Edmunds Full Test

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Old May 16, 2008 | 06:22 AM
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Edmunds Full Test

Edmunds posted their full review of the 2009 TSX. I won't quote the review at length, but I will quote the second opinion, which echoes what a lot of us have said:

I just sold my 2006 Acura TSX. I loved it, but I'm sure you'd agree it's hardly a collector's item worthy of gathering dust and depreciation in the Edmunds garage for years to come. But would I have traded in my 2006 TSX for this all-new 2009 TSX? Not a snowball's chance in Haiti.

There are certainly areas of improvement. The shorter-travel clutch, revised gearing and additional midrange power make the rev-happy four-banger easier to drive around town. The driving position is slightly better and the new Technology Package is excellent — particularly the ELS surround-sound audio system.

However, the rest of the comparison is a push or a bust. This 2009 model is no quicker, its braking distances are still subpar and its slalom and skid-pad performances are basically the same. The interior offers a tad more shoulder room, but it remains mostly unchanged in size, while still providing tons of standard equipment at a reasonable price.

And then there are numerous ways in which the 2009 TSX has gone backward. The electric steering is just awful, with zero feel and sloppy weighting, as if it came from the old Accord hybrid. The old car's excellent steering basically made the car, and it's hard to believe easy parking and a fractional fuel-economy benefit have been worth the sacrifice. If this is the future of Honda steering, the company is in trouble.

Furthermore, the new TSX's interior trim is now silverish plastic rather than real alloy, while other bits that were once chrome or wrapped in leather are now plastic. The new RL-style electronics interface works well, but I think the old touchscreen was more intuitive and looked better. And speaking of which, my '06 hardly featured styling to stir one's soul, but the 2009? Judge for yourself.

This all adds up to a net loss for the 2009 TSX. If Acura wasn't going to make an effort to improve this car dynamically, it could've saved itself a lot of money by just adjusting the old car's gearing and updating the nav-audio system. It's a cliché for an owner of a previous-generation car to say his is better than the newfangled version, but in this case, the cliché certainly applies.
They did measure the 0-60 for both 6MT and 5AT:

If you're not into these sensory delights, though, chances are good you'll decide the TSX isn't quick enough. Its 7.7-second 0-60-mph time (7.2 seconds with 1 foot of rollout like on a drag strip) and 15.6-second quarter-mile at 89.8 mph are on par with the 2.0T-equipped Audi A4 and Volkswagen Passat, but the normally aspirated 2.4-liter's peaky power band isn't as friendly as the 2.0-liter turbo's flat torque curve.

The 2009 Acura TSX is also an easy mark for almost any family sedan with a V6, especially when equipped with the five-speed automatic. We tested a TSX with the five-speed and its 0-to-60-mph time fell to 8.6 seconds (8.3 seconds with 1 foot of rollout like on a drag strip). That's slower than all four of the family sedans in our last comparison test which included the Chevrolet Malibu, Honda Accord, Nissan Altima and Toyota Camry.
These numbers don't seem to be an improvement from the '06. I don't want for more power now, and if you're the type of person who has to smoke everyone at the light, I can't see you buying a TSX anyway. What I do expect is good handling that makes the car a pleasure to drive, and Acura destroyed that with the EPS.
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Old May 16, 2008 | 07:43 AM
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with all this bashing going on (and some from me, as well) i bet the tsx still sells at least 15k units per year
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Old May 16, 2008 | 07:57 AM
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Finally a review that is brutally honest about this debacle Honda/Acura calls the TSX. The funny thing is I have been to two dealerships to look at this car and drive it, and myself and the salesman openly spent about 30 mins discussing what in the world was Acura thinking!!
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Old May 16, 2008 | 08:30 AM
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Yes the TSX will sell to the normal population (people who don't truly care about the car just drive it point A to B)..but I think the true Acura enthusiast will be disappointed will the overall driving experience (some already are). Look at the following Acura had with their Integra type r’s and TL-S’s…etc. You take the fun driving experience out of the car and your left with a Chevy Lumina with some extra bells and whistles. Common Honda/Acura you originally starting off making fun, economical, practical, reliable, sports cars. Keep your soul and don’t sell out buy making sh*t cheap and sub par (ugly grille with cheap black honey comb plastic lower grille for example)

BMW has a huge following because of just the driving experience.
One up them and make an affordable driving experience with the legendary Honda/Acura name of reliability.

