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The wheel/brake package and the front/rear bumpers that were unique to the show car should have been what we saw in the showrooms. If we did I would have had a very tough decision on the visuals alone.
AMEN! The one time Acura shows they can actually design attractive and sexy wheels, it ends up on a prototype only. Soo annoying...
Amen to that. They also softened up the TLX's look for production. Boooooooo! I would likely be in a TLX despite the back seat situation if not for that.
Who said he was justifying or rationalizing? He was just giving us details on the reasons he made the move.
So I dont think the discussion just ends there. This is important feedback for Acura to understand why the RLX isnt doing as well as it could be and take the opportunity to make it better than the car below it that costs tens of thousands less, yet captured this customers attention, and one that already owned the RLX. His reasons for trading down being both the unjustified high cost of the RLX (which IMO are due to lack of features that make it worth the cost) and the ride quality issues (of which Ive been saying for decades now) should be important notes for Acura to take back to the drawing board and hopefully improve upon.
Congrats on the trade in Mike. After having several TLX loaners, it is a superb vehicle and better than the RLX in a number of areas including the value/cost. It is a well excuted product in the tradition of what Acura has come to be best known for. The ONLY things that have prevented me from making the move myself are the lack of folding mirrors, parking sensors (huge one for me), automatic steering tilt, the bigger size and nicer leather quality of the RLX steering wheel (another big one for me), and the general interior design. I could almost deal with the interior if it didnt lack those other important features for me.
Which trim TLX did you end up with? PAWS or SH-AWD?
Thanks, Holographique. I got the Tech with PAWS. Down here in the sunny Southwest we seldom have need for 4WD, although I know from past experience (RL, MDX) that SH-AWD is of some use on dry roads as well.
The TLX does lack a few features of the RLX, but it also includes some that the RLX doesn't have. For me, the additional features outweigh the ones missing.
It's been only a few days, but I'm pretty happy with the trade right now.
Thanks, Holographique. I got the Tech with PAWS. Down here in the sunny Southwest we seldom have need for 4WD, although I know from past experience (RL, MDX) that SH-AWD is of some use on dry roads as well.
The TLX does lack a few features of the RLX, but it also includes some that the RLX doesn't have. For me, the additional features outweigh the ones missing.
It's been only a few days, but I'm pretty happy with the trade right now.
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Congratulations Mike on your new ride.
Personally, the TLX is too small for me. But in the end, that's why each person has to drive the car that's right for them, and not what others say or think is right.
The TLX is a nice vehicle and I hope you get an opportunity to show us some pics real soon.
This may not be the right place for it, but several people has asked for photos, so here goes. Bob, you can move this if not appropriate for the thread.
My TLX is the "standard" Graphite/Greystone combination, but it's the only combo of Acura's available colors I like. (Get some new colors, Acura!)
This may not be the right place for it, but several people has asked for photos, so here goes. Bob, you can move this if not appropriate for the thread.
My TLX is the "standard" Graphite/Greystone combination, but it's the only combo of Acura's available colors I like. (Get some new colors, Acura!)
Keep Mike over here. Regardless you are still on team RLX.
I think the real eye opener here is how badly Acura has misfired with the RLX. There really *should* have been no way that a $60k RLX can possibly be considered inferior to a TLX, which starts at $30k, yet here is a loyal RLX owner doing this exact swap AND feeling really good about it.
I applaud Mike_TX's move, but, what's more, is that his move really illustrates that the RLX suffers from more than just media-driven hate or TLX fanboys. Just think, if an Acura diehard can make this move, how can a non-Honda fanboy even give the RLX any chance?
Time for Honda to go back to the RLX drawing board and, this time, not by starting with an Accord.
I think the real eye opener here is how badly Acura has misfired with the RLX. There really *should* have been no way that a $60k RLX can possibly be considered inferior to a TLX, which starts at $30k, yet here is a loyal RLX owner doing this exact swap AND feeling really good about it.
I applaud Mike_TX's move, but, what's more, is that his move really illustrates that the RLX suffers from more than just media-driven hate or TLX fanboys. Just think, if an Acura diehard can make this move, how can a non-Honda fanboy even give the RLX any chance?
Time for Honda to go back to the RLX drawing board and, this time, not by starting with an Accord.
