nate'sCLS

Exactly
I know a guy who had a S500 with so many problems he lemon law'ed the damn car and gave it back to the dealer.

GET OVER IT!! Sometimes in life we catch a bad deal and we move on. In your case you got another car you like more, right???

nuff' said!

SiGGy

ugh

I paid 35k for my 01 CLS loaded in July of 00 (34,???) I'd have to look...

look at my sig...


NO TAX added

IGNORANCE?

EXCUSE ME!!!!!

please explain...

And dont tell me about your deal on your CLS.

go get a DEAL on a NAVI manual 6 speed NOW! You can't when things are new... Like when i purchased my CLS it was only out a few months...


and my comparison was for a 330i and a CLS both 01's
goto www.kbb.com and pull out the calculator... <YAWN> then come back here. if you choose to not do that... who's ignorant then?

the 330I has the CLS hands down...

CLS=20% a year trade in loss from orignal value
330I=10% a year trade in loss for resale from orignal value

simple man...

NO TAX, NO BLOAT, and granted the 330I doesnt have NAVI. ohh boy...

24,000 miles
$35k for CLS (use 32k if you feel better, for wood spoiler, guards)
$37K for 330I (premium and sport package, leather, moon roof, wheels.. go read his back post! he says all of his options for $37k)

SiGGy

its what I paid for mine...
and what another fellow paid for his 330i in this THREAD.

READ MY POSTS! and the *whole* thread...

I'ts easy to read one and make snipe decisions if you don't read the history...

codehead

OK, I've been going through the 330ci versus CL 6MT decision too--so don't shoot me, I'm just weighing in.

(I'm assuming you are referring to JerrL's post--he doesn't meantion leather, wheels, etc, but does say "fully loaded".)

First, he said "$1000 over invoice ($37,900)". To me that means $38,900 plus all the tax & stuff to get out the door. I'm assuming he means this because if I go to BMW's "build your own" and choose metallic paint and leather I get $37,560 MSRP with no other options. So I'm guessing 9%--I don't know if this is right, but I asked the Acura dealer how much gets tacked on to the CL after our agreed on price, and he said it was about 9%--so that's maybe $42,400 for that guy's car. (I'm just working with the info I have, so take it easy on me if I'm wrong.)

For me, I'd have to add options that would boost the 330ci price to about $41,600 MSRP, before the tax, etc. And thank goodness that I don't want an automatic, or that's another $1,275. That's assuming they don't tack on another $1k over invoice. No matter what, I'm well into the $40k's even if I have a dealer that gives me a deal.

The 2003 CL 6MT, no additions except for mudflaps and wheel locks thrown in, will cost me under $33k out the door. This isn't a guess, and the dealer is looking for the color I want without demo miles on it right now.

As for value retention, recent model used BMW do hold better value, but it's not that huge. If you start with a BMW in the same price area as the CL (which would be, say, a 325ci with no options except for leather seats--nobody would really buy that leatherette would they?), there's about a $2k difference for 2001. And I've been told that the 3-series value drop-off increases after a few years--when I bought my Legend I looked at the 325ci, and I see my Legend held its value more.

Anyway, probably a better measure of value retention is to look into leasing the cars and seeing what the residual is. I'm no expert--just guessing. That's when you find out what they really think when their wallet is on the line. And that way you're not factoring how the cars fared in the past but how they expect this model to fare. I would expect the BMW to do a little better than the Acura--how much I don't know. Maybe someone here has compared leasing.

Now, I there really was only $2k difference in the price, I'd probably go for the BMW, but from where I sit, I can't get out without at least $10k difference.

JerryL

codehead:

Let me clarify the price that I paid for my 330Ci
Base price $32,000
Metallic $430
Cold Weather Package $635
Premium Package $2640
Sport Package $545
Xenons $635
Freight $645
Dealer Markup $1000

Total $38,530 + Tax & Tags

This has at least all the extras that the CL-S has plus other goodies. The BMW is more money, but you do get a better car.

Jerry

acura_service

nothing personal ?

acura_service

2nd gen seat belts, just because you think they should zip back into place doesn't mean that there is anything wrong with them, most are like that anymore, it is normal

SiGGy

thanks for posting that!!! I thought he was going to end the comversation. But he had to add something else in...

