Just drove the new G35 and I think . . .
04-06-2002, 01:04 PM
#81
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Car & Driver HAS 1/4 miles times for the G35 and it shows the G35 to be .1 second slower than the TLS.
Since the G35 has RWD and assuming you pay for the optional sports suspension, you have to expect the TLS to have slightly slower slalom and skid pad ratings than the G35 (.81 vs. .84 in favor of the G35) per C & D tests. However the TLS certainly doesn't feel like a boat and handles extremely well! I think Motor Trend posted a .84 skid pad score for the TLS but since they have no test results for the G35 yet, I didn't think it fair to use their test results for the TLS in a comparison to the G35.
Originally posted by EZZ
The suspension might not make it fast but at least it doesn't feel like a boat...er a TLS :p
The suspension might not make it fast but at least it doesn't feel like a boat...er a TLS :p
04-06-2002, 02:18 PM
#82
Hey TypeSAcura why do you keep posting pics of the G35 Coupe aren't you getting the dope looking 4 door 
Yes the coupe looks good but ?
At least the G35 coupe will come out in 6 months where as the new TLS is slated for 2004. I'd also like to know where you got the info for the 3.5 ltr AWD that is going to be in the 2004 tls.
The new NSX will be AWD and the new RL will be RWD so with that technology already in use it makes cents .00 to also use one of those platforms when Acura wants to be king of the entry level luxury class in the 2004 TL-S!!!! If people can wait 6 months for the G35 cpe then just wait another 6 more months for a real car:p
P.S. Car & Driver HAS 1/4 miles times for the G35 and it shows the G35 to be .1 second slower than the TLS. and still have $3,000 to put into suspension TO MAKE IT A "SKYLINE" SUSPENSION AS WELL!!!!!!!!!!!!:thefinger :p
Yes the coupe looks good but ?At least the G35 coupe will come out in 6 months where as the new TLS is slated for 2004. I'd also like to know where you got the info for the 3.5 ltr AWD that is going to be in the 2004 tls.
The new NSX will be AWD and the new RL will be RWD so with that technology already in use it makes cents .00 to also use one of those platforms when Acura wants to be king of the entry level luxury class in the 2004 TL-S!!!! If people can wait 6 months for the G35 cpe then just wait another 6 more months for a real car:p
P.S. Car & Driver HAS 1/4 miles times for the G35 and it shows the G35 to be .1 second slower than the TLS. and still have $3,000 to put into suspension TO MAKE IT A "SKYLINE" SUSPENSION AS WELL!!!!!!!!!!!!:thefinger :p
04-06-2002, 05:14 PM
#83
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Originally posted by BFOR3
P.S. Car & Driver HAS 1/4 miles times for the G35 and it shows the G35 to be .1 second slower than the TLS. and still have $3,000 to put into suspension TO MAKE IT A "SKYLINE" SUSPENSION AS WELL!!!!!!!!!!!!:thefinger :p [/B]
P.S. Car & Driver HAS 1/4 miles times for the G35 and it shows the G35 to be .1 second slower than the TLS. and still have $3,000 to put into suspension TO MAKE IT A "SKYLINE" SUSPENSION AS WELL!!!!!!!!!!!!:thefinger :p [/B]
:p
04-06-2002, 06:58 PM
#84
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Originally posted by EZZ
Gee...I never knew you could turn a 60/40 FWD drive into a 52/48 RWD for $3000. :thefinger :p
Gee...I never knew you could turn a 60/40 FWD drive into a 52/48 RWD for $3000. :thefinger
:p
originally posted by before4
when Acura wants to be king of the entry level luxury class in the 2004 TL-S!!!!
Ah, you got caught. So you are admitting that the tls isn't king of the entry level luxury class RIGHT NOW, TODAY and that the G35 is.
Wait till 2004, the last time i looked in my calender it still said 2002.
04-06-2002, 07:14 PM
#85
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Originally posted by vandy786
Man, this thread is a testament to your ignorance, insecurity, and contradictions. You first said that the G35 hasn't even been tested thoroughly yet, and there are no quarter mile tests. So what you are doing is declaring the G35 the best car in it's class without any real data. Are you retarded?
