randomwalk101

Gas prices slowly creep up again... and with the TL demands premium only my wallet is getting a toll. Anyone try to pump just the plus or regular on their TL? Does it hurt anything? Just TL, not TL-S.

jr

I never have tried, you could get some knocking/pinging. but i would say it is a

fahoumh

I think you can drive on a fuel with a lesser octane rating w/ reduced performance but I would definitely recommend AGAINST it.

johnnyb_s

Quote:

Anyone try to pump just the plus or regular on their TL?

I did it when I first bought the car not knowing that it required premium...I didn't notice any problems at all actually. However, I did quickly realize that it requires premium and have been using that ever since. You might want to try regualr and see if your performance diminishes any. I upgraded my previous car with a computer chip that said use premium or problems might occur. I eventually went back to regular due to an increase in gas prices. The car ran fine. One other option is to switch between reg. and prem. if you find that your engine isn't knocking and are ok with it.

randomwalk101

Well i really don't give a crap about performance on a TL.. the car is slow as crap (comparing to my last turbo integra gsr which ran 11secs 1/4 mile)...but TL is nice and comfy.

doopstr

What you need to do.

Figure out how much you would spend a week filling up with the good stuff.
Then figure out how much you would spend a week putting in the cheap stuff.

Figure out your yearly savings.
Determine if that savings is worth putting non recommended gas into your $30,000 car.

liutang

I say use the regular if you're concerned with your wallet. There's no difference. And 99% of the time, you're not pushing redline anyway so that "performance hit" is barely noticeable.

randomwalk101

That is what I've been thinking too...even if it knocks (pings), I can always retard timing to compensate for the low octane gas. I'll give it a try.

bloo_tls02

It's around the 1.30's here, and it's supposed hit the roof in the summer.
Man, I only pump 93. The dealer told be that you could get away w/ 92 (if you can find it), but to stick w/ 93.
I let my dad borow the car, when I first got it, and he pumped about 3/4 worth of 91 into it.....I almost had a stroke.

RAdams

100% agreed!

Assuming you buy 15 gallons of gas a week, at a $0.20/gallon difference you'd save a WHOPPING $156/year -- that's $3 a week.

RAdams

How, exactly, do you plan on adjusting the ignition timing? And would all that work (accompanied by the loss of performance you'd experience by retarding the timing) be worth the savings?

my99tl

yeah, you can save even more if you never run the A.C., too.

It will probably save $100 or so, and you can even loose a little weight in the process, saving $300 on a gym membership. This is turning out to be quite a money saving, fuel efficient car.

pianoman41

The computer will do this for you automatically when it detects lower octane fuel. As long as you don't mind the minimal performance hit from running 87 octane, you can save a few $$$. But if saving money was your concern and performance wasn't you should have got yourself a V6 Accord instead. You'd save money up front and you run 87 octane to your heart's content.

acuraTLao

i don't think that it will affect costs too much....but...as long as you can afford it, put in the best gas for your car...i'll keep on putting premium until I get laid off or if I have to start working at mcdonalds.....

but yea..gas prices suck...plus in my state, they're proposing to add more gas taxes on top of the normal price increases....hope it doesn't get up to $2/gallon this summer...but there's always public transportation to get to work.

Bitium

You are exactly right. $3-$4 dollars a pump. The problem is that I put gas an average of 3-4 days. Let's say I do it every 4 days at $3 dollars difference. Minimum of $273.75 a year, up to around $500 a year. Is it still worth the savings probably not and I wouldn't do it, but been unemployed for six months, makes you think about it

Our cars have knock sensors, so it would automatically adjust if you used lower octane. There shouldn't be any problems if you run lower octane. Only lower the performance. That's why acura recomends and not requieres that you used 91 octane or higher.

chuchu

I have read many published articles regarding this undying subject. This is what I finally concluded FOR MYSELF:

Most modern cars(all Acuras and Hondas included) are now equipped with knock sensors that virtually eliminates knocking and pinging when you use fuel that has lesser rating than recommended. This however results in a slight performance loss, which I bet that most people wont even realize under normal driving conditions. If your driving style finds you flooring it often, then you may feel the difference, therefore you may have to live with the added cost of higher octane. However, there is something you can do to help ease the wallet pains and at the same time curtail some of the performance loss. What I do is, during the winter and spring months, I switch to a lower octane fuel (89) because the cooler ambient temperature helps avoid the pre-ignition that causes performance loss. Lower octane fuel is more susceptible to pre-ignition especially in higher ambient temperature. And it is for this reason that I switch back to higher octane when the temperature starts to rise, like summer and fall.
Remember, you car is equipped with knock sensors so switching back anf forth once or twice a year should pose no problems. Its not going to save you a whole lot but it also keeps you from burning money you dont need to burn.

tdoh

I guess then that us Cali TL/TL-S owners are getting screwed from using the 91 octane gas we have over here...

On a somewhat more serious note--is that true for all TL/TL-S sold in the U.S., or perhaps just for non-CA ones (is there still such a distinction?)? I ask because IIRC (I could be wrong here) my manual says minumum 91 for optimum performance; plus, most premium gas sold here in CA is currently 91 pump octane. I don't think Acura dealers here in CA would be saying the same thing your dealer is claiming (getting away with using 92 instead of 93)...