B.T.W.

Kelly Blue book gives you $32,460! as a tradein!!!
nice man!

you only lost $6K

lets say a base CLS with NO real wood, NO spoiler, NO windscreen, NO mud flaps... (by all means not as nice as the 330)

$30,000 new for CLS
$22,265 is the tradein!
$7735 lost... you really need to add the extras to the CLS to make a fair comparison to your car specifically. so add +1300 to the CLS (for real wood and things...) but it still lost either way...
in my eyes the CLS lost $9000

and this was non navi compared to non Navi...

95gt

Well first and foremost this is the best string I have read in awhile. Great stuff.

And like everyone else had to go to KBB.com and to acura and BMW and compare some prices. Just am confused about where all these numbers are coming from. How about we just use list prices and not the deals (or lack there of aka 35k for a cls) people are getting.

BMW : comparable options(no nav) 42,085
(base price was already 35k)

Base CLS with spoiler 31,706

List price difference of 10,379

2001 330 with 15k miles = 31,980 loss of 10,105
2001 cls with 15k = 22,195 loss of 9,511

Both very big losses and cls definetly higher % loss 30% in first year vs 24% for the BMW. Have read this gets to within a couple of percentage points over 4 to 5 years however. BWM great car but man 10k more than the cls, just can't swing it.
As for all the problems with the car you got a bad one. Sorry. Mine works great no issues. It sounds like most of your problems are dealer related anyway. By the way a tear in the seatbelt is not acuras fault. The dealer is to blame for giving you a car that is not in perfect condition. I am sure acura does not manufacture the seatbelt with tears in them.

great string though. have fun with your bimmer.

Gabo3k

Man you really have lost it! I'm sorry for all the problems with your vehicle. Also sorry to tell you that youmight just run into the same issue with MB, BMW, and yes even Lexus. Sister owns a GS400, roommate owns a 540I, and although I know no one with a MB, I've heard plenty of bad reliability issues.

I can't believe you fell for the "ultimate driving machine" crap. Ever think of Porsche, Ferrari, or even Lambo, yes they are out of league of BMW and your Acura. But they my friend are ultimate driving machines, not some German front engine car.

I also looked at the 330CI before deciding on my CL-S. If you are any good with numbers, and research, there will be no comparison. I read a report a while back that estimated BMW to charge upwards of 20% over necessitated pricing because of their brand.

Sure the 330CI is a nice ride, just not worth an additional 10K over my nice CL-S, period!

Maybe you got a lemon car. No issues with mine so far. And although Acura was not my first choice, Porsche was. You can't deny the value they represent in their cars!

Good luck with your 330CI, I also would have opted for it if it were not for my analitical nature.

JerryL

95gt:
I am using real numbers. I am looking at my buyers order right now. It doesn't get any more real than this. It is a 7K difference not 10K you have stated.

codehead

Thanks Jerry. Now bear with me--I'm not disbelieving you, I just want to know if I can get that deal, etc...

OK, I go to http://www.bmwusa.com, choose "build you own", and I get:

Base price $34,900*
Metallic $475
Cold Weather Package $700
Premium Package $2900
Sport Package $600
Xenons $700
Freight $645
Dealer Markup don't know

*on the site you'll see $35,635, but apparently that includes freight which I've broken out separately as you did (it's broken out in the final price list when you're done).

No leather for you? I couldn't do without that (add $1450). And I see a CD changer being an additional charge ($595 for trunk or glove-box mount versus CL in-dash). So I'm at $43,055 before tax & tags (or $40,920 as you have yours configured--$3390 more than yours, same gear, before dealer markup).

You can see why this is frustrating. I haven't priced one at the dealer, but I did look at the 2001 models when they came out and it was clear I couldn't get out the door without being well into the $40's.

Gabo3k

I priced the 330CI at the dealer a while back for 42,000 and change.

A few weeks later I purchased my CL-S (30,000) sticker. And I got the exceptional navigation system which BMW did not even offer on their 3 series cars.

I'm a happy camper!

codehead

Hmmm, not sure how you can complain about wood trim and ignore that fact his 330ci doesn't have leather or a CD changer...

