briden

First off, I would like to say hello to all!

Now, on to business.

I picked up a SSM/Ebony TL about 2 weeks ago. I discovered the next day, much to my horror, that the bumpers are more pewter than silver. I took delivery in-doors due to rain and just plain didn't notice the difference during the walk around under fluorescents. But boy did it pop out at me under natural light.

I did my research here and elsewhere and then started the process with the service manager to reach a resolution to the problem. Of course I received the obligatory: all our silver TLs look the same, it will look the same if repainted, you don't want to break factory paint, etc. I took a few days to consider whether or not I could live with it.

After cringing everytime I looked at the car for those few days I decided that, "Hell No"! I can't live with it. So I took it back to the dealer yesterday, listened to the same bs for a few minutes and then pointed out the TSXs on his lot that are SSM and have bumpers that are a near perfect match. I also cited responses I've received on the internet from SSM owners that have very minute to no discoloration. I spoke of the silver metallic Hyundai at my office who's bumpers match beautifully. He kept insisting that it will only look the same and I shouldn't "break factory paint". I then INSISTED that he contact the factory rep and get approval for paint. He did.

I visited the shop today that will do the work if I proceed. Nice big, clean shop. Very professional, 2 locations, very nice and accomodating. Spoke with the manager and head paint tech at length and they are convinced they can make it much better but still strongly advised that it likely will not be a perfect match. I can live with that. What I have now is not even close. It's embarrasing to me and to Acura. They are going to shoot a sample on the same material as the bumpers and let me check it out tomorrow morning. If I approve, the car goes in on Monday.

The reason I'm posting this is to not only get feedback from any and all others going through the same ordeal but to share my experience as well. I've read through the posts from VTEC=happiness, mr_superlove, abanner and others. I know a lot of the WDP owners were posting about this but I don't think I read any SSM owners experiences.

Sorry for the novel... but appreciate everyones input.

VTEC=happiness

I would definately proceed with the repaint as some of the TL bumpers I have seen (including my own) are horrible looking. I did get mine repainted, but the car returned even worse after spending 10 days with the dealership's body shop. I just had a meeting with my factory rep yesterday and I am now being given money to go and get the work done at a place of my choice. I shopped around and found a shop with a fantastic reputation that is confident that they will be able to improve the vehicle. Hopefully it will work this time.

Good luck Briden, and just make sure that you don't back down or give up. This is a factory problem that needs to be addressed. Although some people pay extra for a two toned paint job, we did not.

mr_superlove

Welcome to the board! Sorry we had to meet under such circumstances.

I hear and feel ya, briden. When I was having mine repainted I made a couple of trips down to the body shop and saw a wrecked SSM with the problems you've mentioned.

After four attempts and having to replace the bumpers the best I can say my bumpers are is "acceptable." I'm certainly not thrilled with them. I honestly think it comes down to the shop. abanner's matched well in the end. Like mine, VTEC's intial experience was less than stellar.

Anyway, one word of advice. When you're comparing the test sprays to the body of your car stand far away. The paint on mine matches perfectly from the position the paint tech and I were standing (which was directly on top of the sample) when doing the comparison. From a distance of even 6 feet it is still off.

mr_superlove

VTEC, how much did they give you for the third-party repaint?

VTEC=happiness

They said that they would authorize the same amount that their own body shop billed for. Well, my invoice shows that the amount it $970, but they cailm that the number on my invoice is incorrect and that the total is $715. Therefore, they have given me that much to work with.

The shop that I really want to go to will be $920, but there is another good shop that I have used in the past gave an estimate of $650....I guess that I will be going there.

Aspector Gadget

Never buy a car at night or in the rain.

briden

Yeah, tell me about it. I would've never thought to look for something such as that, however.

I read about the car extensively prior to purchase but had never come across any mention of color match issues. The buying process had been superb...best ever, really...car even arrived early. Should've known it was too good. :banghead:

Shoot2Thrill

I have posted numerous times on this subject and it is a real sore point for me on this car. I have had numerous cars repaired at quality shops and the paint will be a better match than what Acura currently does on the TL. ALL colors have this issue with lighter being more noticable. This could easily be corrected but I guess if they fixed it midstream in the production year it would make it difficult to argue current greivences. Luckily car still has enough positives to sell well so it be a while before it fixed. Here's my Acura marketing strategy 05 change all the colors "slightly" and then say that all the way that color was.