the 09 TL better be good or I'm really going to question the future of Acura.
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Old May 16, 2008 | 09:41 AM
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i saw a black 09 in the dealership yesterday and i wanted to see the snaggletooth grille. didnt look as bad as I expected - i've hated it in photos, seeing it in person was a bit better.

give me the tech package in my 06 and i'll die a happy man.
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Old May 16, 2008 | 10:50 AM
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If you're "the kind of person who likes to smoke everyone at the light," ... are you really considering one of these entry-level upscale/luxury sedans at all? I imagine you'd be going right to top-line M-series or something of that ilk. Don't kick your burro with the spurs expecting it to turn into Seabiscuit....
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Old May 16, 2008 | 01:08 PM
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Originally Posted by davidspalding
If you're "the kind of person who likes to smoke everyone at the light," ... are you really considering one of these entry-level upscale/luxury sedans at all? I imagine you'd be going right to top-line M-series or something of that ilk. Don't kick your burro with the spurs expecting it to turn into Seabiscuit....
I'm guessing your refering to me? I was talking about overall driving experience and a resonable price....3 series comparible. If I wanted just straight line then I would by a crappy mustang...etc.
I bought a 07 tsx over a 09 because we wanted to actualy feel the road a little and not feel like we were driving a full size car. The 1gens actually have spunk and spirit when you drive them. They lost it in the 2gen. I don't understand why americans always feel bigger is better. I went to the dealership and drove an 09 and imho didn't like the look (cheap ugly rims for example) and didn't like the "drive" given it has the same engine but so called "tweaked". I just feel Acura did alot of external cheapening. I just see reviews like this and it makes me realize I'm not the only one who thinks this..thats all.
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Old May 16, 2008 | 01:23 PM
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I just don't get how they can turn out a car like this, was this designed in the US for US market or Euro/Japan for EDM/JDM market? Cause if i remember the TL was designed here for the US market and its a ridiculous hit, and the MDX also? C'mon, just keep up the designing.
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Old May 16, 2008 | 01:40 PM
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Originally Posted by LaZyPiGgY
I just don't get how they can turn out a car like this, was this designed in the US for US market or Euro/Japan for EDM/JDM market? Cause if i remember the TL was designed here for the US market and its a ridiculous hit, and the MDX also? C'mon, just keep up the designing.
I believe it was for the Euro market. I read that somewhere...thus the US tsx is pretty similiar to the Euro Accord (except their Honda grille is much better looking)
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Old May 16, 2008 | 02:23 PM
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Originally Posted by godfather2
with all this bashing going on (and some from me, as well) i bet the tsx still sells at least 15k units per year


ah...

the original sold about 30k per year I believe.

and they predict and are making 40k per year for the new one....

so 15k is a real low number, they better achieve that!
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Old May 16, 2008 | 02:42 PM
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Originally Posted by cbusAcuracls
I believe it was for the Euro market. I read that somewhere...thus the US tsx is pretty similiar to the Euro Accord (except their Honda grille is much better looking)
Ah, I think they should get their US design team to work on some new models, the TL is just amazing. Why stop there.
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Old May 16, 2008 | 03:26 PM
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The Fat Lady Has Sung

Brutal.

A black day for Acura and a day of shame for the memory of Soichiro Honda.
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Old May 16, 2008 | 03:55 PM
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Well, I agree with this review, it's nice to see Edmunds and I agree here.


I think it's funny:

They say the new TSX is a great car for traffic jams and sitting still.
But once you have to drive it.... well, it's not so good at all.

exactly my thoughts.


I'm a guy that likes to DRIVE cars....

so naturally I don't like the new TSX.
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Old May 16, 2008 | 04:09 PM
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All Out for the 2009 TSX: USA Today & Edumunds.com

Staggering.

USA Today joins Edumunds.com for a brutal one-two punch.

http://www.usatoday.com/money/autos/...tsx-2009_N.htm

http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do.../pageId=138874

Keep up the great work, Dick Colliver! We can't wait for the 09 TL!
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Old May 16, 2008 | 04:13 PM
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Originally Posted by cbusAcuracls
I'm guessing your refering to me? ....
No.
Originally Posted by darmok (in the opening post)
... These numbers don't seem to be an improvement from the '06. I don't want for more power now, and if you're the type of person who has to smoke everyone at the light, I can't see you buying a TSX anyway. What I do expect is good handling that makes the car a pleasure to drive, and Acura destroyed that with the EPS.
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Old May 16, 2008 | 04:22 PM
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Exclamation

1st article: "Incongruously imprecise steering"

Thats not good to hear since the 1st gen's steering is right on the money.




