Big Ped

For the thrid time I've posted that my city milege is insane. I'm up to 2800 miles on my TLS. My highway miles are 30-31MPGs on average. However my City MPGs are 13 to 16 MPGs on average and the last time I measured milege I travelled 154.1 miles annd it took 13.06 galons to fill the tank. That works out to be an incredible 11.8 MPG. That is crazy and gets me very upset. I have now gone through half a tank and total miles now are 89. so most likely I'll get something like 180miles for a ful tank.

I have given up waitinng to break my engine in. I will now look to see what I can possibly do to increase my MPGs. I know that if I take the car back to thhe dealer, they are going to say that there is noothing wrong with the car and they will probably keep it for several days. I took my car in for repairs many times already and I hate dealing with those people. I'm going nutts over this. 12mpgs is Lincoln Navigator milege, this is crasy.

I know many of you use special spark plugs and other things to increase performance and fuel consuption, can you guys please help me and let me know what could possibly be the problem and what gadgets or things you used to increase performace and decrease fuel consumptiion. Thanks, I'm getting desperate about this. Help Help Help Please.

imax

According to most who post on this subject we are the minority. Everyone else gets fantastic gas mileage

The only thing I think that can be done is to perhaps try a synthetic oil in order to eek out that last 1/10 of an mpg. But the increased cost of the synthetic oil will probably eat up the small amount of $$$ gas savings.

I will never "baby" the car to increase my mpg; why have it if I do that?

Highway mpg decent; city mpg SUCKS big time!

SteVTEC

first off your car isn't fully broken in yet. Your milege probably won't peak out until you get to around 10,000 or so.

I have the same crappy city mileage problem on my Accord V6, though. I've gotten as low as 11 mpg, but I tend to have a VERY VERY heavy foot!

One thing that should help you is Denso Iridium spark plugs. I'm not sure on how much they help you guys, but we see some very decent low-end torque gains on the Accord V6 and rather large improvements in city mileage as well - because of more efficient combustion from the plugs. So you might give a set of these guys a try.

If you drive a Navigator just as hard then I can guarantee you that that thing will be down in the single-digits for city mileage.

If you're not driving hard at all and you're still getting crappy mileage then take the car into the dealership because there very well could be something wrong with it.

ucla107

few questions for ya
- what kinda gas do you buy?
- how do you calculate your mileage?
- how do you drive?
- what do you have in your trunk? hehe but that has to do with gas mileage

i'm at 2800miles on my car too.. for city driving i average 18-21mpg

for highway driving i've gotten 25mpg

Big Ped

UCLA, these are my responses. 1) Gas is 93 octane, 2) I calculate milage by filing the tank all the way to the top. Resseting the counter then traveling till I feel like it, usually close to an empty tank and refilling the tank to the top again. I then devide the distance traveled by the amount of gas I put in.

3) I would say I drive moderately. I sometimes drive hard and sometimes I don't. I don't let the rpms pass 4,000 most of the time.

4) I only have rags in my trunk. And I've never gotten 18mpgs in the city. The most has been 16 and that was with like 60-70% highway. I've gotten 31mpgs on the highway though.

ASU - TLS

Try changing your oil.

My dealer put in the wrong oil and the gas milage dropped about 3-4 mpg.

get 5-20 oil.

Guest

Just finished my first tank and I've been taking it real easy on the car (want to break it in properly). I averaged 17 mpg, almost all city and canyon driving. Not too impressive, but I suspect the mileage will improve.

imax

I love all the guys who ask "how do you calculate yoour gas mileage"? As if everyone who is posting about poor gas mileage ain't got a clue how to that; duhhhhh. The car, for now, gets sh _ tty gas mileage; period! :o

I have 2100 miles on it after a few more, well we'll see . . .

amcl

Whoohoo! I don't feel so alone anymore. I get 12 - 14mpg in city driving. It really sucks cuz i took it to the dealer and they didn't help a bit. It's weird cuz when i got the car, it got about 19-20mpg for city driving but it gradually decreased to 12-14mpg. I'm starting to think that the oil has gone bad or there are engine deposits or something. Btw, turtling the car didn't help my mpg's.

