I've been reading the posts about harsh ride, rattles, etc. with the TL that seem to come up on a consistent basis and I just wanted to give some perspective to the term "quality"...

As the former owner of an '03 Lexus SC430 (purchased new), I noticed 3 issues mentioned consistently by owners of this car:

1) Teeth-jarring ride caused by the runflat tires. The dealers would not even talk about replacing the tires, which were an extra-cost option, so owners had to spring for the extra cost of Michelin P/S or similar. We were then left with the option of no spare or a $775 spare tire kit.

2) Numerous rattles coming from the roof, passenger seat, and various other places inside the car. Some of these went away with replacing tires. Some didn't.

3) Annoying buzzing coming from the door speakers caused from the bass in certain music. Some owners had entire door panels replaced, some didn't. Problem was never completely resolved.

During my year of ownership, I personally experienced all of these issues and I had a model that was in the 2nd year of production. (If anyone has any doubts as to the validity of the problems you can visit the SC430 forum in ClubLexus.)

See any similarities here? Everytime someone complains about rattles or a harsh ride someone else is quick to jump in (especially non-owners) and scream "poor quality" or "Acura had to cut corners somewhere". The only difference here is that it's "I expected more from a $35k car" instead of "I expected more from a $60k car". Does that help put things into perspective?

Don't let someone tell you that Acura scrimped on quality because of niggly problems. Acura has hit a home run and delivered a great car for the money. The Lexus SC430 is at the top of JD Powers' list of most reliable vehicles... not because of the ride or lack of rattles (and certainly not because of the handling!) but because it doesn't spend a lot of time in the shop. Aside from the niggly issues, I think MOST of us can say the same thing for our TL's. Enjoy the drive!

Thanks for letting me put in my $.02.

 

Well said...

 

Like my Father use to to say - "two wrongs don't make a right". Shame on Acura at $30K. Bigger shame on Lexus at $60K.

 

BarryH: Shame on u

 

Even bigger shame for BMW for rattles in an 86K 745i. It can keep going on forever..I'll be the new Maybach has some, and that bad boy is 300K+ . Fact is, shut up already, all those that are complaining about MINOR issues . Nothing is perfect..and 35K ain't shit for a car these days. I have a 500K home in Las Vegas, and I have had tons of problems. My neighbor down the road in his 1.5 million dollar home has several problems too!

Moral of the Story: EXPECT MINOR PROBLEMS..BE PLEASANTLY SURPRISED IF U DON'T HAVE ANY!!! focus some of that energy on having the problem fixed. I really luv all the people that are quick to SUE or claim LEMON LAW because they have a minor rattle in their car..those are the people that really crack me up

 

Allow me to add some perspective as well. The following is the list of warranty work I've had done to recent vehicles...

1998 Dodge Durango: Power-window failure at 50 miles. Warped brake rotors at 1,200 miles. Power-window failure again at 1,600 miles. HVAC-fan failure at 6,500 miles. Broken front half-shaft at 6,800 miles. Warped brake rotors again at 7,200 miles. Interval-wiper failure at 9,300 miles. Rear A/C blows warm air at 12,100 miles. Transmission failure at 28,800 miles. Traded-in with 32,500 miles.

2001 Ford Mustang Cobra: Engine develops serious knock/ping at 500 miles. Dealer was never able to fix the problem. Clutch slipping at 1,000 miles. Dealer found a tranny gasket was improperly installed and tranny fluid was making a serious mess of the flywheel and pressure plate. Second-gear synchros failed at 2,500 miles. Dealer replaced. Second-gear synchros failed again at 3,000 miles. Dealer replaced entire tranny due to TSB on bent shift forks. Engine knock/ping gets worse. Five repair attempts. Dealer and Ford have no clue what to do. Ford denies request for a new engine. Vehicle returned under Lemon Law at 5,000 miles.

2002 Chevy Avalanche 1500: Front-differential failure at 400 miles. Dealer claims part was improperly assembled at the factory. Subsequent repair results in an immediate second failure and gear oil contaminating much of the front chasis. Attempted cleanup resulted in paint being removed from the front frame-rails and the truck developing a serious rust problem. Dealer refuses further repair. Chevy says tough luck. Rear brakes spring a leak at 5,000 miles. Paid for repair out of my own pocket because failure occurred in a rural town in Wyoming. Chevy refuses reimbursement. Engine blows smoke during cold starts and is consuming oil at 9,500 miles. Dealer replaces PCV valve. Problem persists. Truck traded out of frustration. Time to try a foreign car.