Guess you probably won't ever drive your car in CA, eh?

Tony

bkasisch

[QUOTE]Originally posted by tdoh


Is that true for all TL/TL-S sold in the U.S., or perhaps just for non-CA ones (is there still such a distinction?)? I ask because IIRC (I could be wrong here) my manual says minumum 91 for optimum performance; plus, most premium gas sold here in CA is currently 91 pump octane. I don't think Acura dealers here in CA would be saying the same thing your dealer is claiming (getting away with using 92 instead of 93)...

Guess you probably won't ever drive your car in CA, eh?

Tony [/QUOTE


When VTEC engines first came out, Road and Track had a technical analysis on it. One of the things they pointed out was VTEC requires a very sophisticated Engine Management System (EMS). One of the side benefits of the EMS was to be able to detect the pinging and adjust the engine to prevent this. Therefore you can burn pretty much any octane you want.

Obviously the downside is you will not get the same performance out of 87 octane than you will from 93.

In general your average Car Dealer/salesperson is not an automotive engineer. (99% of them know less about cars than the average reader of this forum). The dealer/salesperson will tell you the safe thing.

Remember we live in a country where people will sue you for anything . Therefore your Dealer/Salesmen will tell you the thing the won't get him in (legal) trouble later on. Saying you have to use 93 octane won't get him in trouble. Telling a customer he can use low octane gas could get the dealer/salesman in trouble.

You know the scenario, customer goes to Jify-Quik Lube to get oil changed. Mechanic doesn't tighten drain plug and it falls out. Customer then drives around with no oil in engine and engine siezes up. Customer tries to sue Jify-Quik Lube to get car fixed but they just went out of business. So customer now sues Dealer/Acura and says EMS broke first because it was overworked adjusting the engine for low octane causing the engine to use all the oil up. And this was all because the dealer said he could use low octane gas.

payyourtoll

How does an EMS make these adjustments ? Air/fuel mixture ? And what would tell the sensor that the engine is pinging ?

neuronbob

My TL-P's manual says the we can use regular gas but with a "reduction in performance". That said, I've never pumped anything but 93 octane in the car, though (it's running $1.35 at my local BP/Amoco station). I used to think that if you can afford to buy/lease a $30k car, spending money on the recommended fuel is just part of the cost of ownership. I have to admit, though, that if I were unemployed for some amount of time, I'd have to reconsider using premium to save money, even though the cost per year for me would be around $170 (I tend to flll up from a dry tank). That doesn't look like much for me now, but again with unemployment ANY cost savings is a good thing.

tdoh

Agreed, but saying that said car owner needs to use minimum 91 octane for best performance shouldn't get the dealer in trouble either. What I'm getting at is that at least in the case of octane requirements, it's much safer to state the minimum allowable threshhold rather than offer some arbitrary but specific figure that is known to be valid.

Tony

bkasisch

Engine Knock (or Pinging) begins in the combustion chamber. There are other causes (such as your spark plugs fire too early) but in this case when the fuel octane rating is too low, the fuel doesn't burn gradually -- it detonates all at once. This explosion sends out violent shock waves that vibrate the entire engine.

Therefore there are vibration sensors on your engine block that sense the vibrations.

The simplest solution is to retard the spark (which the EMS can easily do)

- pw wannabe -

bkasisch

You are right. But you expect a car salesperson to be able to know that there are two types of premium available??

haha hahaha ahahahahahahahaha

Personally, I'd be surprised if the California saleperson even knew what the octane of premium was.

- pw wannabe -

johnnyb_s

So in summation, use whatever octane you want. I put in 87 once again because 93 was around $1.50 and I had no noticeable problems. Also take note that the owner's manual RECOMMENDS 92 or higher, but doesn't REQUIRE it.

Squidboy

91 is the best we can get here in Colorado too.

The manual does say that 91 is the minimum we should put in our cars.

jkc2121

damn gas prices are starting to climb down here in florida too. grr.

Outlook

Go to Sams club, its Premium gas is 18 cents cheaper than anybody out there :wow: ...

99LagunaTL

I wish our local Costco had gas here. It's already up to $1.50 and it's not even April yet . Looks like it'll hit $2 by summer.

Will all of this gas talk, how about mig-grade as a compromise for those looking to save a few bucks?

TommyBoiSxty9

its like what $1 or $2 more per tank.. its not that big a deal

Outlook

Well, if at Sams today its $1.16, and every else its about $1.44, with a difference of about 28 cents, then the difference per tank is a little higher, almost 4 bucks a tank. $4.00 times 4 times a month is about $16.00 which comes out to about a FREE tank of gas a month, woo hoo!! :wow:

smoothnyc

well im picking up my 03 Tls w/navi on Friday and i still have my crappy 97 Mazda Millenia... i had it almost 4 years now and from day 1 i put 93 octane... i figure if u love yah car pay the $1 extra for the premium gas... chit u just bout a $ 30,000+ car whats a $1

smoothnyc

midrange gas 89-91 octane is usaully only 7 cents difference anyway ..prob less

SwampGas

When gas was really expensive last year, I put in regular 87 octane...

Since I'm not a hardcore car fanatic, I wouldn't be able to notice a performance difference...but I did notice the mileage on the tank dropped from 350-400 miles per tank to barely 200.