I guess it's only fair to point out that I traded a $52k list-price RLX Tech (for which I "paid" less under my lease) for a $40k list-price TLX (for which I also paid less). The $30k-ish TLX is a 4-cyl, which would be considered a downgrade from the RLX's 6-cyl engine.
But we've already agreed the content discrepancy is an unfortunate timing thing, where the TLX was introduced mid-cycle of the RLX, and as such it was endowed with some content that its big brother doesn't yet have. Retrofitting the new stuff into the 2015 RLX was apparently too costly to do, and Honda/Acura is relying on the other aspects of the RLX to sell it.
But ... I still can't help wondering if Honda is really committed to the RLX long-term. It almost looks like they are setting the stage for the TLX to be the premium car in the Acura stable, and since RLX sales continue to be slow, you have to wonder if it will be around for another generation.
I wrote a long reply for you, Mike, then then trashed it to say "I agree with you." I think Acura has already given up on the RLX. I wouldn't be surprised to see it go away completely. If they keep it, they need to go big, with sexy sheet metal and big marketing of eSH-AWD, which is honestly THE reason to own this car.
I haven't even given up on the RLX. First drive was negative because I pissed off for having to deal with Dallas traffic and time was running out on me also and I drove the super cheap version and didn't get to experience the things that the advanced has. I was driving today and passed up a 4gs (the car #1 on my list right now) and to me it looks boring and small on the road. It looked like a Honda accord in the front and normal in the back. I am not giving up on this just yet. I might even go to Arkansas to test drive this thing in a normal environment.
I wrote a long reply for you, Mike, then then trashed it to say "I agree with you." I think Acura has already given up on the RLX. I wouldn't be surprised to see it go away completely. If they keep it, they need to go big, with sexy sheet metal and big marketing of eSH-AWD, which is honestly THE reason to own this car.
I don't think they've given up on it. It's scheduled to appear with a major revision in the 2018 model year.
However, to be honest, it's still not going to be a high volume car. I believe that the majority of them will still be configured for the JDM and sold as the Legend, and I believe that they will not plan on producing it in North America.
My prediction is that the 6G Legend will continue to be a small time niche product that will appeal to long time Honda buyers looking for something unique, just like the current RLX/5G Legend.
My TLX is the "standard" Graphite/Greystone combination, but it's the only combo of Acura's available colors I like.
I am still surprised.
After having owned two RLX and after having been given a TLX V6 P-AWS Advance for extended periods on two different occasions, I just would not be satisfied with a TLX, just because of the content and quality differences which, while subjective, seem very obvious.
They must be selling like hotcakes here....pretty much as I predicted.
The TLX is a big hit for Acura.
But.... It has to cover a lot of bases, and the range of prices and features is so very market encompassing that it confuses people what it's competing with.
To me, the sign that Acura has given up on the RLX is that fact that the 2016 changes are nothing like the ones to the MDX, ILX, or the RDX. The RLX had already fallen behind all it's little brothers and sisters in terms of equipment and electronics, and the mechanicals have already proven uncompetitive, sales-wise. With the lack of changes, it seems that Acura is going to let the sales of 200 RLX's / month dwindle down to double digits, probably just trying to maintain minimal inventory and losses.
To me, the sign that Acura has given up on the RLX is that fact that the 2016 changes are nothing like the ones to the MDX, ILX, or the RDX. The RLX had already fallen behind all it's little brothers and sisters in terms of equipment and electronics, and the mechanicals have already proven uncompetitive, sales-wise. With the lack of changes, it seems that Acura is going to let the sales of 200 RLX's / month dwindle down to double digits, probably just trying to maintain minimal inventory and losses.
Nice write up. I love Acura/Honda, I've owned 2 TL-S' and 5 Honda motorcycles. The late model I wasn't particularly pleased with but the redesign is great. The only think Acura needs is a performance line, were the only brand without. AMG, M, S/RS lines, V-series and Lexus even has F-sport yet we have nothing...
I don't think they've given up on it. It's scheduled to appear with a major revision in the 2018 model year.
To paraphrase you: O_o So is Honda/Acura listening to us? Or have they decided that actual buyers of the RLX are such odd ducks to be not worth selling to, and they'll swing again with something different? Only time will tell...
To paraphrase you: O_o So is Honda/Acura listening to us? Or have they decided that actual buyers of the RLX are such odd ducks to be not worth selling to, and they'll swing again with something different? Only time will tell...