TL-Rocket

Briden,

In my trip to Acura of Boston back in March, every TL on the lot had a slight
body/bumper color mismatch. This mismatch existed regardless of the color.
Even the new Honda Accords have this same color mismatch.
Could it be that the plastic bumper paints differently than the body metal?

TL-Rocket

Shoot2Thrill

I believe it is just coverage, insufficient paint. I had a repair one time very similar. Brought it back to the shop, the manager looked at it agreed, said is was just coverage. Another coat later and magic the same color. IMHO it just too far off especially when the fix is minimal cost when done sufficiently the first time. I think the bumpers have a black primer over the natural yellow color of yellow. The paint coverage is insufficient to cover the mismatch base of the sheet metal and the black bumper.

Hybrid

Paint on rubber/plastic bumpers contains flex additive so the paint won't crack when the material flexes. That alone changes the color slightly. The skill is in adjusting from that point. Plus, if the components are painted separately and the metal flakes in the paint don't settle out exactly the same (orientation), the color will look different in different light.

TheNip73

I would venture to say 95 percent of bumpers, under certain lighting conditions, do not perfectly match. I haven't seen your car, and maybe it is really bad, but I would say live with it. Don't hassle yourself over something nobody is going to notice but yourself. Is it really worth the time and hassle to only have the bumper come out the same way with non-factory paint? I wouldn't think it is. And FYI, my Abyss bliue biumper isn't a good match in direct sun, but ohh well.

Shoot2Thrill

Can anyone tell me a new current Audi or BMW color that has a similar mismatch. Any model any color.

briden

It is really bad. I could live with a slight difference. I also look at the fact that the rocker panels, door handles, xm antennae cover and mirrors all match beautifully and I think I'm pretty safe in assuming that each is also plastic. So why shouldn't the f'ing bumpers match on my 35k car?

As for non-factory paint...I couldn't care less. If done properly I think the new paint will be just as good if not better.
I'm really starting to settle on that conclusion as well. It's also one of the first things the paint tech said when we first started discussing it.

I got the paint sample today. It definitely looks a lot better than the bumpers and at some angles it even looks perfect. Then again, at some angles it looks just so so.

At this point, the 2 obvious choices are live with it or roll the dice and get it painted. I've also considered going back to the dealer and asking for another car...different color of course...NBP/Parchment would be my choice. I'm sure that would be a long shot at best, however.

This whole thing is giving me an ulcer. I love the car and it's killin' me that I have to deal with this bs. :sqntfawk: is my salute to whomever is responsible for this issue at the factory.

BTW, both the shop manager and paint tech dismissed the flex agent as having anything to do with discoloration.

Shoot2Thrill

If Acura would pay: I would get it painted. A tough color test for paint matches is the light in the parking light of shopping malls. A good paint shop can beat factory paint. I did see a silver Audi maybe a few years older today that was not so great. However the bumper portion was not half the car either. To be open I have a vested interest in the paint getting fixed. I like to seriously consider buying the 05 but right now black would be my only color choice. Black is nice but I 'll to have options. I keep cars for a long time 200-300K+ and can take care of the mechanical stuff but I want to have a nice coat of paint. The car is a great value and I trade the bluetooth, xm and some other stuff to have Acura paint the car first class.

VTEC=happiness

You may say to live with it, but if you had to live with it, I promise you would be singing a different tune. When your car is so bad that people can notice from a football field of distance away, or so bad that near strangers comment on it, and even your factory rep says "wow, this is bad", you don't live with it. The new paint I am getting is the same stuff used at the factory, but even if it wasn't, if my bumpers look a bit better, I wouldn't care. I don't think anyone here would deal with the trouble involved in getting their bumpers repainted if it wasn't bad.

jefffree

This is an interesting thread as I just took my TL to the dealer's shop for repair due to a scratch on the rear bumper left by a hit and run.

After a $650 estimate, the shop manager said "oh yeah, that's a pearl finish. You know we're going to do the best we can to match the rest of the car, but even the factory has imperfections on your car now. Look around the wheel wells. And look at the car from various angles." Went on to say that silver, white and brown/gold are real boogers for their paint crew.

My .02 worth. Thanks for the mental prep of what's to come!

