Why is VTEC so hated on by owners of non Honda/Acura ?
07-27-2004, 07:24 PM
#41
Originally Posted by bigman
Now that i am a Trans Am Owner i can tell you that i do miss the sound of Vtec engaging. To my surprise a lot of F Body guys have respect for the little 4 banger vtec hondas that pull hard. They just hate the guys that overhype vtec like when it kicks in that 160 hp 115 lbs ft tq motor, with exhaust is gonna turn out 350 whp and 250 lbs ft of torque. They just hate shit talking ricers. We have plenty of srt-4's, civics, preludes and other guys on the board that we are cool with because they are not ricers. They are enthusiasts with respect for all cars.
I'm a huge fan of the F-body.
07-27-2004, 10:41 PM
#42
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Originally Posted by 12MiDNiTe
BTW my friend has a 2001 GSR with CAI, headers, and exhaust and when the VTEC kicks in I can feel a significant change in the sound of the engine and in the power being delivered. The car really starts to pull pretty hard. I personally love VTEC that's why my future goals are to buy an S2000 or a new RSX type R.
07-27-2004, 11:25 PM
#43
Bleed Honda Blue
Originally Posted by CLS2001_97124
I still got my fully build B16 storked 1.8 sitting in the garage still with no car to put it in. T_T When Vtec kicked in that motor, it feels like turbo too.
Vtec + FI =
I hope it will start up for you. Oh, I think people hate vtec because those people still have nightmare over the sound of vtec. In the early 90's if you don't have vtec and you hear vtec on the other car, damn you are so smoked!
10-28-2004, 05:02 PM
#44
2010 SHAWD
I've been combing over these forums for the past few weeks learning everything I possibly can about 03 CLS with SS.
What exactly is VTEC?
When does it kick in for my car?
When should I shift using the SS or should I let the auto do it on its own.
What does WOT stand for? Im assuming its that sound that the car makes when you floor it.
What exactly is VTEC?
When does it kick in for my car?
When should I shift using the SS or should I let the auto do it on its own.
What does WOT stand for? Im assuming its that sound that the car makes when you floor it.
10-28-2004, 05:47 PM
#45
Moderator Alumnus
Originally Posted by Chopper
I read a post within anothe post on here from an RX-7 board, and they made statements, such as " must have been when VTEC kicked in" and we're cracking jokes at this trademark name.
Why is this, I mean it's a damn Valve Timing system, WTF is there to hate on, jealous because Honda Patented it first ? :wtf:
Why is this, I mean it's a damn Valve Timing system, WTF is there to hate on, jealous because Honda Patented it first ? :wtf:
Probably because it's so common place now it's kinda funny Honda still has to market it to make people feel they have something special....
10-28-2004, 05:49 PM
#46
Moderator Alumnus
Originally Posted by sonnyboyacura
I've been combing over these forums for the past few weeks learning everything I possibly can about 03 CLS with SS.
What exactly is VTEC?
When does it kick in for my car?
When should I shift using the SS or should I let the auto do it on its own.
What does WOT stand for? Im assuming its that sound that the car makes when you floor it.
What exactly is VTEC?
When does it kick in for my car?
When should I shift using the SS or should I let the auto do it on its own.
What does WOT stand for? Im assuming its that sound that the car makes when you floor it.
4800 RPMS on the CLS is where the cams switch.
Whenever you feel like it.
WOT= wide open throttle (i.e. mashing your gas pedal as hard as you can
)
10-28-2004, 05:52 PM
#47
Race Director
Originally Posted by white3.0
no because Ricers think that VTEC is there own personal little turbo they go around big talking to fast cars.
Some people just give it a bad name.
10-28-2004, 05:55 PM
#48
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wow you dug up an old thread.
1) VTEC (which stands for Variable Valve Timing and Lift Electronic Control) is an electronic and mechanical system in some Honda engines that allows the engine to effectively have multiple camshafts. As the engine moves into different rpm ranges, the engine's computer can activate alternate lobes on the camshaft and change the cam's timing. In this way, the engine gets the best features of low-speed and high-speed camshafts in the same engine.