The 330ci is worth 10% more for looks alone. However, *on paper*, the G35 coupe looks like it's going to make both cars look sick in the price versus stuff & coolness department.

Gabo3k

Would have to dissagre! 10K worth of looks = not to everyone. Yes, the Bimmer does look better from the front. Worth 10k for me personally = "NO".

Saw a G35 the other day, it did not look all that good to me. The interior is nasty. Front end looks like the sad CTS.

I'd still pick the CL-S over the G35!

codehead

Ummm, looking again, I see that wood on the 330 is an option--add another $500.

Hey, I know you're trying to be objective, I think, and you're certainly adding useful things to think about in this thread, but you're exaggerating some things and it detracts from the strength of your argument. He never said leather. wheels, and wood trim. And his original price quote was $37,900 + $1000, + tax & tags, which you rounded down to $37k. Between the gear you added ($2850) and the cost you subtracted ($1900), that's a difference of $4750, before adding tax & tags. Then besides giving the 330ci that advantage, you compare it to a CL out the door with tax & tags and an inflated price (I'm not saying you didn't pay $35+ for yours, but I know I'm going to pay at least a couple of thousand less than that out the door for the 6MT, which is in limited supply--an automatic would be cheaper yet). Of course we're assuming people want a manual transmission (included in the CL-S but adds $1275 to the 330ci), which is not true of the general public but is true of me and probably many others here.

I don't have either of these cars yet--I don't have an axe to grind. If someone else was paying, I'd go with the 330ci. And if the CL really cost $35k out the door and the 330 $37k, it would be the 330. But I'm a practical guy, and I see $10-12k out the door difference between the cars equiped similarly, after Acura discounts me and BMW dings me. That pays for a new kitchen and I have a fun ride.

And if money was no object, it wouldn't be a contest--I'd get the M5

Gabo3k

No, I think you mean if money was no object you would get a Ferrari, Lambo, or at least a Porsche, right?

cnatra

DAMN you got a good deal !!!

base MSRP is $34990 & once you option it up $40k easy

Here in Houston the dealers rarely come of sticker on new Bimmers or Mercedes

supply & demand I guess ?!?

codehead

Read my post again--I said "10%", not "10k". So I'm saying that to me, the looks is worth $3k, and I really picked that number arbitrarily--I'm saying if the price was within $3k I'd seriously consider the 330ci. But that's a personal issue. I think the 330ci (*not* the sedan--the lines are damaged there) is *one* of the more elegant and beautiful car designs on the road. The previous generation 3-series suck, they got this one right. But I'm just explaining my rationale--I wouldn't disagree with anyone who thought the CL was beautiful and the ci ugly. And the ci design does suffer a bit from being everywhere you look, so that may bother people, compared to the fewer CLs.

The CL has a more understated design, in keeping with traditional Acura styling. It takes a {ž½½e to appreciate, but then again I don't think it will suffer a few years down the line--subtle designs are good about that. Personally, I think my '89 Legend is the most beautiful passanger car Acura/Honda ever put out, and still one of the best looking cars on the road after all these years (ironically, its design borrows a bit from the old "greenhouse" BMWs).

Looks aren't everything; I think the X-series Jag is has a great look--but it's not the look I want to be driving. I can look at one drive by and appreciate the look, and have no desire to be sitting behind the wheel. I just can't picture myself pulling up at the beach with my surfboard and getting out of a Jag--beautiful but pompous. The point is that beauty or lack thereof does not correlate directly to whether I want one or not. Conversly, there might be two uglyish cars, one of which is ugly in a tolerable way for me and the other not :P

Thanks for your input on the G35 coupe. I need all the reasons I can muster to not wait another x-months to see what that thing is like. I don't drive a lot (office at home), which is why my Legend is still in the garage after all these years. When I couldn't get excited about the CL automatic a year and a half ago and the 330ci seemed overpriced, I just waited to see what the 6MT brought to the table (I like).

