Need some help after motor swap in my 6 Speed
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Need some help after motor swap in my 6 Speed
So I put a motor from an auto into my cls6 after i lent the car to my friend who blew the motor. I swapped in the new CKP sensor with the harness that connects to it, the timing belt gear, and the front cam gear and cam plate. the car continues to throw a code p0336 and the car is at the dealer now. they have redone the timing, redone the valve clearance. and still there is an issue with power loss and this occasional random code for the crank sensor.
they are telling me that the car is pulling timing and that I have a vacuum issue but have not found a specific cause. they are now telling me they want to swap out my oil pump as it is different from the auto to manual motors. but i have not read from anyone who has dfone this swap that this was needed. this has cost me about $5,000 so far in trying to find the cause of this issue and I need some help!
they are telling me that the car is pulling timing and that I have a vacuum issue but have not found a specific cause. they are now telling me they want to swap out my oil pump as it is different from the auto to manual motors. but i have not read from anyone who has dfone this swap that this was needed. this has cost me about $5,000 so far in trying to find the cause of this issue and I need some help!
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i did a compression test and found 240psi on all cylinders
it seems to throw the p0336 code when the a/c is on and the car is idling, but the car has very choppy throttle response and is not smooth at all. ive done swaps in my cvar before, but this is the first time i swap an auto motor in the car. the reason why I went with the auto motor this time was because i figured the motor from an auto could not be abused as one from a manual tranny.
it seems to throw the p0336 code when the a/c is on and the car is idling, but the car has very choppy throttle response and is not smooth at all. ive done swaps in my cvar before, but this is the first time i swap an auto motor in the car. the reason why I went with the auto motor this time was because i figured the motor from an auto could not be abused as one from a manual tranny.
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was there something i missed in the swap conversion? and whats this deal with the dealer telling me that the oil pumps are different? I am under the understanding that the CKP sensor mounts to the oil pump, and if that is the case, if the mounting for the sensor is diff from auto to manual it would make sense as to the reason that it is throwing a p0336 code, but how come nobody has mentioned this in threads from other swaps?
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one other thing i forgot to mention, I have the clutch masters stage 4 clutch and light weight fly wheel installed. I dont know if that is related to my issue in anyway
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#8
I got the Shifts
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oil pumps are the same. i would check the vacuum hoses and make sure they are connected to the right spot. such as the vacuum hose that goes to the FPR and the intake manifold.
the cam gears are different
the cam backing plate is different
fsstyms1 went throught he same thing with his swap. i would pm him
the cam gears are different
the cam backing plate is different
fsstyms1 went throught he same thing with his swap. i would pm him
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Timing Belt Pulley
Part #s:
- 13621-P8A-A01 (auto)
- 13621-PGE-A11 (6MT)
Cam Gears:
The front cam gear is different between the auto and manual. The manual cam gear has PGE stamped on it.
Part #s:
- 14260-P8A-A01 (auto)
- 14260-PGE-A11 (6MT)
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oil pumps are the same. i would check the vacuum hoses and make sure they are connected to the right spot. such as the vacuum hose that goes to the FPR and the intake manifold.
the cam gears are different
the cam backing plate is different
fsstyms1 went throught he same thing with his swap. i would pm him
the cam gears are different
the cam backing plate is different
fsstyms1 went throught he same thing with his swap. i would pm him
15100-P8E-A01 automatic
15100-PGE-A12 6 speed
does anyone have pix of either or of these pumps?
#14
Whats up with RDX owners?
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Front cam pulley 14260-PGE-A11
Front plate assembly (behind cam pulley) 11860-PGE-A10
Timing belt pulley(lower) 13621-PGE-A11
Crank shaft sensor 37500-PGE-A11
Sub harness for CKP 37501-PGE-A10
TDC Sensors (Qty 2) 37840-PGE-A11
TDC SUB HARNESS 37841-PGE-A10
Those are all the parts you need from a CL-S6. You did replace the TDC sensors right?
Front plate assembly (behind cam pulley) 11860-PGE-A10
Timing belt pulley(lower) 13621-PGE-A11
Crank shaft sensor 37500-PGE-A11
Sub harness for CKP 37501-PGE-A10
TDC Sensors (Qty 2) 37840-PGE-A11
TDC SUB HARNESS 37841-PGE-A10
Those are all the parts you need from a CL-S6. You did replace the TDC sensors right?
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oil pumps are the same. i would check the vacuum hoses and make sure they are connected to the right spot. such as the vacuum hose that goes to the FPR and the intake manifold.
the cam gears are different
the cam backing plate is different
fsstyms1 went throught he same thing with his swap. i would pm him
the cam gears are different
the cam backing plate is different
fsstyms1 went throught he same thing with his swap. i would pm him
I cant find a user by that username
#18
Whats up with RDX owners?
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The oil pumps do have different part numbers, but that may have to do with different pick-ups. I would have to say that the auto pump in the auto motor is perfectly fine.
Did you swap TDC sensors and harness?
Did you swap TDC sensors and harness?
#19
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Front cam pulley 14260-PGE-A11
Front plate assembly (behind cam pulley) 11860-PGE-A10
Timing belt pulley(lower) 13621-PGE-A11
Crank shaft sensor 37500-PGE-A11
Sub harness for CKP 37501-PGE-A10
TDC Sensors (Qty 2) 37840-PGE-A11
TDC SUB HARNESS 37841-PGE-A10
Those are all the parts you need from a CL-S6. You did replace the TDC sensors right?
