I've looked at Edmunds and KBB but they always seem to be inaccurate, so can anyone give me an indication on how '04 TL values are holding up? I'm trying to determine if an '04 5AT Navi model could be within my affordable range by August 2006 (around $20k)....

 

I would say it should be, barely. I mean, August 06 is over a year away, so you will see quite a bit more depreciation by then. Wouldn't be surprised if early '04's with say 40-50k miles will go for around $20k by then.

Also, the 07 TL will almost be out by then, and if it has significant changes that could drive values even lower for 04-05's. Not to mention if the IS350/250 are hits...

Ah, I just hate new car depreciation. One minute it's new, then boom seems like a year goes by fast and you lose $5k!

 

Do early '04 TLs suffer from the transmission problems that have all but taken the 2nd generation TL off my list of cars to look at after everything I've read recently?

 

acuras usually hold their value well. sure, it seems like 04's have taken a quite a hit, but all new cars do. i'd say early models would go for about 21k-24k by aug 06. it's a wild guess, though, as used car values depend on many variables.

i don't think the 3G suffers from any trans problems.

 

Somtimes ppl seem confused with those numbers. Trade in value and private sale value. Sometimes lots of ppl continue to be upset about why they cannot get the sale value as high as the private sale...

 

I'm thinking that values should actually hold up quite a bit for cars in the next two years. And I say that for not just Acuras but most cars with a history of reliability. I think people will begin to slowly dump their SUVs when they see gas prices aren't coming back down to where they were a year and a half or two years ago...

 

unless the gas price reaches $5+/gallon, you're not gonna see many people dumping their SUV's solely because of it. really, it's just a bit more than an average sedan... if i liked SUVs, i wouldn't care if i had to paid $100 - $200 more per month on gas.

 

I'm going to disagree. I think it would take a jump to $5 for people to dump their SUVs right away, but a steady higher gas price will also do the trick, but it will take a few years to wear people down enough to make the switch. We're about 1 year into it - give it two more years like this and people will be jumping back to cars and whatever SUV hybrids are around.

Prediction: The first company to come out with a Hybrid Mini-van is going to make a killing...

 

The 3rd gen TL is holding its value AMAZINGLY well. Right now is definitely not the time to buy a used one since you can bargain a new one down for a few thousand more than a new one would cost. Next year may be a different story, however. High mileage has historically hurt the value of the TL.

Side note: The TL was in the KBB Top 10 for cars expected to depretiate the least in the next 5 years. Something to keep in mind.

 

5 bucks!!! lol

GM and Ford are at junk bond status now because they are losing their shirts on building big trucks and SUVs. They have not concentrated enough on the car market in the past few years and are now paying the price for it.

As for hybrids... people are crazy to spend 5000 more for a vehicle that gets 30mpg vs 20. In the end, a v6 hybrid minivan all loaded up will probably sell for 38k. hardly a bargain!!!

 

Not too worried about depreciation right now. As long as my car is worth 15k or more four years from now I'll be just fine.

 

Exactly my point. People are now looking for cars (and energy efficient vehicles as a whole) more than SUVs and trucks. A trend that has only recently begun. And as gas prices stay relatively high, it's only going to continue - hence higher resale values of cars as a whole, and especially for ones known for quality to begin with.

Of course they are not a bargain. But they will sell like wildfire. It's like paying a premium for a luxury brand. A) it's a status symbol, and B) Unique cars always have a higher resale down the road.

If you do some research, there are tons of people currently paying HIGHER than new car MSRP for USED Toyota Priuses just so they can have one. They are that popular. And the thing with hybrids is unless you put on a TON of miles, everyone knows you won't even break even in the end. But it's not just about a higher price, it's about the image you portray about yourself by driving one. To some, driving a Hybrid gives them the same feel as others get driving a Mercedes - that they are somehow in a unique group of people by doing so. And in that sense a enviromentally conscious soccer mom driving a Hybrid Mini-Van will be the envy of the rest of the moms. So she'll pay the premium.

 

Do not expect it to be!!! Unless you have a car in mint condition. Which means the wheels are cherry with new tires. You probably repainted the entire car. No butt prints and no other issues. A clean 2001 Cl type S with 60,000 today gets about 12,000 in trade in. That car was probably worth 32,000 new.. So expect 20,000 bucks in 4 years. And I am sure they want to pay much less than that.

 

My guess is it will be Honda, oddly enough. The Odyssey is already the #1 minivan, hands down...been #1 for 5-6 years now. If they made it a hybrid, every soccer mom on the planet will get one.

A few personal musings:

Ford and GM being rated junk - junk cars, junk status, 'bout time.

$5/gal for gas? I'll buy a Geo Metro for a commuter car...60 mpg and it will lower my insurance due to multicar discount.

Russdaddy - Love the avatar!

 

When I saw the subject line--"How are '04 values holding up?"--I was going to respond that since Labour won re-election, '04 values must be holding up OK, otherwise they would have voted in a different party.