2nd article: "The 240-hp turbocharged 2.3-liter inline-4 in the Acura RDX seems like the obvious solution here. Even the 4,000-pound RDX beats the TSX through the quarter-mile (15.2 seconds at 90.4 seconds), so you can imagine the results if the engine had 600 fewer pounds of car to motivate. But the turbocharged engine's intercooler would have to go up front and that would lengthen the front overhang, and Acura's designers aren't up for a car with a big nose."


The acura designers won't lengthen the front overhang for Turbo but they will put a Saturn Grill in the front?

Logic = thrown out the window.
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Old May 16, 2008 | 04:49 PM
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Low blows from the journalists.

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Old May 16, 2008 | 05:20 PM
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<threads merged>
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Old May 17, 2008 | 11:09 AM
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Cool A

I would like to point out that the Overall Grade for the vehicle was an A.

Acura apparently made it less of a driver's car which would mean less than glowing reviews from enthusiasts & magazines but probably an increase in sales (see Camry). Maybe they are leaving the sportiness for the rumored upcoming turbo diesel.

People may want to focus on the negative comments in that article but they still gave it an A. That says something ...

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Old May 17, 2008 | 11:44 AM
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Originally Posted by TSX69
Maybe they are leaving the sportiness for the rumored upcoming turbo diesel.
I've driven a number of modern diesels in Europe, and I wouldn't classify the driving experience as anything approaching "sporty".
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Old May 17, 2008 | 12:23 PM
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According to Edmuds Slalom figures for IS-350 and TSX are the same. and TSX is full 2 DBA quieter than 6 six cylndier IS-350. Admittely they are comparing 6 speed auto with 6 speed manual. braking performance is also similar.

http://www.edmunds.com/apps/vdpconta...7/pageNumber=5
Vehicle Top
Model Year: 2006
Make: Lexus
Model: IS 350
Style: N/A
Base Price: N/A
Price as Tested: N/A
Drive Type: RWD
Transmission Type: 6-speed manumatic
Engine Type: V6
Displacement (cc / cu-in): 3.5
Horsepower (hp @ rpm): 306@6400
Torque (lb-ft @ rpm): 277@4800
Brake Type (front): 4-wheel disc w/ ABS, BrakeAssist and Electronic Brakeforce Distribution
Steering System: Speed-sensitive rack and pinion
Suspension Type (front): Double wishbone independent w/ stabilizer bar
Suspension Type (rear): Multilink independent w/ stabilizer bar
Tire Size (front): 225/40R18
Tire Size (rear): 255/40R18
Tire Brand: Dunlop
Tire Model: Sport Max
Manufacturer Curb Weight (lb): 3527
Recommended Fuel: 91
Fuel Tank Capacity (gal): 17.17
EPA Fuel Economy (mpg): N/A
Edmunds Observed (mpg): N/A

Conditions for Testing Top
Temperature (Fahrenheit): 81
Humidity: N/A
Elevation (ft): 131
Wind: 1.2 mph

Performance Top
0 - 30 (sec): 2.7
0 - 45 (sec): 4.2
0 - 60 (sec): 6.1
0 - 75 (sec): 8.55
1/4 Mile (sec @ mph): 14.23@99.82
30 - 0 (ft): 30.71
60 - 0 (ft): 123.02
Braking Rating (Excellent, Good, Average, Poor or Very Poor): Good
Slalom (mph): 64.1
Skid Pad Lateral acceleration (g): N/A
Handling Rating (Excellent, Good, Average, Poor or Very Poor): Good
Db @ Idle: 44
Db @ Full Throttle: 77
Db @ 70 mph Cruise: 68

