redtail07

Cars like a Yaris I would expect to be a piece of crap right off the lot. But to some people, its a warranty, low maintenance, fuel efficient vehicle. Most people don't really think about depreciation. Or the coolness/fun-to-drive factor

Jase13

Acura's hold their value.

NavS

I was down to choosing either the TL-S, GS350, and the BMW 535... The answer was easy. The TL had more goodies and was newer/less mileage for the price vs the older GS and the unequipped BMW. I guess the only regret I had was FWD vs RWD but I think I've gotten over it with the fuel savings.

Toneroni

I was deciding between an IS250, G35x, tsx and the TL won out due to the outstanding value.

Curiston

I've had car fever most of my life, always itching for my next ride. My TL has me happy, 2 of my friends recently picked up new civics and paid equal or more to what I paid for my 08. They are both sad to say the least.

n3o

iTrader: (2)

I'll complain.

'06 white 6mt w/ nav
108,000 miles.
$14,995 and this dealer is VERY firm on their prices. I've been there before.

http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-s...15326885&Log=0

MLantzyTL3

What the???

I'm about to purchase an '04 w/ 150,000 for right around $4k from a family member. AND the private selling on KBB (at fair condition) is $6,905.

I feel I should look around a bit more for an '06 for $7k?!?!?

Toneroni

the 06 TL glen_one_n sold had 170k miles.. I think 4k for the TL from a family member seems good. Especially if they took care of it.

n3o

iTrader: (2)

Good luck. I've been looking for 4 months for another TL or S2000. You wont get a good car for under 8-10k.

MLantzyTL3

It was well maintained. Body condition is on the fair side, but I've got a good friend at a body shop that would help me with the fixes and help work on a case of bud light.

Also just looking for something to get me from point A to B without any hiccups for a few years.

gideon's_test

Going to the dealer tonight to pick up a '04 WDP 6MT w/73K miles for $13,000. Seems like it's line with what I'm seeing here...

rockstar143

iTrader: (6)

6MT is the key...you'll love it.

geekybiker

I drove my 06TL new off the dealer's lot and don't regret it one bit. The price spread at the time between a new one and a used one was about $1000. New I knew the history, and could order the exactly color combo and options I wanted. New isn't such a bad deal if you keep your car a long time. If you're switching every few years, the extra bucks add up.

Healingduck

Yea, it really depends on the car. Some cars depreciate thousands the second you drive it off the lot, others not so much.

But to me the biggest pro is that you get to choose the color combo/options on the car and pretty much fit it to your needs. I it's worth it if you are going to pick that sort of stuff and to me that stuff is a big deal.

And as you said, you get to know the history of your car which is pretty much priceless.

giggity

Regarding skip shifting... My 01 eclipse GT was driven for 150k before the wreck and it took any gear like a champ. I would definitely agree with no power shifting or speed shifting while doing it though. Let the flywheel slow down just past the correct rpm then blip the ga back up to the correct rpm and I never had any issues.

Of course I only did this from 0-60 1st then 2nd - after the person was behind me, get into 5th after coasting...

Regarding the mpg... 55 gives me about 38 but I'm a target on the road where 65 is the speed limit. So pulse and glide between 79 And 65 along with a little bit of dwl gives me 34 on the highway. Max pressure on tires is 50 and I set them to 40... Let's you glide for longer. This on a 5AT

I have also started down shifting with the SS to keep it in DFCO. Keeping my city driving around 28. 50 I down shift to 4th... 40 to 3rd... Never into 2nd

Upshift at 2500 rpms... In 5th at 40 or 45 depending the incline.

giggity

^^^^^
Acceleration is 0-60 in 10 - I dot seem to push it as often as my eclipse.
There are not many cars that I feel are a challenge anymore.
I want to go against my boys 328i coupe.

