Well it bit me, and leaked just enough oil to take the alternator out with it. Nothing like a pricey repair to take the shine off owning a car that is paid off.

My question is this… does the back bank of cylinders have its own spool valve that is waiting to spring a leak, even if it isn’t in a spot to kill the alternator?

And for those familiar with the 3G RDX, does that engine have any similar design flaws waiting for us if we decide to go newer?

 

This happened to me while traveling, so in addition to the $1400 they charged me for the spool valve and the alternator, I had to pay for a tow, and a motel for several nights. I do not think there is a second spool valve, although I have not actually researched that. It seems to me that the dealer would have tried to sell me a replacement for the second spool valve if there was one...


RFT!!!
Dave Kelsen
--
Police officer: there’s a dead body in your basement.
Schrödinger, sighing: Well, there is now.

 

Yes, there is a rear spool valve as well.
How many miles were on your 2015 RDX? Were you religious on the oil change maintenance? Did they offer to just change the o rings that were leaking, (for less than $4 each, but the same labor) versus replacing the entire spool valve assembly?

 

I was just over 107k, all oil changes done on time. Changing the o-rings was never mentioned as an option, but sounds like about a $300 savings, which is only so much against what was a huge bill.

Did I see correctly that there is a TSB out on these guys? I guess if that prescribes changing the whole assembly, you’re kinda locked in at that point.

 

From the research I have done, it appears that Honda doesn't supply the gaskets separately, so that is not an option (at least from the dealer).

Last November I had to replace the spool valve and alternator in my 2014 RDX Tech. Less that 7 months later (and only 9000 miles, I don't drive much), this is happening to my car again. Fortunately, the work was done at a Honda shop, and is warranted for 1 year/12000 miles. Let me say that it has not been diagnosed, but yesterday I drove from Fargo, ND to Bozeman, MT, and as I got close to Bozeman (60 miles or so away), I noticed that my lighter socket voltage meter was changing numbers rapidly. The only time I have seen that before was when this happened to me in November. Sigh.

RFT!!!
Dave Kelsen
--
Love can touch us one time and last for a lifetime, and never let go till we're gone.

 

Is there any preemptive maintenance that can be done for this? Like replacing the spool valve or gaskets at some interval? Can I visually inspect it at each oil change or gas fill to catch it before the alternator gets hit?

 

Of course, but you'll need a special tool. It's called your eyes. If you use them, you can easily see whether the valve is wet or dry, and also whether the alternator is wet or dry.

 

ETCG recently replaced the front cylinder head spool valve on his Ody, check it out to get an idea as to what's involved.

 

This is a story about how to buy a cheap, counterfeit gasket that started leaking after a year, and instead of buying a good, branded gasket and giving it a chance, Eric unfortunately gave up, wasting a lot of money and time on replacements.

 

I thought that was the gist of him going the 'cheap' route initially?
Because there was not a legit OEM gasket available for purchase at the time, no?

 

He then bought a cheap counterfeit OEM part made of ordinary rubber. Although these parts are manufactured by Mahle and Dorman, which are clearly not made of ordinary rubber.
The OEM still doesn't sell them.

 

Good to know lol. What I'm trying to get at, is how fast does this progress from starting to leak, to destroying the alternator? Like if I see it's dry, will it be safe for a few months until my next oil change? Or if I look under the hood and it looks good, could it potentially turn the next day and the alternator craps out before I even get to my next gas tank fill 2 weeks later?

Maybe if I'm at 100,000 miles it's also a better idea to just change the spool valve so it will at least potentially give more trouble free miles?

 

Nice! I think I'd end up taking it to the mechanic for this one though. I'm not really in a position to mess around under the valve cover right now

 

If the alternator is dry, then you're fine until the next oil change, and so on each time until oil appears on the alternator.
If you have an extra $1000 that you want to throw away, then replace it preventively.

 

Alternator for the J35 is really a thousand bucks? Is it gold-plated or something?

 

The new spool valve, valve cover gasket, and 3 hours of labor will cost $1000.

 

Is that for an Odyssey or RDX?

 

The same engine, the same labor, and the same spool valve.

 

He did buy a cheap part, and it sounds like he knew it was not OEM, despite having a Honda part number; it didn't do the job. That is what is shown at the beginning of the video (the 'cheap' route, initially.)

He then bought the entire spool valve assembly and installed it, because as you pointed out, Honda is fucking people who might want to replace the gasket by forcing them to buy that assembly rather than the gasket.

This happened to me on the road, so in addition to the other costs, I had to be towed, and spend two nights in a motel. Altogether, $1800 (that does include the alternator.)


