routedtonull

So this is my first post, but I've been a lurker.

I went in to buy a TL-S, offered 34,800 for it, dealer said "haha" I called back a day or so later and said "35,500" and they told me I needed to come in an put the offer in writing and put down a deposit. I told them no thanks.

So I took the 35,500 number to another dealer and they told me 36,800 was the best they could do. I said I wasn't going to pay that, so he told me good luck on my future car purchases.

I have their invoice price at 36,114 and their cost after the other junk they get (for me financing with honda, etc) is 34,470.


Oh well, no TL-S for me. I have a 2002 Jetta with 92K miles on that I own outright...

Anansi

The way I got my best offer was by sending email quote requests to all of the local dealers. Make them work against eachother and earn your business. If there is any competition in your market you should be able to find a dealer to do $35,500.

davenlei

Try contacting their 'internet sales' department if they have one. I received a great deal that the regular floor sales guys said was impossible to get.

Glaze

me and my buddy did the same, he sent out emails to all dealers in the state, even some down south in portland (we are in WA). We took the best price, went into the nearest dealer, and they were hesitant to beat it....but with a little negotiating we came down to the price we wanted for our tl's. it helps to be at the end of the month as well, they get more aggressive.

routedtonull

Yeah, I'm talking to 3 other dealers right now. Probably call some in Ohio and Indiana perhaps.

Glaze

sweet! keep up updated!

u080570

As someone else mentioned, go to the internet guy - I got an offer of 35,500 within 1 hour of sending my request out....different market down here in Houston, but the internet guys are the way to go....

tl2go

Invoice is 35,6xx. I recently had a local dealer offer any one on their lot for invoice and another say they would beat it by 250. Both dealers had 10+ TL-S's on their lots. Just have to work the phone/fax/email a little. I've got a pitch I like to use, so I prefer the phone.

Call around and negotiate on the phone. Start out below invoice, acknowledge invoice but point out invoice is at least 1200 profit to the dealer. Comment that the 08's will be out in 30 days and the car will be a year old then.

If you want to drive south for it, I know it can be purchased below invoice in southern Ohio - I did.

ayethetiense

the internet guys are def the best way to go. they dont like to haggle as much as the regular sales guys do.

i just dealt with an internet sales guy for my wifes new car purchase (it wasnt an acura but still relevant), he told me that internet sales guys are good at what they do cause of volume, they dont like to haggle so its going to be easier to get a good price off them. i got about 400 below the actual dealer's invoice, not the 'dealer's invoice" that they show you, on a car that hardly sells for invoice. she got a mazda 3, in red, 5 door, manual. it was the only one avail in cali and wouldnt get another one like it for at least 2 months.

he was a cool guy, i know he still made money cause of the dealers hold back from mazda, but the best i could get anywhere else was invoice. those mazda 3s are hard to get deals on cause they sell like hotcakes coated in gold.

Bearcat94

Let me get this straight, because I think I'm missing something.

YOU called back and said $35,500. They said, lets write it up and you said, nevermind. Is that right?

I'm sure I must be missing something, but if thats the way it went down, thats bush league on your part.

You coulda worked around the deposit easy. Eventually, they gotta write a deal and you gotta sign it. Why offer $35,500 and not then not let 'em put it in writing but just walk away instead?

jay0k

I don't understand either. You both agreed on $35,500 over the phone. Hmm, what's the next step here? You walk in and sign the buyer order. If they magically change the price then you just call them unethical and leave.

Silver_Surfer

I'd take the $35.5k offer. It's pretty good.

onsknth

re-read... He said 34.8 the first day, he called back the next day and the dealer said 35.5 was the lowest he could go and to come in for "final pricing." He took the 35.5 number to another dealer who told him to get screwed. He'll get 34.5 any day now, I bet closer to September, but it'll happen and I bet you'll find em on lots the last day of the year for near 30.

ayethetiense

maybe you should re-read.....

"I called back a day or so later and ("I" is assumed here since there was no change in the verbage)said "35,500" and(in response) they told me I needed to come in an put the offer(the offer that he made, not the dealership) in writing and put down a deposit. I told them no thanks."

THAT is what the original statement is, if that is not what the OP meant to say, then he was very VERY unclear.

Bearcat94

You've interpretted quite a lot to get from what the OP wrote to what I bolded in your post.

The way it is written, it sounds like the OP "called a day or so later and said '$35,500'", then walked when "the dealer said come in and put the offer in writing".

routedtonull

Woops, let me clear this up right quick.

I said 34,800 the dealer laughed at me basically, so i called back in a day or so and I upped it to 35,500. Without an answer on that, I went to another dealer and gave them 35,500 also. Eventually the first dealer told me he would submit the offer "to management" only after it was in writing and I put down a deposit. I wasn't going to put down a deposit without a final sale price. Then the second dealership outright told me to get bent.