http://www.edmunds.com/apps/vdpconta...0/pageNumber=4
Model Year: 2009
Make: Acura
Model: TSX
Style: 4dr Sedan w/Technology Package (2.4L 4cyl 6M)
Base Price: $32775
Price as Tested: $32775
Options on Test Vehicle: None
Drive Type: Front-wheel drive
Transmission Type: 6-speed manual
Transmission and Axle Ratios (x:1): I = 3.267, II = 2.040, III = 1.429, IV =1.073, V = 0.870, VI = 0.686, R = 3.583, Final Drive = 4.764
Engine Type: Transverse-mounted inline-4
Displacement (cc / cu-in): 2,354cc (144 cu-in)
Block/Head Material: Aluminum/aluminum
Valvetrain: Double overhead camshaft, 4 valves per cylinder, variable intake valve timing, variable intake and exhaust valve lift
Compression Ratio: 11.0:1
Redline (rpm): 7,100
Horsepower (hp @ rpm): 201 @ 7,000
Torque (lb-ft @ rpm): 172 @ 4,400
Brake Type (front): 11.8-by-1.1-inch ventilated disc
Brake Type (rear): 11.1-by-0.35-inch solid disc
Steering System: Electric speed-proportional power steering
Steering Ratio: 13.4:1
Suspension Type (front): Independent double wishbone, coil springs, 27mm antiroll bar
Suspension Type (rear): Independent, multilink, coil springs, 17mm antiroll bar
Tire Size (front): P225/50R17 93V M+S
Tire Size (rear): P225/50R17 93V M+S
Tire Brand: Michelin
Tire Model: Pilot HX MXM4
Tire Type: All-season
Wheel Size: 17 by 7.5 front and rear
Wheel Material (front/rear): Aluminum alloy
Manufacturer Curb Weight (lb): 3,415
Curb Weight As Tested (lb): 3,386
Weight Distribution, F/R (%): 59/41
Recommended Fuel: Premium unleaded (recommended)
Fuel Tank Capacity (gal): 18.5
EPA Fuel Economy (mpg): 20 city/28 highway
Edmunds Observed (mpg): 22.0

Conditions for Testing Top
Temperature (Fahrenheit): 60.8
Humidity: 54.8%
Elevation (ft): 1,121
Wind: 1.5

Performance Top
0 - 30 (sec): 3.1
0 - 45 (sec): 5.0
0 - 60 (sec): 7.7
0 - 75 (sec): 11.1
1/4 Mile (sec @ mph): 15.6 @ 89.8
0-60 with 1-ft Rollout (sec): 7.2
30 - 0 (ft): 31
60 - 0 (ft): 127
Braking Rating (Excellent, Good, Average, Poor or Very Poor): Poor
Slalom (mph): 64.1
Skid Pad Lateral acceleration (g): 0.79
Handling Rating (Excellent, Good, Average, Poor or Very Poor): Average
Db @ Idle: 41.8
Db @ Full Throttle: 74.9
Db @ 70 mph Cruise: 66.1
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Old May 17, 2008 | 12:35 PM
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I wouldn't compare any 2006 to 2009 numbers.


for one, they continue to change how they write the numbers.
two, you're not giving lexus any credit for making any improvements in 3 years.

the 2004 TSX and the 2008 TSX are not identical you know.
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Old May 17, 2008 | 02:59 PM
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Originally Posted by MMsTSX
I wouldn't compare any 2006 to 2009 numbers.


for one, they continue to change how they write the numbers.
two, you're not giving lexus any credit for making any improvements in 3 years.

the 2004 TSX and the 2008 TSX are not identical you know.

But the 2006 and 2008 IS350s are identical. They haven't changed anything (performance wise) since the last generation IS came out for 06. So a comparison of an 08 IS350 would yield very similiar results to the 06 IS350.
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Old May 17, 2008 | 08:13 PM
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Red face Type S

Originally Posted by Fishbulb
I've driven a number of modern diesels in Europe, and I wouldn't classify the driving experience as anything approaching "sporty".
Well, I was thinking that the turbo diesel would be more along the lines of a Type S. It would come up performance upgrades like larger tires & retuned suspension etc etc.

All 3 of Acura's sedans were more or less sport sedans, maybe they made an effort to provide something more luxury oriented. In other words, perhaps the base 2009 TSX is meant to compete w/ the ES350 & the Type S is meant to tackle the IS250/350.

I probably am giving Acura too much credit but maybe ....