Yes, that CTS is one ugly bitch...

codehead

(re: And if money was no object, it wouldn't be a contest--I'd get the M5)

LOL--See how practical I am (engineer) Need backseats once in a while, don't see myself pulling at the basketball courts in a Ferrari, don't see myself pulling up at the beach with a surfboard on top of my Lamborghini. Now if the choice is that I get a practical car plus one to just cruise around in and impress the ladies, mechanic on call... well, I'd have to think about that :P

JerryL

These are the 3 packages that I ordered with the car. As you can see leather and wood trim does come with the premium package.
I also added xenons. The Harmon Kardon stereo comes with a single in-dash CD player. It also has that RDS gizmo that shows the call letters and format of the FM stations. I listen to talk radio most of the time so I will not add the trunk mounted CD changer. By the way, there are 4 BMW dealers within a 20 minute drive of my house. I love it, plenty of competition.

Premium Package

8-way power front seats with 2-way manual headrests; 3-driver memory for exterior mirror and seat positions; automatic tilt-down of passenger's side-view mirror when vehicle is shifted into reverse gear; automatic-dimming inside rear-view mirror; Myrtle wood trim; 2-way power glass moonroof; Montana leather upholstery; 4-way power lumbar support for front seats; rain-sensing windshield wipers; Automatic Headlight Control

Sport Package

8-way power front sport seats with 2-way manual headrests and thigh support; 3-driver memory for exterior mirror and seat positions; automatic tilt-down of passenger's side-view mirror when vehicle is shifted into reverse gear; white turn-signal indicators; M Double Spoke (Styling 68M) alloy wheels, 17 x 7.5 front, 17 x 8.5 rear; 225/45ZR-17 front, 245/40ZR-17 rear performance tires

Cold Weather Package

3-stage heated front seats; retractable, high-intensity headlight washers; ski bag

keuka1

Persian Prince sounds like an overpaid, arrogant, loudmouth to me.

codehead

Whoops, my bad. I was confused by the fact that in the "build your own" you select leather and wood trim on one page (with pricing added), then choose the Premium package on the next page (with price added--apparently choosing it superceeds the previous choices).

So subtract $1950 from the $2850 I told Siggy that he needed to add to his (not your) list (IOW, I'm talking about $900 for the wheel package he mentioned but you didn't, and the $1900 discrepancy he had for rounding down your price and not adding dealer markup).

But I'm still hoping you can tell me how the heck you got that deal (and can I get it). When you say "invoice" prices are you talking about wholesale invoice or retail? The MSRP is $34,900 base, and you say that your invoice says $32,000--and all the MSRP for all of the other items are higher than you list too, as detailed in my previous post to you. In total, it adds up to $3110 more than you have for the same configuration ("build your own": metallic, the three packages, bi-xenon--$41,010). Do you know why?

JerryL

codehead:
I am talking about dealer cost. Like I stated before, there are 4 dealers within a 20 minute drive from my house. It is no problem to get one at $1500 over dealer cost. Lucky that all the dealers are whores and they are not about to lose a deal. My guy did the deal at $1000 over.
Your mind must be fogged seeing that you are from Torrence- the home office of Acura. Must be something in the air. Just kidding

Jerry

cakennedy

Let me also inject some real-world numbers for the 330ci. I paid less than $38k for a 330ci with premium package, HID, Harmon Kardon stereo, and CD player. I'm not aware of any significant features found on the CL not on my 330ci. If new CLS non-navis are going for $30k - $32k, then the price difference between my 330ci and a CLS is $7500 - $5500, not $10,000.

The 330ci isn't a great value -- especially compared with the CLS, which is a great value -- but it's such a fun car to drive. Is the $5000+ premium worth the driving experience? In my humbe opinion, it's worth every penny.

SiGGy

Cd Changer I don't know about but leather is standard on the 330Ci...

Click on "Stand and Optional Equipment"

THESE ARE JUST STANDARD OPTIONS!

I went ahead and put "**" next to the nice ones! Compare the options to the CLS. And this isn't including what JerryL added to his 330Ci... Which makes it even better!