I think it may be the a/c too. Cuz here in southern california, i blast my climate control to 65-72. I think the real test will be in the winter when i get to turn off the a/c!

amcl

ucla107

welp i got a first oil change at 1000 miles so i wonder if that helped it or not.... might wanna consider that cuz it only cost $20 (and I got mine free at the dealer) =P

Big Ped

amcl I have gotten bad city milege since I got the car. On the first full tank, I got only 160 miles. Since then I've gotten a little better but not by much. Additionally, I try to keep the AC off most of the time and substitute it by oppeneing all the windows and the moonroof. I don't use the AC to see if it makes a difference in milege. The results, milege is equaly bad in both cases. Milege is just bad period. And I don't want to take it to the dealer because they are going to give me the same response they gave you. My dealer is like 40 miles away from my house and for every little thing i have to set up an appointment and when I get there they say that they are very busy and that I have to leave the car for a few days. Then they give mi a tinny winny Integra which feels like it has 1.5 horses compared to the TLS. Plus I don't trust anybody, they could easily say that they checked the car thoroughly, and not do sh1t. Then I have to take a trip back up to pick up my car and take hours away from work, which are worth a lot of money.


Has anyone been able to remedy this situation. What did you do: changed the oild, spark plugs, waited till a certain milege or something. Just anything that will give me hope. Help please.

ucla107

see if you have gotten 31mpg on highway then it sounds totally normal...

and yet there are different types of local....

you can go 5 miles in a residential area with a stop sign at every intersection... or you can go 5 miles on a big street with only a stop light every 1/2 mile or so.....

it really depends on your route... if you keep it between 3000-4000 rpm and drive streets with LOTS of stop signs then 15mpg sounds about right...

i usually keep it around 2500-3000 rpm when i start from a complete stop... the car has sufficient power even at that low rpm... maybe try that and see if i'll improve it by a little...

and you can always use SS to shift it whenever you want to, rather then letting the auto tranny shift for you

Big Ped

I've tried going real easy too and it only inproves milege by a bit. Anyway, 3,000-4000 rpms for a machine like this one should be normal and if not 19mpg, then 17 or 18 not 12 or 13. That is insane. Plus i'm putting in 93 octane, which should be able to make up for the extra rpms. Why is it that this only happens to a small number of us and everybody else gets great milege. There must be something.

heymista

I have 1700 miles now. On my first tank I got 17mpg. My second tank got me 20mpg. My third tank was 70% highway and I got 24mpg. Since then I have been around 20-21 on 75% city driving. I'm hoping it will improve after I get my first oil change and switch to synthetic oil.

rockinTLS

Although I do usually work on my own cars I don't consider myself an expert. I also realize you guys have probably checked with the dealer. However, there should be tests & checks they can do on the oxygen sensors (monitor air/fuel ratio) and various parts of the fuel injection system to make sure there are no defective parts that the computer may not be checking to display an error code.

Have you guys tried resetting the ECU to see if that helps?

Sorry, I wish I had an answer.

SC TL

I've had my TL since the beginning of March, I have around 3800 miles total, I do mostly city driving, and I get crappy mileage too, but it seems to be getting better.

It seems to me that our engines are actually guzzlers, and only get ULEV/LEV designation because our gears 4-5 are both overdriven and very long, which makes up for our punchy gears 1-3.

I read Oblio's post re his great mileage (30+ mpg), and noticed that he bought his TL-S in mid-March and has over 12,000 miles on it already. That means that he must be spending a lot of time in gear 5. I've been spending most of my time in gears 1-3, hence my bad mileage.

However, like I said my mileage seems to be improving (220-230 per tank, up from 190-200) as I rack up more miles on my engine. Plus, I just got my first oil change last week which I hope will improve my mileage. However, if you live in gears 1-3, I wouldn't expect much more the 15-17 mpg.

Big Ped

SC TL that makes a lot of sence. That would explain why I get great highway milege (31MPGs) and such horrible city milege (12-16). However, many TLS owners are reporting great city gas milege, and from what I have noted, some of them live in big cities lime miself (NYC), such as LA, Chicago, etc. They must use gears 1-2-3 a lot as well. Plus I heard of guys who are constantly on VTEC, who still get OK milege (17-20MPGs) .

This is a mistery and we should get to the bottom of it. If we put our resources together and get feedback from as many people as possible, maybe we can come to a conclusion and put an end to these types of inquiries. Additionally, if we can figure this out, We can then be able to adress future TL owner's questions and show them how to cope. This milege questions have been posted time and time again. I for one, have inquired about this three times . For now, please continue to make your contributions. Thank you all for your attention to this matter.

yee

are you using SS when driving in the city? if so...try using D4 and see if it does any good...I'm using it and it's better than D5 and since you drive from 1-3 most of the time...you might even go ahead and try D3...it might give you better mileage.