So basically, the engine has one cam setting for idle to 4800 RPM that makes the most power for the car at low RPM, then to maximize your power when your going wide open throttle, the engine gets a different cam setting for 4800rpm to 6900RPM (redline). Some cars, including the CL, have single overhead cam VTEC (SOHC VTEC). This means that only the valves on the intake side, or the valves that control letting the air fuel mixture into the car are varied. Other cars like the NSX, Prelude, Civic Si, Integra Type R\GSR, etc have Dual Overhead Cam VTEC (DOHC VTEC). In these cars, both the intake side of the valves and the side that lets the exhaust back out of the cylinder change. The sound that the engine makes when VTEC kicks in on these cars is very loud and very noticeable, more noticeable than our SOHC CL's.
You might want to check out this link, it explains VTEC in great detail with graphic pictures to describe whats going on: http://auto.howstuffworks.com/question229.htm
2) VTEC kicks in in your CL at 4800 RPM. If you listen I'm sure you can hear the sound of the engine change from 4800RPM to 6900.
3) Most people that use SS shift right before the car induces spark cut, also referred to as the rev limiter, which kicks in at 7200 RPM. Although there is a slight delay on the shifting so you might want to tap the shifter to shift a little sooner than actually getting there. I personally just let the car shift on its own, the computer does a good job most of the time of knowing where to be to make power. The only time I really use SS is when I'm taking turns fast, so I can prevent the car from upshifting to a higher gear .. you need the extra torque and engine braking when cornering fast. If your just driving around town, you can leave the car in D4 and it keeps the car in the lower gears a little longer. However there are some people that swear by driving in SS and some people who drive the car every day, all day in SS.
4) WOT= Wide Open Throttle. in other words, 100% throttle, putting your foot to the floor. but I guess you could kinda say thats the sound the car makes when screaming through VTEC hahahahah
1) VTEC (which stands for Variable Valve Timing and Lift Electronic Control) is an electronic and mechanical system in some Honda engines that allows the engine to effectively have multiple camshafts. As the engine moves into different rpm ranges, the engine's computer can activate alternate lobes on the camshaft and change the cam's timing. In this way, the engine gets the best features of low-speed and high-speed camshafts in the same engine.
So basically, the engine has one cam setting for idle to 4800 RPM that makes the most power for the car at low RPM, then to maximize your power when your going wide open throttle, the engine gets a different cam setting for 4800rpm to 6900RPM (redline). Some cars, including the CL, have single overhead cam VTEC (SOHC VTEC). This means that only the valves on the intake side, or the valves that control letting the air fuel mixture into the car are varied. Other cars like the NSX, Prelude, Civic Si, Integra Type R\GSR, etc have Dual Overhead Cam VTEC (DOHC VTEC). In these cars, both the intake side of the valves and the side that lets the exhaust back out of the cylinder change. The sound that the engine makes when VTEC kicks in on these cars is very loud and very noticeable, more noticeable than our SOHC CL's.
You might want to check out this link, it explains VTEC in great detail with graphic pictures to describe whats going on: http://auto.howstuffworks.com/question229.htm
2) VTEC kicks in in your CL at 4800 RPM. If you listen I'm sure you can hear the sound of the engine change from 4800RPM to 6900.
3) Most people that use SS shift right before the car induces spark cut, also referred to as the rev limiter, which kicks in at 7200 RPM. Although there is a slight delay on the shifting so you might want to tap the shifter to shift a little sooner than actually getting there. I personally just let the car shift on its own, the computer does a good job most of the time of knowing where to be to make power. The only time I really use SS is when I'm taking turns fast, so I can prevent the car from upshifting to a higher gear .. you need the extra torque and engine braking when cornering fast. If your just driving around town, you can leave the car in D4 and it keeps the car in the lower gears a little longer. However there are some people that swear by driving in SS and some people who drive the car every day, all day in SS.
4) WOT= Wide Open Throttle. in other words, 100% throttle, putting your foot to the floor. but I guess you could kinda say thats the sound the car makes when screaming through VTEC
hahahahah
10-28-2004, 05:57 PM
#49
2010 SHAWD
Originally Posted by SiGGy
Do a search on google for "variable valve timing history"
4800 RPMS on the CLS is where the cams switch.
Whenever you feel like it.
