Cu2Suspect

Turn off traction control.... I chirp second but the clutch master cylinder has that dumb valve thingy that slows you down....

ssjoeboe9

A video won't do anything... It's just jerky from 1st to 2nd

optimusaccord

I know what you're talking about, and the delay valve on the clutch slave cylinder has something to do with it, along with how your foot work is. Also, the factory clutch is meh...

ssjoeboe9

I mean, I've been exclusively driving this vehicle for 5 years! I know the clutch very well, so I know it's not me lol.

I'm just wondering why it would be jerky from 1st to 2nd [only]. It's the only transition that's not smooth. How could a calibration affect when you should shift?? Idk.. haven't done the research on it. As long as I shift around 4500 then I can make a clean shift, but now I've moved into the VTEC range and I'm not gaining much acceleration at this RPM.

Anyone else have experience with this kind of problem?

iCrap

Well, this is weird. My car seems to have "de-tuned" itself. Previously the vtec crossover was very very noticeable both with feel and sound.... but now it's not. wth? I'll flash the calibration again I guess.

optimusaccord

I think you are getting used to it.

You need more parts now, more airflow... more fuel, more spark.... moar powa.

optimusaccord

By no means did I mean to infer that it was your fault, I was just saying once there is a bit of a jerk, sometimes the feet move and it can make it worse.

iCrap

Hmm yea maybe i'm used to it.
Need moar stuff, you are right... downpipe, 2nd cat delete, exhaust.... etc.

Cu2Suspect

I have the same issue time to time, and I know it's not me.... These new cars nowa days ;(

Dime Feng

So I played around with the oct map from optimus and ive been getting alot of knock counts when WOT after vtec kicks in. knock on cyl#1=28 knock on cyl#2=37 Total=67. Ran autotune to try to fix the knock but didnt do much. Anyone know wassup?

Oh btw mods are takeda CAI, rv6 pcd, p2r tb spacer, and a custom magnaflow exhaust with 2.5" pipes.

iCrap

I'll take a look at your file when i get home...

But how did you get autotune to work?? Both myself and joe tried and it won't work.

optimusaccord

Is everyone using 93 octane?

Dime Feng

1.Plug in flashpro to car
2.Load the calibration on flashpro manager that u want to autotune.
3.Select the live tuning tables u want to be tuned. (under the online tab)
4.Press the upload button and start the car.
5.Press the lighting icon (start datalogging/f10)
6.Click on tables tab and chose the box that u selected for autotune. For example u wanted to tune "fuel low". Click on that graph and it should show the live tuning with the boxes flashing and moving around. If u see the numbers changing by itself that means it should be auto tuning.

iCrap

I am using 93 octane.


And @dimefeng, i tried that but the lighting icon was greyed out, same for joe.

Dime Feng

I'm using 91 octane. California has piss water for their gas and 91 is the highest grade i can get at the pump. Who did the calibration for you optimus?

FORGOT TO MENTION after your done w/ the autotune save the file!! You will have to re upload the calibration to the car after.

@iCrap
Ill make a video of what I did to get it to work and ill post it later.

optimusaccord

A shop here in St. Louis called Adrenaline motorsports. Charles Rodriguez. The car has been tuned like this for 2 years now....

I'm going to use vitviper to set up the tune on my turbo..., get a base, dyno, send it to vit, and probably pay the extra for vip so that we can turn around a solid tune very quickly...

Dime Feng

optimusaccord

Nice video. The uploading was brutally painful to watch.... like it always is in real life...

I haven't messed with the auto tuning feature at all.

When you were completed, was there a noticeable difference? Did you do any driving around town, and highway driving to better build out the map?

Dime Feng

I did notice a difference in the low rpm knock counts, but I cant seem to get rid of the high rpm ones. Before the autotune I would get an average of 100-200 knocks just cruising around town for 15 mins but after the autotune lowered it to around 10-50. One thing that worries me about your tune is that from 4k-7.5k rpm WOT you get alot of knocks. One WOT pull would give me around 50-200 knocks on cyl 1&2, and that is just on one pull alone. Also around 5-6k rpm I hear this rattle and scraping sound from the engine. I cant tell if its the headers making that sound or if the knock is so bad I can hear something scraping from inside the engine.

-Autotune settings
So for the knock tuning I set it to:
max change from basemap = 10%
make adj every=1 sec
autotune strategy=closest cell

Now from my research i was told not to use the closest cell for tuning fuel,cam angle and the other boxes availble in the live tuning box, and instead use precise cell and lower the max change to 5%.

OH FORGOT TO MENTION
After u click the lightning button(start datalog) remeber to press the music icon(ctrl+t) 2 icons to the right of it.

If I am doing anything wrong here please let me know b4 i blow up my engine.

ssjoeboe9

I am traveling but Im going to take a look at all of your settings Dime Feng... Still don't understand how autotune worked for you and not for me and icrap.

I don't think I was getting any knock when I used this calibration. Lemme look again though. Also using 93octane

ssjoeboe9

25, 18, 1, 3--- This was my knock count for cylinders 1-4 on heavy acceleration for optimus calibration for. Same datalog I uploaded earlier.