RFT!!!
Dave Kelsen
--
"My mom is convinced I have narcissistic personality disorder, but I'm pretty sure I'm too awesome to have that." -- Adrienne Airhart

 

Agreed on the same engine, but it appears the configuration of the spool valve and labor to replace the spool valve (or just the gaskets) is completely different on the 2013-2015 RDX (or other J35s of similar vintage).

I pulled the spool valve and replaced its gaskets on our 2013 RDX...it was really simple and took me ~1/2 hour (3x 10mm bolts) an easy DIY job IMO.

The Acura dealer quoted $615 for the job (gasket replacement) when my daughter had to take it to the dealer for alternator replacement. It appears that 2013-2015 RDXs have the same spool valve configuration and the spool valve configuration on the 2016-2018 RDX is like in the ETCG video?

RockAuto shows the same spool valve gasket kit for up to the 2015 RDX - Spool Valve Gasket Kit

Here's a video on spool valve removal and gasket replacement on a 1st Gen Ridgeline...same procedure on the 2013-2015 RDX

​​​​​​

 

D'oh I completely forgot about labor.

Out of sheer curiosity, is that book time about right?

I have 1.0 for book time on the 1G RDX K23 spool valve, which I'm pretty sure Alldata just copied from the K24. But it's so much harder to access on the K23 due to limited clearance in the back and a bunch of stuff in the way. Of course removing the intercooler makes it easier but adds time to the repair... ditto for removing that dumbass coolant return line that Honda could have routed literally anywhere else but instead chose to block a wear part with it.

 

I was interested to see if I could actually find the 15815-R70-A01 screen gasket and / or the 15845-R70-A01 upper flat gasket via a U.S. online Acura / Honda part websites. ETCG stated he did this in the first video on the subject.
The results below were consistent with the below:


When this occurs, I immediately go to amayama Japan to once again cross reference to get any available data, if any, as to status.
It appears that at some time these two gaskets were in 'production'; however, now they are out of production and considered 'discontinued'.
Further proof that 'any' red labeled Acura / Honda package with these gaskets, found on the interwebs, is either repackaged Dorman 918056GS or Mahle GS34049 or a foreign land knockoff.

 

Watch the video carefully; Eric replaced the gasket, but it started leaking again after a year, so he decided to replace the entire assembly. The entire assembly is replaced in the same way on these engines, requiring the removal of the rocker arms. In the 2016-2018 RDX models, a different engine and a different spool valve were installed.

 

Very nice, if its like the Pilot in this video, I'll totally be able to do it when the time comes. Eric's Odyssey video was MUCH more involved.

 

Got it...see that now. Which brings up the question from my situation at the Atlanta Acura dealership with my 13 RDX where the dealer indicated the spool valve was leaking and the recommended fix / quote was for replacement of the spool valve gaskets ($615). So if OEM spool valve gaskets are not available to anyone...I wonder what gaskets the dealership was going to use? Head scratcher.

Another question. Where ETCG put the LockTite sealant on the bottom of the spool valve assembly...what exactly is that sealing off? That area is not involved with sealing off oil circulating thru the spool valve, correct? He was not getting the oil leak in / from that area. Correct? If so, why not take the "top" of the new spool valve (with its new OEM gaskets) and install on the (existing, in place) assembly's bottom part. That would seem a whole lot simpler and less involved? Or is that just a dumb idea?

​​​​​​So to clarify, yes ETCG replaced the entire spool valve assembly...and that is way more involved. I replaced just the gaskets (as demonstrated in the video I posted) inside the spool valve assembly itself, which is a much simpler process. I did so simply b/c it (gasket replacement) was the recommended repair by the Atlanta Acura dealer when the alternator failed on my daughter. Till now, I was unaware that replacement of the entire assembly was so involved.

I purchased / installed the linked Dorman gasket kit from RA and that's been 5 months / 10k miles ago. Currently, no sign of any leakage. I will say when I pulled the old gaskets out...they were flat, hard and came out in pieces. Acura dealer said the spool valve was leaking and that is what killed the alternator...I never saw any indication of a leak there and believe it was more than likely the 12yrs & 240k miles the alternator had been in the car that killed it. Regardless, I'll continue to monitor for oil leakage there.

So, you have a decision if / when the time comes...you can do what I did and replace just the gaskets with an aftermarket gasket kit -or- replace the entire assembly. FWIW, I learned years ago to never buy new "OEM-labeled" parts off Ebay...or even Amazon for that matter.