The only thing that can be stated for sure right now about the G35 is that the majority of people think it looks like ShiZ. Why don't you contribute some real posts if you know so much about cars? Or maybe better, why don't you get a grip and realize that the G35 will never be the king of entry level luxury? This market segment is particularly competitive, and the way you make it sound, 100% of the buyers looking for an entry level luxury sedan will be buying the G35 starting today because it is simply the best. This has never happened with any car in the past and judging by the looks of the G35, it's definitely not going to happen in this case. Even though the TL-S is "older technology," overall it's still got the G35 beat (as some would argue), or at least in check.
Man, this thread is a testament to your ignorance, insecurity, and contradictions. You first said that the G35 hasn't even been tested thoroughly yet, and there are no quarter mile tests. So what you are doing is declaring the G35 the best car in it's class without any real data. Are you retarded?
The only thing that can be stated for sure right now about the G35 is that the majority of people think it looks like ShiZ. Why don't you contribute some real posts if you know so much about cars? Or maybe better, why don't you get a grip and realize that the G35 will never be the king of entry level luxury? This market segment is particularly competitive, and the way you make it sound, 100% of the buyers looking for an entry level luxury sedan will be buying the G35 starting today because it is simply the best. This has never happened with any car in the past and judging by the looks of the G35, it's definitely not going to happen in this case. Even though the TL-S is "older technology," overall it's still got the G35 beat (as some would argue), or at least in check.
let's see some tire screechin' action
04-06-2002, 07:28 PM
#86
Dr. TLS
Originally posted by TypeSAcura
Ezz, i think the tls is more like 70/30. also the coeficient of drag on the G35 is .26 with 0 lift. The only sedan with comparable aerodynamics is the lexus Ls430 but that car cost 50-60k. The tls aerodynamics are comparable to an SUV.
originally posted by before4
when Acura wants to be king of the entry level luxury class in the 2004 TL-S!!!!
Ah, you got caught. So you are admitting that the tls isn't king of the entry level luxury class RIGHT NOW, TODAY and that the G35 is.
Wait till 2004, the last time i looked in my calender it still said 2002.
Ezz, i think the tls is more like 70/30. also the coeficient of drag on the G35 is .26 with 0 lift. The only sedan with comparable aerodynamics is the lexus Ls430 but that car cost 50-60k. The tls aerodynamics are comparable to an SUV.
originally posted by before4
when Acura wants to be king of the entry level luxury class in the 2004 TL-S!!!!
Ah, you got caught. So you are admitting that the tls isn't king of the entry level luxury class RIGHT NOW, TODAY and that the G35 is.
Wait till 2004, the last time i looked in my calender it still said 2002.
About the weight distribution: I think you may need to learn how to round properly. The 62% in the front rounds to 60% while the back 38% rounds to 40%. Nice try at making the G35 look strikingly different from the TL-S. But with the real data, its evident that 62 vs 52 and 38 vs 48 is not ALL AS different as you wanted everyone to think.
Another thing: It is sad that EVEN AFTER all the disadvantages you mentioned about the TL-S in your first paragraph, the car can still hang with the G35. To me the ugly rear end (as well as the interior) isn't worth the minor CD drag and weight distribution improvments in the G35. I won't be driving it in the tracks and I am positive most consumers won't be doing the same so all the stuff about performance and riding in the twisties is BS. Plus, on top of all that, it costs 3K more. I think my point has been made quite clearly so only post a reply if you need further explanation.
04-06-2002, 08:05 PM
#87
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I don't see why someone would want to put down the TL-S in a TL forum. Not very bright 
If you think the G35 is so great, then why don't you trade in your TL and go buy one? And if you're waiting for the coupe, have you put your deposit down yet? If not, then quit wasting our time b/c your not putting money where your mouth is.
If you think the G35 is so great, then why don't you trade in your TL and go buy one? And if you're waiting for the coupe, have you put your deposit down yet? If not, then quit wasting our time b/c your not putting money where your mouth is.
04-08-2002, 03:55 AM
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*chants* go buy the g35 types, go buy it... we'll be waiting for you to come back and beg for our forgiveness J/p 
hehe, whatever pleases you mang, but don't argue wit it, it's just a waste of time
we'll be waiting for you to come back and beg for our forgiveness J/p hehe, whatever pleases you mang, but don't argue wit it, it's just a waste of time
04-08-2002, 11:56 AM
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WOW!
Lots and lots of yelling at each other.