WOT= wide open throttle (i.e. mashing your gas pedal as hard as you can )
4800 RPMS on the CLS is where the cams switch.
Whenever you feel like it.
WOT= wide open throttle (i.e. mashing your gas pedal as hard as you can
)THANKS!!! I'll be back with more questions later! lol
10-28-2004, 08:29 PM
#52
2010 SHAWD
LOL, yea...
You may see a few more zombies before the month is over. A lot has already been covered, if people would use the search button they'd see that. I need a bit of clarification on some things though.
You may see a few more zombies before the month is over. A lot has already been covered, if people would use the search button they'd see that. I need a bit of clarification on some things though.
10-29-2004, 12:45 PM
#58
Bleed Honda Blue
Originally Posted by Chopper
I read a post within anothe post on here from an RX-7 board, and they made statements, such as " must have been when VTEC kicked in" and we're cracking jokes at this trademark name.
Why is this, I mean it's a damn Valve Timing system, WTF is there to hate on, jealous because Honda Patented it first ? :wtf:
Why is this, I mean it's a damn Valve Timing system, WTF is there to hate on, jealous because Honda Patented it first ? :wtf:
http://www.angelfire.com/tn3/kaitlyn/McNasty
10-29-2004, 02:47 PM
#60
Registered User
if anyone wants to hear what it sounds like on a Si with a turbo here is my 2000 Si before i blew the engine up
you need to wait until the car is shifted into 3rd, then u can hear when it changes cam profiles(VTEC) also the redline on my car was 9200
http://rbf351.com/CL-S/Si/Dyno1.mpg
http://rbf351.com/CL-S/Si/Dyno2.mpg
you need to wait until the car is shifted into 3rd, then u can hear when it changes cam profiles(VTEC) also the redline on my car was 9200
http://rbf351.com/CL-S/Si/Dyno1.mpg
http://rbf351.com/CL-S/Si/Dyno2.mpg
10-29-2004, 03:33 PM
#61
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Ignorance and Jealousy folks, nothing more.
10-31-2004, 11:25 AM
#64
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Originally Posted by blader
wow you dug up an old thread.
1) VTEC (which stands for Variable Valve Timing and Lift Electronic Control) is an electronic and mechanical system in some Honda engines that allows the engine to effectively have multiple camshafts. As the engine moves into different rpm ranges, the engine's computer can activate alternate lobes on the camshaft and change the cam's timing. In this way, the engine gets the best features of low-speed and high-speed camshafts in the same engine.
So basically, the engine has one cam setting for idle to 4800 RPM that makes the most power for the car at low RPM, then to maximize your power when your going wide open throttle, the engine gets a different cam setting for 4800rpm to 6900RPM (redline). Some cars, including the CL, have single overhead cam VTEC (SOHC VTEC). This means that only the valves on the intake side, or the valves that control letting the air fuel mixture into the car are varied. Other cars like the NSX, Prelude, Civic Si, Integra Type R\GSR, etc have Dual Overhead Cam VTEC (DOHC VTEC). In these cars, both the intake side of the valves and the side that lets the exhaust back out of the cylinder change. The sound that the engine makes when VTEC kicks in on these cars is very loud and very noticeable, more noticeable than our SOHC CL's.
You might want to check out this link, it explains VTEC in great detail with graphic pictures to describe whats going on: http://auto.howstuffworks.com/question229.htm
2) VTEC kicks in in your CL at 4800 RPM. If you listen I'm sure you can hear the sound of the engine change from 4800RPM to 6900.
3) Most people that use SS shift right before the car induces spark cut, also referred to as the rev limiter, which kicks in at 7200 RPM. Although there is a slight delay on the shifting so you might want to tap the shifter to shift a little sooner than actually getting there. I personally just let the car shift on its own, the computer does a good job most of the time of knowing where to be to make power. The only time I really use SS is when I'm taking turns fast, so I can prevent the car from upshifting to a higher gear .. you need the extra torque and engine braking when cornering fast. If your just driving around town, you can leave the car in D4 and it keeps the car in the lower gears a little longer. However there are some people that swear by driving in SS and some people who drive the car every day, all day in SS.
