type-s'er

I have a TL type s automatic tranny and i decided to do a drag race with my buddy who has a TL a-spec with a manual tranny. we did 4 races in total, 2 from a standstill and 2 from a 30 roll. all four races were extremely close but we ended up with me winning 2 races and my bud winning 2 races. both of us won 1 from a standstill and 1 from a roll. Is this normal to loose because he has a MT or do i just really suck at slamming the gas pedal...

PS- the races were a little more than a quarter mile

ifirahse

iTrader: (6)

base 6mt and type-s 5at are pretty close in performance so yes, this is normal.

Blazing GT

TL is a beast is with 6MT

erick3

any mods?

iforyou

iTrader: (1)

technically if your friend is really really good, then he should win by a little. I think this is normal.

Manual Transmission

Yep..... what iforyou said is perfectly right.


For the TL MT it more depends on the driver how good he can drive stick and know the correct shifting points. You shift early you gonna get problems...

OP didn't get into much of detail on the race, including the speed they accelerated to. From a dig it's easiler for the AUTO to do the launching. It's more difficult to launch MT. As mentioned, if the MT version was driven well it would've taken out the Type-S Auto. The 6MT TL has higher trap speeds (99~ 100 mph) at the quarter mile and gets there quicker. The Type-S Auto at 97~98 mph.

juruki

iTrader: (2)

^^ I think they should be really close cuz 99and 100 are the highest trap speeds recorded YET on a stock 6MT base TL. I think only a very talented few can pull off 99-100 trap speeds.

juruki

iTrader: (2)

Did you max out all your gears in SS mod and turn VSA off? Sometimes when i leave it in drive and just floor it my car shifts way too early.

ChrisQ1980

If VSA is off and you are shifting just before fuel cut you should win (STOCK FOR STOCK)

anx1300c

iTrader: (2)

Let's not get too carried away....LOL. TL 6MT base is generally a 97-98 mph car in stock form, with the one exception being an A-Spec C&D got 99 mph from. I don't know of any road tests that got triple digits. Mine has full bolt ons except pre-cat deletes and I only got 99.32 on a single pass. I'm sure with a couple more passes I could break 100, but I doubt a bone stock one would.

Manual Transmission

There is nothing special done to the A-spec version other than slightly improved drag coefficient (by 0.01) but has *added* weight due to the extra components.

There are way more things that can keep you from reaching good numbers for the quarter mile. Maybe the road condition wasn't that great. Maybe it had to do with the weather condition. Just because you can't reach 99 mph on a stock form doesn't mean all other TL 6MT owners/drivers can't do it stock. You ain't that great. Maybe there is some problem (extreme wear) with your car. You got the used one, right? Maybe it was already beat up one..... So don't give me this "Let's not get too carried away....LOL. TL 6MT base is generally a 97-98 mph car in stock form". LOL..... ??

The most important part in my post has been bolded and underlined. Very very important message.





As for the Type-S 5AT, let me take it back what I said earlier. It should be at 96~ 97 mph at the quarter mile.


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TylerT

iTrader: (1)

Manual Transmission;

I don't think mileage effects your motor as much as you think. As long as you're keeping up with maintenance that is .

I'm sitting with 84,000 miles and I'm still pulling G35s.

Manual Transmission

The STOCK TL 6MT is good for 14.2 sec@ 99 mph at the quarter mile. The car is able achieve it. It depends on the driver and weather condition, AND car condition.

The average is that the TL 6MT *IS* a faster car than the TYPE-S 5AT, stock for stock. How many times do I need to repeat about the gearing?







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Manual Transmission

But your car is modded. Plus you beat some average driver stock G35 5AT, if I remember correctly. Good that you beat it, but that doesn't mean every TL 5AT will beat the G35. Anything can happen on the street.


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Manual Transmission

Man if it wasn't the stupid 3rd gear synchro problem on our TL 6MT and if the build quality was more like Acura Legend-like quality I would've kept my TL 6MT in a heartbeat...... I still miss that car. That car hauled some serious ass from roll and had so much control.

anx1300c

iTrader: (2)

Your original post stated the TL 6MT had trap speeds of 99-100 mph. I can pull up several tests showing 97-98 and only one at 99 mph. Can you show me just one with a trap speed of 100?

I did buy my car certified with 40k on it. It was hardly "beat up".

I hate cars

Since mph is a function of power and has very little to do with driving skill, it's up to the car to produce the mph. Blow the launch, shift it easy, it's still going to mph the same. Atmospheric conditions affect mph more than any other factor on identical cars. Mine typically picks up 3mph from when I first get to the track with the sun up to the cooler night time.

Below 150,000 miles, wear is not a factor.

anx1300c

iTrader: (2)

Exactly.

Manual Transmission

That's what I've been saying. Didn't you read?