3.0-liter dual overhead cam (DOHC), 24-valve inline 6-cylinder engine


Electronic throttle control
Double-VANOS steplessly variable valve timing \
Dual resonance intake system
5-speed manual transmission
Dynamic Stability Control (DSC), with All Season Traction
Strut-type front suspension with forged-aluminum lower arms
Multi-link rear suspension with cast-aluminum upper transverse arms
Front and rear anti-roll (stabilizer) bars
Twin-tube gas-pressure shock absorbers
Engine-speed-sensitive, variable-assist power steering
**4-wheel ventilated anti-lock disc brakes with Dynamic Brake Control
**Sport suspension calibration
17 x 7.0 Double Spoke (Styling 79) alloy wheels, 205/50R-17 all-season tires
Chrome and body-color detail trim
Halogen free-form foglights
**Heated dual-power mirrors and heated windshield washer jets
**Harman Kardon AM/FM stereo/CD audio system with 12 upgraded speakers (including 2 subwoofers), upgraded amplification, and vehicle-speed-sensitive equalization
**8-way power front seats with 2-way manual headrests; 3-driver memory for exterior mirror and seat positions; automatic tilt-down of passenger's side-view mirror when vehicle is shifted into reverse gear
**Leatherette upholstery
**3-stage heated front seats
**3-spoke leather-wrapped multi-function sport steering wheel with fingertip cruise, audio, and accessory phone5 controls
Front-seat center armrest with storage compartment
Front seatback storage nets
Split fold-down rear seats with center armrest
**Titanium-finish trim
Vehicle & Key Memory
Remote entry, including 2-step unlocking and remote trunk release
Automatic climate control with micro-filter and air recirculation
** Tilt/telescopic steering wheel column
**Power front windows with "one-touch" up/down operation, power rear windows with "one-touch" open
Cruise control
Front/rear map-reading, footwell, and visor mirror lights
**Locking glovebox with rechargeable take-out flashlight
Electric interior trunk release
Fully finished trunk with reversible mat and drop-down tool kit
BMW Ambiance Lighting
**Service Interval Indicator with miles-to-service readout
**Check Control vehicle monitor system with pictogram display
** 4-function on-board computer
** Titanium-finish instrument rings
Anti-lock braking system (ABS)
Head Protection System (HPS)
Driver's and passenger's front airbag supplemental restraint system (SRS) with "smart" dual-threshold, dual-stage deployment and sensor to help prevent unnecessary passenger's airbag deployment
Door-mounted side-impact airbags
**Interlocking door anchoring system to help protect against door intrusion in side impacts
Battery Safety Terminal
Automatic fuel cut-off, triggered by airbag deployment
Central locking system with center console switch (leaves gas filler door unlocked), double-lock feature, and 2-step unlocking
Coded Driveaway Protection
**Height-adjustable front safety belts with automatic pretensioners and force limiters
Automatic-locking retractors (ALR) on all passenger safety belts (for installation of child restraint seats)
Crash sensor that automatically turns on hazard lights and interior lights, and unlocks doors
Daytime running lights (via Vehicle Memory system — programmed at BMW center)
**Full-use spare alloy wheel and tire7


----------------------------------
Premium Package

8-way power front seats with 2-way manual headrests; 3-driver memory for exterior mirror and seat positions; automatic tilt-down of passenger's side-view mirror when vehicle is shifted into reverse gear; automatic-dimming inside rear-view mirror; Myrtle wood trim; 2-way power glass moonroof; Montana leather upholstery; 4-way power lumbar support for front seats; rain-sensing windshield wipers; Automatic Headlight Control
-----------------------------------
Sport Package

8-way power front sport seats with 2-way manual headrests and thigh support; 3-driver memory for exterior mirror and seat positions; automatic tilt-down of passenger's side-view mirror when vehicle is shifted into reverse gear; white turn-signal indicators; M Double Spoke (Styling 68M) alloy wheels, 17 x 7.5 front, 17 x 8.5 rear; 225/45ZR-17 front, 245/40ZR-17 rear performance tires

SiGGy

Actually he said 37k at 1st... And i was just even working with the 330I being a TON more than what he had it at. I agree my #'s were off.... but then he came back and clairified... so ya I was dead wrong...

Leather is standard
Wood is on the dash standard
wheels part of one of his packages

exaggerating only what I was told... So my appoligies.

I said 35k on my car, because you need to deck out the CLS to honestly compare it to even a standard 330i... (you can remove the spolier and navi) ;-) Which it's about $32,000 (i even did a $30k compare on back post) I was just trying to be somewhat fair as the bimmer way out does the CLS on little things here and there. But they add up!

Silock

Pretty funny you say that, considering you also posted this little gem:

Before you flame someone on the internet for bad spelling and grammar, better make sure you have your shit straight.