Lore

jefffree:

What do you know - I had the same problem with a LOANER TL that I got a few weeks ago. Hit and run on the left rear bumper which left about 3 scratches on the bumper. I haven't heard back from the dealership yet (regarding how much I owe them) but I did take MY TL to a different dealer to address the bumps in the bumper paint. I also got a $650 price (even though it's charged to Acura) and the body shop guaranteed I'll be happy with the way the Anthracite looks or else they'll redo it for me.

We'll see!

automophile

The discoloration is caused by chemicals from the polyurethane bumper leaching into and discoloring the paint. My WDP Solara developed this slowly - after 2 years they were REALLY different colors. Fortunately, due to other's negligence, I was able to have the bumpers repainted, and they were perfect until the end of the lease. The second layer of paint sealed it.

My TL now shows some difference after only 6 months. I will report this to the dealer so it is in the record, with the note that if it continues I will insist on a re-paint. A good paint shop can match them NO PROBLEM.

By the way, My excellent paint shop told me that the bumpers MUST be removed for painting so the paint doesn't go in the jopints and make the car look cheesy. Please check on this before re-painting.

briden

I've heard this theory before as well. My first thought was, why would a car that was only 10 days old show discoloration? Then I recalled the fact that the bumpers are painted in batches separate from the car and added during assembly. They could in fact be sitting around the factory for who knows how long.

Where the f is Sherlock Holmes when you need him?

Ah well, regardless...I'm getting it painted. I believe the car will be going in on Tuesday. Wish me luck...

Lore

My repainted car was just dropped off at the dealer yesterday and should have its door panels (rattles) addressed by Tuesday. When I pick up my car I'll let you know how the repainted Anthracite bumper looks.

briden

Well, I picked the car up yesterday. Bumpers look essentially the same.

I spoke with the paint shop manager at length today. He told me they actually called in a rep from BASF and had him run a stectrograph on the body to pull the exact paint code. He's pretty much at a loss at this point why it doesn't match.

Of course the knucklehead service manager at the dealership keeps stating that it's because the bumpers are plastic and the body is metal. When I again ask why then does the TSX sitting 10' from us match near perfectly he states, "well, that I can't answer".

So, at this point I'm deciding what to do next...live with it, call ACS and start raising hell, insist to have it painted at another shop...

Lore

To their credit, paint plastic will definitely have a different look than metal, especially since there is the flex additive that they had to use to make sure the paint sticks on the paint and flexes with the plastic without cracking.

That said, what color is the TSX? Was it a different color? Some colors may appear to be better "blended" than your color. Who knows - but without those details, it's hard to say one thing or another.

Xpditor

Just for the record, the bumper covers on my NBP (black) TL match perfectly.

XP

Shoot2Thrill

I believe you, but it does not make sense. Did they do a test panel. I'm not a paint expert but clearly at some point the base material becomes a non-issue since you are painting over paint. The difference between coat after coat starts to become insignificant. Last time, my car was hit by a deer a few months ago I went to 4 shops dicussed the job and the paint matching and went with the shop I felt understood my concerns and was willing to get the proper end result. Shops can feather in the transistion between new and old paint. What is a stectograph, With a brand new car the factory paint by code should be available without compensating for fade. One shop I have gone to, not always has a machine that determines the color and mixes the paint. JMK BMW. There has got to be more to what is going on than your were told.

briden

The TSX is the same color...SSM, with the same paint code.

Blue Sky

My 1996 silver Integra also had plastic bumpers front and back, and their color matched exactly to the body. I don't think there is any excuse there.

Shoot2Thrill

I agree the black is near if not perfect. I suspect largely because the unpainted bumber is base black so converage is not an issue. I am a nit picker on this and guys love the wdp and buy it day in and day out but black is the only color I can live with because of the paint coverage. I actually don't like black that much but the bumpers otherwise would always piss me off. It just because I know they can fix this so easily.

batting_cleanup

Having worked at two dealerships in a past life I just want to tell everyone that the body shops at all of them are not worth the dynamite it would take to blow them up. There are many great shops in every area and your insurance company can be a great asset in finding a good shop. Just make sure you tell your agent you are calling for recommendations for a friend or something so they don't put a mark next to your policy. (Even inquiries can trigger annoying complications down the road).

Hopefully your dealership won't insist that you use their sub-standard shop to get your paint done but they may insist you give them the first try. If they do, just remember, every coat of paint will prevent future bleed-through. If you aren't happy with their results just insist they re-do or pay you to take it somewhere else.

