Differential Fluid?
09-22-2019, 12:44 PM
#1
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Differential Fluid?
About to do the first service on the car and I'm planning on changing the oil, transmission fluid and diff fluid. Why? Because reasons. Also, historically, Honda's transmissions and diffs have been made of glass (see: suck) and changing the fluid out can only help. I found that the tranny takes ATF 2.0 but can't find anything on diff fluid. The owner's manual doesn't have anything on it (doesn't even give the transmission fluid). Anybody have any insight into this?
09-22-2019, 01:42 PM
#2
Latent car nut
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About to do the first service on the car and I'm planning on changing the oil, transmission fluid and diff fluid. Why? Because reasons. Also, historically, Honda's transmissions and diffs have been made of glass (see: suck) and changing the fluid out can only help. I found that the tranny takes ATF 2.0 but can't find anything on diff fluid. The owner's manual doesn't have anything on it (doesn't even give the transmission fluid). Anybody have any insight into this?
09-22-2019, 02:09 PM
#3
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Thread Starter
Hmmm, according the the manual I have, it says, "Use Acura All-Wheel Drive Fluid (DPSF) only." My local Acura dealer sells it: https://acura.bernardiparts.com/Acur...200-9007A.aspx
Thanks for the info though!
09-22-2019, 02:16 PM
#4
Drifting
Fluid requirements are listed in the Owner's Manual, not the printed Owner's Guide that came with the vehicle. The manual may be downloaded from owners.acura.com
The rear differential isn't "made of glass", it's a sophisticated design that requires a fluid with friction modifiers because it has clutch plates that are constantly slipping. Like an old-school mechanical limited slip diff. The friction modifiers degrade and the fluid needs to be replaced to replenish them. It's nothing like a big ole truck's open rear differential. The current design requires DPSF fluid ( not the VTM-4 fluid of some previous versions ), because it uses hydraulic pumps to engage the clutches, and the rear diff housing has "DPSF" molded in big bold letters above the fill port.
DPSF = Dual Pump System Fluid. Dual hydraulic pumps drive the clutch plates.
If you frequently drive the vehicle under conditions that stress the AWD system, such as towing or mountainous terrain, it is recommended to replace the rear diff fluid more often than the MM would indicate. This is in the Owner's Manual.
Of course, it can do no harm to replace the fluid frequently.
The front transfer case is just a set of hypoid gears, so it takes conventional hypoid gear oil. This stuff can go a long time, and it gets changed on the same schedule as the AT fluid cuz it's right next door.
The 10-speed AT requires a special fluid, as do most high-gear count transmissions, but it's not crazy expensive. The AT has no dipstick and there is a procedure to set level using an overflow port. It's possible to DIY, but AFAIK the service interval is fairly long under "normal service" conditions. ( 45k miles? )
BTW, there is a DIY section of this forum. Enjoy.
The rear differential isn't "made of glass", it's a sophisticated design that requires a fluid with friction modifiers because it has clutch plates that are constantly slipping. Like an old-school mechanical limited slip diff. The friction modifiers degrade and the fluid needs to be replaced to replenish them. It's nothing like a big ole truck's open rear differential. The current design requires DPSF fluid ( not the VTM-4 fluid of some previous versions ), because it uses hydraulic pumps to engage the clutches, and the rear diff housing has "DPSF" molded in big bold letters above the fill port.
DPSF = Dual Pump System Fluid. Dual hydraulic pumps drive the clutch plates.
If you frequently drive the vehicle under conditions that stress the AWD system, such as towing or mountainous terrain, it is recommended to replace the rear diff fluid more often than the MM would indicate. This is in the Owner's Manual.
Of course, it can do no harm to replace the fluid frequently.
The front transfer case is just a set of hypoid gears, so it takes conventional hypoid gear oil. This stuff can go a long time, and it gets changed on the same schedule as the AT fluid cuz it's right next door.
