FlyingPig

got dyno result?

Closer

I have a comptech filter and headers.
I'll try to get a dyno this week.
Here's a dyno from a CL-S.

allanc45

um....how can that be a CL-S. Stock 200hp? Modified 225hp? AH....I see it now! Acura has been lying to all of us Type-S owners! Everyone...return your cars, and go buy those Kia's you've always wanted!

So...anyone have some accurate dyno's for a modified Type-S and not the regular CL or TL?

FlyingPig

Thanks, so you gained about 30 HP for the combination of comptech CAI and Headers.
I didn't know comptech make CAI for CL-S.
How much is that?

Bitium

Well, Acura and any other manufacturer never display their actual horsepower at the wheels. They do dyno's at the flywheel. That's the horsepower they use for marketing. I heard that the wheels get 20% to 30% less horsepower than the flywheel.

Deniska

Now that's pretty significant! Look at the chart people, both the HP and Torque bands are consistently and significantly above stock. I especially like the torque band in this chart.

Closer, can you post any more detailed on what you have on your car? Anything besides the comptech filter and headers? How much did that run you?

Also, have you run any 0-60 or 1/4 or slalom times after mods yet? Would be interesting to see.


------------------
1998 BMW ///M3
TL-S soon, very soon

juniorbean

iTrader: (5)

I'm sorry but this post cracked me up!!
Acura's (and all cars sold in the US) 260hp rating is at the flywheel, dyno's are done at the drive wheels. If you figure in 25% loss in the drivetrain that's around 195hp at the wheel for a stock CL-S. You may want to read up on this stuff before you post like that.

Those figures from the dyno are accurate and should be pretty close to what the TL-S would produce with the same mods. Since weight wouldn't be a factor, just engine and drivetrain, I would think they could even be identical....




------------------
1998 Acura CL 3.0 (Iced Blue) ** Some mods, but who cares,
I want a Type-S... (CL or TL)!!

Moderator - 1st Gen Forum @ www.acura-cl.com

FlyingPig

The guy didn't know, give him a break, will ya?

Closer

FYI:
This isn't my dyno, it's a CL-S with just Comptech Headers. The CAI is supposed to add a few more horses for a lot of sound. But, this graph doesn't show it.

My setup is the comptech filter in stock airbox and comptech headers (about $1300 installed). I didn't want any extra noise, so I didn't get the cai.

This car stock has 198hp at the wheels (assuming 260 at the crank). Thats a 24% loss. So after headers 228/76*100 = 300hp at the crank and a much nicer torque curve. 40hp for 1300 dollars, that's pretty decent.

tinman

Thought I might post on this subject since we've got the same engines... I'm not quite sold on the headers/CAI setup at the moment: We had a mini-meet for CL-S's over the weekend here in Phoenix and afterwards, the group of us went to an open street in an industrial area for a little "testing". My CL-S is stock (except for removal of the resonator below the air filter and H&R OE springs). The CL-S I ran against had Comptech headers and an AEM CAI (along w/ CT spring & sways).

In our jaunts to roughly 70-75 mph or so, we were pretty much head-to-head the whole way. On one of the three runs he pulled maybe a car-length on me. We were all really surprised as to how little the win margin was for the headers/CAI setup. I know that if we had more run room, he would've pulled further on me but based on the extra sound from the CAI and cost of the headers, I'm not 100% convinced they are worth it yet (just my opinion though). He even raced a CL-P that was there and won by maybe two car lengths. All of us had previously seen the dyno results posted above which is why we were baffled: real-world didn't show that great of benefit. This by no means is scientific proof but it was an eye-opener for all of us there.

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1" FACE="Verdana, Arial">[This message has been edited by tinman on May 02, 2001 @ ]</font>

AKRY

I thought ALL manufacturers post flywheel HP/Torque in their brochures???

Andy Kuo

------------------
'92 Mercedes-Benz 400SE
Pearl Grey/Black

'02 Acura TL-S
Satin Silver/Ebony, w/out NAV

Mercedes-Benz S-Class

juniorbean

iTrader: (5)

They do. Every car sold in the US is rated at the flywheel......