They better be listening because I will be there to by the next one too, only if it is dynamically different.
In my view, Acura should go all in and sell the RLX with only the e-SHAWD package. The reviews of this car have been so stellar, it's very impressive. I like the FWD version, but for 60K a car needs something really special to have a competitive edge. Although I've yet to drive one, I believe the e-SHAWD system is just such an edge (along with some of the other niceties the Sport Hybrid offers).
I hope Acura does not give up on this car. A few tweaks here and there and a better marketing package would allow Acura to show a lot more people what a fine car it is.
I totally respect your view, George, but to me there is no real difference between the RLX and TLX except cosmetics. The TLX Advance (which I admittedly don't have) has all the same bells and whistles as the RLX Advance and then some. But again, your Latin phrase and all.
To get back on track with comparisons, I already have a couple more observations after only 200 miles:
- The jewel eyes, which I was a bit concerned about with only half the number of "eyes" as the RLX, have proven to be very capable. In fact, the ones on this TLX seem to outdo the ones on my old RLX. The only difference I see is that they seem a bit warmer in color temperature, making them not quite as blue-white. But they light up things way down the road, and look like they'd blister the asphalt if left on for awhile.
- It looks like I was a bit hasty with my condemnation of the 9spd transmission. It hasn't gotten tangled up in its own shoelaces a single time yet, andt does a superb job of hiding all those gear shifts. In fact, it doesn't seem any busier than the 6spd in my RLX did! Obviously, progress has been made in the transmission business since my LS460 and M56.
- Improved gas mileage is already showing up. In my daily driving, I routinely got about 21.5mpg in the RLX, whereas I'm showing about 22.5 in the TLX. That's on Regular gas (the only thing my dealership has in their pumps). I'm going to fill it up with Premium as soon as this tank is gone so I can get a better read.
The only negatives I've logged so far are the loss of the folding outside mirrors, the rear door handle locks/unlocks, and the power-tilting steering wheel. Those three things were nice, but certainly not critical features.
i think the real eye opener here is how badly acura has misfired with the rlx. There really *should* have been no way that a $60k rlx can possibly be considered inferior to a tlx, which starts at $30k, yet here is a loyal rlx owner doing this exact swap and feeling really good about it.
I applaud mike_tx's move, but, what's more, is that his move really illustrates that the rlx suffers from more than just media-driven hate or tlx fanboys. Just think, if an acura diehard can make this move, how can a non-honda fanboy even give the rlx any chance?
Time for honda to go back to the rlx drawing board and, this time, not by starting with an accord.
My telescoping steering wheel was making a squeal so I had the dealership replace it; they gave me a SH-AWD v6 Tech for a loaner. It was a very nice car & I can see why it is selling so well. Now for my thought compared to the RLX:
Pros:
* According to the trip computer, I was averaging ~3 miles more gallon (EPA only estimes +1)
* Acceleration felt different - I assume that this is the difference b/n AWD & being pulled by FWD
* Had no issues with the 9 speed automatic transmission & the button gear selecter was much easier/intuitive than I thought (when is the RLX getting these??)
* The vents were better shaped - in my RLX the steering wheel often blocks the air
* The wood grain was better looking
* I think the metal around the center console was real as it was cold to the touch
* The infotainment system moved a lot quicker when using the dial; same as the MDX loander I had which makes me wonder if there is something wrong with my RLX?
* Frameless rearview mirror was interesting looking
Cons:
* More cheap/hard plastics to be found
* The idle-stop feature was anything but smooth. It was also very alarming when you take your foot off the brake & apply the gas & nothing happens. If I had more time with the TLX I would probably get used to it but this was not a feature I particularly cared for
* No power folding mirror - this is the way that I can tell if my RLX has been locked
* No cup holder cover - pet peeve of mine
* General ambiance & ostentatiousness was a step below - as it should be
^^^^
I thought I was the only one who set the automatic mirror folding on their RLX. Great feature since my two play cars use the garage, and the wife has to park next to me outside during the "driving" season. For those unaware, you lock the car with the key fob and the side mirrors fold in automatically.