SiGGy

man I'm glad you didn't look at any of my posts. I read them and go "WTF WAS I TYPING!"

lol

I need a fricken Spel chekr! heheh

moomaster_99

You know we are all waaaaay off-topic....the whole reason for this is that Persian Prince thought he was buying a $50K+ car for $30K...sorry.....he also thinks that by buying a 3-series...he'll be never have a problem on his car....keep dreaming. Now, I say $50k car...cuz he wants to be super baller......hell, anyone in the Bay Area with a decent job can buy a $30-40k car.....Acura or BMW. So he wants something that is nicer....$50K+...will it break?...Yes,in one way or another, something will go wrong...

codehead

Hey, Jerry, I'm not so fogged that you can't spell my city right (LOL--yeah I meant it that way). OK, I caught the four dealerships part, but this is the first I've seen about dealer cost. I could drive to four dealers around here, but I can bet none of them will do that deal--too much demand around here, willing and able to pay MSRP+. Heck, I'd have to order one at the local dealer and wait 2 1/2 months just to get a test drive.

But even with the deal I can't get it's $8,900 more than the CL for me (your price before tax & tags, mine before tax & tags--different state, so I won't even take a stab at that part). Oh well.

Anyway, I'm not defending the car, I'm defending the truth of the matter that there's $10k involved between the two cars, a notion that was being questioned in this thread. If I could get your deal, the additional $8,900 plus the tax on that additional amount is just under $10k. Now, for other people reading the thread who want an automatic tranny, add $1275 (or, I believe that dealer cost would be about $1170; my Acura salesman told me the 330 has a 9% markup, and that seem to be right on with the figures you gave as cost) to the 330ci and lop a bunch off the CL and the gap widens. The cars are just in a different price class and for some people the choice is not simply a matter of which car is better.

Hate to over-explain, but lest anyone be confused by what I'm getting at, I'm happy for you to have that car--I'd love it too--and I don't think you made any kind of mistake or overpaid. People here just want to know the facts I think (I hope), and everyone has different criteria for making a decision, and knowing the costs of each is part of it. Some people think I'm a nut for owning a Machintosh G4 computer when I could own a Pentium for less and steal everyone's software--I have my reasons. Or when I have no problem dropping a couple of thousand into a pair of stereo speakers when they paid less at Best Buy for for bigger cabinets with a lot more speakers in them :P

Anyway, it's clear now that it wasn't the $2k+ Siggy had slated, but the ~$10k and up that most of us who've shopped already knew. Thanks for clearing it up--at least now I know I'm not living in some alternate dimension

codehead

Um, you know what "leatherette" means, don't you? hehe

codehead

Well, nope, nope, and yes. Not trying to nit-pick you to death Siggy--sorry. The first two are part of the premium package, the third I said you were wrong in a previous post but I see what you meant now. I thought you meant the optional wheel package (18"), not the wheels that come with the Sport package.

And I hadn't noticed the rear power windows in the 330. In the CL, I was momentarily dumbfounded when I reached down to fiddle with the windows--I'm used to having four in my Legend (but truth be known I get a tiny bit annoyed in the extrememly rare case there's a rear passenger in my car that uses 'em, so I don't give a poop--LOL. Still, it's a nice feature for most people).

But just to letcha know... the 2003 CL does... have... (drum roll) auto-up!

As for audio systems, in my younger days I managed a high-end car audio shop--way back in the days before car audio became popular (man, my friends sometimes tell me my '75 Honda Civic is still the best car system they ever heard So, I know about factory car audio systems. I also know Bose blows--never heard a Bose speaker I liked even a little. Now you might think I'd trick mine out pretty good, but the fact is I don't drive much and spend most of my time here in my office/studio with biamped studio monitors so I don't care much about car audio (I do kinda like that the CL has cassette and CD changed in dash, cuz I can play my old cassette music and ideas tapes without transferring to CD--I'm not talking about pre-recorded cassette). For the CL I'd proabbly add a sub and replace the speakers if they are offensive--nothing big. If I wanted some really good portable audio, I'd probably get an iPod.

