Ethanol Content In Gasoline
04-11-2012, 10:28 AM
#4
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Yep, screw ethanol. Probably going to make it more expensive too.
04-11-2012, 11:20 AM
#6
Suzuka Master
NASCAR went to it
http://www.nascar.com/2010/news/busi...011/index.html
quote from that page
"NASCAR team engine builders have been testing the Sunoco Green E15 for several months, and reports have been very positive. In fact, many have reported achieving more horsepower with Sunoco Green E15."
Mind you gas milage isn't such an issue with them if they know what it is and can calulate thier pit stops. .
Bothers me more that we are driving up the price of food to use corn for gas and there is people starving in the US because they can't afford even basic food .... corn.
http://www.nascar.com/2010/news/busi...011/index.html
quote from that page
"NASCAR team engine builders have been testing the Sunoco Green E15 for several months, and reports have been very positive. In fact, many have reported achieving more horsepower with Sunoco Green E15."
Mind you gas milage isn't such an issue with them if they know what it is and can calulate thier pit stops. .
Bothers me more that we are driving up the price of food to use corn for gas and there is people starving in the US because they can't afford even basic food .... corn.
04-11-2012, 02:23 PM
#7
Team Owner
NASCAR went to it
http://www.nascar.com/2010/news/busi...011/index.html
quote from that page
"NASCAR team engine builders have been testing the Sunoco Green E15 for several months, and reports have been very positive. In fact, many have reported achieving more horsepower with Sunoco Green E15."
Mind you gas milage isn't such an issue with them if they know what it is and can calulate thier pit stops. .
Bothers me more that we are driving up the price of food to use corn for gas and there is people starving in the US because they can't afford even basic food .... corn.
http://www.nascar.com/2010/news/busi...011/index.html
quote from that page
"NASCAR team engine builders have been testing the Sunoco Green E15 for several months, and reports have been very positive. In fact, many have reported achieving more horsepower with Sunoco Green E15."
Mind you gas milage isn't such an issue with them if they know what it is and can calulate thier pit stops. .
Bothers me more that we are driving up the price of food to use corn for gas and there is people starving in the US because they can't afford even basic food .... corn.
There's going to be a point where cars not designed for this crap are going to have a hard time. With the additional fuel volume requirements you're going to run out of fuel pump and injector sooner. Stoich for ethanol is much different than gasoline. The ECU is shooting for stoich (or whatever it's target is at any given condition) of gasoline when it needs to be running richer. At a minimum I hope we end up with more octane out of it but that's very unlikely.
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04-11-2012, 02:55 PM
#8
Suzuka Master
Their hp goes up because engine designs change to take advantage of it. Even if static compression ratio is fixed by the rules (not sure if it is) there are plenty of ways get get a higher dynamic compression ratio in addition to the timing changes. Green E15 is 98 octane. Not likely we're going to get that. What we're going to see is the same octane, no additional power, and worse mileage. It's a lose lose at the pump and for just about everyone but a handful of people.
There's going to be a point where cars not designed for this crap are going to have a hard time. With the additional fuel volume requirements you're going to run out of fuel pump and injector sooner. Stoich for ethanol is much different than gasoline. The ECU is shooting for stoich (or whatever it's target is at any given condition) of gasoline when it needs to be running richer. At a minimum I hope we end up with more octane out of it but that's very unlikely.
There's going to be a point where cars not designed for this crap are going to have a hard time. With the additional fuel volume requirements you're going to run out of fuel pump and injector sooner. Stoich for ethanol is much different than gasoline. The ECU is shooting for stoich (or whatever it's target is at any given condition) of gasoline when it needs to be running richer. At a minimum I hope we end up with more octane out of it but that's very unlikely.
Exactly .... BTW the thing that link I posted doesn't tell you is they also went to fuel injection which is run by and ECU ... but NOT the system we get ..
on the loose loose ... when you get a lobby group behind something no one seems to win except the lobbyists ( sp) and then its only a short mental shot and off to save another tree, or something. NASCAR only did it to please the 5% of the fans that are supposedly green and its good PR. The average you and me couldn't give a rats a$$ because the emissions they put out isn't even measurable in the sheme of things ..
BTW IHC ... you have some great postings .. very solid..
04-11-2012, 06:58 PM
#10
2005TL(6MT)
Less MPG for more dollars, great! Another negative for our poor economy besides our personal finances.
The good news is it's not mandatory (yet). If enough people are made aware of it and don't buy it, the drop in demand will make gas stations order less E15 and eventually make the gas companies from producing it. But then our green president will probably push through a mandate for E15 instead of E10. The first part of this was approved October 13, 2010 and the second part on January 21, 2011.
From the EPA site ( http://www.epa.gov/otaq/regs/fuels/additive/e15/ ):
"In response to a request by Growth Energy and 54 ethanol manufacturers under the Clean Air Act, the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) granted two partial waivers that taken together allow but do not require the introduction into commerce of gasoline that contains greater than 10 volume percent (vol%) ethanol and up to 15 vol% ethanol (E15) for use in model year (MY) 2001 and newer light-duty motor vehicles, subject to certain conditions."
The good news is it's not mandatory (yet). If enough people are made aware of it and don't buy it, the drop in demand will make gas stations order less E15 and eventually make the gas companies from producing it. But then our green president will probably push through a mandate for E15 instead of E10. The first part of this was approved October 13, 2010 and the second part on January 21, 2011.
From the EPA site ( http://www.epa.gov/otaq/regs/fuels/additive/e15/ ):
"In response to a request by Growth Energy and 54 ethanol manufacturers under the Clean Air Act, the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) granted two partial waivers that taken together allow but do not require the introduction into commerce of gasoline that contains greater than 10 volume percent (vol%) ethanol and up to 15 vol% ethanol (E15) for use in model year (MY) 2001 and newer light-duty motor vehicles, subject to certain conditions."
04-11-2012, 07:24 PM
#11
Team Owner
Exactly .... BTW the thing that link I posted doesn't tell you is they also went to fuel injection which is run by and ECU ... but NOT the system we get ..
on the loose loose ... when you get a lobby group behind something no one seems to win except the lobbyists ( sp) and then its only a short mental shot and off to save another tree, or something.
NASCAR only did it to please the 5% of the fans that are supposedly green and its good PR. The average you and me couldn't give a rats a$$ because the emissions they put out isn't even measurable in the sheme of things ..
BTW IHC ... you have some great postings .. very solid..
on the loose loose ... when you get a lobby group behind something no one seems to win except the lobbyists ( sp) and then its only a short mental shot and off to save another tree, or something. NASCAR only did it to please the 5% of the fans that are supposedly green and its good PR. The average you and me couldn't give a rats a$$ because the emissions they put out isn't even measurable in the sheme of things ..
BTW IHC ... you have some great postings .. very solid..
I forgot NASCAR went to fuel injection. That's worth some hp alone. I wonder how they're going to regulate hp, do they still use some form of throttle restriction (TB size or restrictor plates)?
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