 

After checking the Honda TSB's Eric had linked under his video, that's actually what it looks like they were instructing as the fix for this. The acura one for our RDX looks similar: https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/20...72418-0001.pdf
​​​​​​
Yeah I'd be very tempted to go the gasket only route if I caught a leak before it damaged the alternator. It would be so much easier and cheaper. But, if my monitoring doesn't catch it before the alternator goes out, I don't know if I'd take the chance. I'll be looking every time I open the hood so when the time comes I might do what you suggested, and the TSB's say, replace the top part of the spool valve. Although Honda/Acura seems to want around $230 for the part. Browsing some others experiences online, some were also mentioning failures due to overtightening the bolts. The TSB says torque the bolts to just 8 N.m (6 lb-ft).

 

Huh...that it does. Great catch! Yeah, a much simpler procedure, and certainly not a problem for the DIYer to perform. I find it interesting that ETCG didn't use the (easier) procedure he linked.

​​​​​​Agreed. For me however, that horse (gasket replacement) has already left the barn. I'll continue to monitor for leakage...if it returns, I'll probably go ahead and buy the OEM spool valve assembly and replace just the top section with its gaskets. I'll circle back and update if that happens.

 

 

your post is a bit of a head-scratcher. Your point?

 

The point is that you do it the way you want. If you want to do it correctly, you change everything completely; if you want to do it simply, then you do it simply.

 

Was your question in regards to why he employed the lengthy repair in replacing the entire spool valve or the short repair in tearing apart the new spool valve to cut the repair time?

 

No argument there...I just find it interesting that the only reason ETCG apparently chooses to give is "just because." Especially considering the factory procedure is dramatically simpler.

Are you saying these Honda and Acura TSBs are not correct? Flawed? Nonsensical? Counter intuitive?

Font Rocker Arm Oil Control Valve Leaks - 20-023 Honda - Front Rocker Arm Oil Control Valve Leaks - 20-014 Acura

According to Honda / Acura there's "correct and simple" with regard to this procedure.

 

So it's up to you, you can replace it however you want. The service bulletin says to do it the way that will be cheaper for Honda, but Honda wants you to buy the entire assembly and, logically, replace the entire thing. What's so hard to understand about that?

 

Yes. Considering the factory procedure (which ETCG actually linked) shows replacing only the upper half of the spool valve and its gaskets. Why advocate and demonstrate such a complex procedure to your audience (of DIYers?) when even the factory doesn't? That your reason is "just because." I find that curious.

 

A service bulletin is not the same as factory procedures, don't talk nonsense.

 

Not sure how it'd be cheaper for Honda / Acura if the car is outside warranty coverage. It's definitely cheaper for a paying customer with the savings of labor / additional parts of pulling the valve cover and rocker arm assembly. For the DIYer, it's absolute that it's a dramatically simpler repair.

Not according to those Honda / Acura TSBs...one is not mutually inclusive of the other.

Semantics...it's a procedure prescribed by the factory


Question. You're a professional mechanic, correct? Which way would you advocate for your customer? The method prescribed in the TSB or the "Full Monty?"

 

ETCG was a properly trained ASE Master Certified Technician with years of experience & critical thinking skills toward vehicle repair approaches.
He displayed, on his YT channel, the total replacement of the spool valve because the 'depth' of that work was not an intimidating concern for his experienced 'skillset'.
He, in turn, links (very thoughtfully) the also acceptable alternative factory 'short cut' because he reasonably understands that the normal DIY'er, referencing / watching his videos for guidance, may not necessarily want to go the extra length he employed. Moreover, he also cognitively uses the 'comment' area below his video, utilizing the frontal lobe of his cerebral cortex, to substantiate HIS 'just because' reason (not mine) for replacing the entire spool valve as a means to receive the full monetary utility / value of a new OEM unit. This attempt was reflected above initially in post #28, in my response to your somewhat vague question in post #27 above. /

 

This service bulletin from 2020 was specifically created to save Honda money on cars that are still under warranty.
As a ASE certified automove technician, I will give the customer a choice of two options, because the lower part of valve spool can also leak through the RTV, and the customer can choose which option they prefer.

 

My opinion...penny wise and pound foolish. Expending additional parts and a lot of time to ensure you've used a part...not used per the factory TSB procedure...

You should take a look at the TSBs for the years covered...mighty few would've still been in warranty at the time the TSB was issued.

​​​​​​Kudos to you for explanation and full disclosure of the factory endorsed repair options to your customers. If I had to pay someone to do the job...I know which I'd choose.

HAPPY NEW YEAR!!!

 

Well, you know what they say about opinions.
If it were my wife's vehicle I would have invested the time, like the money for the OEM part, and replaced the whole spool valve as well, TSB be damned.