As for the TypeS guy, he seems way too ingrained with the potential of G35. (which I actually own to my hapiness)
As for the 5.9 second 0-60, I seriously have high doubts on that.
The original poster at freshalloy.com had trap speed of 99 mph!!! (which is in league of very low 14sec car). Of course, he did repost saying it was 96mph. (much more reasonable and at the same time making me wonder where the claim comes from)
So, you guys can pretty much forget about the 5.9 sec argument at this point until the hard facts (shakes my head as there is none other than at track which doesn't get 0-60 anyway).
As for some members who disagree on handling characteristic comparison between TL-S and G35... That 13 % that moves toward or rear is very different. (But then, I am the kind of guy who detects difference in handling even if there is single passenger on board) Not to mention FWD vs RWD difference. I don't see how you can say the handling is comparible?
Interior: Purely subjective. I consider TL-S interior to be boring myself. G35 interior to be clean but lacking. BMW 3 series arcane. Only thing that looks good IMO is the Audi. $2-300 investment on aftermarket kit takes care of all interior issues I have on any of the vehicle though (except Audi... no need). Leather is of high quality with good feel, plastic has nice feel to it (except center console which is getting changed quickly in my book).
The only reason in my book for TL-S vs G35 would be the straight accelaration they have (about even from what I can deduce at this point) and price range (2-3k difference with similar option).
This is first car that I got I had no remorse or second thought after getting the car at all.
PS) I will be willing to race on track for someone else to put money down... (lmao) Is there good drag track around LA? I don't condone illegal racing myself.
As for the TypeS guy, he seems way too ingrained with the potential of G35. (which I actually own to my hapiness)
As for the 5.9 second 0-60, I seriously have high doubts on that.
The original poster at freshalloy.com had trap speed of 99 mph!!! (which is in league of very low 14sec car). Of course, he did repost saying it was 96mph. (much more reasonable and at the same time making me wonder where the claim comes from)
So, you guys can pretty much forget about the 5.9 sec argument at this point until the hard facts (shakes my head as there is none other than at track which doesn't get 0-60 anyway).
As for some members who disagree on handling characteristic comparison between TL-S and G35... That 13 % that moves toward or rear is very different. (But then, I am the kind of guy who detects difference in handling even if there is single passenger on board) Not to mention FWD vs RWD difference. I don't see how you can say the handling is comparible?
Interior: Purely subjective. I consider TL-S interior to be boring myself. G35 interior to be clean but lacking. BMW 3 series arcane. Only thing that looks good IMO is the Audi. $2-300 investment on aftermarket kit takes care of all interior issues I have on any of the vehicle though (except Audi... no need). Leather is of high quality with good feel, plastic has nice feel to it (except center console which is getting changed quickly in my book).
The only reason in my book for TL-S vs G35 would be the straight accelaration they have (about even from what I can deduce at this point) and price range (2-3k difference with similar option).
This is first car that I got I had no remorse or second thought after getting the car at all.
PS) I will be willing to race on track for someone else to put money down... (lmao) Is there good drag track around LA? I don't condone illegal racing myself.
04-08-2002, 03:07 PM
#91
Dr. TLS
Re: WOW!
Originally posted by jinu117
Lots and lots of yelling at each other.
As for the TypeS guy, he seems way too ingrained with the potential of G35. (which I actually own to my hapiness)
As for the 5.9 second 0-60, I seriously have high doubts on that.
The original poster at freshalloy.com had trap speed of 99 mph!!! (which is in league of very low 14sec car). Of course, he did repost saying it was 96mph. (much more reasonable and at the same time making me wonder where the claim comes from)
So, you guys can pretty much forget about the 5.9 sec argument at this point until the hard facts (shakes my head as there is none other than at track which doesn't get 0-60 anyway).
As for some members who disagree on handling characteristic comparison between TL-S and G35... That 13 % that moves toward or rear is very different. (But then, I am the kind of guy who detects difference in handling even if there is single passenger on board) Not to mention FWD vs RWD difference. I don't see how you can say the handling is comparible?
Interior: Purely subjective. I consider TL-S interior to be boring myself. G35 interior to be clean but lacking. BMW 3 series arcane. Only thing that looks good IMO is the Audi. $2-300 investment on aftermarket kit takes care of all interior issues I have on any of the vehicle though (except Audi... no need). Leather is of high quality with good feel, plastic has nice feel to it (except center console which is getting changed quickly in my book).