I had yet another dealer today say "not interested." I finally called the last one in the area and offered 36,000. He left by the time I emailed him back. I'll find out tomorrow.

Sorry for the confusion... hehe

Bearcat94

^^^ Thanks. I was figured you weren't a total tool and there was something missing.

In that case, IMHO, you were right. No need to go to the dealership just to get an agreed price. Most likely they'd say "no" to your "formal" offer and counter; Now they've got you in the dealership and can work your desire to drive away in a brand new TL-S. Just a way to manipulate you to pay more than you want/need to.

Not sure about your region, but $35,500 is possible. I got $35,650 on month ago in NC. Another member got $35,500 in Houston about the same time. Alot of other deals posted here for a little less or a little more than $35,500. Many in SoCal are doing a good bit better than that even.

routedtonull

Yeah, apparently there's only "6 of the color you want" in the state. I don't know whether to believe them or not. They say they're selling crazy amounts of type-s', but yet I've never seen one on the road. Oh well, we'll see tomorrow!

cali2882

I am getting offered 1000 below invoice at 34500 here in norcal.

shooter

Some of the dealers won't even deal with me on the phone for price here in NorCal, instead they want me to come in & chat. So I went h the internet way & get a few price quotes from various dealer and went to the lowest internet offer.

If you are not in a rush, then it's your advantage to bargain with the dealers. Remember you can always just walk out on them if you don't like the deal being presented to you.

Good luck and keep us posted ....

ps. I was told type-s was going out very quick yet I don't see that many on the road ..

Turbonut

iTrader: (1)

Now that's a real salesman!!!

Hooksta

Being a business to business sales person by trade you do realize that just about any good salesperson is going to tell you what your EGO wants to hear right? Things such as "My goodness, I've never seen prices this low...enjoy your car."

By the way I am not denying that you didn't get a fabulous deal - and by no means do I think I done any better than most of you here on car deals. I'm just saying never believe that extra fluff. There is a reason the showrooms look really nice and commercials are on TV...they are very good at making money.

I just do my research, try to get dealers to compete, "attempt" to not fall in love with the car (which is my achilles heal), and keep the conversation on what I feel. In other words when the dealer says something that my research doesn't agree with I say non-threatening stuff like..."I trust what you are telling me is true, however, I am simply not willing to pay that price. I know your time is valuable, so I don't want to waste anymore it. Thank you for your time." If delivered genuine...this protects THEIR EGO, doesn't insult them, and usually will have them go check with their supervisor one last time.

Also, from knowing quite a few salespeople (and managers) personally over the last 15 years, typically the best deals are on cars like Corollas, or your basic pickup truck. The dealer knows you are more likely to walk when buying for pure economy. When you start buying luxury items, they will typically make some cash.

Final thought - I DO AGREE WITH USING INTERNET QUOTES AS AN EFFECTIVE WAY TO GET A GOOD DEAL. The dealer can't apply the "waiting" tactics on you, you haven't committed to actually driving some great distance to "look" at a car. So very good advice offered there.

routedtonull

Well, the last dealer offered the Type-S 5AT Black/Ebony, with a 15,000 mile per year lease and $1523.47 due at signing at $493.67 per month. I'm trying to get the sale price from him, but that number looks fine to me. The due at signing is more than I wanted. I guess I'll go visit the dealership.

Hooksta

How many month's lease is that? That actually seems high for a lease to me...considering how well Acura holds up in resale value. Isn't that what a lease is: paying the difference between cost and anticipated resale value in three (four) years. We already know a 2004 TL will bring in the $22,000 and up frame. And that is for a regular TL. I suppose that is about a $10,000 or $11,000 loss/depreciation over three years.

But the lease your describing is $493 x 36 months = $17,748 + $1,523 for a total of $19,271. $36,500 (or whatever a TLS costs new) - $19,271 = $17,229 (also bet the buy out amount after three years is probably more like $25,000 and not the $17xxx that you "should" owe. This would be a much worse figure if you are talking 39 months or 48 months, etc.

Based on current results, I would figure a 3 yr old TLS would sell for $25,000 or so in three years. You would only lose $11,500 in that scenario....if you chose to resale it in three years. The yearly loss shrinks more as you increase the number of years you keep the car.

I know some leases are pretty attractive. I have a friend in financial trouble recently tell me he was considering leasing a KIA Sportage for $199 a month, zero down. The car would be under warranty for the whole 39 month lease so it wouldn't matter if it broke down (as Kia's are prone to do). AND he wouldn't have to worry about the bottom dropping out from under the car (as it would likely do because it is a Kia). In this circumstance it seemed like a good gamble.