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Old May 17, 2008 | 10:59 PM
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Originally Posted by MMsTSX
I wouldn't compare any 2006 to 2009 numbers.


for one, they continue to change how they write the numbers.
two, you're not giving lexus any credit for making any improvements in 3 years.

the 2004 TSX and the 2008 TSX are not identical you know.
there is slight horsepower bump for TSX in 2006 vs 2004 so performance is better but IS-350 is exactly the same. funny thing is in quietness TSX beat six cylinder IS-350. Slolam run and braking are almost equal. Only in quarter mile IS-350 is better by 1.5 seconds. (it just shows how excellent aerodynamic drag of TSX at higher speeds is vs much powerful rival). TSX is 4 cylinder it will take some time to get upto speeds but at higher speeds it is much refined car.
Does 1.5 second makes a big difference in life time? that any one will spend $10K extra on car that has smaller road presence and probably worse fuel economy and higher maintaiance.
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Old May 18, 2008 | 12:46 AM
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I think 14.2s@100mph is one of the slowest times I've seen for a stock IS350. Many mags have gotten mid to high 13's trapping at around 104mph. Granted, Edmunds' times are always slower than that other mags get as they don't include the correction factors and I don't think they brake torque or drop the clutch at high rpm.

I agree though, for most consumers, they won't need that amount of power. And if they do need it, then they can choose the TL, IS350, G35, or something else that has a V6 or something.

In summary, the TSX is a great car for people who want a entry level luxury sedan, and a high 20's to low 30's pricetag makes it very affordable and a decent alternative for those who don't want to settle with the bread and butter Accords, Camrys, or Altimas. And its 4 cylinder engine ensures low running cost too. The 1st gen TSX has already shown this formula does work. It's sad that the 2nd gen lost some of its driving appeal, but the general public don't really care about it anyways (of course, I hope they will have a Type S version for us car enthusiasts). For those who planned to upgrade from the 1st gen TSX to the new 2nd gen, this is most likely not the car as even Acura admitted the new car is still for buyers who want to buy their first luxury car. Acura instead wants people to keep moving up, as in, from the TSX, to the TL. Their reasoning is, you will also be making more money and thus be able to afford a more expensive car too.
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Old May 18, 2008 | 09:18 AM
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Did the article mention if premium fuel was required or recommended?
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Old May 18, 2008 | 12:57 PM
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I'm pretty sure it's required, considering it's also required for the 1st gen. As usual, you can still use regular fuel but it will make less power.
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Old May 18, 2008 | 01:08 PM
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Originally Posted by iforyou
I'm pretty sure it's required, considering it's also required for the 1st gen. As usual, you can still use regular fuel but it will make less power.
Hmm. Considering it doesn't make all that much more power that the 2.4 in the accord, filling it with premium doesn't excite me much.

It's too bad they couldn't just have put the 3.0 from the old accord in it. Regular gas, decent torque, 244hp. Probably wouldn't throw the handling off too bad.
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Old May 18, 2008 | 01:17 PM
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Originally Posted by TSX69
I would like to point out that the Overall Grade for the vehicle was an A.
No, it wasn't. That was just the sound system review.
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Old May 18, 2008 | 04:06 PM
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Originally Posted by iforyou
I'm pretty sure it's required, considering it's also required for the 1st gen. As usual, you can still use regular fuel but it will make less power.
P. 356 of the 2009 OM. 91 is usual for a high compression engine like the K24, I'm told. No changes there.

Less power, and it'll be exercising the anti-knock detector and response system.
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Old May 18, 2008 | 08:32 PM
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Originally Posted by iforyou
I think 14.2s@100mph is one of the slowest times I've seen for a stock IS350. Many mags have gotten mid to high 13's trapping at around 104mph. Granted, Edmunds' times are always slower than that other mags get as they don't include the correction factors and I don't think they brake torque or drop the clutch at high rpm.

I agree though, for most consumers, they won't need that amount of power. And if they do need it, then they can choose the TL, IS350, G35, or something else that has a V6 or something.

In summary, the TSX is a great car for people who want a entry level luxury sedan, and a high 20's to low 30's pricetag makes it very affordable and a decent alternative for those who don't want to settle with the bread and butter Accords, Camrys, or Altimas. And its 4 cylinder engine ensures low running cost too. The 1st gen TSX has already shown this formula does work. It's sad that the 2nd gen lost some of its driving appeal, but the general public don't really care about it anyways (of course, I hope they will have a Type S version for us car enthusiasts). For those who planned to upgrade from the 1st gen TSX to the new 2nd gen, this is most likely not the car as even Acura admitted the new car is still for buyers who want to buy their first luxury car. Acura instead wants people to keep moving up, as in, from the TSX, to the TL. Their reasoning is, you will also be making more money and thus be able to afford a more expensive car too.
motortrend has similar figures as Edmunds. It seems at higher speeds it loses its appeal. later g is only 0.83 despite having it low profile tires vs TSX. Slolam run is again the same. I fail to see how TSX is bad compared to this.