Also, if you run into head wind that's gonna impact the quarter mile trap speed a lot more than the 0-60. The faster you go the more resistance you run into. It's a physic.


Incorrect. The car's performance change over time with so many miles. They do not run exactly the same, meaning different 0-60 and quarter mile.

Also, maybe the owner has been taking care of the car. You do proper maintenance that'll help keep from losing power. But if the car came already f#@ked up you are not gonna get as good results.


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Manual Transmission

Nope.

Manual Transmission

There is not much of speed difference between 99.xx mph and 100 mph. I am surprised you didn't know this.


You got the real old used one. 40k is quite a lot of miles. You should've gotten the new one and break it in properly. Ultimately, YOU HAVE NO IDEA how the previous driver treated it. You don't know what that car has gone through. You don't know the car condition. You didn't buy it new so you wouldn't know.






Don't give me this "Let's not get carried away LOL, the TL 6MT can only do 97~ 98 mph" JUST because you can't do it with your used car. It is not a perfect condition.

iforyou

iTrader: (1)

lol it's good to see that Manual Transmission still has so much love and respect to the TL 6MT!

I hate cars

Please tell me what technique you use to extract more mph from the same car. Do you push the pedal with two feet?

You cite a headwind as a possible cause for low mph when just a couple posts ago you were blaming it on bad driving.

Excluding abuse, there will be no changes in performance over 100,000 miles and certainly not at 45,000. After break-in, wear levels off until it starts a fairly fast decline usually well past 150,000 miles. This abuse you're talking of would have to include a serious screw up like forgetting the oil or going all 40,000 miles without a change. In fact look at magazine tests where the car usually gets faster after 30,000 or so miles. You're dead wrong on this one.

Again, run the car at sealevel on a 30 degree day and you might see 100mph. Run it at altitude on a 100 degree day and you might see 95mph.

I've had the car come unglued and cut a 2.7 60' and then cut a 1.6 60' and mph was unchanged even though ET varied by over a second.

juruki

iTrader: (2)

Manual Transmission your taking one person that trapped 100mph and saying every TL can do that? What if when he trapped 100 he had perfect conditions PLUS tailwind?
Im just saying...
Did you ever run 99+ with ur stock 6MT TL? post some slips

MVR 155

I have to disagree about MPH being a constant and not effected by driving skill. In an auto car maybe but in a manual trans car definately not true. I spend alot of time at the track with the corvette crowd, lots of Z06 owners, we have had lots of cars with similar mods/similar dyno numbers have drastic variations in MPH due to driver ability, not running the car up to redline and pulling off fast clean shifts will make MPH suffer period. I know you spend some time racing (your GN sounds like a mean car) but I have hundreds of passes in 3rd pedal cars and I can tell you that driver skill makes all the difference. I have taken many other owners cars at the track and lowered ET while increasing MPH from what their timeslips were.

As far as the 5AT Type S vs. 6MT base, its pretty much gonna come down to driver ability for the one behind the wheel of the 6MT..... with a good driver its gonna be a very close race with a slight advantage going to the 6MT.... botch the launch or make a bum shift/miss a gear and the 5AT (Type S) is gonna be the winner.

I hate cars

I hear what you're saying. I was assuming the driver was competent. As long as you're shifting near redline and not taking 2 seconds in between shifts, there's little mph to be made up by driving. There's always the owner that's afraid of hitting redline or hitting 3 second "power" shifts lol.


In the faster cars like your Z06, there's usually more room for a good driver to shine but on a 100mph car there's really not much difference in mph between drivers.

What it comes down to is you're not going to have a TL trap 97mph with a good driver and then throw in a better driver and pick up 3mph.

Like I said, my GN varies 3-5mph from day to night on the same track on the same day. Take a TL in a town like Bakersfield that's near sealevel and then take one in Colorado at over 3,000' and you get your 3mph variation.

Your point is understood completely but I don't see it happening in this situation with a TL.

Manual Transmission

You're losing control man. Push the pedal with two feet? This is why I immediately know you lack in knowledge. We are not even in the same level.


Of course the headwind is one of the strong factors that affects trap speed at the quarter mile. Didn't you know bad driving is another factor? I said *many* factors that can cause this. Obviously you don't read my messages carefully and really understand it.




Dream on. It doesn't work that way. And as a matter of fact, it is the most stupid and ridiculous claim I have ever heard. It's a complete retarded comment.




Dead wrong my a$$....
One of the tests the review sites have done was a BMW M3. Tested 0-60 and quarter mile when it was new after breakin, and after 20k miles, and then 45k miles or so. With weather condition being similar and in same stock condition of the car it dropped performance in the 0-60 and quarter mile tests. Not significant drop, but lost by some good margin. I'll try to find the source if I can but don't have it with me right now. This is ridiculous.... I don't even need to prove this as it is NORMAL to lose power and torque when the car gets old. It will run a little more sluggish and the torque will be lost as well as the horsepower. You are just trying to be stupid here. The more you speak it, the more you sound ridiculous.