The only reason in my book for TL-S vs G35 would be the straight accelaration they have (about even from what I can deduce at this point) and price range (2-3k difference with similar option).
This is first car that I got I had no remorse or second thought after getting the car at all.
PS) I will be willing to race on track for someone else to put money down... (lmao) Is there good drag track around LA? I don't condone illegal racing myself.
Lots and lots of yelling at each other.
As for the TypeS guy, he seems way too ingrained with the potential of G35. (which I actually own to my hapiness)
As for the 5.9 second 0-60, I seriously have high doubts on that.
The original poster at freshalloy.com had trap speed of 99 mph!!! (which is in league of very low 14sec car). Of course, he did repost saying it was 96mph. (much more reasonable and at the same time making me wonder where the claim comes from)
So, you guys can pretty much forget about the 5.9 sec argument at this point until the hard facts (shakes my head as there is none other than at track which doesn't get 0-60 anyway).
As for some members who disagree on handling characteristic comparison between TL-S and G35... That 13 % that moves toward or rear is very different. (But then, I am the kind of guy who detects difference in handling even if there is single passenger on board) Not to mention FWD vs RWD difference. I don't see how you can say the handling is comparible?
Interior: Purely subjective. I consider TL-S interior to be boring myself. G35 interior to be clean but lacking. BMW 3 series arcane. Only thing that looks good IMO is the Audi. $2-300 investment on aftermarket kit takes care of all interior issues I have on any of the vehicle though (except Audi... no need). Leather is of high quality with good feel, plastic has nice feel to it (except center console which is getting changed quickly in my book).
The only reason in my book for TL-S vs G35 would be the straight accelaration they have (about even from what I can deduce at this point) and price range (2-3k difference with similar option).
This is first car that I got I had no remorse or second thought after getting the car at all.
PS) I will be willing to race on track for someone else to put money down... (lmao) Is there good drag track around LA? I don't condone illegal racing myself.
04-08-2002, 05:51 PM
#92
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Re: Re: WOW!
Originally posted by vandy786
Why can't TypeSACura be more like this guy? For a while I thought the G35 was attracting the wrong crowd but I guess there are losers in every category. Where are you from Jinu? Let us know so that maybe one of us can run with you and see what's up.
Why can't TypeSACura be more like this guy? For a while I thought the G35 was attracting the wrong crowd but I guess there are losers in every category. Where are you from Jinu? Let us know so that maybe one of us can run with you and see what's up.
FYI, I was die hard fanatic of TL-S until G35 came out (for 2-3 years hasn't it?). Best bang for the buck. It still is if canyon carving is not involved.
04-08-2002, 06:30 PM
#93
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Originally posted by vandy786
Hey, I would love to get behind a G35, especially with my SUV, as long as I receive permission to ram it several times to give it a complete makeover. Who knows? Maybe I will also be able to slap the ugly out of the interior, almost like killing 2 birds with one stone. Catch my drift?
Hey, I would love to get behind a G35, especially with my SUV, as long as I receive permission to ram it several times to give it a complete makeover. Who knows? Maybe I will also be able to slap the ugly out of the interior, almost like killing 2 birds with one stone. Catch my drift?
G35 shares Maxima's ugly butt.... however there is a consensus on the design of the upcoming G35 sport coupe - STUNNING :wow:
04-08-2002, 06:34 PM
#94
Burning Brakes
Sorry to break the consensus, but I don't like the coupe's looks either. As someone already pointed out, it looks like a cross between a Mercury Cougar and the new Z--hardly a marriage made in automotive heaven...
04-09-2002, 11:22 AM
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Originally posted by vandy786
Dang it, I live in Nashville. Someone else (less than 3000+ miles away) has to take you, Jinu. Don't forget to post results if this race ever happens!
Dang it, I live in Nashville. Someone else (less than 3000+ miles away) has to take you, Jinu. Don't forget to post results if this race ever happens!
Gotta give credit where it is due. (either I win or lose). I am not the best dragger in this car at moment (my first 260 HP car) and haven't tried torque breaking yet. (Waiting a little more to get the car ready for punishments only has 2200 miles now). Too bad my cousin who has TL-S is not necessarily in good terms with me at this point. He and I could have tested it out.
