acura_dipset_tl

iTrader: (40)

anybody have pics of this relay? I think my car is having some of the same symptoms. Hard to start but eventually will turn over.

accord_CLs

thank you soooooooooooo much for this thread!!! bought a cheap soldering iron and though it was my first time soldering i fixed that POS and now the car starts every time..especially in the heat

Scottman111

^


Fixed it once years ago and haven't had to touch it since

pinina

iTrader: (2)

Still waiting for pics. My nephew just got a black 2001 Accord V6 Coupe that left him stranded at work. The would turn over but not start. It was well over 100 degress in the car. We opened the doors and let it cool down then it started right up. I would love to see a write up with pics if possible. Thanks

disgruntlednut

Well, after 4 years, the relay started acting up again. This time the car shut off as I was driving. Time to replace it.

These pics are taken looking upwards under the dash on the driver's side.The relay is impossible to get off of the bracket while it's under the dash. Do yourself a favor and just remove the entire bracket and you'll save yourself a ton of trouble.

MIKE01clpremnavi

I havent driven my 01 cl in about 2 years and now it wont start now. the last time it was running it was reving up and down between about 700-1500 rpms all by itself now nothing how do i get to the fuel pump and how do i check the relay (it runs when I spray starting fluid into the intake but cuts off i guess when that dries up) ???? can you help me??

disgruntlednut

When you turn your key to the acc position (just before cranking it), do you hear a high pitched buzz noise from the fuel pump (about 2-3 seconds)?

accord_CLs

i made a short video that i think would help some through this process.

Dead-Fox

^^ Many thanks for posting that video! So when you looked at the bad relay, could you see bad soldering joints?

Scottman111

I couldn't see anything obvious on mine. I was worried that it wasn't the problem when I didn't see them, but it definitely was.


And I didn't bother re-mounting mine...it's still dangling there

disgruntlednut

I could actually see one point with a hairline crack in it, but that's not necessarily always the case.

I couldn't re-mount mine either... Zip-ties are your friend.

disgruntlednut

I also wanted to post this story:

The soldered relay worked perfectly for the last 4 years. No problems starting the car even on 110-degree days.

However, a couple of months ago, as I'm driving, the car shut off. Managed to get off to the side of the road. Took about 5 minutes of cranking and waiting before I got it started. Happened 3 more times over the course of a month before I finally couldn't get it to start (had to have the car towed back home). Replaced the relay with a new one and haven't had the problem since.

Doing 60 on the freeway and losing power brakes and power steering is really not fun.

RobOnLI

Wow, what a bit*h this is.

Thanks to the help of these boards I at least knew where the fuel relay was and had an idea of what to do.

Somehow I wasn't able to figure out how to get any type of tool under the steering column to get the bracket holding the fuel relay undone. So I used a flathead screwdriver and jimmied the fuel relay housing off of the bracket. Unlike the poster above me the housing slid off the bracket without breaking any tabs. Not that this matters since getting it back on the bracket would be nearly impossible. I already put one gash in my thumb trying to break the thing off in the first place.

Once I got the fuel relay out of the housing I used a soldering iron to touch up all of the points. I'll know tomorrow morning if I went too far (Right now my K&N air filter is air drying so I don't want to start my car with no air filter installed).

Also, instead of tie-wrapping the fuel relay housing back to the other cables under the steering column I simply wrapped it up and around the bracket and pushed it in to the point where I doubt it will come out by itself. But if it does I have the cable ties ready just in case.

So here's hoping my car actually starts tomorrow and that the problem I was experiencing has gone away....

Let me describe my problem and maybe you can chime in whether it's even caused by the fuel relay or not.

Ever since I've had the car (12 years now) and even more so recently the car will refuse to turn over, but it still cranks, after the car has been running for a while and if I try to start it again within a short period of time. For example, once the car is up to normal temp and I run into the grocery store and am back in the car in say ~5 minutes, I will attempt to start the car and it will crank but not turn over. If I wait another ~5 minutes or so the car starts up fine.

