neuronbob

...and now for something completely different from the usual "why isn't the RL selling?" threads.

I was just over in the TL forum looking at threads on pulley installs and I am gradually losing my fear of having the pulley installed. I keep hearing that this will allow the engine to rev more easily because of the reduced rotational weight and (for underdrive pulleys) underdriving the electrical equipment.

I know no one has done a dyno with this mod. Thus my first question: In general, does adding a pulley improve torque, and specifically low-end torque? Can anyone share objective evidence for this for other cars than the RL? Second, how long have those of you who have pulleys in your RLs had them on and have there been any engine issues related to this?

And before anyone asks, no, I didn't buy an RL for the straight line performance, all my mods are for fun and make the car much more fun to drive when I need to have fun, while keeping that luxury stature when I don't want to have fun.

csmeance

from the information on the TL forums, there is a very slight improvement in power, maybe 1-2 HP at the most from less mass spinning. The real gain is the faster time to the power band of the car, since the pulley is lighter weight and spins less of a load on the electrical system, the car can rev up faster. As for reliability, it should be fine, the TL and RL do not use harmonically balanced pullies and the balancers are in the motor. Like I stated before, the weight reduction does make a large difference, for those of you who have higher power electrical systems, you can buy the stock sized one too.

RL06tech

Pulley smolley, A pulley has absolutely no effect on performance unless you can use it to vary timing, and with modern cars such as the RL that is almost imposible since you would have to reprogram the engine management computer to do so. Changing the oil cap with a mugen one or putting a type S sticker on the trunk lid give comparable "performance improvements". Face it there is nothing in the market to improve the RL's forward progress. Only 2 things do that more air comming in and more air comming out. #1 can only trully be achieved with forced induction, all the other little tricks are BS and #2 can only be achieved by an entire large bore exhaust from the header to the tail. All other mods are just a waste of money except for additional noise.
Even in the s2000 which has a much more amenable engine for tuning the previous is true. One of the best "cheaper" mods the TODA front to back exhaust requires computer reflash and even then only gives you 15- 20 HP or so and will run into a couple K for the entire "mod". Couple that with their direct intake and you get another 20 , and add another 2.5k. A supercharger gives you 90HP off the bat and will put you back 3K.
None of these radical and expensive mods (though effective) are available for the RL. Thus be happy, the RL is as fast as its going to be and thats pretty much it.

TampaRLX-SH

neuronbob

Interesting discussion here so far.

RL06Tech, you bring up a very good point with engine tuning. Thus far, there is no one who's managed to retune the RL's ECU. That is my only bone of contention with having installed an intake and exhaust, no one has spent time retuning our ECUs. No market for it, and no one here is a hobbyist with this sort of thing, so we won't know.

Even with proper ECU tuning, I wonder how people can feel the engine spooling up faster if we use a "drive by wire" system?

csmeance, I've been all over the TL board reading opinions interspersed with dynos, and certainly people who've put the pulley on feel a benefit to it.

I have been going back and forth on this mod for months, and from the points made above, it seems I'm right not to blindly install one yet. Any other points of view?

godfather2

neuronbob, your rl should be able to spool up faster. auto owners (like myself) really couldn't ask for much more. hp/tq gain is negligable, but at least we can hit the engines sweet spot a bit sooner

Mike_TX

I've not had any direct experience with pulleys, but I tend to be on RL06Tech's side of the fence.

Think of it like this - how much raw horsepower is actually bled off by a larger-diameter (stock) crank pulley? Conversely, how much raw horsepower could be recaptured just by having a smaller, lighter pulley? In the grand scheme of things, not much.

Sure, it spins accessory drives (A/C, alternator, etc.) at a different speed, and some parasitic loss is recovered, but I've never seen any measurable evidence anywhere that it is a meaningful amount. If a guy spends good money on one, and expects it to improve performance, he'll probably "feel" a performance increase. (IOW, it's probably largely in his mind.)

I'm not saying pulleys for family sedans are snake oil, but they do possess a certain reptilian quality and have a slightly slippery feel to them.

Just my opinion, of course.

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Touge

Bob you already know my view on this. While all the theory in the world about the pro's/con's are great to think over. It's real world testing I go by and the pulley according to my RSM shaved of as much time from my rolling acceleration test as the AEM intake. It's the best performance bang for the buck for the RL. It makes that much of a difference in the low end.