Regarding the actual topic of the thread lol
I have no regrets with the cost of my TL. 04 with 72k $13k.
I had stay above 200hp and have a better mpg than the eclipse.
With being a four door to put the wife and 2 kids for long trips (instead of the expo) and being a daily driver... It's the best car. After my mom having a legend with 300k miles on it, I knew they were reliable (with maintenance)

robocam

I thought the way you did before I bought my 2006 6MT TL w/navi in 2009 with 77k miles. But after how much I've spent on it and how much I'm going to spend on it (for repairs/maintenance), it's much more difficult to hold that position (still trying though!). And I didn't know about the 3rd gear issue until after I bought it (it didn't act up during the test drive). I think I still love it but I'm in the middle of some struggles with it right now, and here's my story.

Here are a few things that cost a lot (to me), and obviously most are normal maintenance items, but they're still costly and certainly not how much a Yaris would command! =)

New clutch and flywheel @ 104k $2105
Timing belt and water pump @104k $1090
New left & right axles @104k $611 (not dealer)
I've also done a lot of brake work myself (rotors, pads).

Right now it's in the shop getting one of its heads repaired. I accidentally downshifted from 2nd into 1st instead of upshifting into 3rd causing piston to valve contact. I know this is operator error, but Honda's engineers should have thought of this and used valve springs with just a little bit more force. This repair will probably end up costing around $2200. I also purchased better valve springs at the cost of $289. Hopefully this will prevent this from happening again if I mis-shift.

So if they're going to do a valve adjustment on the head that's out, I might as well have the other head's valves adjusted. That's another $204.

And while they were in there, they found that my power steering pump is leaking. That's another $180 if the dealer does it, but I'm going to do it myself (parts are just $50).

Now everything would be fine and dandy when fixed, but that clutch they put in doesn't feel right (it feels way too slippery - can barely bark from a 1-2 shift). Could it be the master/slave cylinders? Who knows. The tech said that they've never seen those have problems when they're not leaking. He's going to check it out once he's done with the head.

After I get it back from the dealer, it's going straight to the transmission shop (probably Aamco). Here the thread I started on my transmission.

https://acurazine.com/forums/3g-tl-problems-fixes-114/difficulty-shifting-into-1st-also-need-advice-mt-transmission-rebuild-837925/#post13345235

It's 12.9 hours of labor plus parts. I guess now would be a good time to get that new 3rd gearset.

The whole reason I didn't get an E39 BMW or Mercedes was because I didn't want to deal with tons of repair bills. If I had known I was going to pour this much cash into my TL, I may not have purchased it. Now I know I'm to blame for some of my problems, but oh well.

I've been browsing Autotrader to see some what ifs.

Check out this nice 2003 Mercedes E500 for $13k.

http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-s...18286530&Log=0

Or maybe you want some more luxury? How about a 2004 S500 4-MATIC for $15k?

http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-s...18713341&Log=0

Perhaps you want something a little more late-model. How about a 2005 E320 for $14k?

http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-s...12587816&Log=0

Yes, they're "high-mileage" but still under 100k, and I'll bet that if I had bought cars like those back before I bought my TL, I probably would have spent less repairing/maintaining them, and they look a LOT more luxurious.

Oh, and how on earth are you averaging 30 mpg on your MT TL with "spirited" driving? I average 17.8 MPG over 6892 city/highway miles (I don't have my average speed handy). That's one thing good about the TL. I can only imagine the horrors if I had an E500 with its big V8, but man do I wish my TL had more torque.

When someone buys a new car, they don't have to deal with a lot of these high-mileage repair/maintenance bills. I might not get a Yaris, but a Camry is only a few thousand more, and we have one of those in our household (we paid $100 over invoice and invoice at the time (2005) was $16,645 according to autobuyguide.com, but $17-18k sounds closer if I recall correctly). Not a single out-of-warranty repair yet (we've had it since 2005 and now it's 2012). Only one warranty repair (water pump bearing made noise). Guess how much I have to pay when the timing belt needs to be changed. Zero dollars! It has a timing chain! =) What amazes me is that it's still on its original set of brake pads past 60k miles! My 6MT eats through brake pads like there's no tomorrow. Good thing Autozone offers a lifetime warranty on brake pads!

