencher, so DIY is not an option. TIA for any thoughts!

 

If you are in a major urban area, like DC, then that may be the going rate; however, if you shop around you might do better?
Input your zip code into the link below, maybe you'll find a better service provider to discuss details with.
Acura Repair Shops - Find an Acura Mechanic | AcuShops

 

NGK plugs. Denso are fine, but should be NGK.

platinum or iridium run $3-6/ea from online retailers, $12-16/ea at a local parts store. Let's say they're marking them up to $20/ea so $120 max for the plugs.

the front are easy, 15-20 minutes. the rear are not as easy, but an experienced tech should be able to do that in 20-30 minutes- say 1.5 hours to be generous. most places are charging $130/hour these days. $200 for labor.

so with fees and "supplies" that they like to add in there, $350 to do plugs.

probably doesn't need the induction service. maybe a throttle relearn while it's there. $100?

I still think that's high because it would cost me $30 at the home shop... but I'd expect $450 to get new plugs and do the relearn then see how the idle is after that.

 

Many thanks for the feedback! It's very, very helpful and much appreciated. This forum and most everyone on it are great.

 

WTF is an "induction service"???
Walnut blasting?

 

According to local shop, theirs entails a 3-step process:
1. Removal of and hand-cleaning (with brush) of the throttle-body.
2. Chemical additive to the fuel tank intended to clean the fuel system (lines, fuel rail, etc.)
3. Chemical cleaner applied directly into the engine in order to loosen/remove carbon deposits.

Was told that this service is usually done along with change of spark plugs (they've specified NGK plugs, as others here have recommended).

Still not entirely sure if it's necessary or worth it.

 

1) Don't mess with the throttle body
2) Use Seafoam
3) Use Seafoam

This should cost you $8

Changing the plugs would take less than an hour if you have the right sockets and don't run into any issues. I bought NGK Iridium for $58 on Amazon.

Change the PCV valve while you're at it. $40 from oemacuraparts

 

1) Don't clean the throttle body with anything but a cloth. Never use a brush.

FWIW, I would never buy any NGK parts from Amazon. There are too many fraud for various auto parts on Amazon.

 

yup this.


RockAuto.com is the only place i would trust buying online (if not an online dealer)

 

Thanks for the additional advice, everyone. I appreciate it.

Just wish I was a wrencher, which I'm not (as stated in original post). So, unfortunately, DIY is sorta off the table for me. I've only done really, really basic stuff myself: replacement of the EVAP purge canister/valve/solenoid back when I first got the car, engine and cabin air filters, hood struts, wiper blades, etc.

Think I might just get my mechanic to put in new (NGK) plugs and skip the "induction service."

In any case, given my experience of buying certain items (clothing, belts [for one's pants, not engine], computer peripherals, wiper blades, etc.), Amazon is like the X-itter (pronounced: "shitter") of online shopping ... full of shoddy and falsely advertised products. And there's no vetting of vendors, as far as I can tell. I imagine it's the same for more critical car parts, too. Rock Auto FTW!

Thanks again!

 

$hit! Right on f**king cue.

My mechanic just called to tell me about a bunch of other issues they found while inspecting the car more thoroughly:

• side and front engine mounts broken (replace)
• serpentine belt and tensioner(s) worn (replace)
• timing belt and water pump need replacement
• front left sway bar linkage broken (replace both sides)
• outer tie rod boots torn (replace)
• fluid (oil) leaks--replace cam and crankcase seals

So, another question: I literally had my serpentine belt and tensioner(s) replaced exactly 1 year ago. I trust my mechanic, but am simply trying to figure out for myself how the serpentine belt could be shot after only one year of operation??

On inspection, my mechanic says the belt is now "glazed" (sorta stripped?). Wouldn't that have resulted in a high squeal? Could abnormally fast wear and tear on the serpentine belt be caused by movement of the engine itself (under acceleration) due to broken motor mounts? In the video of the broken motor mounts, the side mount is on the right-side of the engine--same side as where the serpentine belt and tensioner(s) are located. I'm a bit confused.

 

First off, I do the vast majority of my own work on our vehicles and some family and friends. I'm very doubtful a good quality serpentine belt and tensioner would go bad in a year, so I'm just suspicious of that. The other stuff looks typical considering your mileage and age of your 3G.