BTW, I have a WDP TL and the paint is a perfect match so far. Almost a month now so I will be keeping a close eye on it.............

briden

I decided I was going to pursue all avenues in an effort to reach a resolution on the issue so I opened a case with ACS. I wasn't willing to simply keep painting the bumpers in hopes that it'll eventually turn out right. The fact the service manager kept chalking it up to "plastic bumpers" convinced me he wasn't going to go the lengths required to fix the problem either.

A few calls between ACS, the dealeship and myself took place over the past week. Today I received another call from Acura Client Services. He stated that product engineers were brought in on the issue and that they are aware of a problem with bumpers on some vehicles. He also stated that my dealer was contacted and advised on the course of action to correct the problem. He said it would involve replacing the bumpers but he didn't have any other details. He asked if I'd heard from my dealer yet…which I hadn't…so I've since left a message for the assistant service manager (service manager is on vacation) to call me back and give me the scoop.

I'm also waiting for them to bring in a new drivers door keyhole surround. The stock one was scratched something awful from some ape at the dealership who apparently was incapable of using the fob and simply jammed the key into the opening and let it guide the key to the lock.

Stay tuned for another episode of "As the TL Turns"... :sqnteek:

rescueswimmer

New bumpers may solve your problem. I hope it gets taken care of it for you. Were in the process of buying a SSM now. So let me thank you for your post it will be most usefull now that I know thats something I really need to look at. Keep us posted. P.s. Flog the $hit of the loaner you get.

In the pic section there is a SSM Aspec it looks like his bumpbers dont match etither but it could be just the pics

SSM ASPEC

briden

Thanks, rescueswimmer. I'm really hoping this news is legit and all ends well. [crosses fingers]

As far as the loaner TL I got while the bumpers were being painted...let's just say I had a quite a bit of *fun* with it.

jwaters943

Briden,

Not to sound like a d*ck, but how do you sleep at night? Being a car/auto enthusiast myself, I know what it's like to get a new car and want it to be perfect (the first ding, chip, etc. is always the hardest). I even understand your wanting the bumpers to match the car, but complaining that some service guy scratched the tiny circular metal area around the keyhole??? Who in the world is going to notice that? If they scratched your paint, that's different, but the area in question can't be more than what 1/4" and it's metal which will scrach easily. You gotta relax a little bit or you'll give yourself a heart attack if something (god forbid) really serious actually happens to your car. Good luck with your paint issues, I hope Acura does the right thing by you. Although, you may be taken less seriously if you start to complain about things like scratched keyhole surrounds. Just a thought.

oblio98

I was looking at my SSM TL in the sun the other day, and this problem stuck out like a sore thumb. There is a "great" difference between the body color and the bumper color.

When I bring the car in for it's first oil change/check, I will bring this up. I am not sure if it's better to have a repainted bumper that will probably deteriorate faster than the rest of the car but be the same color, or leave the factory paint that looks wacky in the sun.

I would have expected more from Acura. (NOTE: I picked up the car on a rainy night, and I was mostly looking for dings and scratches and missed the color difference)

:-jon

briden

I guess I didn't explain in enough detail what was done.

The keyhole is recessed about an 1" below the surface directly behind the actual handle. It's paint all the way down to the lock cylinder. There are 3 gouges in the paint in the opening. Not just scratches, mind you. It was down to the plastic, which is black. It looked like shit and I wasn't about to just shrug it off. I have 0 tolerance for carelessness such as that. Especially considering there was no reason to use the key in the first place because they had the FOB.

That's pretty funny...you thought I was referring to the lock cylinder itself. Now THAT would be over the top!!

briden

It looks the worst in the sun? Mine looks it's best in bright sunlight. It's when it's overcast that it looks truly awful.

mrpete

Anyone having their paint peel at all? I've not noticed my bumper color being slighty 'off'. What I have noticed is that a few spots on the front bumper show paint peeling a little. I've NEVER seen paint on any car I've owned do this. VERY strange. Upon calling the dealership I heard ' we've had to have some repainted, we've seen some bumpers doing this '.

Anyone had paint peeling on their front bumper?

I have a rock chip in the front upper support of the frame as well. The chip seems microscopic in depth but has already rusted?? It looks like one layer of paint was applied.

Is this normal?

Pete