dmcfan

I recently traded in my 07 TSX for a certified 06 TL from the same dealer I bought the TSX from. I have never had any issues from them and we have bought our recent cars (3 in 4 years).

They day I bought mine it was in the middle of one of the worst weather weeks we have had in the midwest. I looked over the paint the best I could and I had them get the certified checklist for my review. Every section on the checklist regarding the body panels was checked as "meets Acura standards".

I finally had the time to detail the whole car (clay bar, cleaner,wax) and while I was going over the car the whole pass side of the rear bumber was dull and orange peeled. I then noticed that the length of the roof line right above the doors on both sides had pitting below the clear and there were also visable finger prints under the clear. There are also visable tape lines. I took this to my cousin who owns a body shop to confirm my findings. Now that I have detailed it all of this stands out like a sore thumb.

To me this is hardly what I would call "Acura standards". I would like to see another certified car like this that meets Acura standards. The car was obvioulsy repainted and the certified checklist did not mention any repainting, etc. Isn't this something they would have to disclose especially being a certified car? I really can't see how this was missed.

So what are my options? What should I expect them to do since I caught them in a misrepresentation of the car? I am supposed to go in on Thursday.

YeuEmMaiMai

Good luck with that but once you took delivery of the car, there isn't much you can do. talk to them and see what they say

VQPower37

i would demand them to put u in a car of equivalent or greater value ... such as an 07 tl due to their misinterpretation of the car ... i dont think acura certified cars are suppose to have that much body work done on them. so request them in a demanding tone you want something done or u will be talking to acura corporate, or u will be calling your lawyer ... that is what i would do.

ggesq

iTrader: (1)

I think you have alot to work with here. See this: http://www.acura.com/content/PreOwned/CPO_150pt.pdf

swoosh

iTrader: (5)

am not a car guru and not had many occurences with the dealership but here is my input....

certified pre-owned means you get an additional 12000 miles warranty.....and the car goes through a 150 or 175 points check.....

"acura standards" means not new but no need to replace right now.....tires/brakes/etc etc.....

about repainting......i had a little door accident (another car ran into my car while my door was open).....and there were no cops.....no report.....insurance claim and i got my car fixed and the fault was other persons so i didnt pay jack.....now since no cops and no complaint there was no record on car-fax and my door is repainted......

so there could be many possibilities.....i think you should talk to your dealer if the paint is peeling.....i dont think they would give some money back or something lolz @ that......you might get some extra's (after they fix your car) as in free oil change for life, or free extended warranty..and all that jazz.....just my pennies.....

123456SPEED

I have bought 'certified' Acuras before and IMO it's mainly a promotional tool. The checklist is just a paper. My certified car had numerous obvious things wrong. like headlights way out of adj, ABS sensor on in dash, passenger seat wouldn't move, needed new tail light, driver window was not aligned correctly. body had some paint work.

It's a selling tool, that's all. even the 'certified' warranty does not cover everything the orig warranty does.
A certified Acura is basically $2000 more with a 1 year added on limited warranty. Can be a good deal, can be not so good. Good luck on yours. I got them to fix everything and loved the car, a 95 Legend Coupe, but I no longer consider the 'certified' status anything but a selling tool.

dmcfan

Thank you for your quick responses. As I would normally say "buyer beware" on any used car the fact that part of the checklist is the finish of EVERY body panel and it is clearly faulty, I can't see how they would say it is up to Acura standards.

The link to the checklist actually brings up one more thing. After driving the car more I noticed that it drifted to the right. This is a part of the checklist. I had them do an alignment two weeks after and the rear toe was way out of spec. To me this is another misrepresentation of the car since they checked it as ok. I still have the alignment sheet that shows how out of spec it was. I highly doubt it got that way after two weeks of driving.