Don't get me wrong. I really like my TL, but it comes at a cost (to me at least). But there are days that I wonder what it would've been like had a bought that BMW 525/530/540, Mercedes E55/430/320, Lexus LS430 (the dealer let me take it home for one night and man it felt so good!), Infiniti G35x, Infiniti Q45, Honda Accord V6, or Toyota Camry V6. Those were all cars I seriously considered before choosing the TL. I even bought a 2005 Volvo S80 2.5T (it only had 44k miles!) for two months before selling it to buy the TL. I got 23 MPG (vs 17.8 on the TL), and it felt like it had a LOT more torque (loved the turbo torque, but dislike the turbo cool down period after spirited driving). Ultimately got rid of the S80 because I got obsessed with stability control (the Volvo I got didn't have it - the TL does). If my previous car had stability control, it would still be alive (I spun out on the highway because of some water).

Anyway, since I've put so much into my TL, I'm going to stick with it for the long haul. I hate to think that I made a bad choice =) but this has taught me a big lesson. All that research through Edmunds, Consumer Reports, and what-not didn't prepare me for any of this. The next time I buy a car, I will put MUCH less emphasis on perceived reliability. Man that E500 looks nice!

Guiltyox

Personally, I'll never drive a Mercedes, as they might as well be garbage, IMO. Sounds like you just got the short end of the stick when you bought your TL. Purchasing a warranty + having a mechanic look at the car prior to buying might have saved money on this one.

As far as the heads are concerned, no sympathy from me there. Good luck with the car from here on out!

robocam

I don't think I got the short end. All my repairs/maintenance are typical. I did have my Acura dealer check out the car before I bought it, and it was fine at the time. Besides, I don't believe in paying extra for "aftermarket" warranties. The last time I bought one, the company went bankrupt, (Warranty Gold) and my plan was supposedly double insured (whatever that means).

No sympathy? Why's that? You think it'll never happen to you? I just don't think that's a very nice thing to say especially to someone who's hurting.

twigglius

iTrader: (6)

x2???

parasitius

So you bought the vehicle with the expectation of having $0 in work? Realistically you must have had a number in mind, so the real cost was double your number or what?

For me I got an extremely high-miles 07 TL-S for about $8,000 below what a "low miles" ~70,000 version of the same year would have cost. I saw it as a gamble I was likely to win -- no matter how much crap needs done, I'm likely to come out /under/ the $8k difference. So far I needed the 105k maintenance and back break pads = $1200. I won't be freaking out until the running repair bill hits $4,000. I don't see what the big deal is.

dc2_LEO

I just picked up an 04' for the wifey. I paid $9,500 and it had 104k. It's a used car and has its small issues. I can't complain though, it's a smooth car and runs well. The TL's have really impressed me, minus the infamous dash crack....

parasitius

(can't believe I wrote "break" pads above) b]

geekybiker

Most of your issues are either normal maintenance on a car of that mileage or user error. Chances are if you had bought your Mercedes or BMW you'd be look at many of the same maintenance issues and they would be charging more for the work. Any time you buy a car pushing over 60k miles you should start asking yourself when the major services are due, how much they cost, and have they already been done. This is particularly true once you approach 100k miles. Many people who are thinking of selling choose to sell just before these major items are due to avoid the costs.

Healingduck

Pretty much this. If you buy a used car with 77k miles on it, you shouldn't be surprised if it needs something done to it. Even the most reliable car require maintenance, and possibly more depending on how well the previous owner took car of it. Which is also a problem when buying a used car.

Sure that '03 Mercedes may look nice, but a car that old is bound to need maintenance, and the risk of something going wrong is increased. Just like the TL. But with a Mercedes you will be paying quite a bit more.

Mr Marco

Bullshit. If you spend the time to find the right car, you wont need to spend a penny right off the bat. Finding a good used car in today's market takes time. It took my 3 months to find a suitable used Impreza for my sister. Other than a broken interior door handle, she has not had a single issue.

