Ant7701

I'm thinking of buying a wideband O2 sensor so I can have a actual working a/f ratio guage inside my pod. Can someone tell me exactly what i have to buy???do i just replace the O2 sensor itself and thats it or what. Also anyone got any good links for a good price on one. I was thinking about the AEM package but that's $500 someone help me out..

allmotor_2000

I purchased the Techedge WB02 (along with Scalbert and ModAddict, I believe). You can get a DIY kit for around $200 + a $28 Bosch sensor. It doesn't come with a pod-type display, but rather a little box. I mounted mine off the windshield with suction-cups and it looks decent.

The AEM unit is self-contained within the guage itself.

http://wbo2.com/

Ant7701

Ohh I see....so I can't just buy the bosch wideband sensor and hook up an autometer gauge to it?

Aight cool, any other kits available??

AND...I was part of the lotec gauge pod group buy. What size are the pods, I think they are 2 1/16" but not sure. Lemme know cause I need some gauges

blader

Any way we could hook that up to a regular round pod mount guage instead of the box?

allmotor_2000

I believe techedge is working on a 2 1/16 standard guage, but not sure of its availability. A true wideband monitoring system requires a wideband sensor along with the appropriate hardware (op-amp, DAC and misc circuitry). The techedge is more advanced, in that it has a microprocessor and datalogging functions as well.

A Bosch sensor with an autometer is a complete waste of money.

scalbert

For a wide band monitor ready to go out of the box, expect to spend $500+. But, that is a far cry from prices just ten years ago; $1000+. If you have some electronics skills you could get the DIY kit and have it for under $250.

mrsteve

iTrader: (1)

Wouldn't an EGT guage be even for us cars without forced induction to monitor A/F? EGT too low, rich. EGT too high, lean.

yes? no? thoughts?

JHEIII850Turbo

yes, however it's not as necessary as a car with forced induction, if you're running spray it's a good idea... but usually when you lean out with spray it's dam near immediate

mrsteve

iTrader: (1)

Well i'm assuming the reason why Ant wants one is because of the UniChip leaning out the car. He isn't running FI. An EGT gauge would easily let him know how the car is reacting with the UniChip under different atmospheric conditions.

Isn't the guage pod a dual set up? What other gauges were you planning on using Ant? Transmission Temp gauge?

scalbert

OK, but what are the EGT values you are shooting for to get an ideal A/F ratio?? Are you able to adjust for ambient temperature changes?? Where do you tap to get the best reading otherwsie you need to compensate for cooling??

EGT is a valuable items but is only a part of it. It tells you less than actually reading the A/F ratio as there can be external influences.

mrsteve

iTrader: (1)

This is true, but considering the sensitivity the CL-S has to atmopsheric changes as discovered through the UniChip problems, wouldn't those ambient temperature changes go hand in hand with the EGT values?

Normally aren't pryometer probes installed directly behind the cylinder heads? Roughly 1-2 inches?

I know it isn't going to be as exact of a science as the A/F gauge, but at a most lower cost would it be useful at all, in your opinion?

A pryometer gauge and its associated probe kit be an alternative to the A/F set up? Cheaper and have the ability to be displayed via a 2 1/16" gauge? Not that an A/F gauge can't be in a 2 1/16" configuration, but the system allmotor described wasn't comparable to this.

Ant7701

I was hoping for an acurate a/f gauge and a water temp gauge to monitor coolent temps at all times w/ the mugen mods and uni-chip adjustment.

scalbert

Ambient temps play a part in the final EGT value. That just needs to be considered. If it is 30 F out or 100 F out your EGT values will change in roughly the same amount with everythign else being equal.

I was just pointing out that considerations need to be taken.

And yes, most thermocouple probes are installed near the exhaust ports for the most accurate reading. Further down and people need to consider an approximate offset to apply.

mrsteve

iTrader: (1)

I guess it would be hard to tell what the ideal EGT value is though for our cars, right?

scalbert

Nope, just compare it to a wide band value and take note of the ambient temps. That'll get ya in the ball park.

Ant7701

so lets say I get the wbo2 kit for $250. You guys say it's a DIY kit. Well...what do I have to do exactly??? And is this my last solution other that the AEM route??

scalbert

Have you ever done any electronic work?? If not then this may not be for you. If you have, how good are you?? It isn't terribly difficult but you need to know the difference between resistor values, both range and accuracy. You need to know the polarity of transistor, etc. Plus, you need a good iron soldering set, preferably a station. From there you are good to go.