04-09-2002, 02:25 PM
#98
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Iceman, do you really think the cls looks better than the G35coupe
2003 infiniti G35coupe
2003 acura cls
Iceman you are either blind or just a plain ignorant fool. Or maybe you live in the ice ages
Muaahaaaha
2003 acura cls
Iceman you are either blind or just a plain ignorant fool. Or maybe you live in the ice ages
Muaahaaaha
04-09-2002, 02:51 PM
#99
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Originally posted by TypeSAcura
Looks like a very extensive comparison/write-up to me. Notice the Infiniti model finished 7th out of 9 cars.
In case you haven't noticed that write up was done last year
No body is argueing that the past generation infiniti i30 is not as good as the tls. we all know that the tls is superior to the i30, so whats you point. The acura is better than the infiniti LAST year whoop dee doo. hey 15 years ago infiniti and acuras didn't even exist and the Cadilac was the shiz.
Today the G35 is king of the entry level luxury.
Looks like a very extensive comparison/write-up to me. Notice the Infiniti model finished 7th out of 9 cars.
In case you haven't noticed that write up was done last year
No body is argueing that the past generation infiniti i30 is not as good as the tls. we all know that the tls is superior to the i30, so whats you point. The acura is better than the infiniti LAST year whoop dee doo. hey 15 years ago infiniti and acuras didn't even exist and the Cadilac was the shiz.
Today the G35 is king of the entry level luxury.
04-09-2002, 03:10 PM
#100
Burning Brakes
Re: Iceman, do you really think the cls looks better than the G35coupe
Originally posted by TypeSAcura
Iceman you are either blind or just a plain ignorant fool. Or maybe you live in the ice ages
Iceman you are either blind or just a plain ignorant fool. Or maybe you live in the ice ages
04-09-2002, 04:09 PM
#103
Burning Brakes
Sorry, I appreciated you actually looking for my input rather than just dismissing it, and then I forgot to answer your question! Here are some coupes on the road today that I like:
- Toyota Supra (now discontinued)
- Honda Prelude (now discontinued)
- Acura Integra (now discontinued)
- Acura CL (but I like the first gen bodystyle better)
- Acura NSX (but I like the pop-up headlights better)
- Mercedes-Benz CLK and CL (both are stunningly beautiful)
I think the recurring theme here is that I like coupes that were designed 5-10 years ago, with their swooping lines and sexy curves. New sporty cars now have lots of angles, harsh edges, and straight lines. I can live with the fact that the population at large likes things aesthetically that I don't, but that doesn't mean I'll keep my opinions to myself!
- Toyota Supra (now discontinued)
- Honda Prelude (now discontinued)
- Acura Integra (now discontinued)
- Acura CL (but I like the first gen bodystyle better)
- Acura NSX (but I like the pop-up headlights better)
- Mercedes-Benz CLK and CL (both are stunningly beautiful)
I think the recurring theme here is that I like coupes that were designed 5-10 years ago, with their swooping lines and sexy curves. New sporty cars now have lots of angles, harsh edges, and straight lines. I can live with the fact that the population at large likes things aesthetically that I don't, but that doesn't mean I'll keep my opinions to myself!
04-10-2002, 12:24 AM
#104
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Iceman,
Why do you avoid the question.
Haaahaa, you were asked if you would rather choose a 2003 G35coupe or a 2003 cl-s.
I know you are a bit mentally impaired but its not a hard question.
U don't answer the question because we all know that answer.
Lets just put it this way the cls will join the prelude and integra as a discontinued model very soon.
Why do you avoid the question.
Haaahaa, you were asked if you would rather choose a 2003 G35coupe or a 2003 cl-s.
I know you are a bit mentally impaired but its not a hard question.
U don't answer the question because we all know that answer.
Lets just put it this way the cls will join the prelude and integra as a discontinued model very soon.
04-10-2002, 08:50 AM
#105
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Iceman
- Toyota Supra (now discontinued) , I Agree
- Honda Prelude (now discontinued) , Somewhat agree, only with an OEM kit on
- Acura Integra (now discontinued) , Only with a kit on
- Acura CL (but I like the first gen bodystyle better) , I DON"T AGREE
- Acura NSX (but I like the pop-up headlights better) , OF COURSE
- Mercedes-Benz CLK and CL (both are stunningly beautiful) , THEY ARE NICE...