Sometimes I catch it in between the "it doesn't want to turn over" phase and the "it's ready to turn over phase" so the car turns over, the revs go up to normal for a start but then the car can't idle and it stalls. I then need to wait another 5 minutes or so.

The worst case happened a couple of months ago. I had to jump start a friends car and we had issues with it (they have a Prius so we didn't realize the 12V battery was dead so we kept trying to jump start it using my car). My car ran for at least 30 minutes with a lot of that time revved up to help jump start the other car. After 30 minutes I shut it off but then had to move it. The car would not start for 30 minutes after that. Once it "cooled down" it started fine and off it went.

Is the "cooling down" related to the fuel relay? I'm hoping it is because I don't think it's a fuel pump issue which is far away from the engine and shouldn't be near the heat source.

Thanks in advance for your help/input. If it's not the fuel relay I at least know how to fix that now

-RM

Scottman111

^ Sounds very similar...I'd put my money on it. It's such an easy repair, you have nothing to lose by trying it.

Mine would only do it during the hot days though, never a problem besides summer weather. Sometimes it would start right up, other times it would start and then stall like you described, and the majority of times when it messed up it wouldn't even start. Would just have to wait a few minutes, then it would start and run like nothing ever happened.

GL

Dead-Fox

RobOnLI- Congrats on owning your baby for 12 years! I am in the same boat as you! (Got mine Aug 2000) Satin Silver too!

zeta

iTrader: (1)

lol, When this happened to my car, in the dead of summer here in FL, I could not hear the Walbro FP prime first when the ignition was turned on. Replaced the FP Rely and I've had no issues.

I will have my six speed 10 years on 31 August 2012.

RobOnLI

Just thought I'd follow up with everyone in case anyone is interested.

I "fixed" my fuel relay about a week ago. This past weekend I had an opportunity to use the car, shut it off for a few minutes while I ran an errand and then back to the car to drive off which would have almost definitely caused it to stall or not turnover at all. I can tell you that the car started right away with no hesitation and no, "I want to choke and die" either. Whatever I did to the fuel relay with a soldering iron and no magnifying glass did the trick.

Also - the fuel relay is still tucked up around some other cables and hasn't bounced free so I think I'm good here, too, with no need to put it back on the bracket or tie it with tie wraps.

Thanks!

-RM

codehead

I've had this problem the past few months. I did a quick search a few months ago, and as soon as I saw "main relay" some place, I was confident that was it—fit the symptoms perfectly. The car (2003 CL-S 6MT) hadn't been serviced in a long time, and I wanted to have them look at a couple of things, so I never looked further for DIY, after it died twice in traffic (all others where at stops, or at start-up) on New Year's Eve (was lucky both time to have momo to roll someplace safe).

So I took it to an independent Honda repair, and told them what it was. They called me later and said it's a bad idle control valve. I muttered that that didn't sound right, but what the heck, they must have found something wrong so I let them replace it—$241 part, $203 labor. A couple of weeks later, dying again. And the aggravating thing was that this time it came back to life while I had was working the ignition switch, so i hear the relay snap to life, and its location. I hadn't looked up the details before, so hopped on the computer and...yep, the sound had come from the exact location of the main relay.

It had always been about a minute, but in the past week it died twice, took 5 minutes to restart, so crawled under the dash today.

And what a pain it was to get that bracket out. But in the end: Pull the tab of the other thing (I forget now, doesn't matter) that's pressed into the bracket out. Pull the connector from the relay out (the catch is on the side facing the kick panel). Then you can get to it was a standard socket wrench with a standard 6" extender, just right. You need to feed the extender over the top of some things, but just trust that it will end up right in line with the bolt, and just make it so. (You may need to push another wiring harness a fraction of an inch in order to get the top of the socket wrench up there and in line.)

