optimus prime

I have a problem and I need some advice as soon as possible.

The car is 3 months old with 7500 miles (yes, I commute) and has not riden the same for the last 500 miles. The car is now hesitating and sluggish when I push the gas. At 70 miles per hour, the RPMs are 2000 instead of the 1500-1800 it was in the begining. Also, when I am at a stop or braking to a stop, the car will surge while I am holding the brake. This is getting a little dangerous since today, the car lurched toward the car in front of me while stoped at a light. The engine is warm so I have ruled out cold engine problems.

Could this be related to that crap 91 octane gas we now have in California?

Can anyone help? Thanks in advance.

optimus prime

I forgot to mention it is a 2002 WDP TL-S w/ Nav.

Austin519

Although this is a totally out there thing...at least on my four wheelers and similar...it sounds like the governor is too high...thus giving too much gas at idle...try taking it in for them to adjust it....

Austin519

daverman

The surges when you're braking could be the A/C compressor kicking in. The computer raises the engine rev right when the A/C compressor comes on to compensate for the higher load, and it sometimes causes the car to slightly lurch forward. If this is what you're feeling, just press on the brake pedal a little harder next time.

As far as the hesitation and sluggishness, it could be a dirty fuel injector; what gas are you using? Make sure you use gasoline with a good detergent additive to make sure your pipes are clean.

And finally, there could really be something broken with the car. Take it to the dealer's and take one of them on a ride, and don't take "it's normal" for an answer!

Road Rage

I smell dirty fuel filter - is it possible you bought a contaminated tank of fuel somewhere?

mikegunnz

A dirty fuel filter and fuel injector are unlikely considering the age/mileage of the car.
...But I guess anythings possible.

bricot

To add to Davermans reply, the air conditioner compressor kicks in periodically even if the system is heating, probably to get rid of moisture. The first time it did it to me in heat mode I thought that the air compressor theory was blown. 5 seconds later I realized why it was kicking on...

As for the fuel filter, at least it is an inexpensive (at least I hope) item to change.

QuickRick

OP--Mine does this too and I complained while in for other things and they told me that indeed , at least the surge at a stop, was due to the idle speed compensation for A/C. I will buy this as many others here said that their cars do it but my 10 year old car and none of my "poor quality domestic" cars do this. Go figure!

nameeri

Hmm.... This sounds like what some others on this forum described as the beginning of their transmission problems. I hope that it isnt, maybe a check in to the dealer will tell.

DallasTypeS

don't touch the gas when your sitting at a light

I haven't experience that as of yet...does sound like a bad tank of gas...its what my lawnmower does if I don't empty the tank before winter then fire her up in the spring...she runs real high...

T Ho

You must have misinterpreted the readings before. The transmission gearing and final drive ratio are such that you should be spinning just above 2000 at 70mph. Perhaps your speedo wasn't working right before?
On my car 1500rpm is just above 50mph in 5th with the torque converter locked.
The surge, provided it's a small one, is due to the AC compressor kicking on. The ECU kicks the Idle Air control motor open a bit, to compensate for the extra engine load of the compressor. Virtually all cars within the last 10 years work like this. The timing of the event on the TL-S could use a little improvement, though.
The sluggishness could be the 91 octane thing. At 10.5:1 compression, 91 octane is at the very edge of acceptability for the engine. Luckily, here in FL, premium is 93, so I don't have to worry (especially now that I only pay $1.07/gal). Try a different brand next time, and see if that helps.

Todd

ymckoon

Yeah, I used to believe that gas is gas, but I don't anymore.

In my other car, i used to buy variety of gas. Arco, Chevron, Rotten Robbie...whatevers. Well on a few occasions, the cheap gas places and Arco gave me bad tanks of gas, and if I put 76 or Chevron or something, it would run better.

All I know is I don't put cheap gas no more.

fla-tls

The difference between your 1500-1800 RPM and the current 2000 RPM at 70 could be due to the torque converter not locking up. If the car is surging while you're driving at 70, due to bad gas, dirty fuel filter, etc., the computer may not lockup up the torque converter. It would do the same thing if you manually created "surges" with your gas pedal at 70 - no lockup.

You may want to wait until you get more/different gas in it, but if that doesn't solve it (or it's been lasting several tanks already, or it gets too bad) just take it to the dealership and let them worry about it.

P.S. I have the same color/options (GOOD CHOICE!)

systek

yeh, the surging at idle is the ac compressor...im surprised this car actually moves if your not prepared for it or pressing the brakes hard enough...plus this means the car has enough power to make it move when the idle is turned up...while lesser cars simply stay put and of course are even more sluggish if it happens when ur driving...ya'll know what i mean

y2ks2k

Ignore everything any one has told you on this subject.

What you should have done for the beginning is take the car to get it serviced. Who cars what the base problem is to begin with. Let the service department fix it and dunna worry about it.

systek

y2ks2k

Speaking of dumb... Since when is the State of Washington in the country of Canada????

You think is Dumb to take all and any problems with a new TLs to the dealer to get it fixed?... Me thinks your the one missing some marbles smart a$$.

TUFF GONG

LOL...Oops, he put his foot in his mouth on that one, too funny

Maybe he thought Wa stood for "Way Above".

optimus prime

Whoa, Whoa.

No fighting.

I thank everyone for the responses. I, in fact, turned the A/C off and that has corrected the surging problem. Who knew the default setting was on.

As far as the sluggishness goes, I use Shell and Chevron (sometimes 76) gasoline. Bad tanks of gas don't discriminate between resellers sothat could be the problem.

Does anyone know if running a fuel injector cleaner would be detrimental at this stage? Does anyone recommend a brand?

TUFF GONG

I have had many success with a fuel injector cleaner made by Chevron, called Techron. It comes in a black bottle.

I don't think it's detrimental to use these, I just don't use it too often. Just when I feel I need it, on my previous cars. Haven't used it on my TL-S yet, it only has 5000miles

I always tended to use it right before a oil change. In fear of having some of the cleaning chemicals mixed with the oil(yes I'm anal ) Really nothing to worry abouit I suppose.

systek

that is what i thought...and i meant to say, GO TO CANADA AND STAY THERE...

ur close enough to be canucks...so why not just walk on over and not come back...???

fla-tls

There was an article in either Car & Driver or Motor Trend a few years ago that dealt with this very topic. Unfortunately, I was unable to find it or provide a link to an online copy for you. So, this is all from memory... The results ended up that fuel system cleaners with Techron in them did in fact do the best job at cleaning the entire fuel system (from injectors to combustion chambers and everything in-between).

However, a lot of people don't know that although Chevron invented and manufactures the additive, a lot of other companies put it in their products as well. STP manufactures a fuel system cleaner that comes in a silver bottle with the STP embossed in the plastic (I think the name is Complete - or something like that). That STP product contains more of the Techron additive than the Chevron product. A quick measure and something to always look at is the amount of fuel the bottle will treat. The Chevron bottle is around 16 ounces, but will only treat 12 gallons I believe. The STP bottle is similar in volume, but will treat 20 gallons. Forgive me if I'm off a little, again, all from memory.

Anyway, I have used the STP product on every car I've owned since I read that article and highly recommend it. FYI: I believe the bottle states that you should NOT use it more frequetly than every 4,000 miles though. I use it every other oil change.