 

RockAuto is the best online place for non-OEM parts. Great prices, fast shipping, great selection of multiple aftermarket manufacturers for the TL. Can't say enough good things about RockAuto, friend turned me onto them ~2010. Any problem I've had (they once sent a cabin filter which didn't fit our CR-V, they gave a full refund and didn't want me to ship it back to them, the manufacturer had listed incorrectly) they resolved in the best way possible.

 

Plus, you're forgetting the most important perk of RockAuto....

You get a magnet with every purchase

 

Just curious, why not? I could barely wrench a year ago (only changed oil) but now I do a lot of my own stuff. Things like swaybar links are super easy to change out and could save you a lot of $$ on shop labor.

 

QFT our garage fridge has so many RockAuto magnets on it

 

Alldata calls for 0.7h of labor to do plugs, maybe round up to 1h. Even with Audi dealer labor cost, labor alone for plugs shouldn't cost more than $300. Plugs shouldn't be more than $30 each. Induction service is not really needed, sounds like snake oil type of deal. Skip it.

So rounding everything up by quite a lot, less than $500. $200 - $300 should be a normal rate nowadays. Unless they also want to replace coils, but you shouldn't touch them if there's no misfire and no cracked boots.

Also, they are recommending a maintenance, there's no guarantee that it will fix the rough idle, but diagnosing that might be hard. (I mean, if car does it only after sitting for very long period of time and only for a minute, shop would need to replicate this situation at the very least.)

 

Came here to say this beat me to it

 

https://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo...choice=0-0-0-1
$10 here a pop on Rock Auto

https://www.oemacuraparts.com/oem-pa...MtNWwtdjYtZ2Fz

Even at dealer pricing it's 20 bucks.. so maybe 30 is retail price counter pricing.. rip off

 

In the shop we usually charge MSRP / list price (rounded up), not actually what we paid, so "retail price counter pricing.. rip off" is exactly what I meant

 

And the newsletter!!

https://www.rockauto.com/Newsletter/

 

No skills, which I could acquire over time.
No tools, which I could purchase over time.
No garage, just curbside parking and assigned spaces out back (of our town home). This is the primary reason, unless I come into a windfall that allows me to purchase a home with a free-standing or attached garage.

 

Skipped the induction service, but had them do almost everything else using OEM parts:

• NGK plugs
• timing belt, water pump, and seals
• motor mounts
• outer tie rods
• front sway bar links
• serpentine belt and tensioner
• power steering flush
• alignment

All told, set me back ~$5k Believe you me, I had sticker shock. I'm sure I could've (should've) paid less, but just hope the investment is worth it over the long-run. Penalty for my lack of DIY-skills.

I've been window-shopping almost daily for a new (to me) ride, around $10-$15k. Had my eye on a low-mileage 2007 TSX w/2.4L I4 (~$8.5k) and a 2010 TSX w/3.5L V6 (~$11k). But I still love my TL, and maintaining it's less expensive than buying another vehicle, at least for now.

On the more positive side, the steering is much tighter and more responsive and vibrations have markedly decreased --> less play and vibration in the steering wheel.

As for efficiency, I've got a 200-mile trip tomorrow and so will report back in due time.

Thanks again for all the feedback and advice. Appreciate it.

 

$5,000 lol. Did that include a transmission rebuild?

 

Timing belt is moderately challenging and definitely necessary. Alignment you can't really do yourself either (kinda, but it's never as good as what the computer can do).

Never thought I'd say it but $5k isn't totally unreasonable for all that given shop labor inflation... definitely more than the cost of the parts ordered from Rock Auto, but I understand not everyone can DIY, and still cheaper than a new car.

Hopefully they didn't mark up the parts to pad their profit. A shop I used to go to before learning to DIY had a habit of doing that, i.e. $59 for a quart of power steering fluid, $190 for a battery... to me that's even worse than overpaying for labor.

 

Well considering adding power steering fluid is normal for a timing belt package I'd guess they charged for this so-called "flush."

 

The cold start rough idle could be related to a failing coolant temp sensor. Seen it happen once on a friends Del Sol.

 

What I meant was, I had a shop once charge me $59 for a qt of p/s fluid. That was on top of the $100ish they charged for the flush.

This was back when I didn't know any better. Hopefully OP didn't pay that much for the fluid itself.

 

$5K is nuts. A lot of that could have been done at home. That said - you should be good for another 5+ years.