But, I'm impressed that the 330 system has a couple of subwoofers. I haven't listened to their system, but it seems to have a good chance of being better than the CL's. I'd probably want to add a changer though, cuz my kid has to have his faves on tap (got a 10-changer in my Legend).

The split fold-down seats I like too. Annoying that the CL has a pass-through for skis (yay--so lame in the Legend to bring skis), but can't wear chains (grrr--what good does the pass-thru do for me?). I only ski in the dead of winter, so that really "frosts" me. Gotta take the girlfriend's Accord (man, a couple of weekends ago I did a 720 spin at about 60 mph after hitting a surprise sheet of ice--managed to come through fine--whew).

Some other nice little features I like on the 330--the integral support for roof racks and such. Those Germans think of everything.

JerryL

Codehead:
I paid $38,530.00 not including taxes or tags. Are you saying you purchased your car for $29,630.00 before taxes and tags? This would be the $8,900.00 price difference that you are talking about. You got a great deal on the CL-S then. They are not discounting them at all in my area. I would have had to pay $33,180.00 (list price) for the vehicle.
In my case $38,530.00 minus $33,180.00 equals the price difference of $5,350.00
It was a easy choice even with my fogged head.

codehead

OK, I was going by your first post in this thread: "I paid $1000 over invoice ($37,900) for my fully loaded (no navi) 330Ci." So, I took that to mean $38,900.

CL-S 6MT list is $31,030 ($30,550 plus $480 destination). Your price ($33,180) is with Navi. I have zero interest in navi cuz I only drive where I've lived all my life.

Anyway, my guy says $30k and he'll toss in the mud guards and wheel locks (actually, he said he might be able to go a little lower, but that's a pretty good deal). I made sure there were no hidden extras. I asked what the tax and everything extra to get it out the door would be, and he says it adds about 9% (sales tax here 8.25%). I've been talking to this guy for a while and he's trustworthy, so I'm not worried about the deal changing when it shows up. They only got in silver so far, so he's looking for my color with no demo miles (and I didn't even have to ask for that last part).

In fact, back in December I was wondering if I shouldn't just go ahead and get the automatic, thinking they'd jack the price on the manual, and he talked me into waiting--he assured me they wouldn't ding me with extras and said I'd be so much happier with it. He was pretty excited about it then and now that it's out he says his dad is getting one to replace his used NSX for better general utility and the guy says he's getting one for himself. That's a little off topic, but it's nice to work with a salesman who really likes the cars and the commission isn't everything (before the 6MT came out he invited me to bring my son and take the NSX on the showroom floor for a spin).

He even set me up with a guy at the BMW place (same owners) that would treat me fairly, and insisted that I try the 330ci out. (The kicker is that I had talked with the BMW guy before--when he was at Acura--and already knew he was an honest and upfront guy.) The BMW guy was apologetic that he couldn't get me a manual to test drive, but was ready to take me out in an automatic, and took my number in case a manual came in and the buyer dropped out of the deal. I declined the drive in the automatic, but I might do it tomorrow, just so I get an idea of the handling.

codehead

heyhey--pretty funny that you can't get a deal from Acura but you get a #$%^! rockin' deal on BMW--good job

cnatra

Yeah! That's the complete opposite of things down here!!


BMW, Mercedes & even Audi to a degree , rare to get less
than sticker BUT Acura , no problem getting a deal.

cnatra

hmmm......retrofit ???


Yes, BOSE home audio does suck! the 901's especially! all hype!

So I gotta ask Codehead, what kind of home speakers you got ?

B&W ?? Martin Logan ??

asalatt

I test drove the G35. At first glance it looked pretty nice inside out. However, when I got into the car and drove it, I didn't think it was worth $30k at all. CL-S drives much smoother. Also, the meterial, plastic and stuff, reminded me of my Civic. But the guy at the dealer told me that they are getting the G35 coupe by the end of this year, it's gonna be 280hp and around $35k-$40k

momentum3.2

I'd have to stand right behind Cnatra on this one here stating that these vehicles ARE made in good ole US of A, as well as the entire Benz ML line (including the $65k 345hp ML55) are made right here in Alabama. If you don't believe me, drive/fly/take a train down here and see it for yourself. The plant is in Vance, Alabama, about 45 miles away from the new Honda plant for the Odyssey and Engine R & D.