2004 Acura TSX 6MT Navi: No mechanical problems or warranty repairs after a year of ownership and 20,000 miles.

2004 Acura TL 5AT Navi: Car has a couple of minor rattles but is otherwise smooth and solid at 1,250 miles. No complaints.

 

Barry now keep this in mind. "Three right makes a left".

 

Not eveybody here is complaining. Some simply want to get the words out to fix the problems. It doesn't matter how much you paid for your cars. Some rattle, headline, etc., etc. issues are not acceptable. Do you think that Acura would've done something about tires if no one complained about it? Your arguments about how much you paid for your Lexus and some of the problems you have in that car are irrelevant with TLs.

 

I have been driving a rental 2004 Cadillac De Ville for a week. Some observations:

I should have taken along some sea-sick pills for the road trip from Ft. Lauderdale to Orlando. The ride was very soft and cushy and boring.

The radio (I won't call it a sound system because I have one of those in my TL and this isn't one) could get very loud which would undoubtedly please many on this forum. My dog is deaf but couldn't take maximum volume; he started moaning and crying. I was close. I think I saw a trickle of blood coming from his ears (j/k PETA). But the sound was as mushy as the ride. It was artificial and muddy compared with the system in the TL which is crystal clear and clean. I was unable to adjust it to a good balance F to R.

The Cad has LED turn signals in the mirrors. BFD. So do Ford trucks. Not impressed. It was distracting (it's on the mirror side).

The Cad sounded and felt quick. It's an illusion. It has its best show in passing speeds on the pike. 60-100 MPH is fun. I was toying with a 'Vette since we were both bored and there was no other traffic on the road. At one point, I raced up behind him in his lane, then swerved out and blew by him at about 100. All of a sudden, it felt like someone popped my drag chute! I still had my foot to the floor, but the Cad was braking. There is a lag in the digital speedometer but the last reading I saw was 3 figures and climbing.

WTF??

Then, on the Pac Man instrument panel, the notice scrolled. "TOP SPEED FUEL CUTOFF ACTIVATED" Huh? At about 110 max?

Upon consideration, I figured the tires must not be rated for more than that. The "W" rated tires on the TL are rated for 168 MPH and there is no "TOP SPEED FUEL CUTOFF" that I know about.

The Cad has an enormous turning radius. It also has an enormous back seat- much bigger than the TL. I have had one person in the back of my TL since I got it. And that one, I could have done without. Thinking back to my last cars, I don't think I have had people in the back seat more than 10 times in 15 years. If Acura had a '04 CL, I would be driving it today.

The interior of the Cad is devoid of style or function. It looks like it was designed by a committee with stock in DuPont. The plood is amateurish. The buttons: contra-intuitive. It plays ONE, mind you, ONE CD once you figure out how.

On a bumpy road, the Cad squeaks and rattles but it didn't bother me. I EXPECT cars, made up of thousands of parts, to squeak and rattle on bumpy roads. Besides, it was hard to distinguish between the rattles from the car and the anomolies in the radio/CD.

The seats are wide and the leather nice in the Cad but the TL is more comfortable when you get it where you want it.

I averaged 22 miles per gallon with heavy foot. I drove it like the rental car it is!

The steering wheel adjusts up and down, but not in and out. The Cad drives like a.... well, a Caddy. My TL is sporty and responsive to small inputs. Tight. Caddy=NOT tight.

Worst of all, I talked to the Caddy but it never answered me. The satellite radio buttons just yielded a curt statement that I must be too cheap to have ordered the option. Same for the phone function of the On Star.

The Cad is a stretch Lumina with extra padding, a nice V8 engine, and a bogus claim of luxury, IMO, for a $47,000 car (base).

I'll keep my TL, thank you very much. The TL just owns the Caddy hands down.

XP

 

I'm glad I haven't had any serious problems. I LOVE my car. End of story. I don't feel it's poor quality. It has its issues, like all cars, but its tranny didn't fall apart at 625 miles like my Dodge Intrepid.

 

I had one problem (other than the tires) which I fixed myself. The TL is one fine automobile. I'm happy with my purchase and wouldn't change it for anything.