Oh ya, plan on about 3 - 5 hours depending on your level.

Here is the link to the build page:

http://www.wbo2.com/2a0/const.htm

Ant7701

AHHHahh....I'm good at electronic work and soldering but that is one job I don't think i wanna tackle. I was readin up on the AEM unit, according to what I read it's an A/F controller as well. If this is true then couldn't I ditch the uni-chip, purchase the AEM unit for $500 and controll my own fuel values???

Ant7701

OK.....Scalbert/Allmotor. How's this kit look to you??
http://www.zeitronix.com/Products/zt2/zt2.htm
Will it work for me??
$279 seems like a good price huh??
Any assembly required like the techedge unit??

Also, I'm guessing Lambada is the voltage reading of the A/F ratio that would normally be viewed on scan tools right??

So then whats EGT??

Thanks again guys..

Ant7701

OK...figured out EGT stands for exhaust gas temperature. And also fiured out that the Zeitronix unit w/ the nice display is $399, still not a bad price. But I'm not an expert at this stuff so I need ur imput. Will this work w/o any CEL's ??? Also do I need the EGt sensor if I order this kit??what's it's purpose??

mrsteve

iTrader: (1)

An EGT kit will require a pryometer probe to be installed into your A-pipe. This probe is basically a thermometer. If your EGT is too high, you are running lean; EGT too low, you are running rich. Pretty simple and accurate. Although like scalbert pointed out, you have to take into consideration ambient atmospheric differences in reading the EGT values.

scalbert

Just FYI, it is pyrometer.

scalbert

Yes, you need the probe (sensor). This will be a Type-K Thermocouple. A TC (thermocouple) is a passive temperature sensing device. It is very simple where there are two dissimilar metals joined and this junction create a small voltage output (in the millivolt to microvolt range). This output varies according to temperature. The problem is that it is non-linear. So a curve must be applied to derive the actual temperature.

This is where the gauge quality comes into play. The gauges need to linearize the signal and do it accurately enough. In most cases it will only be within 1% - 2% of the actual value which is fine for what you are doing.

There are things to consider when installing the probe such as location. The greater distance from the exhaust ports the cooler the gases will be at the sensor. In other words, the closer to the actual ports the value will be more indicative of what is going on in the chamber. So you should always consider an offset.

Also, the cooler the ambient air the lower the value. This is only relevant when you want to try and get an idea of the mixture. But ultimately you want you temps to be under 1500 F for the most part. So will get close to 1600 F but after that is when aluminum can start to melt. So give your self a safety margin.

mrsteve

iTrader: (1)

Thanks

mrsteve

iTrader: (1)

Ant,

Autometer sells everything you'd need to hook up the EGT.


Can we still purchase the gauges? How much?

Ant7701

[QUOTE=Ant7701]OK.....Scalbert/Allmotor. How's this kit look to you??
http://www.zeitronix.com/Products/zt2/zt2.htm
Will it work for me??
Any assembly required like the techedge unit??

Will this work w/o any CEL's ??? \\
QUOTE]

The more and more I look into this kit...I like it. Any input?

Ant7701

ttt.

scalbert

That looks pretty good and at a great price. I suspect they are using the same 7057 sensor as the TechEdge unit. If it is accurate it would be a great unit and something I wish I knew about before as I like that display better than my TechEdge.

The base kit does not come with the display though. It is $399 for the kit with display which is still less than others I have seen.

allmotor_2000

I've had a lot of problems with my Techedge - in fact it stopped working again!! Anyways, I e-mailed them and the are sending me a replacement (WBO3 - next generation) unit.

Customer service always outweighs minor problems/hassles - unless the product is worthless to begin with!

allmotor_2000

[QUOTE=Ant7701]That looks pretty nice - cool guage!

av6ent

[QUOTE=Ant7701]Good find Ant

I like the display as well and it seems will do the job fine.

scalbert

That is great to hear that you are getting another unit, and the better one at that.

Ant7701

good shit guys...I found another kit at www.tuneyourengine.com for $350 but i like the zeitronix one better. This weekend coming up I'm gonna be installing my custom system and after that in the near future I'll be doing my gauge pod and gauges (finally)....BUT when I do get a wideband kit it will prolly be the zeitronix!!