From there, it's a breeze. I popped the relay out of the case—I didn't have a magnifying glass, but it looked like a hairline around one of the terminals. Before a being a "codehead", I was an electronics hobbyist and studied Electrical Engineering"—I knew exactly what these kinds of cold or fatigued joints can do, and it fits the symptoms exactly.

A bit of a pain getting the bolt back in, just due to the difficulty of getting both hands in there, but not too bad, and once you've figured out where to feed the wrench, the second visit is easy to tighten it.

Thanks all who contributed! Let me see if I can get up a decent picture of where the socket wrench needs to go...

codehead

The extender feeding over the top to the bolt:



The wrench handle (hand goes at bottom center of pic)—notice that the wiring harness behind it needed to get pushed over a quarter-inch or so:



The wrench with extender:



The circuit board—the left-most of the lower triplet looks like it has a hairline crack around it; I resoldered all connections:

codehead

PS—You can probably get an open-end or box wrench on the bolt from below, if it's a slim one. But if you're going after it with a socket wrench, you'll need the extender as described.

Weav

same^

Badnahras

Worked for me too!! Thanks everyone. Car stalled while driving a couple times. Then few days later would not start. Got the relay out (which was tough). Soldered parts that showed wear (2-4). Put back in and booooom!! Started up right away and fine so far. ��

mja966

Mine started acting up today. It was over 90 deg. Couldn't wait for it to cool down. Took another car to work. I will try in the AM when it's cool. Had the same problem with my '89 Accord. I had to leave the relay hanging under the dash and would squeeze it to make it work. They only last about 3-4 years.

tlmane03

Anyone have a video showing how to replace or at least get to the fuel pump aka main relay acura 2nd gen preffered?

IF NO VIDEO (I looked on youtube maybe you can find one though) does anyone at least have the DIY INSTRUCTIONS with Diagram?

Thanks if so!

mordor110

Mine wouldn't start 2 days ago (2003 CL-S 6mt). No sound from fuel pump. First 100°F day here in DFW area. So far it all adds up to what I've read about these relays. Only thing I didn't see to confirm was the dash lights:

1. My yellow engine (PGMFI) light is not coming on. Usually comes on for a few secs when key is first put in.
2. The Green key immobilizer light does not come on at all when ign is turned on. It usually flashes for a few secs when key first put in.

Question I have is are these symtoms typical of a main relay failure too? Has anyone noticed? Or is my immobilizer acting up? Do you still get the green key flash when main relay is failing?

Thx.

mordor110

Update: Well I had time to figure it out now. When the relay is failing you don't get the flashing green key or the yellow engine light.

I played around with my relay some this morning and just tapped it with my finger, then I heard the fuel pump cycle and crawled up from under the dash and saw the yellow engine light was on to say the ECU is ready.

Pulled relay out and did not see any dry solder joints. Hooked back up to car and cycled ignition with the cover off the relay. Looked like just one of the relay solenoids was sticking. Ten years old and 243K miles so can't complain! Will order a fresh relay.

disgruntlednut

Mordor, glad to hear you got it figured out. Also in the DFW area with a high mileage CL (nearing 200k) with no complaints.

Colin Stockburn

Hey thanks for the info! I believe I'am having the same problem on my 2000 Honda Accord EX coupe. I will get this part replaced by a buddy of mine who owns his own shop.,even though I know it's not that hard to replace myself I hate dealing with electronic crap in case I screw something else up in the process lol The scoop on my car is pretty much the same issues you were having. my car will run normally but if I'm frequently turning on and off the vehicle example short runs to the corner store and sometimes back that is if it starts,sometimes it does not want to crank over,I can however get it going again with my booster pack or wait about 20 minutes and it's work again..I notice it happens allot with temperature fluctuations either when it's to hot or humid or damp outside.It's only happened to me a few times mabey 4 times in total. I notice when car sits in idle at red lights the rpms drop and feels like car wants to stall and vehicle runs rough, thank god it's never happened to me at an intersection yet! If I give it a little more gas and it's fine........ is the part a black looking box with a red/brown plug end???? what is the actual name for this part and what part number do I use out of the two you game me??????As I need my mechanic to order this part in for me. I wish you had a picture of the part. Is it the relay that is to the right of the steering column behind what looks to be like a larger power steering box which you should remove the bracket for easier access to install the fuel relay?

