stefce

Hi..
Just wanted to update you all folks that are not happy with the Audio in the Acura RL or Honda Legend..
its supposed to be state of the art audio in it from the factory and with lot of engineering in it but honestly it sounds like crap.. i am yet to determine if its the Audio amp is to blame for this, that's in the trunk and not the speakers themselves.. in any case i just wanted to update anyone that's doing or thinking of doing this.. i can answer many questions i will post a lot of pictures and i will tell you what i found as an advice to my fellow owners
First of all i have not have the time to do anything i did since i have 3 small kids oldest is 4 years and my time table i always full ..hobby time is limited and mostly is after 12 midnight..
1. I got all the stuff i need to do this maybe almost a year or so..but have postponed it because i knew i would at least take 2 weeks to put it together.. with lot of work ..and considering my available time maybe 2 months.. but with help of 3 friends they did all the labor work and i had to do the wiring and thinking..
2. I bought 2 bulk packs of Dynamat Extreme and they both went in the car..first of all the car floor is extremely well damped from the factory but the trunk and the doors is basically untouched and bare metal..
3. doors got a layer of dynamat extreme on the outer shell and the inner shell and the outer sell got a 19mm insulating material to do the acoustical sound proofing and the dunamat extreme is resonance and vibration proofing.. the inner shell ..one door got a dynamat dynaliner and other 3 doors a 6mil HVAC insulation like the inner part but 6mil..
4.Door speaker adapters were made from MDF and front was 1 " and rear was 2" but i got to trim the front one 2/5 of an inch due to door cover not closing right..
5. Speakers are old-school Polk/Momo MM6 with Blaupunkt 100w Silk dome Tweeters and sub is also Oldschool MM10 sub.. Center and rear twidlers are stock Bose since i took them for a professional measurement and they are pretty good..in fact really good..i will know if the oem speakers in the doors are good too in few days when i get the measuring results from them.
6. Amps are 2 units 2 x 150w PRS 210 Pioneers for the front and rear..a Polk MOMO C500.1 for the sub and in the end of the install i put a Really oldschool Pioneer GM-X404 to power the Center by bridge and rear twidlers..
7. Processing power and tuning is done by a Helix DSP controlling all channels
8.2x prs210 and the C500.1 are hung on the ceiling where the oem Sub is located.. the X404 is in the left rear fender and was not part of the plan until late in the install.
9. there is a post i did where i posted pictures of the oem speaker and sizes..
look for it if you like to see them or are interested how they look

