I will try to explain as best as i can. I currently have the comptech supercharger, scalbert's intercooler and emanage. I have recently gotten tuned and WOT is great. On my wideband i am running safely making good smooth power. Some things that no one can explain to me is: i have a 9lb pulley but i am boosting 12.5lbs max and before the intercooler i had the higher boost pulley that was or is suppose to peak at about 7.5lbs but i was hitting 10lbs. Nobody knows why. I am now tuned on 12.5lbs of boost safely even though it shouldn't be at that boost in the first place. Another issue is that everything is great WOT but partial throttle boosting anywhere from 1lb to about less than 5lbs in 1st, 2nd, 3rd the car will suddenly go really lean on my AEM UEGO (air/fuel ratio gauge) to off the charts lean that you can truly feel the car being starved for fuel. A few days ago this problem was only in 1st gear which also has the problem not boosting but even right before it is about to hit any boost. Slowly it started happening to second gear boosting in the 3-4lb range for a few seconds and then it began happening in third gear boosting in the same range for a few seconds more than 2nd gear. It is not a spark plug issue becuase i just changed those last week. Before this problem happens everything seems good and out of nowhere it shoots to lean until i clutch in.
Any help would be appreciated because i need it. Thanks

 

this is the reason I am not doing FI, never heard of a smooth drive after install.

 

try explaining your problem in steps and seperating everything 1 by 1 and let me see if i can understand what your problem is.

 

Do you have a fuel pressure gauge on your setup? I suspect your FPR or pump.

 

There are a lot of guys running a standard Comptech setup with no problems at all.

 

yeah it sounds like a fuel delivery problem, maybe your injectors are clogged. Did you upgrade your fuel delivery system when adding the S/C?

 

Too much air not enough fuel or too much fuel not enough air, mixture must be darn near perfect for any engine to run smooth regardless if it's FI or NA.

-Injectors are too small when you upgraded...(assuming)
-Injectors are dirty
-Fuel system is clogged, i.e., filter, pump, rail
-Intake manifold is dirty, i.e., carbon build up
-Intake is dirty or clogged...check throttle body too.

This DIY fix would drive anybody nuts.

 

1. boosting 12.5lbs when i am supposed to be maxing out at about 9lbs (9lb pulley)

2. I got tuned 2-3 weeks after running the base map that came with the emanage kit which caused me to be super rich.
In my 1st Tuning day we saw that there seemed to be a problem with being able to hold a nice steady air/fuel ratio but i was still able to gain power in the tune, so it was suggested that maybe my spark plugs were fowled because of being rich for so long. I changed those and found that 2 of the plugs were bad because the ceramic part of it surrounding the winch (sp.) was cracked probably causing no spark in both. If you shake these 2 plugs, the ceramic part gaps the plug too much. None of these plugs appeared to be fowled because none of them became black.
We thought that changing the plugs would make everything good and better and it did for WOT for the 2nd TUNING session because my power was being delivered so smoothly throughout my dyno graph and such big jump in horsepower and torque.

3. BIG PROBLEM : A few days after the 1st tuning day before changing the spark plugs, in PARTIAL throttle (tippin), anywhere from 1 vac to any point of boost below 5lbs (mostly in boost) in 1st gear, the car would seem fine at first for 1 second or 3 and all of a sudden the car would become super LEAN. It becomes so lean that you can feel the car basically stall out which is when i would immediately clutch in because the motor is so starving for fuel.
5lbs of boost to flooring the gas the car would be fine.
A few days later, the same thing starts happening in 2nd gear but it would take a few more seconds of being in that boost range for it to lean out as severely as first gear.
A few days ago, same thing happens while being in third gear but it takes 1second or 2 more than 2nd gear while holding the gas steady in these low boost conditions.

I went back for my 2nd Tune Day and made more power than my first dyno day and my 4th and higher gears are fine no matter what kind of throttle but the other gears maintain having an AIR/FUEL ratio problem at 5lbs and less boost holding the gas for that range of boost. He tried a partial throttle tuning and it didn't make a difference. The problem still exists.

What problem are we missing??? The only thing tweaked for tuning ever was my Air/Fuel ratio. Nothing else was adjusted. My current idle Fuel Pressure is set at 30psi. Please someone tell me what's wrong with the car because nobody that i speak to knows why there is a problem.!!!!!

 

I can't really help... but how much power you putting down?

 

well, the injectors are stock, the icebox filter itself is clean and i don't know about the rest.
The car is running good over 5lbs especially WOT but moments it will go to rich and then suddenly jump to Super Lean like it just ran out of gas. I don't know what to do.

 

Still check the rest of the list just to make sure...It'll be a pain but at least they will be ruled out, check your fuel pressure if you have the right tools.

 

I still think it's FPR or pump related.