Mark K. Wells

Having experienced a similar problem and recently replacing the battery, my 2001 CL-S shut off at a traffic light, after losing gauges, AC, and radio, it limped to a gas station. The alternator is testing bad, it would jump start but shut off shortly after removing cables from car jumped from. Had four week old battery recharged and alternator tested, it is not charging, but I figured it would run to go to the store and back, on the way back it lost power, engine shut off and restarted, gauges, AC, and radio went out and I barley limped home. I am not convinced that the alternator is the whole problem. I fear something else in the electrical system. I replaced the main relay to be on the safe side. Gonna pull the alternator and have rebuilt at a local shop, less than $69.

Tosh

I found I could get a 10mm open end on that bolt for both removal and reinstall. Once it was out I filed down the tab in the gray relay housing, so the relay will lift off the bracket as designed.

Here's the best explanation for the cause and effects of this fuel pump relay problem I've seen so far:
http://www.tegger.com/hondafaq/mainr...mainrelay.html

uhhjackumms

my car is experiencing the same thing, except that it is not hot out. do you think that it is still the main relay that could be causing this?

codehead

Yes. If the symptoms are that the engine drops dead like the gas just got pulled, but some time later runs just fine, yes. It died the last couple of times on the late afternoon of December 31 (not particularly cold here in So Cal, but hardly hot in the car)—almost a year ago, and hasn't died once since I touched up the solder joints. Heat isn't that important to a bad solder joint.

Tosh

When it's not starting, try tapping on the relay: if it starts, then the relay is flaky and can likely have the solder re-flowed.
Temp swings cause unequal expansion and contraction in different materials, which will aggravate any bad solder joints, leading them to fail open circuit in the long term...

uhhjackumms

Is the acura tl main relay the same for the cl?

Tosh

Same relay, same location on 2nd gen TL.

likeawp

iTrader: (1)

I am having this same issue, while driving the fuel would just cut off and the engine dies. However, it cranks up fine and runs with fluctuating RPM. Then 10 minutes later it runs completely fine.

I took out the relay to find that all the soldering points are perfectly solid. My uncle told me that the contacts of the relay could build up small amounts of dust and oxidation overtime so I took 2000 grit sandpaper and sanded them down a bit. There are 2 contacts in the relay. I then blew pressurized air into the contact points to blow off any microscopic dust.

So far so good, it has been 2 days and the car is running perfect. Just contributing my experience.

uhhjackumms

So I was stuck at the grocery store and my car didn't want to start, believing I have a bad main relay. So after waiting and a couple tries trying to get it to start. It starts. However it made a couple funny noises and my check engine, vsa, and that exclamation light came on. Would the main relay cause this? I had a friend check it out and it said random multiple misfiring. It's weird because the car seems to drive fine. What do you guys think?

dante76

did you force gas by pushing down the gas pedal? i did this before and other lights came on. Misfiring codes may mean you need new sparkplugs...does your cl have 80,000+ miles?

uhhjackumms

Yeah that is what I did, and I changed the spark plugs about 5000 miles ago. So it is just the main relay then huh? And thanks for the reply

dante76

yeah rev'ing the gas is what caused the lights to come on...you'll need to change or repair the fuel relay under the dash.

I repaired mine and it is a bitch to remove but what i did was unscrewed it and popped off the circuit board portion and then repaired it and popped it back into the casing and then screwed it back in place.

hope that helps some.