FlyingPig

$1400 for headers (installed) isn't cheap, but it's really not a lot of money. If I can spend $2000 on a NAV that's not worth anything just for fun, I shouldn't be complaining about $1400 for headers.
However, I don't want any more noise than it already produces. I heard most CAI don't contribute to more noise until you hit 4000+rpm. During normal driving, that barely happens, and it would be acceptable. I just want someone to confirm that.

Also, Closer, are you suggesting that Headers alone would get you 30-40HP, and CAI may add another say 5-10HP?

allanc45

Sigh, normally wouldn't feel compelled to respond, but it seems as if my initial post was somewhat misunderstood. I did not know that it was the "standard" to measure hp at the flywheel vs. at the wheels or whatever (hence the Kia joke), however the part about the "accurate dyno" was referring to the fact that Closer said that the dyno he posted was not of his own car, but someone else's. Sure, I saw the "CL Type-S" part in the pic, so I wasn't assuming someone just made up a dyno with a crayon . The "not a regular CL or TL" comment was in regards to Comptech's website, which only has dyno's for the regular TL (for the headers+exhaust) in the TL section. However, tonight I just happened to check the CL section, and there is a dyno there for a CL-S with the Comptech headers (doesn't say anything about whether it includes the exhaust or anything else). Enjoy:
http://www.comptechusa.com/images/dyno/2000CLSplot.pdf

juniorbean

iTrader: (5)

Obviously he didn't know, but he seemed so confident that he was correct. So much so that he basically was calling Closer's information incorrect and disregarded it as an inaccurate dyno.... not necessary in my opinion....

EricL

The dyno graph above is from Mike (a "Mega Moderator) on the acura-cl.com forum. The AEM CAI makes another 8-10HP. Here is the most current dyno with:

Comptech headers
AEM CAI intake



BTW -- there is some debate about the amount of loss from the flyweel to the front wheels. Some say its 20% and some say its 23%. It can get a bit "dangerous" taking the 260HP (at the flywheel as gospel) vs. the front wheel result. All of the cars and dynos are slightly different. So, the HP loss is somewhere between 20% and 23%.

(just my opinions...)

tinman

Hey Eric!

(Guess I'm not the only one straying from the CL board ) Now that you've got the goodies installed (specifically headers & intake), are the gains what you were expecting? I know you're going to feel "more" power in higher RPMS's but does it "feel" like you've increased power by nearly 20% (38hp)? I want to hope that Gold's CL-S just needed his headers retorqued or some other minor tuning but we were all surprised how little difference they apparently made. I want to get them myself but I'm having second thoughts now. We can look at dyno charts all day but real-world results count for more IMO. What's your opinion on the mods?

EricL

I actually got more boost out of the lightweight SSR Comp wheels and Toyos (about 48-50lbs decrease in weight for all 4 wheels). The feel there is the feeling you get by throwing out a couple of people from the car (at least).

The headers and CAI give a solid shove from 5K up (it climbs so fast, my wife couldn't believe it), and the AEM CAI helps a little when putting around town (I notice that I don't have to push down on the throttle as much when cruising on the freeway -- I think I picked a few MPG, but I will see soon).

So, is it worth it to me -- yes!

The general impression is this -- you just don't get much until you kit the VTECH, then it really goes wild. At low speeds, it doesn't really help that much (IMO).

However, if anyone is thinking about dropping 1/4 mile times by 1/2 second with the headers and CAI alone, I have my doubts.

If you lighten up the wheels, get some traction (pick tires that are real sticky (wet and dry), then add the headers and CAI, you will probably get similar times to what Mike got in the 1/4 mile (14.3) @ 70 degrees. (And he should improve!)

He was getting 15s before the tires and wheels...

I think he can do better.

OTOH -- Xepher showed a slip for a CLS doing a 14.4 with a CAI (who knows what is going on)...

I finally did a GTECH, but conditions were not ideal but I'm under 5.9 seconds in 70 degree weather (and I'm a big guy -- 6'4").