Noobie, the temperature isn't the only equation that makes your car go faster or slower. Of course the cooler temperature will certainly help. You don't have to run it at sea level to get 99~ 100 mph on a TL 6MT.


Nevermind TL, you seem to be basing on your old Buick GN. You put a lot of time upgrading and maintaining the thing of course you will feel the car is getting faster and faster. Take that stupid Buick GN out of the equation. Your car isn't even a stock....

Manual Transmission

You nailed it, couldn't disagree more. Now I hear some intelligent comments.

That I hate cars guy is really going downhill... Disappointed.


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Manual Transmission

Thank you my friend for the kind remark..


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Manual Transmission

Like I said this for the 20th time, there are many factors involved to get the good numbers for the TL manual version in the quarter mile.

- Weather condition
- Conditon of the car
- Driver's ability



You can taken an Enzo Ferrari and reach the quarter mile in 15.2 seconds at 98 mph. This is a good one. Oh yeah.


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Manual Transmission

Aey noobie, it's called "launching". You don't know how to launch a TL with stick you will get worse result on the quarter mile and trap speed. Even a "Good Driver" doesn't make a perfect launch. They make mistakes, if you haven't noticed. Just because it's a good driver doesn't mean you can easily assume you will get xx results.




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I hate cars

Ok dickhead. Are you serious? It's called 60' not "launching". 60' has no bearing on trap speed. Everyone knows this, well almost everyone. You're a bit pathetic. How many passes have you made down the strip in your Corolla?

I hate cars

What a revelation! Are you sure you're not John Force? I bet you're going to tell me that more hp will make it go faster too.

Manual Transmission

You have trouble understanding my posts, keep jumping into conclusions.

If you can't launch the TL with a stick it'll fu@k up the entire acceleration. You don't even know what rpm you need on the first gear before releasing the clutch. If you don't get in the right powerband you will get worse trap speeds. That's what I mean by launching. Plain and simple. You fu@k up the launch you are out. There's no if and buts about it.

p.s., watch your mouth.......


MVR 155 taught you some good stuff. You should be thankful about it.

Manual Transmission

Btw MVR 155, how's it going at the other acura forum? Hope all is going well for ya.

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juruki

iTrader: (2)

Im gonna repeat my question: What if the one and only 100 trap speed posted by Car&Driver had some wind on its favor?
Since you are so good at driving and know so much about drag racing why dont u post some slips of ur TL? I bet u didnt even run once. You are just quoting magazine numbers man.

I hate cars

Yes, I'm losing control. That's why you're resorting to insults. Calling my GN stupid? Really? That hurts coming from an overpriced Corolla owner. Noobie? LOL.

What's next, you going to tell me I'm ugly and you're pretty like your buddy?

Using two feet to push the gas is about as retarded as saying you can pull 3mph out of your ass in an identcal car in identical conditions both with decent drivers. It was a sarcastic comment that is obviously not caught by someone who doesn't have a grasp of the english language.... and you know it's true.

And again, here we go debating basic elementary knowlege. Cars do not slow down or lose power after only 45,000 miles. You're flat out ignorant. Go read Road and Track or Car and Driver and you will see that cars always get faster after they have some miles on them. Ignorant lol.

I hate cars

Ok dickhead.....

Once again, launch has nothing whatsoever to do with trap speeds. You have to be one of the most ignorant people I have ever had the displeasure of speaking with. Going from real world experience, I've pulled a 2.7 60' and the next run a 1.6 and mph was nearly identical. You need to freshen up on your mag racing lol.

Messing up the launch only affects ET (that's the time in seconds to get to the finish line for the retarded).

PS. NO

Manual Transmission

I don't own the TL anymore. I own the Lexus IS350. And no, I didn't go the track to get the drag time for the TL.

There has been occasions where the TL driver was able to get around 14.2 sec @ 99 mph at the track, don't know which one it was. And this wasn't submitted to the drag strip database on the web. I'm not only going by the Magazine times here.

The review sites test the car usually in a good weather with calm or no wind. Whether the driver had the headwind or tailwind the 6 speed manual TL will have the edge over the Auto Type-S. It's a faster car, just need the right driving to get to it.


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Manual Transmission

Actually, yes, the ET is affected depending on how good the driver launches. The faster you take off from point A you get to point B sooner.

But I think you are basing on your stupid Buick GN though...

The TL needs sufficient RPM (to get max powerband) and be able to launch without spinning wheels from a dig. This will help on the high speeds as well. This has been proven based on my experience.


Again, watch your mouth, boy.


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