 

I'd say the values are holding great so far and we will continue to see the same trend.

 

people who panic buy a hybrid are insane... That's what they hope you do since the perception is they are cheaper to run.. The cost to run an automobile includes the purchase price and the repairs. no brainer there... and resale value.

The only reason to buy a hybrid is if they ration the gas and you are stuck with only 10 gallons of gas per week. If you have to go further on a finite amount of fuel, then you would pay more for a hybrid.

We are just going back to the late 70s early 80s where energy costs were super high and people were buying pintos...lol

 

I just find out recently that Prius costs more than what I expected... it says 30k+?? (everything and after tax 8.625%?) is reasonable. Most of local dealers nearby ask for additional charge (500+ or 2k+), and you have to buy whatever colors/options they have... sucks!!!


I

 

While the "Wholesale" value for the non-NAVI 04 TL's may be down as low as $22K next year, don't count on buying one for that from an individual. Wholsale prices are just that... Wholesale. Right now you can get a 04TL with around 50K miles (high) for about $25,000 but that car was most likely in poor condition. If your willing to accept a 100K mile car (yes, some people CAN put 100K miles on a car in 3 years) then you might find something and since it's a Honda, it "should" still be a viable car but don't expect a pristine TL for anything lower than $25K even next year. Resale for 04TL's with NAVI and REASONABLE miles (20K) is around $28-$29K right now. As a matter of fact, I am thinking about selling my NAVI 04TL with 21K miles for around the $29K figure and move back into a Merc (CLS55) simply to get a quieter ride (Plus just a little performance increase).

 

I remember someone is selling his non-navi 04 6MT for 26k here??? It's so hard to say which price range is right.

 

You guys are looking at hybrid cars the wrong way. It is worth paying more money to buy the car because you are going to be reducing the demand of gasoline. It will help the environment; this is more important than your money savings.

 

I agree with you. What I'm saying above is lots of ppl may not realize how expensive the high-tech Hybrid would cost. And, since the tremendous demands on these cars, more car makers start to produce them, and some models are highly popular and their price tags are above MSRP. Hopefully, Honda/Acura would come out something better with its IMA system against Prius.

 

Hey, I for one OWN a hybrid (5 spd. Civic, 2003). It has averaged 51 TRUE mpg over 36,000 miles. I know a non-hybrid Civic wouldn't do that, but it would probably get 38 or so in the same driving. At the rate I drive, and anywhere near current gas prices, the cost difference WILL either pay for itself or be close to it. However, I AM assuming the battery pack will last past 100K miles. Since Toyota says they've never replaced one yet, and older Prius' are over 100K miles now, and I've never heard of any Civic owner having to replace batteries either, I suspect the makers are correct now that they are starting to say that the batteries could last the life of the car.

But if they don't, it's not exactly a financial disaster, in my opinion. Even at the inflated $3000 price (which should come down). TL owners pay that much for body kits, or even close to that for some wheels and tire combinations.

Another hybrid advantage that few bring up is that they go a lot greater distance between fill-ups. It's pretty nice being able to go 600 miles or more before getting gas. Yes, maybe even worth paying a little more for. Sure would be nice if my TL would do that.

Last I looked at KBB and other sources, the hybrids are more than holding their own as far as retained value.

All the people that jump on the anti-hybrid bandwagon because "they don't pay off financially" need to look at their own behavior: Were our TL's a smart financial decision vs. a Honda Accord V6? Probably not, and that cost difference is greater than the hybrid vs. non-hybrid cost difference. I'm just saying that there are a lot more factors in a car's purchase decision than pure economic logic. That's why we own TL's. That's why some people own BMWs. So why does buying a hybrid have to come down to economics only, where it's OK to buy a TL for reasons that aren't totally economic? "Efficiency" is a valid reason to purchase a car, probably more logical than "nice looking 17" wheels" or other things that sell cars.

Personally, my hybrid is paid for. So my expenses (other than insurance and similar costs) comes down to gas and maintenance. It's pretty nice paying half what everybody else does to drive around, for gas. (As for maintenance, I've done only oil and filter changes, and air filters. No warranty or other repairs whatsoever, which I can't say for my TL that has 1/4 of the miles that my Civic has).

Another little side benefit of the Civic Hybrid: as far as I know, it's the only Civic (sedan, anyway) sold here that's made in Japan. It actually appears to be better assembled than the Ohio-made TL. That's worth paying for too, in my opinion. (I'd pay more for a TL made in Japan). Then there's the $2,000 income tax "deduction" for buying a hybrid. That reduces the cost difference by, say, $600, depending on tax bracket.

Given all that, I too can't really say paying over MSRP for a Prius, and being willing to "pay anything" in essense. I don't even really LIKE the Prius (dash, and styling).

Also, as far as gas prices, nobody knows for sure what the future holds. There's currently a concept of "peak oil" that says that the world's oil reserves are half gone by now, and things are quickly going to get very bad as far as supply vs. demand in the world. Start here for a link: http://www.energybulletin.net/primer.php