4) WOT= Wide Open Throttle. in other words, 100% throttle, putting your foot to the floor. but I guess you could kinda say thats the sound the car makes when screaming through VTEC hahahahah
1) VTEC (which stands for Variable Valve Timing and Lift Electronic Control) is an electronic and mechanical system in some Honda engines that allows the engine to effectively have multiple camshafts. As the engine moves into different rpm ranges, the engine's computer can activate alternate lobes on the camshaft and change the cam's timing. In this way, the engine gets the best features of low-speed and high-speed camshafts in the same engine.
So basically, the engine has one cam setting for idle to 4800 RPM that makes the most power for the car at low RPM, then to maximize your power when your going wide open throttle, the engine gets a different cam setting for 4800rpm to 6900RPM (redline). Some cars, including the CL, have single overhead cam VTEC (SOHC VTEC). This means that only the valves on the intake side, or the valves that control letting the air fuel mixture into the car are varied. Other cars like the NSX, Prelude, Civic Si, Integra Type R\GSR, etc have Dual Overhead Cam VTEC (DOHC VTEC). In these cars, both the intake side of the valves and the side that lets the exhaust back out of the cylinder change. The sound that the engine makes when VTEC kicks in on these cars is very loud and very noticeable, more noticeable than our SOHC CL's.
You might want to check out this link, it explains VTEC in great detail with graphic pictures to describe whats going on: http://auto.howstuffworks.com/question229.htm
2) VTEC kicks in in your CL at 4800 RPM. If you listen I'm sure you can hear the sound of the engine change from 4800RPM to 6900.
3) Most people that use SS shift right before the car induces spark cut, also referred to as the rev limiter, which kicks in at 7200 RPM. Although there is a slight delay on the shifting so you might want to tap the shifter to shift a little sooner than actually getting there. I personally just let the car shift on its own, the computer does a good job most of the time of knowing where to be to make power. The only time I really use SS is when I'm taking turns fast, so I can prevent the car from upshifting to a higher gear .. you need the extra torque and engine braking when cornering fast. If your just driving around town, you can leave the car in D4 and it keeps the car in the lower gears a little longer. However there are some people that swear by driving in SS and some people who drive the car every day, all day in SS.
4) WOT= Wide Open Throttle. in other words, 100% throttle, putting your foot to the floor. but I guess you could kinda say thats the sound the car makes when screaming through VTEC
hahahahahwhen VTEC kicks in this allows you to take avantage of (Dynamic Compression).So basically at higher RPM's when your piston reaches (Dead bottom center) and starts making it way back up your intake valve is still open.The force of your stroke when pulling in air is so powerful that your still pulling air and fuel in when the piston is making its way up and then the valve closes just before the air stops and changes direction.So more air and fuel= more power.Thats why the VTEC lobe is huge so you can have a longer valve duration(Valve opening).Thats why if you set the VTEC engagement to low of a rpm with a VTEC controller you will bog your engine because the during the intake stroke period your not pulling in the air strong enough so when the piston hit (Dead bottom center)and starts making its way up the air just goes back out into the intake.So thats the intake side the exhaust side VTEC helps get that extra exhaust out more quikly for effeciently.Hope that helps.
11-01-2004, 01:29 PM
#69
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Originally Posted by TheOne305
when VTEC kicks in this allows you to take avantage of (Dynamic Compression).So basically at higher RPM's when your piston reaches (Dead bottom center) and starts making it way back up your intake valve is still open.The force of your stroke when pulling in air is so powerful that your still pulling air and fuel in when the piston is making its way up and then the valve closes just before the air stops and changes direction.So more air and fuel= more power.Thats why the VTEC lobe is huge so you can have a longer valve duration(Valve opening).Thats why if you set the VTEC engagement to low of a rpm with a VTEC controller you will bog your engine because the during the intake stroke period your not pulling in the air strong enough so when the piston hit (Dead bottom center)and starts making its way up the air just goes back out into the intake.So thats the intake side the exhaust side VTEC helps get that extra exhaust out more quikly for effeciently.Hope that helps.
it was my post you quoted ...