But an Acura is neither going to break down nor take a dive in value. Therefore, in my mathmatical (but biased) opinion I don't think this sounds like that great a deal. My other two cents is that I see all sorts of people driving around in cars in my state that I know probably shouldn't be in. Lots of people in my town (the capital of KY) drive around in Tahoe's, Suburbans, BMW's, Lexus that I know work for our state government making around $25K a year.

I think this is the evil temptation to leasing. Lures you into buying a car you can't really afford. I know everyone "deserves" to have a nice ride...I agree with that one for sure. I think some fall for leases for "image." Meaning they want to appear cool or of a certain social status. I know that isn't everyone, but there is a reason why most cars sold these days are now leases.

If my company wasn't paying me $9,000 a year to buy a nice four door car to entertain customers, I would probably be driving a 2003 car and not a 2006. I'd let someone else take the hit for the new one.

routedtonull

I can't really work the numbers backwards. It's for 3 years. I'm assuming the residual is lower because they're refreshing it in '09 which may or may not make a difference.

Here's how I'm working the numbers....

With a sale price of 35,700, a residual of 21,725.20, a term of 36 and Money Factor of 0.00093 I get the following:

Finance Fee of 53.41/month (cap+residual)*MF
Depreciation fee of 388.19/month (cap-residual)/term

So that makes it: 441.59 per month. I guess michigan taxes 6% of the monthly payment, that adds 26.50 to make it 468.09 and add 3K miles a year (about $25/month) to make it at 493.59. That's as close as I can get it.

But... I don't know what the up front fees are and what's in it. If it's a capital cost reduction it'll make the price of the car $37,200 and (538.74/month). It's probably the 1st month payment and other stuff? I don't know what, I'll have to read the fine print. I have no trouble walking out on this and I have no trouble with the monthly payment (it'll be less than 12% of my net income per month).

Hooksta

It's just good that you are thinking it out rationally and carefully. The sales price of $35,700 sounds great for a TLS. Subtracting what you will pay in over three years ($19,271) doesn't sound as nice does it? $35,700 - $19,271 = $16,429. What is that about $1,000 in taxes and $4,000 grand for the dealer to essentially "rent" a car for three years.

Maybe it is a better deal than I think. Heck maybe you could sell it for $25,000 in three years and make $3,000(it is after all a TLS that will have low miles because of the lease restrictions).

Before you act I honestly think you should at least consider buying a two year old car that has taken the depreciation hit. I have a friend that bought a 2003 BMW 5 series (32,000 miles) that was in immaculate condition for $25,000 out the door. It had been a lease. That car had depreciated almost $25,000 in three years!!! But it won't depreciate nearly that much now and it looks like new. And it is a 5 series not a 3 which is considered on par or better than a TL. Just a thought.

I would do it that way but seriously I have strict restrictions in my job. I MUST drive a three year new car (2004 and above right now), it must be a 4 door and have an initial price of no less than $22,000. So I could have purchased a mildly equipped Honda Accord, but I get $9,000 a year specifically for a car/insurance/maintenance etc. I put too many miles on to lease. So I bought my 06 TL in December (that buys me a year of high mileage driving if that makes sense...in other words my car won't "appear" to be as ridiculously high on mileage because it was essentially 2007 when I bought it). I bought my Automatic TL with Nav for $32,500. After what I put down, my payment is about $580 a month. So I have $320 left for insurance, tires, gas etc. I know that doesn't quite cover my total expenses, but it is about 85-90% of it. If I leave ever leave this type of job my cars will be 2-3 yrs old. And for what its worth, my wife and my combined income is over $135,000....she drives an 04 Forester.

routedtonull

The moral of the story I guess is to pay cash for a used car . That way the only thing you can't avoid is taxes. Death and Taxes, the only sure things in life.

I will update on what happens tomorrow.

Bearcat94

Residual on the TL-S was running at 56% of MSRP ($21,725) a month ago. So if you are "estimating" your residual, I think you are right on the money. (no pun intended).

Vicman17

Well said.

I will never lease. Unless of course I would be paying something dirt cheap monthly. I've seen so many friends and family turn in a car after lease and get seriously f**ked, it's not funny. Think of it as a rental that requires you to pay large chunks of money at the end of your "rent". They'll nail you for new tires, burnt out or broken lights, cracked windshields and dents and dings. They will pretend to "waive" some or all of these nasty charges then force you to sign into a new lease and put all those fees on top of the price.

A new car is the worst invstment we can ever make. You are right. Make another sap pay for all the upfront new car fees and just buy a low mileage lease return for a depreciated value. We all for fall the status image that new loaded car can provide, but that car is not yours, you're renting it. It's neat concept and the car companies and dealerships end up winning 'coz not many leasees out there really end up buying out the car and just end up jumping into a new one and starting all over again.