http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/...ecs_price.html

Base price $36,030
Price as tested $39,000 (est)
Vehicle layout Front engine, RWD, 5-pass, 4-door sedan
Engine 3.5 L / 306 hp / 277 lb-ft DOHC 24-valve V-6
Transmission 6-speed automatic
Curb weight, f/r dist 3571 lb, 53 / 47%
Wheelbase 107.5 in
Length x Width x Height 180.1 x 70.9 x 56.1 in
0-60 mph 5.5 sec
1/4 mile 14.0 sec @ 99.8 mph
Braking, 60-0 mph 122 ft
600-foot slalom 64.4 mph avg
Lateral acceleration 0.83 g avg
MT Figure Eight 27.1 sec @ 0.64 avg
EPA city/hwy fuel econ 21/28
What's Hot Great looks; high feature content; class-leading power
What's Not Too much electronics stifles driving experience; no stick shift for IS 350
Like This? Try These Infiniti G35; Audi A4; Acura TL
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Old May 18, 2008 | 08:51 PM
  #33  
S power's Avatar
2010 TL SH-AWD
 
Joined: Aug 2005
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From: Chicago-land
I dont know if its me or what but the MAJORITY of the 1st gen owners I see are female's. Which most likely could careless of how it drives, just as long as it looks sexy. All of the TSX male owners that I know are the car enthusiast ones.
As far as I see it, the second gen will be another hit for the ladies. This time selling less because of the gentlemens are out of the game.
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Old May 18, 2008 | 09:05 PM
  #34  
iforyou's Avatar
You'll Never Walk Alone
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From: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Originally Posted by SSFTSX
motortrend has similar figures as Edmunds. It seems at higher speeds it loses its appeal. later g is only 0.83 despite having it low profile tires vs TSX. Slolam run is again the same. I fail to see how TSX is bad compared to this.
Yea, the IS350 is geared for the 1/4mile run, after that, it loses its speed rapidly, and the G35 can overtake it at that time. And the IS350 is a boat in handling.
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Old May 19, 2008 | 07:55 AM
  #35  
cbusAcuracls's Avatar
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Joined: Feb 2006
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From: Columbus, Ohio
Originally Posted by S power
I dont know if its me or what but the MAJORITY of the 1st gen owners I see are female's. Which most likely could careless of how it drives, just as long as it looks sexy. All of the TSX male owners that I know are the car enthusiast ones.
As far as I see it, the second gen will be another hit for the ladies. This time selling less because of the gentlemens are out of the game.

+1

I take care of my wifes tsx more than she takes care of it..and I drive it maybe 10% of the time.

It it was my car it would be clean 24-7, lowerd, w/ forgeline wheels. Her "its pretty just the way it is"

No dis on women but just the "common" mentality. There are always a few exceptions.
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Old May 19, 2008 | 02:29 PM
  #36  
davidspalding's Avatar
Make a hole, coming thru!
 
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From: Somewhere between 70 and 125 mph
Originally Posted by S power
I dont know if its me or what but the MAJORITY of the 1st gen owners I see are female's. Which most likely could careless of how it drives, just as long as it looks sexy. All of the TSX male owners that I know are the car enthusiast ones. ...
May be your locale. Around here, I see just as many men driving them. And I'm not in San Francisco or Fire Island.
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Old May 19, 2008 | 04:28 PM
  #37  
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I'm still not clear on wether the 2G TSX is a net gain or net loss. The reviewer says he wouldn't trade the '06 for an '09 but doesn't say what they would trade it for instead. Is the '09 still a sweet spot or has another car overtaken the TSX as the best value for an entry level luxury sedan?

Does the new technology outweigh the poor driving dynamics of the 2G TSX or is a used 1G TSX more desirable for it's combination of features and handling?
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Old May 19, 2008 | 05:15 PM
  #38  
davidspalding's Avatar
Make a hole, coming thru!
 
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From: Somewhere between 70 and 125 mph
Originally Posted by darmok
Edmunds posted their full review of the 2009 TSX....
I finally got around to reading this article (I closed on a home and moved this weekend), but some of these paragraphs are downright ugly appraisals -- the editor (Erin) was clearly disappointed.