- i initialy wired all 6 discrete channels to the Helix DSP low level 6 ch input and wired everything to the new amps and put 3 discrete outputs back to the Bose Amp to power the center and rear twidlers.. thats why the x404 amp wasnt part of the plan.. the Oem Amp has 6 discrete channels coming to it from the audio unit and than goes out to 8 amplified speakers from it..
when i had everything wired and powered i was puzzled why i was only getting front speakers playing and nothing else.. ? in the meantime the 3 channels i put back to the bose amp i put them in the inputs of the FR and FL for the rear twidlers and the Sub input for the Center channel and rewired the outputs to power the corresponding speakers..
the main puzzle was that the volume control knob didnt work with the level of the speakers.. now that puzzled me..
In the end i figured it out..and it turns out that all the separation and volume controls are done inside the rear Amp and it seems that the discrete channels are used only for multichannel CDs and DVDs.. the thing that puzzled me was that the center channel worked on the sub output even when the Pin output from the DSP wasnt connected to the SUB input on the Bose amp.. than i struck me. no matter what the input side is the output side of the bose Amp is always the same.. from the initial Front left and right input from the audio unit the bose amp than separates all the signals for the corresponding speakers outputs and the bose amp basically ignores the other inputs until the audio units signals the bose amp that a multichannel media in the input and than probably the corresponding inputs are read and amplified..
- than i got in the trunk and re-soldered everything back in place and took the Front and rear speaker outputs to the Helix dsp High level input and installed the additional amp for the center and rear twidlers since i couldnt control those speakers if the dsp output went in the Bose amp...
now i was happy..the volume knob worked and balance and fader worked as they should.. but than the disappointment came.
before i figured the oem setup out i had time to listen to my work with the low level input was amazed of the sound,.. and now with the high level input the sound was bad.. as bad as the oem sound.. vague and low quality..
than i went in the trunk and re-soldered the low level inputs back in and put a return cable to the bose amp.. and i tested what my ears were telling me.. i used FL and FR low level input (basically stereo input from the audio unit) to the dsp and powered all speakers and listened to a good song than went in the trunk and returned the signal to the bose amp and fed the dsp with the FL FR and RL and RR high level input to power all the speakers.. and the magic was gone.. its like i just gave more DB to the OEM audio..
than the decision was final.. i used the Low level input and lost my volume knob and steering wheel volume adjustment .. i use the Accessory of the Helix DSP which has 2 knobs..one for master volume and one for the sub and a mode switch for 2 dsp setups on the fly.. one for the driver seat and one for the rest of the car.. a center seating position if you like..
I have emailed the Audiofischer company that makes the DSP to tell me if there is a way to have the low level input as a source and have the high level input as a level control.. they initially said not possible but maybe they will see my view and make it possible by a software option in the PC tool for the DSP..
i am forgetting may things buts its 5 am now.. yes the rear twidlers are wrapped in dynamat as to serve as their box and have acoustic filling in the wrapped space..
the rear tweeters are installed on the door panel i didnt take a picture i will tomorrow and upload it so come back for more pictures..
i wanted to keep an OEM look as much as possible..
during the install i used a 4awg wire and found out near the end that it was half the size i need.. i have almost of 200amp of amplification power and the 4awg wire is for 100amp and i bought a new 4awg and put it besides the first one ..also i am using a 1 farad cap..
from what i see our cars have a 130amp alternator and i hope someone can recommend at least a 250amp to replace mine..? anyone has some experience with amp replacement and sourcing?
i am putting up a link with pictures.. there are many pictures there with no order and audio measurements of the twidler..
in any case..final toughts.. was it worth it..
yes it was.. the car now sounds as a concert hall.. clean and loud.. outside the car there is hardly any more noise than a normal car..
the doors now close so much better and are dump..
also what i am amazed most about is that the base reproduction from the door speakers is so high and sounds so good that the sub only seem to add 10-20 % to the pump action..
BTW speakers are cut at 50hz and twidlers and center are at 200hz and sub is cut at 50hz.. i have yet to calibrate it professionally and i am about to do it in the next week or so.. i bet it will sound even better when its frequency adjusted as it should..
for now ..its so loud and clear.. my aim was not to have the loudest car..
i wanted to have a clear and high fidelity sounding car.. and the aim is reached.. and its pretty loud too.. clear and loud.. like in an IMAX theater..
http://1drv.ms/1BkWrG7

there is a video inside where a friend compares an insulated door on one side of the car and an un-insulated door on the other side that hasnt been started..

shoot me any questions you have..i will update some pictures to the link i posted but will write about it..when i do.

stefce

rear door speaker





twidlers





polk and blaupunkt tweeter i put in





front with tweeter

stefce

seems oem speakers are excellent even by the words of the professional that measured them, by me the rear speaker needs the front tweeter in the back so the frequency is like in the front but in any case.. the oem setup is good. i didnt measure the sub..
The main problem is the OEM amp.. it messes up everything and if you bypass it - you loose blutooth and volume control on the HU
since my last update i bought a new DSP audison BIt one and plan to put all 5.1 low level inputs in it and have it reequalize it and than put that input to the amps..i have had it for months but havent had the time to test if it will sound as near as good as the high level input from the HU.
in any case.. my recomendation..
Buy a Audison bit one.. and 2x Alpine PDX-F4 amps .. get the high level inputs from the bose amp to the dsp and power the Alpine amps with the source of the dsp and power all oem speakers from the Alpine amps..including the sub.. that way you will be sure you will get enough power to them,get a clean sound from the dsp and how clean i will see when i install it and report back.. the OEM speakers are quite good it seems and quite Efficient..
i recommend the Alpine amps because they are class d and dont make heat and are really small.. but problem is that you need to get a wire for power to them and maybe if you would put a better speaker cable from the amp to the speakers in the car.. or use the small oem that go from the OEM amp to them..
hope it helps.

oo7spy

Clear as mud!

HEAVY_RL

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