Hi,
I was driving my 99 last night and could smell burnt rubber coming through the vents with the heat on. Today, while driving the car lost all power and just died. I ended up having to boost the car 3 times to get it home because the battery would not last. When I got it home I had a good look and found that there was no serpentine/alternator belt. Belt must have busted. I was hoping this happened just because it was old. So I went and picked up a new one, and the parts guy said make sure the tensioner pulley is moving freely. So I checked that, seemed fine, installed the belt, boosted the battery, started her up and she was running extremely rough, and then I started to get that smell again. The new belt was actually smoking. So I did some more reading online and came up with maybe the alternator is seized. Took the belt off, alternator pulley seems to move fine.

Now from what I read on-line people say to check all the pulleys.. water pump, power steering, etc... This confused me because this definitely wasn't 99 tl specific information. From what I can tell, from following hoses, and looking through the shop manual is that the only pulleys on the whole alternator belt "route" are engine crank (large pulley), tensior pulley, alternator pulley, and a/c pulley.

So I checked all the pulleys. tensioner moves fine, alternator moves fine, engine crank don't move but I wouldn't imagine it's not intended to? the a/c pulley... looks like the a/c pulley to me anyhow, the most lower pulley closest to the front of the engine bay.. doesn't move. Started the car and it just ain't moving, belt just spinning. So I'm guessing this is my issue.

Now, the car is old... 250,000km and has other issues (needs new engine mounts, should have timing belt done, and needs new fuel tank or at least a fuel tank gasket so it wont leak when it's filled more than half way. Based on what I paid for the car and what it will cost to fix those issues I don't plan on fixing them... which brings me back to how can I fix this more serious issue without spending a lot of money?

I've read through this thread https://acurazine.com/forums/2g-tl-problems-fixes-117/99-acura-tl-c-bypass-belt-781521/ which appears to be the closet thing I can find to my issue.

Regarding that thread... I would be willing to settle for no a/c but it looks like the a/c delete/smaller belt wont work because of "let alone making sure that auto tensioner, does not tension the one side of the belt right into the other side". Which makes perfect sense to me.

Another suggestion in that thread was to pull the clutch relay fuse. Where are these fuses located and what are they labelled as? I have the shop manual but having a hard time locating that bit of information.

What are my other options for getting this fixed? Am I able to go to a scrap yard and pull the a/c compressor and clutch and simply swap them out? How do I determine if it's the clutch or the compressor? If I replace the clutch and compressor do I need to have everything recharged as suggested in that thread?

Thanks in advance for any help,
Jordan

p.s. sorry for the essay

 

Also, would anybody happen to know what page(s) in the shop manual that cover the removal and installation of the a/c compressor/clutch?

 

its a heck of a job to replace the ac compressor clutch, usually special tools required
When you have the system open for new lines or compressor you also need a receiver dryer and vacuum down and leak test then refill with the correct amount of r-134 plus spec amount of ac oil

lets start with exactly which pulley is not turning and replace it
a non turning alternator will make car run poorly, a low battery after jump start will also run poorly

 

there is a ROLLER or idler pulley near bottom iirc -ck your hood diagram to confirm

and the top moveable one is the ac/alt belt tensioner
that one wears out a lot!

 

ok so as far as i can tell there are 4 pulleys. there's the extremely large one that is the crank, the tensioner which appears to be working fine (even though its a common failure), the pulley thats attached the alternator, and that only leaves one pulley... its directly bellow the alternator pulley. So this must be the one I'm referring to as the a/c pulley and your calling the roller or idler pulley. Should this pulley move freely with no belt installed? edit: also looks trickey to replace due to low clearance from what i can remember.. may have to remove alternator to get to it? ill have to have another look tomorrow

There's a diagram on the hood? Ill have to check it tomorrow when i get home from work. and what does iirc mean? i have a feeling its a well known abbreviation that I'm completely oblivious to. lol

and before i left for the night.. i pulled the mg clutch fuse and tried starting the car, wouldnt start, turned over but wouldnt start... so i tried boosting it off another car, wouldnt start. I put the fuse back in and even left the cables on for 10min with the other car running. So.. maybe i do have a bad battery? i was able to boost it and start earlier.

but im having a hard time believing the battery started the whole thing because how would thart have caused my belt to break in the first place. it seems more likely this whole boosting and draining without the belt on my way home has killed the battery.