Not sure if this number is bad or not, but I assume even oem knock occasionally at WOT??

optimusaccord

I am not sure about the knock. I suppose I could throw mine in and go trolling around in mine. I have been driving on it like this for 2+ years.... Admittedly, I do not drive around at WOT at every chance, I do it on the freeway a few times a month.

The first tune had over 200 whp, but there was knock, so chuck pulled timing to reduce the knock.

I think that 0 knock probably isn't realistic would be my guess, without running the motor super conservative. And if that is your thing, I would recommend you seek out a professional tuner.

As far as the scraping you are hearing, no idea on that. We may want to inquire with Utah, or vitviper.

Again, this is a map that I had and shared because no one had done any of this prior.

By no means am I saying to run your own personal car with the map.

optimusaccord

for ssjoeb, I would think (I am no expert BTW) that amount of knock is acceptable.

As for Dime, I think that the fuel that you have may be playing a part.

ssjoeboe9

I concur that the amount of knock I am seeing is probably in the "ok" range. Proabably could reduce it even more if I could get the auto tune to work.

*Also.. just watched the datalog again and I only got knock at really high rpm (obviously) but only AFTER I released the throttle... interesting right?! Cause now the crank inertia is doing most of the work bringing the pistons up and down, so why after you release the throttle would you get knock?? hmmmm.. I'm too lazy to research on my own haha

iCrap

Mine on the oct calibration
So, on WOT i get (most extreme case)
k 10
k1 5
k2 4
k3 0
k4 1

Then, after i let off the gas and when it shifts
k31
k14
k14
k0
k3

This is the most extreme case, it's usually way way lower.


I still can't understand how he got autotune to work and we didn't. But he also DID select different tables than we did.

I'll give autotune another try soon..


edit
also yes, OEM DOES knock occasionally.

ssjoeboe9

Interesting with the knock happening after releasing the throttle. You wanna research that Icrap??

Let me know what you find out with auto tune as well

iCrap

I've been really busy with my goat simulations but I guess I can take a break and do some research, if I must.

I'll try and figure this auto tune shit also.



Factors causing detonation :
1. A slow burning, lean fuel mixture
2. Gas with low octane
3. Carbon deposits increase the compression ratio in the combustion chamber
4. Engine Operating temperature is too high
5. Ignition timing is too advanced
6. Bad rings and/or valve seals allowing oil to be burned in the cylinders
7. Air Cleaner passages clogged allowing too much hot exhaust manifold air to enter engine.
8. Excessive boost from a S/C or Turbo application.


but we already knew all this though,

iCrap

I can't find much honestly. People are just like "consult a tuner"....
See if you can find anything.

This page has some usefull info however
http://rivperformance.editboard.com/...r-knock-retard

ssjoeboe9

Yeah we knew all the detonation things. I'll try and do some research too I guess...

ssjoeboe9

So I haven't done any research but here is my theory...

Perhaps the timing is slightly advanced during WOT, so that ping DOESNT occur. This meaning that the explosion occurs right before the piston reaches its maximum stroke to then force it back downward and continue it revolutions. But then you release the throttle and the inertia of the crank allows the piston to reach maximum stroke and you get ping because your advanced timing has now ceased. I'm no engine expert but it makes logical sense to me,

Dime Feng

So after playing around and killing 1/4 tank of gas trying to get rid of the knock when I'm WOT i decided to give up on the auto tune because it doesn't seem to be lowering it anymore then it can. It cleaned up the low rpm but for some reason it wont do the same for the high rpm range. Plus the scraping sound was kinda bugging me and it doesnt seem to make that noise with the stock calibration. So I decided to just get the car etuned by vit. I attached this calibration to the email. Ill see what the numbers are from his tune and compare it to this one.

Dime Feng

So after realizing the map that optimus had was for a MT, I was told to do some datalogs with the "tuned" map included in the flashpro. These are the numbers I got with the "tuned" map.

iCrap

How did you generate a dyno sheet with hondata software?
Also yea it's for MT but Hondata says the maps are interchangable between AT and MT.

ssjoeboe9

That's the graph that Vit does for you

Jaheri_cbp

Correct! Vit does an "e-dyno" for you after tuned. I was going to go with vit viper's flashpro and e-tune package because I have heard good things but got a better price for the combo from a local tuner jotech performance in orlando. Joe's shop has done some of the most serious k-series builds in orlando and specialize in Hondas so I do trust them as much. Lol He was not too fond of vit viper either when I mentioned him. Probably due to shit talking on the racing circuits who knows all it takes is one pissing contest when racing. He also lowered the price of the flashpro and tune for me when I mentioned vit too so it worked to my benefit lmao. I would just prefer somebody local just for the fact that my tsx will eventually be supercharged

UTAH TSX

Just be careful this is what happened to me with the best honda tuner in salt lake city

ssjoeboe9

I think I might just have Honda tune my car when I go supercharged!

iCrap

That would be pretty awesome if they could do it for you.

Dime Feng

Give me a WOT 3rd gear pull from 2-7k rpm data log and i can graph it for u.

ssjoeboe9

Dime feng. I posted a datalog that has a few pulls in it. One being WOT in third gear. Can you graph it for me?