To me I would be happy with the paint done correctly, however since I have two recorded misrepresentations I am starting to wonder what else was misrepresented on this individual car to where I would like them to consider allowing me to replace it with another on their lot.

dmcfan

Just wondering what your tone was for the "a lot ot work with". Was it more You don't have a chance it is to little to late or yes you have a valid arguement?

anx1300c

iTrader: (2)

It's a used car that has had some paint work. All "certified" means is that the car has never been totalled, not that it hasn't has bodywork. I'm not sure you have any legal recourse at this point, but you could try talking to them.

ggesq

iTrader: (1)

It is very rare that I am rude to new members. I think you have a valid argument. At the very least- they could have advised you that the vehicle has had some prior repair and let you make the decision on whether or not you wanted the vehicle. If this was anything other than a "Certified" car from Acura, I would say, "tough" but it's not the case here.

carlos9827

iTrader: (2)

Good Luck. Dealers can be really shady sometimes. Hope you get your situation resolved though.

dmcfan

As I would agree that it is a selling tool because it costs them next to nothing to certify a car and they sell it for a price, the fact that the finish of the body panels in on the checklist and was checked as meets Acura standards means that any car with obviously sloppy paint work meets their standards?

My cousin, whos body shop is one of the most reccognized in the area by having the MB, Porsche, Bently, Ferrari contract for the local dealers said that he is surprised they would certify a car with so much paint work done. He told me the whole rear section was painted, rear quarters, bumper, trunk and the rails above the doors.

I know the only way to know what will happen is wait for Thursday.

dmcfan

I knew you weren't beng rude I just wasn't sure what you really meant by it. I agree with used cars it is buyer beware but again it comes to the checklist. I am not sure why some people keep thinking that doesn't matter. It does matter because there was very poorly done body work done over 1/3 of the car and they marke dthe checklist as meets standards. I agree they should have atleast diclosed this on the checklist.

dmcfan

This is from the certification page on Acura's site:

Every vehicle must pass stringent measures before it can become a Certified Pre-Owned Acura. Only well-maintained, late-model Acura vehicles are considered, and each one must pass a comprehensive 150-point inspection and a Vehicle History Report review. Virtually every mechanical system—from the engine to the door locks—is checked and serviced to meet precise specifications, and a thorough appearance inspection scrutinizes fit and finish—inside and out—to ensure that every vehicle upholds the luxury and sophistication of the Acura name. The Acura Dealership technicians also inspect all placements of the Vehicle Identification Number to ensure that the VIN plates match. In addition, the VIN is researched for open service campaigns.

MWalsh9152

CPO is a joke. I took delivery of my first Acura, and promptly brought it back the next morning and made them take it back. Stringent measures my ass....mine had a shitload of problems that should have been found on this "checklist"

kabota

to the OP:
Does the damaged sheetmetal have the "honda" sticker on the inside?

I don't know if you have much to stand on. Maybe let this be a reminder that you always look a car over on a nice sunny day.

I drove almost 2 hours to go look at an Element at a Honda dealer. It was certified and after my test drive I took a quick feel and look at the frame underneath and I found a boat load of oil. Just because something is certified with a 150 point check doesn't mean it was actually checked. Buyer Beware.

dmcfan

Oh I know it was probably just written up quickly as a formality and these things weren't noticed, however since the checklist does exist and it is supposed to meet Acura standards they would need to back it up. I will see what the dealer says tomorrow and depending on what happens I will bring it up to the next level.

lembowski

iTrader: (1)

have you went to talk to them about it? i would have left detailing right on the spot and started my own storm over at the dealer.

dmcfan

I am meeting with them at 6:30am tomorrow morning. I will post what happened.

dmcfan

Ok I went in and once they saw it they couldn't come back with anything to say. The Sales Director came over and told me that he personally doesn't do the certifications and it upsets him that this was sent through certification and delivered to the customer like this. He basically said we f'd up without saying it. They are taking the car in Monday and will go over everything I noted. I also got reimbursed for the alignment. I will say that they handled it professionally and didn't try to dance around it. Now lets see how the quality is after it is done.