I am not trying to flame you or anyone, but I personally think the G35 Coupe is one of the nicest design in terms or cleanniess & sportiness from Japanese Car. It is one of the rarest car that make me luv at first sight. However, this is just me, I guess
- Toyota Supra (now discontinued) , I Agree
- Honda Prelude (now discontinued) , Somewhat agree, only with an OEM kit on
- Acura Integra (now discontinued) , Only with a kit on
- Acura CL (but I like the first gen bodystyle better) , I DON"T AGREE
- Acura NSX (but I like the pop-up headlights better) , OF COURSE
- Mercedes-Benz CLK and CL (both are stunningly beautiful) , THEY ARE NICE...
I am not trying to flame you or anyone, but I personally think the G35 Coupe is one of the nicest design in terms or cleanniess & sportiness from Japanese Car. It is one of the rarest car that make me luv at first sight. However, this is just me, I guess
04-10-2002, 10:27 AM
#106
Burning Brakes
No, it's not just you dchan, there have been quite a few people here who said they like the looks of the G35 coupe. I just have different taste is all. And I agree with you that the Prelude and Integra looked even better with the under-body spoiler kits!
I forgot to mention a coupe of other coupes whose designs I like:
- Mazda RX-7 (last generation only)
- Lexus SC300/400 (not the new 430 convertible)
- Saturn SC (the very first generation only)
I forgot to mention a coupe of other coupes whose designs I like:
- Mazda RX-7 (last generation only)
- Lexus SC300/400 (not the new 430 convertible)
- Saturn SC (the very first generation only)
04-10-2002, 10:37 AM
#107
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Originally posted by Iceman
...
I forgot to mention a coupe of other coupes whose designs I like:
- Mazda RX-7 (last generation only)
...
...
I forgot to mention a coupe of other coupes whose designs I like:
- Mazda RX-7 (last generation only)
...
04-10-2002, 12:01 PM
#108
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Originally posted by Iceman
No, it's not just you dchan, there have been quite a few people here who said they like the looks of the G35 coupe. I just have different taste is all. And I agree with you that the Prelude and Integra looked even better with the under-body spoiler kits!
I forgot to mention a coupe of other coupes whose designs I like:
- Mazda RX-7 (last generation only)
- Lexus SC300/400 (not the new 430 convertible)
- Saturn SC (the very first generation only)
No, it's not just you dchan, there have been quite a few people here who said they like the looks of the G35 coupe. I just have different taste is all. And I agree with you that the Prelude and Integra looked even better with the under-body spoiler kits!
I forgot to mention a coupe of other coupes whose designs I like:
- Mazda RX-7 (last generation only)
- Lexus SC300/400 (not the new 430 convertible)
- Saturn SC (the very first generation only)
I see you still avoiding the question.
2003 G35coupe or 2003 cls
:wow:
04-10-2002, 12:52 PM
#109
Burning Brakes
I won't resort to namecalling, TypeSAcura, but it doesn't take a rocket scientist to put together the fact that I don't like the looks of the G35 and do like the looks of the Acura CL and figure out which one I prefer.
04-13-2002, 05:01 PM
#113
Lead Footed
Thread Starter
Originally posted by thephantom
Nice write up, Ruf. Where have you been?
Nice write up, Ruf. Where have you been?
I'm also still looking for a stock GS400 to run. Some day it'll happen. Other than that I'm looking to catch a G35 to run. As I said, power was smooth, but really didn't feel faster.
As for the trade-rag times, well they are just that. Having personally beaten many cars that are trade-rag faster I don't put any faith in their times. They are just an indication. Besides, 0-60 time mean nothing when you are within 1 second of another car. And 0-60 doesn't mean the car is quicker. One car can hit 60 quick, but still lose the race. Of course there are some who'll never understand that unless they've drag raced enough. Not just some weekender event either.
BTW - watch out for moded S40 Volvos with manuals. They'll give you a hell of a run if you aren't ready for them.
RUF
04-13-2002, 05:16 PM
#114
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Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Misissauga, Ontario
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I really didn't like the styling of the G35 initially. However, I have to say that it's growing on me, big time. I'll have to hit the Infiniti dealer and take one for a test drive. I'm sure they'll be more than happy to convert another Acura driver.
It will be a hard sell though. I still love my TL-S.
It will be a hard sell though. I still love my TL-S.
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