Also, compare your boost/vac readings with a manual gauge.

 

I had a fuel pressure connected between the FPR and fuel rail and it was giving accurate readings. If it were the pump or FPR then how was i able to tune for WOT with really smooth lines and able to hold about a 12.2 air/fuel ratio.

When you say manual gauge, what do you mean? i'm not using a digital gauge.?

 

The FPR is a rising rate fuel pressure regulator which varies based upon vacuum. WOT is zero vacuum or boost. Part throttle situations are variations between idle and vacuum and WOT. If the rising rate FPR is not rising at the designed curve, you'll have a problem. If I remember correctly, along with the Scalbert setup, he also had some modifications to the FPR to get the AFR to stay in the correct range. Is your FPR modified or is it a standard setup? There have been occurance of the FPR failing to perform up to spec also.

http://www.acura-cl.com/forums/showt...light=Scalbert
http://www.acura-cl.com/forums/showt...light=Scalbert
http://www.acura-cl.com/forums/showt...light=Scalbert

Here's a link to the Intercooler Installation Manual. Did you modify your FPR?
http://www.hopesystemsinc.com/dowloa...stallation.doc


When I say manual gauge, do you have access to another vacuum gauge to do a comparison against yours? Just wondering if your boost issue is real or a gauge calibration issue.

I have one of these in my tune up tool kit. Just tee one of these off of the upper plenum vacuum lines and see what you get. Tape it to your windshield or run it into your cabin without pinching it and compare to your other gauge.
http://www.sears.com/sr/javasr/produ...TOOL&ihtoken=1

 

There are different washers and springs for the FPR to give different fuel delivery curves.

Though the Comptech FPRs work well, they have been known to fail.

Also, I've never heard of anyone running your levels of boost without a supplemental injector.

And my Boost gauge is always optimistic. It reads 5psi and I know my low boost setup is only making 3-3.5 lbs.

 

check your FPR. take it apart and redo the washer and spacer.

 

Um... 12.5psi on a stock motor... are you taking bets to see how long you'll last before a piston goes and/or the block is cracked?

 

I modified the FPR to idle at 32psi. It is rising in rate but i don't have any way of checking it right now because i have a mechanical gauge that i just used on dyno/tuning day so i really can't check my fuel pressure in load.
I believe that the regulator itself is fine because it is brand new. On my last one the pressure couldn't be adjusted and it was stuck at 70psi idled so it was just kept dumping fuel. I don't exactly remember what the max psi was when WOT but the car runs like a dream in WOT.
Something happened to my partial throttle after my first tune before 5lbs of boost.
In WOT my A/F ratio will range at the lowest 10.5 sometimes and highest to about 12.5. In partial it will be in the same range and out of nowhere it jumps to 11 or lower then to 17 and higher.
Fuel delivery seems great at 5lbs or higher boost but that partial aches.

Isn't there only one way to install a boost gauge and it shouldn't need recalibration but i will take your advice soon and make a comparison.

 

I hope the catastrophic failure you describe doesn't happen, but is there a desired or a given spec as to which the supercharger belts or supposed to be torqued at or what? I know that if you it's loose you make more power (maybe boost) but if it's too tight then your power gain is less. I know i am boosting high. Each pulley i've gone through: standard comptech pulley, higher boost pulley, and know scalberts 9lb pulley makes me boost higher. ?????

 

Yeah, but maybe it's just surprised and showing a quick peak at 5lbs and then faultering down to 3.5lbs or so. I don't think my regulator has failed because that WOT is fuel is being delivered optimally

 

Even if my pressure is accurate??

 

As far as belt tension, this is a good way to tell if the belt is tight enough or too tight:
https://acurazine.com/forums/showthread.php?t=174195

 

actually, i should of asked if you got a different washer and spacer with the IC kit? reason for this is because it set the FPR at a different fuel curve and lowers that pressure. too high of a fuel pressure will max out the injectors.

i never had problems with my IC kit, so i would suggest checking the fuel system first. unless you hooked up the rpm signal from e-manage wrong, that will cause fuel problem too.

 

I'll try to speak to Steve Calbert tomorrow thanks guys

 

Well, where to start. So many questions, so i'll just throw out some comments.

Your spark plugs ceramics falling off is a sever indication of detonation. anytime the ceramic is cracked you've got problems.

A good AF ratio is 11.8 for this motor. It is the sweet spot, anything richer won't hurt it, but leaner is bad. There is the possibility if you run to rich to wash the cylnder walls of oil and waste a ring.

Your fuel pressure at idle is too low, 30 psi is no good, should be around 40-42 psi, depends on other factors, but a good place to start is 40-42 psi.

Did you put in the walboro fuel pump? I didn't see this mentioned anywhere and I guess we're all assuming you did.