Front plate assembly (behind cam pulley) 11860-PGE-A10
Timing belt pulley(lower) 13621-PGE-A11
Crank shaft sensor 37500-PGE-A11
Sub harness for CKP 37501-PGE-A10
TDC Sensors (Qty 2) 37840-PGE-A11
TDC SUB HARNESS 37841-PGE-A10
Those are all the parts you need from a CL-S6. You did replace the TDC sensors right?
Last edited by 1hotcls6; 06-29-2009 at 01:47 PM.
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can he verify if it would affect the crank sensor readings sinec the sensor mounts to the outside of the pump? the reason I ask is because they have their master tech of 20 years at the dealership working on my car and thats what he wants to do, but its a freaken $1500 job that I dont want to pay if it aint gonna fix it. ive already spent 5 grand and still no luck. its driving me nuts
#22
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He's doing the majority of the work on mine, and we're leaving it in place at his reccomendation. He said if anything the auto pump would likely have more oil pressure than the manual, and the pan and pickup match....leave em be.
Oil pump would literally be tearing the motor apart.
Oil pump would literally be tearing the motor apart.
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He's doing the majority of the work on mine, and we're leaving it in place at his reccomendation. He said if anything the auto pump would likely have more oil pressure than the manual, and the pan and pickup match....leave em be.
Oil pump would literally be tearing the motor apart.
Oil pump would literally be tearing the motor apart.
#29
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I have $1000 in a 14,000 mile motor, my old motor, $500 to my mechanic friend to store the car, take the motor out, put all new seals and gaskets in, put the clutch in, swap over the necessary parts, and put everything back together properly - along with dirty hands from assisting with it. I can (and have) done all this sort of thing before, but I'm not 19 anymore and the $500 to have it done by the Honda pro is well worth it.
Total investment is going to be $3000ish, but with that, I got all the P2R gaskets, P2R spacer, P2R test pipe, comptech axlebacks, Clutchmasters flywheel, clutchmasters clutch, clutchmasters plate, new tbelt, new water pump, new sbelt, new cam seals, new front and rear main seals, coolant system flush, oil change, new plugs, transmission flush and new fluid, and the guy that would ultimately be fixing it if I took it to the dealership, doing all the work.
[U]
The cams thing concerns me though because I don't want to lose any power....does anyone know if they are different for certain?
Total investment is going to be $3000ish, but with that, I got all the P2R gaskets, P2R spacer, P2R test pipe, comptech axlebacks, Clutchmasters flywheel, clutchmasters clutch, clutchmasters plate, new tbelt, new water pump, new sbelt, new cam seals, new front and rear main seals, coolant system flush, oil change, new plugs, transmission flush and new fluid, and the guy that would ultimately be fixing it if I took it to the dealership, doing all the work.
[U]
The cams thing concerns me though because I don't want to lose any power....does anyone know if they are different for certain?
#30
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We had to grind away a little bit of material to get that TDC sensor from the 6 spd to fit on the auto motor. I don't see how it would have bolted up without doing so. It's a 6 wire sensor vs a 4 wire sensor on the auto - but they use the same connector, just 2 sockets are empty on the auto harness.
If this hasn't been done - maybe that's your problem?
All that crank sensor does is count. It's looking for any variance in the rotational cycle. This is what generates all your misfire codes - it's GUESSING which cylinder is off based on what position isn't meeting the sensor when it spins. If they didn't change the associated timing components out, I wonder if it's throwing it for a loop.
Should be able to fire mine up tonight / tomorrow. Keep you posted....
#32
Whats up with RDX owners?
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Camshafts for 2003 CL-S:
6MT Front- 14100-PGE-A00
Auto Front- 14100-PGE-A00
6MT Rear- 14200-PGE-A00
Auto Rear- 14200-PGE-A00
The cams arent the issue.
OP- Try another crankshaft position sensor (or have you done that?)
6MT Front- 14100-PGE-A00
Auto Front- 14100-PGE-A00
6MT Rear- 14200-PGE-A00
Auto Rear- 14200-PGE-A00
The cams arent the issue.
OP- Try another crankshaft position sensor (or have you done that?)
#33
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I checked on the cams - don't worry about changing them. The 6M cams have identical lift to the auto, the only difference is the Auto has a .263 duration and the manual has a .264. You'll never notice, and since there's valve overlap already - you might run into issues if you switch them.
The water neck and connector were different on the manual and the intake manifold is different - very. Where it mates up to the Throttle body - completely different - you need your old intake mani.
The water neck and connector were different on the manual and the intake manifold is different - very. Where it mates up to the Throttle body - completely different - you need your old intake mani.
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We had to grind away a little bit of material to get that TDC sensor from the 6 spd to fit on the auto motor. I don't see how it would have bolted up without doing so. It's a 6 wire sensor vs a 4 wire sensor on the auto - but they use the same connector, just 2 sockets are empty on the auto harness.
If this hasn't been done - maybe that's your problem?
All that crank sensor does is count. It's looking for any variance in the rotational cycle. This is what generates all your misfire codes - it's GUESSING which cylinder is off based on what position isn't meeting the sensor when it spins. If they didn't change the associated timing components out, I wonder if it's throwing it for a loop.
Should be able to fire mine up tonight / tomorrow. Keep you posted....
If this hasn't been done - maybe that's your problem?
All that crank sensor does is count. It's looking for any variance in the rotational cycle. This is what generates all your misfire codes - it's GUESSING which cylinder is off based on what position isn't meeting the sensor when it spins. If they didn't change the associated timing components out, I wonder if it's throwing it for a loop.
Should be able to fire mine up tonight / tomorrow. Keep you posted....
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If anyone wants to call/text me my # is 214.728.6115
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The crank sensor I put in I purchased new from the dealer
#40
Whats up with RDX owners?
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