The Opposite of Flattery
If you end up on a back road with a 2009 Acura TSX, it probably won't be something you planned. Yes, the chassis has some life to it, but it's in such a conservative state of tune that the TSX is prevented from showing the kind of athleticism that enthusiast drivers like.

At a pace that sane people might drive, the '09 TSX has the compliant, springy ride that's characteristic of Honda, and the car feels light and willing. But as soon as you start to attack the corners, the TSX raises the white flag. There's considerable body roll and the P225/50R17 Michelin Pilot HX MXM4 all-season tires run out of grip quickly. And the lack of steering feedback makes you feel like you're driving the 2009 TSX half-blind.

This has real consequences in the slalom, where the Acura averages only 64.1 mph, one of the slowest speeds we've recorded among current-day, premium-brand cars. It's 1.5 mph slower than a 3,600-pound Honda Accord EX-L V6. Even a Mitsubishi Lancer with a weakling 2.0-liter engine and a power-sapping continuously variable transmission beats the TSX through the cones with a 65.4-mph speed. The TSX performs similarly on the skid pad, and its 0.79g is what we'd expect from a larger, heavier family sedan.

It's like the TSX hasn't had a sure hand to guide its development at the Honda proving grounds.
Ouch.

Where There's Smoke
We get it that Acura likes to keep unsprung weight to a minimum and tries not to burden its cars with oversize brake rotors and calipers. But this particular set of brakes for the 2009 Acura TSX isn't fully up to the task of stopping a 3,400-pound car (though some blame must go to the tires as well).

On a good day in normal traffic, there's no problem, and the pedal feel is solid and linear. But when we apply full braking power at our instrumented testing facility, it gets ugly.

The TSX won't stop any shorter from 60 mph than 127 feet, which is 14 feet farther than an all-wheel-drive Lexus IS 250 that weighs 100 pounds more (and costs the same). The TSX's brakes fade dramatically after just one stop, and there's smoke coming off the rotors by the third run. The car isn't happy. We're not happy.

... After these disappointments, we want to curl up into a ball in the 2009 Acura TSX's extraordinarily comfortable seats and call it a day.

... Yet if driving is still really about the driving for you, then the 2009 Acura TSX will seem like little more than an expensive accessory for your iPhone. Unless you can get by on the occasional rev-matched downshift, the second-gen TSX really isn't about the drive.
(Performance tests)
Acceleration Comments: The TSX is hard to launch effectively due to lots of weight transfer and low-grip rubber. The engine performs well, but isn't on par for this segment.
Handling Comments: Slalom: Light damping doesn't offer the control needed to blast through the slalom's surface irregularities. There's lots of body roll and no information through the steering. Skid pad: The TSX has decent balance and lift-throttle response before the front tires overheat. The lack of steering feel at the limit hurts confidence.
Braking Comments: This is not acceptable braking performance for a car in this class at this price point, and the TSX's 127-foot 60-mph-to-0 stopping distance (achieved on the first run) doesn't tell the whole story. There was considerable fade by the second braking run, and by the third run, the brakes were smoking. We also noticed massive fade when slowing after acceleration runs, which indicates this brake system's lack of thermal capacity. We suspect the brakes on this TSX test car had never been heat-cycled (given that the car had only 850 miles on its odometer), but even so, we expected much better performance in this test.
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Old May 19, 2008 | 05:48 PM
  #39  
davidspalding's Avatar
Make a hole, coming thru!
 
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From: Somewhere between 70 and 125 mph
(from Edmunds Inside Line's 2005 TSX vs. Jetta GLI shootout)

... Compare with a 2005 shootout between the TSX and the 2006 VW Jetta GLI:
... With less roll and quicker steering than the GLI, the TSX is easier to get through turns quickly.

... With its front and rear double-wishbone suspension, quick steering ratio (14.8 vs. the GLI's 16.2) and predictable handling at the limit, the TSX is an easy car to drive fast. It changes directions quickly, doesn't get unsettled over midcorner bumps and understeers progressively.

It was quicker through our slalom course than the GLI and earned a better overall rating from our test-driver. Give it a serious set of tires and it would leave the GLI even further behind.
And this is kinda of foreboding:
For 2006 the TSX gets a minor refresh that addresses its lack of power and anonymous styling. The upgrades will make the TSX a better car, but we doubt the changes will be a big enough personality injection to choose the TSX over the GLI.
(Yes, they handed the trophy to the GLI for being more sporty and fun to drive. But it was a close call.)
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