11-02-2004, 04:09 AM
#71
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When Honda intro'd VTEC on its F1 engines, there was no technology around like it. It helped them win a string of titles in the back of McLarens. I haven't seen a rotary, vanos, etc. winning races CONSISTENTLY like Honda did w/ VTEC. To me, it's all about the haves and the have nots (jealousy).
11-02-2004, 04:55 AM
#72
Senior Moderator
Originally Posted by Chief F1 Fan
When Honda intro'd VTEC on its F1 engines, there was no technology around like it. It helped them win a string of titles in the back of McLarens. I haven't seen a rotary, vanos, etc. winning races CONSISTENTLY like Honda did w/ VTEC. To me, it's all about the haves and the have nots (jealousy).
So you saying Vtec is old technolgy
11-02-2004, 02:58 PM
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I guess it really is
11-02-2004, 11:15 PM
#75
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VTEC is old technology but it was so ahead of its time ..
Honda is still putting it on their new cars .. its like a MUST .. almost as important as fuel injection
Honda is still putting it on their new cars .. its like a MUST .. almost as important as fuel injection
11-03-2004, 02:33 PM
#77
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Basically you either design a motor to rev freely (high RPMS) to make more horsepower or you design it to produce torque and not rev as high. I has to do with the stroke\bore ratios and all kinds of other goodies.
11-03-2004, 02:42 PM
#78
Photography Nerd
Originally Posted by Crazy Sellout
What prevents honda engines to produce more torque?
K20A (RSX-S)
Bore: 86mm
Stroke: 86mm
Redline: 8100rpm
HP: 200
Torque: 142
K24A2 (TSX)
Bore: 86mm
Stroke: 99mm
Redline: 7400rpm
HP: 200
Torque: 166
The extra 400cc of displacement picked up when the stroke was lengthened accounts for 22lb/ft of torque and a lower top RPM.
IF you look at the SRT-4 engine you'll see big differences in torque because of the lengthened stroke:
Bore: 87.1mm
Stroke: 101.4mm
Redline: 6240rpm
HP: 230
Torque: 250
11-03-2004, 02:48 PM
#79
Suzuka Master
Originally Posted by Crazy Sellout
What prevents honda engines to produce more torque?
High-end torque?
Mid-range torque?
Overall torque across the entire rev range?
Torque for a given displacement?
It isn’t difficult to produce an engine that will simply maximize the torque at a particular RPM.
Add a supercharger and you'll produce more torque.
Add more displacement and you'll produce more torque.
Change the intake and exhaust system and you should be able to produce more torque at lower RPMs. This will probably result in the loss of torque at mid- and high-revs.
Increase the compression and you will produce more torque -- as long as you don't detonate.
Of course, everything is a trade-off, and the whole idea of VTEC and variable lift/duration cam systems are to optimize the torque and volumetric efficiency across the ENTIRE power band.
The bore/stroke relationship has a large effect on make revs -- given certain material strength limits -- and it can also impact low-end torque (as can a host of other factors).
And, for their size, Honda engines, in general produce a nice flat torque curve that is good for the displacement.
If you want more low-end torque, get a diesel, they produce a ton of torque.
If you want more low-end torque, and don't want a diesel, get a large displacement engine that is stroked.
The HP is dependant on the torque, and if the torque wasn't there, you wouldn't see the nice HP numbers at the top end.
If you have good HP at a high RPMs, you can gear the car down. F1 cars aren't exactly known for "low end" torque and the acceleration is quite impressive.
11-03-2004, 03:25 PM
#80
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I really think Honda tuned their cam settings for low end gas mileage, and top end performance. I find it hard to believe the low cam position in my car is anywhere near the optimum low end performance. 30mpg on the highway in a V6 3200lb+ car is pretty cool though.
My mom's Nissan (Infiniti) 3.0 has 10 less hp and 10 more tq. and revs to approx. the same RPM - but man can you tell the difference when you first step on the gas in her car. I'll take a VQ over a J engine anyday.
My mom's Nissan (Infiniti) 3.0 has 10 less hp and 10 more tq. and revs to approx. the same RPM - but man can you tell the difference when you first step on the gas in her car. I'll take a VQ over a J engine anyday.