SS are gas suckers, that's why they've discontinued it on the GS430

Big Ped

Based on what SC TL stated above, I thing the higher gears are the good ones, case they keep RPMs down to like 2,000. Using D4 or D3, I'm gessing would keep my RPMs a little higher and gussling more fuel. I may be wrong, but I'll give your suggestion a try. Thanks.

SteVTEC

Depending on where you all live, you might be using different fuel formulations. I read from someone that there is something like 13 different fuel formulations based on what region you're in - and I'm talking about the oxygenated fuels.

If you have to put oxygenated fuel in your car then your mileage is gonna suck. This fuel supposedly will help older crappy cars run a little cleaner, but the side effect is that 99% of cars out there that do NOT need this fuel end up just burning tons more fuel and the net result is MORE EMISSIONS!!! hahaha :p

Anyways, my Accord V6 in southern MD is rated for 20/28. The best I ever got stock was 27 mpg hwy, but of course that's driving at 75-80 mph too. City I've gotten as low as 11 mpg (driving like a bat out of hell) but lately it's been much better (b/c of mods) and I usually manage to get 25-26 mpg in mixed driving.

I'm not sure if I'm running oxygenated fuels or not. I thought gas stations were supposed to put stickers on the pump that say that if you are (I remember seeing some once) but I haven't seen any lately.

Anyways, if you're forced to use oxygenated fuels then that will make a pretty big hit on your fuel mileage, and could possibly explain the wide variances in fuel mileage that you're seeing.

Also, altitude will make a big difference too, along with average temp, and most of all - driving style and speed. There are so many factors, but fuel formulation is one of those...

yee

the thing is that in city, I don't know why, but my engine runs smoother if I keep it in D4.

also, a very tiny adv for using D4 in city is that between stops, your auto box have one less gear to change, which means that it should last longer.

I have the above concept for a long time, please correct me if I'm wrong.

Silver Panther

When 260 horsee's gather around a pond they don't sip my friend, they gulp! Also depends of how hard you ride'em pard... Take heart, the gas mileage gets better through about 5,000 miles but it's only great if you drive it like a blue hair in the left lane on Monday morning!

amcl

My dealer used a "dyno" on my tls and said that fuel consumption was perfect. I suppose if the oxygen sensors are bad, it would show. Maybe our gas tanks are leaking? hehe who knows. What's funny, tho, is that with 50% highway driving, i get about 21mpg.

BTW, what's a PGM tester? It says that on my service slip:

"Customer states that vehicle is getting 12 miles to the gallon... (Check & Advise)...

Cause: Emissions OK..

amcl

amcl

Arghhh i pressed tab and enter...

To continue what's on my service slip:

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Customer states that vehicle is getting 12 miles to the gallon...
(Check & Advise)...

Cause: Emissions OK..
123505 Codes operating data - Retrieve or clear
Codes with PGM tester. Access system
Operating data with PGM tester.
258 W93
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

amcl

lonny

Most of my driving is freeway and I can go about 350 miles before having to fill up.

Lrpba300

I've been reading about this subject on several posts, & I want to know if any of this helps, b/c I want to buy a TL-S & don't want to get that low of mileage. Anyway, some other things to check out....low level tranny fluid(will effect city driving/shifting alot)...a dragging brake(s). This may have to be checked by the dealer or brake specialist. The only other thing, was the ECU. Someone here said about resetting? Defective ones out there?? I do know how hard ya push it, & I felt my Tl didn't "break in" till around about 8,500 miles? Hope some of this helps

californiacat28

I've got no idea what's going on with your mileage but I drive city ALL the time and get an average of 300-320 miles per tank. One time I went to San Diego from OC and got 415 miles in that tank!

I love my car!!! It's completely stock and has 8,100 miles on it right now.

Make sure your tires are always inflated at the proper PSI and if you drive your car hard then your mileage will totally suck the big one. Another thing too....if you crank your AC all the time that will make a big difference.

calcat

amcl

What's a dragging brake? Anyway i can detect it?

amcl

californiacat28

A "dragging brake" might be an emergency-brake that needs to get adjusted? Maybe it's misaligned or something? I don't know? What is it Lrpba300?

calcat

rockinTLS

It basically means that one or more of your brakes are not fully released when you release the brake pedal. It could either be your emergency brake is not adjusted properly so that the brake pad is rubbing on the rotor when the car is in motion or that you have a brake caliper that is not retracting fully when the brake pedal is released and again, causing a brake pad to rub the rotor while the car is in motion.