The 10-speed AT requires a special fluid, as do most high-gear count transmissions, but it's not crazy expensive. The AT has no dipstick and there is a procedure to set level using an overflow port. It's possible to DIY, but AFAIK the service interval is fairly long under "normal service" conditions. ( 45k miles? )
BTW, there is a DIY section of this forum. Enjoy.
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justnspace (09-23-2019)
09-23-2019, 12:06 PM
#7
Burning Brakes
Fluid requirements are listed in the Owner's Manual, not the printed Owner's Guide that came with the vehicle. The manual may be downloaded from owners.acura.com
The rear differential isn't "made of glass", it's a sophisticated design that requires a fluid with friction modifiers because it has clutch plates that are constantly slipping. Like an old-school mechanical limited slip diff. The friction modifiers degrade and the fluid needs to be replaced to replenish them. It's nothing like a big ole truck's open rear differential. The current design requires DPSF fluid ( not the VTM-4 fluid of some previous versions ), because it uses hydraulic pumps to engage the clutches, and the rear diff housing has "DPSF" molded in big bold letters above the fill port.
DPSF = Dual Pump System Fluid. Dual hydraulic pumps drive the clutch plates.
If you frequently drive the vehicle under conditions that stress the AWD system, such as towing or mountainous terrain, it is recommended to replace the rear diff fluid more often than the MM would indicate. This is in the Owner's Manual.
Of course, it can do no harm to replace the fluid frequently.
The front transfer case is just a set of hypoid gears, so it takes conventional hypoid gear oil. This stuff can go a long time, and it gets changed on the same schedule as the AT fluid cuz it's right next door.
The 10-speed AT requires a special fluid, as do most high-gear count transmissions, but it's not crazy expensive. The AT has no dipstick and there is a procedure to set level using an overflow port. It's possible to DIY, but AFAIK the service interval is fairly long under "normal service" conditions. ( 45k miles? )
BTW, there is a DIY section of this forum. Enjoy.
The rear differential isn't "made of glass", it's a sophisticated design that requires a fluid with friction modifiers because it has clutch plates that are constantly slipping. Like an old-school mechanical limited slip diff. The friction modifiers degrade and the fluid needs to be replaced to replenish them. It's nothing like a big ole truck's open rear differential. The current design requires DPSF fluid ( not the VTM-4 fluid of some previous versions ), because it uses hydraulic pumps to engage the clutches, and the rear diff housing has "DPSF" molded in big bold letters above the fill port.
DPSF = Dual Pump System Fluid. Dual hydraulic pumps drive the clutch plates.
If you frequently drive the vehicle under conditions that stress the AWD system, such as towing or mountainous terrain, it is recommended to replace the rear diff fluid more often than the MM would indicate. This is in the Owner's Manual.
Of course, it can do no harm to replace the fluid frequently.
The front transfer case is just a set of hypoid gears, so it takes conventional hypoid gear oil. This stuff can go a long time, and it gets changed on the same schedule as the AT fluid cuz it's right next door.
The 10-speed AT requires a special fluid, as do most high-gear count transmissions, but it's not crazy expensive. The AT has no dipstick and there is a procedure to set level using an overflow port. It's possible to DIY, but AFAIK the service interval is fairly long under "normal service" conditions. ( 45k miles? )
BTW, there is a DIY section of this forum. Enjoy.
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09-23-2019, 01:12 PM
#8
Drifting
The VTM-4 differential doesn't have overdriven torque vectoring. If the overdriven diff got locked, it would be driving both rear wheels faster than the fronts, and that would be a problem.
I still have a 2005 MDX with the VTM-4 system; that's my beater for messy bikes and dogs. It's actually a very practical vehicle with lots of cargo space. Kinda like an SUV! And CarPlay doesn't glitch cuz it doesn't have CarPlay.