Guiltyox

I've owned a 3G 6MT TL/TL-S (traded in at 3.5 years), for 4-5 years now, without any of your issues. Furthermore, I've always purchased my cars from an Acura dealership, with Acura warranties, through Acura Financial Services. Might I also add that I now have an '07 MDX on top of it, without issues. Countless other members on here have also not experienced the issues you have. With all of your issues and "normal repairs", it naturally seems you received the short straw when you purchased it.

As far as you damaging your car due to an unfortunate down-shift (regardless of intentional or unintentional): Sorry for your mishap.


Now leave the pity-party and rejoin the fun here at Azine!

robocam

I expected a 3 year old TL with 77k miles (mostly highway) to be in great shape, ready for many more miles. But I did get it from a private seller at a great price, so I somewhat agree with your last sentence. But paying $8000 for maintenance & repairs in less than a year's time is still a heartbreak. If I had known I was going to drop this much money into it this soon, I would probably have bought a brand new car or at least a different one.

A lot of people have over revved their engines. While I understand this is user error, Honda should have designed the engine in such a way that this would not damage it. What other car has this issue? A simple mis-shift and you're stuck with a $4000 repair bill? And let's not forget the 3rd gear issue.

I also was not expecting the $400+ valve adjustment (again, what car needs this??? other than the Prelude) and $2000+ clutch/flywheel job. But I know it's my fault for not getting the exact prices beforehand. For some reason I thought a clutch job would only cost around $800, but who knew I also needed a new flywheel. And axles failing at ~100k is ridiculous. At least my new ones from Dobbs has a lifetime warranty.

Another thing is that many of these "issues" are related to the fact that this car has a manual transmission. If I had gotten a Lexus, BMW or Mercedes, I probably would have gone with an automatic, which might be more expensive to repair, but I'm sure it would last a lot longer than ~104k miles. I would also not need valve adjustments or risk damage from over revving the engine. The axles probably will last longer, and same with the power steering pump.

I don't consider a 3 year old car with 77k miles that old. What kind of maintenance did you have in mind? TLs seem like they are virtually maintenance free. You change your oil & filter, air filter, tires, brake parts, fluids, a few big things every 105k miles...no big deal. See, I don't consider that Mercedes as being "that old." In our household, we have "old" cars made from 1985 to 1999. We drive our cars until they literally die, so I've seen what it takes to maintain cars and what happens to them as they get old.

It depends on what "right" means to you. I know I would have probably experience zero issues if I had bought a Camry, but I wanted something more "fun." I guess I'm paying for that "fun" now.

If I had purchased my TL through Acura, it would have cost several thousand more, so for my situation, it would not have been practical.

An MDX has an automatic transmission, so it wouldn't risk getting over revved.

I'm sure that there are many people that haven't experienced these problems, but the fact is, many have, as evidenced by the numerous posts. Why does a power steering pump with ~100k miles need to be fixed? And it's not like this is an isolated case. It seems like everyone with an Acura that uses this pump will need this repair around this mileage. The power steering pump on our 1985 Chevy is still original, and it has over 200k miles on it! I know this isn't a "big" issue, but I would have thought that a Honda part would be more reliable. And again, I know this is a small issue, and I will be happy if something worse doesn't happen.

The lesson I'm taking from this experience is that ALL cars will fall apart despite how reliable the brand might seem, so the next time I choose one, I will place far less emphasis on brand reliability perception and more on how much I like the car.

And thanks for your comment on my over rev. I'm having stiffer valve springs installed to prevent this from happening again.

And don't worry. I just needed a listening ear. I love my TL, and I will enjoy it for many years to come. I can't wait to get it back from the shop.

TheLT

iTrader: (1)

I would love to get mileage like that, I'm lucky to get 19 city. I drive to and from college occasionally, about 85 miles apart, and it's entirely highway. I get like 24-25 TOPS