 

In a poll thread that's running, 56% of owners have said they have one or more rattles. That kind of sucks for a new premium car. I had a TL-S and the only two rattle complaints people had were the package shelf and sunroof which affected a small number of cars and was easily corrected. What you're saying is that times have changed and people should now expect less from a newer car that costs more than the model it replaced. Kind of illogical. BTW, I got a BMW 325cic in November and the thing has not one single rattle and it's had it's roof cut off. I might have been lucky but if you check out bimmerfest there's not a lot of QC/rattle discussions going on. Other issues yes. Rattles no.

 

neuronbob,

That is very scary. What became of the Intrepid? I guess Dodge STILL has tranny issues. Here's a quick story for you. I was interning at an outpatient clinic as part of my professional studies and had a Dodge tech as a patient. We talked about cars and he admitted that Dodges seem to have persistent tranny issues. Now that was about 7 years ago. I guess some things just don't change. Hope all the Hemi power isn't going to wreck more trannies. Glad my TL only as an intermitten rattle only.

dsc888

 

We have the 04 3/4 ton Ram, and so far it is much improved on the 99 V10 we had. Steering and braking is MUCH tighter. We did have some tranny problems on the 99 (torque converter) but the local dealer was able to fix it. Hopefully, the new Dodge's will be better.

Compare that with the $55K Suburban we had for a year - a TRUE lemon! Faulty brakes, steering, fuel system, transmission, battery cabling, electrics, doors, interior - a true deathtrap. And GM were not interested in the slightest - "Your brakes haven't failed yet; what's the problem?" - a DIRECT quote from the GM representative during the arbitration meeting. We only got GM to buy it back after starting a website - www.gmclemon.com. They agreed less than 4 days after seeing it

My 2000 TL was the best car I've ever owned - Period. I hated to hand it back. Yes, it had a couple of rattles, but it was superb to drive. I can't wait for the 05.

Vegas_TL04 - Black on Black? In this heat? Yeeoouch! I would be interested in knowing if you bought at Falconis, and how that went for you. THat's probably where I'll be getting mine.

 

Yeah..i bought at Falconi's. I have never really cared for that dealership much...but it seems TREMENDOUSLY better since they have built the new facility and moved further west on Sahara. I didn't care much for my saleslady either, but that actually played to my advantage, as when I went to negotiate the deal, it made it that much easier for me to be tough!! I got mine for 34500 6 SPD manual, NAVI, and high performance tires (which stayed on the car about a month!!), and protection package. I spent 500 more for gap insurance...invaluable to have IMHO. they actually had my car on the lot, and tried to give me the crap about how rare they are and hard to get, in which i replied "MUST NOT BE TOO RARE SINCE THIS ONE IS SITTING HERE AND HAS BEEN FOR ABOUT A WEEK WITH NO BUYER!!!??"...needless to say they shut up and starting dealing as I was preparing to walk and just buy the car in LA. I know I couldve maybe gotten another 500 bucks off if i played the game in So CAL, but it wasnt worth my inconvenience and decided to buy local. also, this way they have no problems giving me service loaners, etc. :P

 

my TL has a rattle, had the headliner problem... i dont complain, shit happens, take it in and they fix it... the ONLY thing I hate is... I'm 24, I can't get a loaner... thats plain bukkake

 

Right On!!!!! I Love My Tl And Couldnt Be Happier With Its Performence So Far.

 

I dunno guys... My TL rattles and squeeks about as much as my Altima did, I'm sorry to say. I dropped my car off this morning to have them fix some of them, and the dealer was out of rentals, so they called Enterprise. Enterprise picked me up in an 04 Durango with 8000 miles on it that felt as solid as a drum, not a single rattle or squeek, even or bad pavement and railroad tracks...

 

Great info - thanks!!

My 2000 TL came out of Scottsdale because Falconi's couldn't get me the lease deal I wanted (they only dealt with Honda finance, who wouldn't accept a big down payment). Haven't had any serious contact with the current crop of salesmen, but they seem better than the average for Vegas (Towbin? Desert? That A-hole Barr? Acckk! Barr makes me embarrased to be British!). The service guys have always been great - very helpful, and not patronising at all (being a car-smart female, that's a big thing with me). And the new location is much improved over the old place.

I'm looking at an 05 Silver w/Onyx, 5AT with Navi. Shouldn't be that hard... but I'll still talk to dealers in LA and Scottsdale. I don't mind the $100 in flights and the drive back if the deal is worth it.

I've noticed they have a few on the lot, and I haven't seen many TLs around - but I saw a Black one going south on 95 around Cheyenne at lunchtime yesterday. Might have been you