So, its like a movie -- if you expect too much, like your going to be the king of the strip, I think someone is in for a big disappointment. I just went, "Ok, lets see what I get... I can always pull the stuff off and sell it..." I have a big grin on my face, so I'm happy (at least so far).

mchtypeS

exhaust sysytems doesnt do shit for our cars i have the greddy evo and it gave me 1-2 hp gain thats it................sounds awesome but performance wise i doesnt do shit

------------------
2001 cl type s
voltage blue, comptech headers, 18 inch ssr agle strusse rims,(painted voltage blue and achrome polished lip) custom iceman intake, pioneer avx 7000 tv, playstation 2, slammed on nex suspension, cross drilled rotors, nos fuel pressure regulator, greddy evo exhaust, (on the way level ten torqe converter and b&m tranny cooler) april 16 taking car to dealer getting 3.5 liter upgrade(mdx crankshaft, mdx rods, shaved heads, port and polish intake manifold, modified dome topped pistons.compression ratio 10.85:1
http://albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=1335581&a=9936626&p=46258064&Sequence=0

EricL

I haven't tried the exhaust, but even Comptech only reports a 2HP gain from the exhaust.

Get it for the sound and looks, but don't waste the money in looking for HP...

EricL

You mentioned the 90 degree temps -- yes.

Isn't the humidity high (yes/no)? The humidity sure doesn't help (most of the time).

Also, I wonder what temp air is being pulled into the engine.

In the bulk of the early posts where someone only added the "header", they only were ahead by a part of a car length at 60 MPH. So, expectations should be tempered by this...

Finally, for people who don't run into the 5K-7K range -- don't bother with the headers (my opinion only).

EricL

Note:

A nother round of GTECH bashing is going on, so who knows what the "real" 0..60 time is...

tinman

As people like to say around here: "yeah, but it's a *dry* heat". LOL! It stills gets very hot. The humidity is relatively low here which hurts performance, I thought- My friend had an old Baracuda with a built 440 that had a water injection unit on it to cut down on detonation so I guess high humidity is a good thing... Actually (speaking of weather), a high pressure zone is probably the best thing since the air would be more dense.

Those are good insights into headers thanks. (Going to Tucson, gotta run...)

tinman

Okay, thanks for your comments Eric. It's good to hear you're happy with the headers/CAI.

I'd heard people talk about how heavy the wheels are but it really sank in when I changed my springs and actually lifted the wheels. They are unbelievably heavy! (I weighed the tire/wheel at about 48 lbs).

The reason I mention my hesitation with the header/CAI setup was because of the results of a race with another member who had them. There really was hardly any difference at all in his win margin up to roughly 70 mph (he did consistently win though!). He just took his car into the shop and the mechanic said the rear bolts on his headers needing a little tightening so we're going to go at it again to see if the re-torqueing helped.

A 5.9 G-Tech run is excellent for 70-degree weather. With no mods on my car, I pulled a 5.9 with my G-Tech but that was back when the temps were in the 30's. My G-Tech runs now are 6.4-6.7 but it's in the 90's here. Oh well, the results of this next race will decide things for me. We're looking for a longer run area to really let the headers show their stuff.

avatar07

Correct me if I'm wrong, but if you decide to get headers and an intake for your car, your letting in more air into engine. Therefore, shouldn't you also get a catback exhaust for your car to let out all that extra exhaust your making?

I figure the standard exhaust is designed to let out the normal out of air coming into your car (stock). Therefore, if your letting more air in (by installing an intake and headers), then your exhaust system needs to be bigger to accomodate for that extra exhuast being produced.

Does this make any sense? Correct me if i'm wrong.

Anyone have dyno results for the tl-s/cl-s with intake, headers and exhuast system?

EricL

I used to put water injection on the high compression Bimmer engines (over 10.5 to 1), it helped the detonation...

I had the 3.5L guy from Florida complaining that he was being treated "unfairly" by the high humidity in Florida during dyno tests.