Just a factoid on the Sport Hybrid...it has the same push buttons as the TLX. I find them very intuitive and easy to use but decades of feeling for the shift lever when going from reverse to drive without glancing over still happens. Then i find that when I don't feel the shift lever, I have to glance down to push the Drive button. I thought my brain and muscle memory would gravitate over to the use of the push buttons but so far not. Other than for that one movement, the buttons seem fine. I just haven't broken the habit when shifting out of reverse into drive.
I too had my squeaky steering wheel fixed and got a TLX loaner.
I really disliked the engine shutoff feature and disabled it every time I got in. I also thought the leather felt cheap. A real downgrade from a 4G TL IMO.
I use the auto folding mirrors too all the time on the RLX. Works with pressing any door lock button though, not just with the key fob.
I use the auto folding mirrors too all the time on the RLX. Works with pressing any door lock button though, not just with the key fob.
I discovered that yesterday by accident. However, if you lock the door from the inside as you are stepping out, the feature doesn't work.
Sorry to hijack the thread, I just thought that was a neat and programmable feature.
It's too bad that the start-stop feature is so noticeable in the TLX. In the Sport Hybrid, it is so seamless that one can barely notice it much of the time. The engine mounts must be made of special stuff....
In the Sport Hybrid, it is so seamless that one can barely notice it much of the time. The engine mounts must be made of special stuff....
I also think the since the front electric motor is used to restart the car that contributes to the quiet and smooth restart function. Whatever the reason it is seamless and silent in the Sport Hybrid.
Have any of you experienced people walking in front of you in a parking lot because they can't hear you coming up behind them? I find that happening all the time.
^^While I haven't noticed that yet, the Canadian version does come equipped with an option to have the car make "noise" while in low speed (12mph or less) electric-only mode to alert pedestrians to your presence. I've never been in front of the car when it is moving in electric mode, so I have no idea what the Acoustic Vehicle Alerting System sounds like.
I also think the since the front electric motor is used to restart the car that contributes to the quiet and smooth restart function. Whatever the reason it is seamless and silent in the Sport Hybrid.
Yes. The pancake motor manages the ICU engine start / stop. And since the car typically launches in RWD EV mode, the start of the ICU is 'feathered in' making it more seamless. The only time I noticed the start of the ICU on the SH RLX was when waiting for a long traffic light and the power level dropped low enough to trigger the ICU start up.
I do not know how often that happens, but so little mention of Start / Stop vibration has been mentioned on this forum I expect it is rare.
I was watching a video of a JDM LEGEND test drive and the camera had the gauge cluster in view during the test drive. I was surprised to see how frequently the engine shut down (seeing the TACH needle drop) during regular driving. It seems to shut down at every coasting opportunity. And the restart did not appear to be heard or noticed by the driver. The dialog was minimal and in Japanese, so I cannot say for certain if they commented on it.
The ICU does shut down frequently but even when at a stop light it is barely noticeable. When it happens while driving you really can't tell unless as you said you happen to be watching the tach or the Power Distribution Monitor [which I have shown in the HUD]. The constant switching which goes on between the three electric motors, torque vectring and the start stop of the ICU continually in the Sport Hybrid is truly amazing. I watch it to keep track [by viewing the HUD] when I am driving to see when the EV mode kicks in between 45-60 mhp. The engineering that goes into the drive train control systems is a real engineering feat that gets little notice since it just operates in the background with little if any intrusion into the cabin. Almost makes me forget the clunky infotainment system.
Tampa -- isn't you Sport Hybrid coming any day now? You must be getting anxious that one of the other Acurazine denizens hasn't hijacked the shipment.
The ICU does shut down frequently but even when at a stop light it is barely noticeable. When it happens while driving you really can't tell unless as you said you happen to be watching the tach or the Power Distribution Monitor [which I have shown in the HUD]. The constant switching which goes on between the three electric motors, torque vectring and the start stop of the ICU continually in the Sport Hybrid is truly amazing. I watch it to keep track [by viewing the HUD] when I am driving to see when the EV mode kicks in between 45-60 mhp. The engineering that goes into the drive train control systems is a real engineering feat that gets little notice since it just operates in the background with little if any intrusion into the cabin.
04-20-2015, 01:29 PM
Shoulda got an Advance, though. ACC is freaking awesome on road trips, or even in everyday freeway traffic.
Indeed
So is Honda/Acura listening to us? Or have they decided that actual buyers of the RLX are such odd ducks to be not worth selling to, and they'll swing again with something different? 
Only time will tell...
Thoughts