09-23-2019, 02:09 PM
#9
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Thread Starter
Heh, having wrenched on cars in my past, Honda transmissions have been their Achilles heel. Their track record in the department is pretty dismal. But, in their defense, it's generally caused by poor maintenance and people who stamp their feet and decry changing fluids often as a "waste." My last Honda CR-V had all original parts except for the starter and radiator with 270k miles. Yep, even the common water pump failure that plagued the CR-V was original on mine with regular coolant changes. Transmission shifted buttery smooth with absolutely no issues. Motor oil was changed every 5k miles with synthetic, transmission fluid changed every 30k (or if I felt like doing it before) and coolant changed at the same time. Transmissions weren't a real issue with the CR-V (since it made no power) but anything mated to their J-series engines that made mediocre power was guaranteed to fail without proper upkeep. Saw plenty come thru the shop. So, we'll see how it goes ... hope for the best and pray that proper maintenance will suffice to keep this thing going for at least six-figure mileage.
09-23-2019, 02:37 PM
#10
Burning Brakes
Heh, having wrenched on cars in my past, Honda transmissions have been their Achilles heel. Their track record in the department is pretty dismal. But, in their defense, it's generally caused by poor maintenance and people who stamp their feet and decry changing fluids often as a "waste." My last Honda CR-V had all original parts except for the starter and radiator with 270k miles. Yep, even the common water pump failure that plagued the CR-V was original on mine with regular coolant changes. Transmission shifted buttery smooth with absolutely no issues. Motor oil was changed every 5k miles with synthetic, transmission fluid changed every 30k (or if I felt like doing it before) and coolant changed at the same time. Transmissions weren't a real issue with the CR-V (since it made no power) but anything mated to their J-series engines that made mediocre power was guaranteed to fail without proper upkeep. Saw plenty come thru the shop. So, we'll see how it goes ... hope for the best and pray that proper maintenance will suffice to keep this thing going for at least six-figure mileage.
09-23-2019, 03:17 PM
#11
Yep....In many cases changing the other fluids are as easy as changing oil. Much cheaper than having the dealer do the job and tools and effort are minimal. Unfortunately many of the vehicles are going to a transmission with no dip stick. They say it is to prevent owners from putting in wrong fluids and causing damage. I think that it is a kick back to the dealers to charge $300 to do a $50 job, but hey. At least the RDX transmission is not super difficult to do, although as I get older that knees and back don't like crawling around under the car as much. The cost of the tools to do the job is paid for in one or two dealer services....and you get to keep the tools forever....it is kinda sad.
09-23-2019, 03:22 PM
#12
I had a 99 TL that had the crap transmission. Got to 97,000 miles and they replaced on the extended warranty. The second one died about 95,000 miles later too. Moved onto an 07 TL and this one has been great. Currently on 292,600 miles. Just change the fluids regularly....no change in pressure switches or any other maintenance. Oh....and we had a several other Acuras with no transmission problems....all ran about 200,000 miles....but they were manual transmissions. I still regret selling my 1988 Integra. She would no doubt still be running now.
09-23-2019, 03:28 PM
#13
Latent car nut
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Heh, having wrenched on cars in my past, Honda Automatic transmissions have been their Achilles heel. Their track record in the department is pretty dismal. But, in their defense, it's generally caused by poor maintenance and people who stamp their feet and decry changing fluids often as a "waste." My last Honda CR-V had all original parts except for the starter and radiator with 270k miles. Yep, even the common water pump failure that plagued the CR-V was original on mine with regular coolant changes. Transmission shifted buttery smooth with absolutely no issues. Motor oil was changed every 5k miles with synthetic, transmission fluid changed every 30k (or if I felt like doing it before) and coolant changed at the same time. Transmissions weren't a real issue with the CR-V (since it made no power) but anything mated to their J-series engines that made mediocre power was guaranteed to fail without proper upkeep. Saw plenty come thru the shop. So, we'll see how it goes ... hope for the best and pray that proper maintenance will suffice to keep this thing going for at least six-figure mileage.
09-23-2019, 05:38 PM
#14
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