Unless it is really serious it's a hard one to diagnose without taking the brakes apart and checking the calipers or driving the car for quite awhile and seeing if one brake pad wears faster than the others.

-----

A "PGM tester" is basically the computer they plug into the the car's computer to check for error codes. Apparently, your emissions system checked out OK. This means that the computer thinks (and it is probably right) that all of the sensors (including Oxygen Sensors) related to your emissions equipment do not show an error code.

I don't know the details of the codes you list. One of the the other members with a Helm manual might be able to help there.

A side thought...
I wonder what a real world vehicle emissions test would show with actual HC and O2 numbers at cruise? This would be interesting. I know none of our TL-S' have likely had that done yet, but what about the CL-S crowd?

Big Ped

How long would it take for my car to be tested for emmissions and milege, breaks and all that at the dealer and would they do this for free. Does the warranty cover these services, because otherwise I would suspect that these are pretty pricey procedures.

rockinTLS

All of these items, if there really is a problem, are covered by warranty. It would be difficult to request that they check all these things specifically but depending upon your relationship with the dealer it might be possible. What I mean is: You don't want to tell them how to do their job if you want further cooperation.

AMCL took his car to the dealer to try and resolve the 12MPG issue. That's how he got the print out above. They didn't fix the problem but at least they plugged in to the computer and took a look for error codes. That's one step. If they don't find anything as with AMCL, you can either accept it or keep insisting they find the real problem. This is where any of the above possibilities come in.

As with any negotiation it's all in how you appoach it and how or if the dealer or Acura will accept responsibility. Although the mileage you are getting is unacceptable in my book, I'm not sure on how much responsibility Acura has to repair/resolve the problem.

As far as cost goes, they really only involve labor. The dealer can write this off against warranty.

Big Ped

Is it possible that I can take my car into anothr dealer to have these thhings checked. My dealer is very small and has a mediocre service department. I wouldn't trust them with the checkup. Will the warranty still cover it?

rockinTLS

Yes

ALFAV6

it doesnt matter which dealer you take it to fix as long as its Acura, atleast thats what i think... I use to bring mine to Nostrand Acura but i kind of dont like their service so now i go to Rallye Acura.... Rallye isnt bad.... i also got to test drive the RSX when i was there last time

Big Ped

If that's the case, then I'll take the car to one of the bigger dealers, like Ralley with expert technicians and have then take a look. I hope they can find a problem and then fix it. Because otherwise, i'm stuck with 12MPG milege till I make modifications to the car. And I don't know when that'll be. When I considered the competion, i thought that the TLS was a lot better because it provided the most power and bang without compromising milege. If the dealer can't find a problem, them I guess I'll live with the fact that I just jhave more power. And when I see an ES, GS 300, I30 and a 325, I'll take off at the start or something to show them how much more power I have. Damn, I'm starting to sound like a hater. Ahhh, it'll go away I'm just a little disapoointed. This purchase put a big dent on my bank account and it hurts me that everything isn't perfect.

Check out this estimat:
at and average of 17MPGs including all of highway driving per year and 15,000 miles for the year. (most of my driving is in the city about 80%)

15,000 miles / 17MPGs = 882.36 galons a year
882.36 galons times and average price of $1.80 P/G = $1,588.24 a year, just in gas. This is just an estimate, but I could certanly use that money for Mods instead.

It would be a lot better average milege was more like 23 or 24 mpgs. The figure would change to somting like $1,125 a year.

amcl

I was thinking... if my brakes are dragging, would the car be aligned? My car has pretty much perfect alignment.

I've also tested if there was any hesitation when letting go of the brakes and just allowing the idle to move the car and in my opinion there doesn't seem to be any hindrance.

amcl

imax

I tried D4 for awhile, no difference.

Lrpba300

It can be where the brake pad is "pushed" by the caliper towards the brake rotor, & doesn't "release" correctly, causing the brake to "drag". Also the emergency brake can "drag".Also saw someone point out about tire inflation, GOOD POINT!

yee

have you checked from dealer what type of oil you're using?
cuz I read from a different topic (5W-20 at last!) that his car got better mileage as soon as he change it to 5W-20...his dealer didn't have it and gave him somin else.