What kind of boost/pressure gauge are you using and how is it hooked up? If it's the autometer one that needs a constant supply of voltage during cranking of the engine, this could throw off the initial calibration the unit performs when the key is turned on.

Your total fuel pressure at that boost level should be close to 100psi at WOT with stock injectors. You also need an additional injector to give the stock one a break. I'd bet your maxing out your injectors and they are shutting down due to the duty cycle. This was something I was experiencing till I upgraded the stock injectors with RC 440's.

Your up.

 

First, i was told by scalbert and instructions to be at about 30lbs of fuel pressure at a 10-20 vaccuum but you are right because most turbo and supercharger applications are anywhere from 40-50psi of idle fuel pressure. I did start at 40psi and slowly took it down to 30psi and made more power.

I believe that i was detonating at some point but couldn't hear it but now that i've been describing what the car would feel like before with just the supercharger kit and higher boost pulley on, i now know that i was detonating every so often higher up in the rpm. good thing nothing blew up.

The attempt has been to get the A/F ratio to stick to about 12.2 and in WOT i guess it has been right around there give or take -+ .3.

I am currently running the fuel pump from comptech itself. I don't know if that is the Walboro pump is or not but it is the comptech pump.

My boost gauge is the autometer Phantom type. I guess it does need power and does engage when the car is on the on position. I just don't understand how it could be so uncalibrated. I'm going to get a manual gauge and make a comparison. I hope that it is my gauge that is wrong because i don't know how much longer the motor can take 12.5lbs of boost.

I wasn't aware that i had to get an additional injector with my setup. Other people have not had to do this so i would assume that i would not have to but we will see.

Today i experienced a new problem. Now constant load even after 5lbs just before WOT makes the car go from about 11 then to 17+ A/F ratio. before this problem was under 5lbs of boost. So this problem of rich to lean is getting worst day by day. I thought that it was just a Tippin area problem but now i don't know.

I amn going to attempt to get re- tuned, but this time by someone other than the one that i've been going to. I'm going to be going to allmotor's tuner (Church) since i know he has a little experience with tuning a cl-s.

Any more info??? thanks

 

Lately i have spoken to Scalbert himself and he says that maybe my car is going into loop mode. The stock ECU is attempting to compromise the values it wants in comparison to the emanage.
The next tune i will watch for my boost cut compared to my fuel pressure. Hopefully this problem is all just tuning.

We'll see if this works out

 

One problem solved:
Manual pressure gauge says that i'm peak boosting @ 9lbs and dropping as i go up in the rpm.

 

Yeah... sounds like you've got a faulty MAP sensor or gauge. Happened to me twice with Autometer's crap.

12.5psi couldn't have been the actual boost level... that blower isn't capable of reaching that compression without ripping itself apart very quickly.

 

That's what I was banking on. Glad you've isolated the problem to the gauge.

 

Bringing this thread back b/c of similar hardware and reading relation.

I got my AEM wideband air/fuel guage installed today and it seems to be running very very lean. At idle it hovers around 15.5 then when I rev it, it goes down to approx 14 give or take a few 10ths. Then as the RPMs come back down it goes off the charts above 17 and reads "---" BTW, the car runs great so I never thought anything was wrong till now.

My fuel pressure idles at 28 psi then goes up to 45+ at WOT.

1. jw/cls03, did you ever find out if your AEM guage was crap or was it working fine?
2. I'm guessing if your guage was working fine, I need to get an aftermarket fuel pump and adjustable FPR just to start?

3.5L, headers, intake

 

Take a look at my dyno, my A/F was reading very high, but when they tuned the Unichip the A/F went down at high RPMs...

I would say your car runs just fine. Or maybe it needs a tune.

 

Your fine. Perfect idle and regular driving conditions is 14.7 and when you rev it real quick and then let off it is just to fast of a change for it and it wacks out.

 

My gauge is perfect. When you let off the gas, the wideband will go off the charts lean. That is completely normal. If you are flooring it and it is reading 15.5 or higher being N/A then that is a problem. You'll get the hang of reading the gauge eventually. Just remember that as you are rising in the RPM (w/ stock ECU or tuned with a fuel management) that your A/F should be getting more rich than lean. It wouldn't be a bad idea to get a better fuel pump and FPR with your stroked motor though or even bigger injectors. Enjoy!

 

Ok, took it out for a spin last night and it was dry so I could open it up. I actually paid attention to the fuel pressure and noticed it idled at 27, then at WOT, went up to only 37. I was totally mistaken last time I thought it went up to 45.

Jay, you're exactly right, as I was able to open it up on the street I noticed it went down into the 13s, and even high 12s once. And as I decellerated it always spiked.

Next is FPR, Fuel Pump and a quick check of the injectors and fuel setup.

 

long story short to much fuel not enougth timmiing to make the fuel burn with causes det.