 

I think your cheapest option would be a junkyard compressor. You could install it without a recharge just to give the belt a place to go, or you could install it and have a professional vacuum the system and recharge it. Either way, you should have a professional evacuate the system of refrigerant before you start. They might do it for free, and keep your refrigerant; or if you have it charged they would re-use yours plus whatever else might be needed.

 

when the alternator no longer puts power to the battery, thru alt failure or belt breakage= the car must run all its electronics on just the battery, sucking it dry, which often kills it

if close to or over 3 years old battery, its a doorstop

yes pulleys with rollers should roll freely with belt off

 

Alright, thanks for the input guys. I'm definitely going to pick up another battery or at least have mine tested at canadian tire (I heard it was free). I haven't really put anytime into this but I plan on doing whatever needs to be done on the weekend. Got the whole weekend off. So I'm going to try and plan it out best I can within the next couple days.

So it looks like I'm leaning towards getting a junkyard compressor. I would be willing to just swap out the compressors and not recharge the a/c... depending on how much it would cost me to have it recharged.

2 issues:

evacuating the system. I'd have to get the car to the shop, etheir a tow truck or buy a new battery and hope I dont wreck it from the constant having to boost the thing. Perhaps I could rent an a/c vacuum pump and do it myself? anybody know any canadian stores that rents these?

second issue is if i get a compressor from a junkyard i wouldn't be able to pull it myself without some kind of a/c pump. there not just going to let me dump the r134a all over the place when removing it.

maybe they have some already pulled? likely more expensive. I was talking to the guy on the phone about going and pulling an alternator myself and he quoted $20 bucks. not bad.

opinions?
Thanks

 

you will need to charge the battery before testing, or the shop will charge it for an hour then test
it needs power in it to see if it has enough power-will accept power
jumpstarting doesn't hurt - having to power the car by itself is bad

junkyards/auto recyclers usually pull the ac compressors and keep them safe inside = valuable

why are you looking at ac comp- have you solved the mystery of the non moving roller at bottom of system?
Is the comp officially seized?

vac pump is for pulling air from the system to test for leaks and remove any moisture
Shops use a special machine that catches and recycles the used Freon when `draining`
When installing all new Freon you can get the system vac tested/buy a vac pump, then a knowing buddy can add the Freon at home for a fraction of the cost at shop, they want 60 to 100 dollars per pound and its not even NEW! we need 2.some lbs

while I can buy 1 lb cans at parts store for under 10 dollars!

 

Alright,
Had the battery load tested and it had a bad cell so I bought a new battery. The cars starts and run's fine without a belt installed (until the battery dies of course).

So back to this pulley, here's what I've discovered. The pulley, which is indeed the ac pulley, does not move at all... its seized. From what I've read this pulley should spin freely if the clutch isn't engaged. I am able to turn the pressure plate. So this leads me to believe that there is nothing wrong with my compressor or clutch... because if the compressor was locked the pressure plate shouldn't turn right? and if the clutch was engaged and the pulley is seized then the pressure plate should be seized too. So possible a bad bearing in the pulley?

So I figured I try and take it apart and see why this pulley isn't spinning. Not working out at all. I removed the center bolt on the pressure plate and from what I've seen in a youtube video for a 98 tl (clutch assembly looks very similar but not identical) and from what I can tell from the 99tl shop manual the pressure plate should just slide right off. Well I've hit it with a hammer, tried plying it off with a scredriver/mini crowbar to no avail. What gives?

You can see the process in this youtube video:

Skip to about 16 min mark to see the pressure plate removal. This setup looks similar to mine except the pressure plate is further inside the pulley but still just the same center bolt holding it on.

 

The drive plate usually comes right off. Try a gentle pry with a small screwdriver on one side and your fingers pulling on the other. Try tapping it with a small hammer while you wiggle and pry with your fingers and the screwdriver. If you're having trouble with this, it doesn't get easier. The pulley/brng. assy. usually requires penetrating oil, and tapping with a brass hammer, while pulling with your fingers. If you get this far, hopefully you won't need the coil. Sometimes the bearing is loose enough that the coil gets chewed up. You can buy a new (not rebuilt) compressor with a clutch for less than the three clutch components. Oh yeah, the coil ground screw will usually come out with vice-grips, not a screwdriver. You will need good, not flimsy snap ring pliers. Good luck.

 

so the thing not turning is the ac compressor itself?
not the tensioner pulley for that belt- is that correct?

 

do whatever trash says- he didn't get that name from restoring a perfect condition TL~