TLAdvanced

iTrader: (4)

That's great! I'm glad to hear they are not blowing you off. I hope everything works out!!

kabota

Glad it worked out for you.

007TL-S

AGREED! page 4 stipulates exterior finish included ...... he should make it an issue!

007TL-S

Yes he doe's , It's called a breach contract, that say's all has been checked & "CERTIFIED TO MEET Stsndards!....shame on you you if you didn't follow through!

007TL-S

Talk with the "General Store Manager & Service Manager and tell them about your Issue's & show them ,"ASK & DEMAND them "KINDLY" to make it "RIGHT" and let them know that you will be notifying "American HONDA & the Area's Zone Manager!....trust me thing's will happen!.....just be polite & respectfull and patient! good luck!

007TL-S

Kick-ass , I'm glad to see it worked out for you!....they'll take care of you trust me!......Make "SURE" you get a( ASK)Loaner while your car is in the shop!(At leasta week in ADVANCE!...... and Be sure to down plently of the snack's in the waiting room!!!

bluenoise

I bought my TL CPO and ended up with a similar paint problem. The dealership took of the problem. The worst part was having a Buick as a loaner.

dmcfan

That is the one thing I like about this dealer is you always get the kind of Acura you own as a loaner. When I had the TSX I got a TSX loaner, now I get TL's as loaners. The problem is they give you 08's so it makes you wanting to get one. Tha car goes in Monday.

kabota

follow through on what?

Also my permanent address is near corydon.
I swim at the YMCA all the time when I am home.

dmcfan

Ok lets stay on topic please.

dmcfan

Well I picked up the car after they said it "looked beautiful." Unfortunately again we had a big storm so the car was wet and still poring when I arrived.

I walked in and my service advisor said my invoice was ready at the cashier. I picked it up and saw that it said, "paint work repair approved by Chuck XXXX" who is the sales director. For the repairs it stated, "wet sand/buffing" so immediately I knew they tried to take the cheap way out, but if all was corrected by not having to result to repainting then great!

I walked to the car and looked over what I could in the rain since I didn't have an umbrella. I noticed the largest eye sore wasn't fixed at all. I went back in and the director came out and said that it must have been overlooked again. Yeah right. So we set up another appointment on the 10th.

I left and when I got it in the garage I dried it off and what to my amazement all of the blemishes were still there! It makes sense because my cousin told me everything was under the clearcoat so wet sanding wouldn't fix it. All I got for the 3 days they had it was a detail, that's all.

After this I called Acura Customer Relations and opened the case number I previously had because I was pissed. I am supposed to hear from a case manager tomorrow and I told them I either need to have the car replaced due to misrepresntation (misrepresentation is in the IL lemon law as well) or have it fixed properly by the body shop of my choice.

The dealer had their chance and insulted a three time customer by trying to pass something off. Now the car has been touched twice by a body shop and I don't want it to get any worse.

So what do you think now?

mickey3c

I would read over all your sales and warranty paperwork and be prepared to state the case and provide short and succinct respones to any questions. Also it sounds like you are well versed with the local lemon law. It might be tough to prove they tried to pass it off as up to acura standards since it is a used car. It sounds like it was damaged and after it was repaired it was traded in.

I would state what I want for a resolution.

What I would expect is they handle it like an insurance repair job where they paint the area and blend the paint with the orginal factory job. In the end they only have to do what they are legally required to do. I can understand you are pissed, but try to walk the fine line between being enough of a squeaky wheel to get what you want and being too much of a push over or too agressive where they say they have done everything they can possibly do for you and you have buyer's remorse.

I would state that you are a recurring customer. Sales are not that great in this economy and that may carry some clout, but typically with the dealership who might also be somewhat of an advocate for you saying you are a good customer and we should go the extra mile for you.

dmcfan

Thanks! I just noticed, now that the sun is actualyl out that they burned through my paint in certain areas. Now it needs to be repainted.