NOLACLS

The grounding wires I NEED INPUT ASAP

I took my car in for a few other things but mainly the drivers headlight is out and the highbeem s are on slightly (brown color) and when you turn the HB's on the drivers side one goes out and the passenger side comes on like normal. I got a call from them saying the head service guy is saying its from the grounding wires that I put on 6 months ago...how in the fuk is it from them....they don't even hook to any component of the fuken headlights

So I am waiting on a call from the head service guy to talk to him...WTF is it even remotely possible that the wires that have been on there just all of a sudden make the headlights short out and NOTHING ELSE...even tho they are not even hooked to the headlights???

I also have pics of what my headlights look like if someone can hst them.

Pics of wires here http://www.acura-cl.com/forums/showt...d&pagenumber=5
ARRRRRRRRRRHHHHHHHHH always something!

Jens H.

You used the factory grounds to secure your aftermarket stuff .BAD idea ! most likely you did not secure them properly or the aftermarket stuff is preventing a good ground for the factory stuff .Looking at the pics I can see where the aftermarket stuff was grounded .Not their bad from the looks of it ,looks like your bad this time .I always said those silly extra ground wires were not a good idea .

Jens

NOLACLS

ohhh no...that is not what I wanted to hear man So how is that possible...if it is the same grounds as the stock....how can that be bad...and why would it take this long to short out....and why would it only be the headlights and nothing else...and the headlights are not even hooked to the ground wires????

CO-CL-S

Like Jens said. Someplace in your "Extra ground wires", you did not make a good connection, and it has now come loose.. Happens all the time when you don't have a good ground connection on trailer lights..

NOLACLS

They are not loose at all...they are all sacure in the same places????

Smitty

All I know is that I bought a grounding kit and installed it 2 months ago.. I have not had any problems.... and the whine I had through the stereo from when the blower was installed is gone..


So Jens, your telling us to dump the grounding kit?

NOLACLS

Yeah I have had these on there for like 4 or 5 months with absolutly nothing else going wrong...and then one sec the lights are 100% ok and then next time I turn the car on they messed up. I just dont get it....

Actualy I didnt even turn the car on...when I unset the alarm I saw the lights not like they were when I parked...

NOLACLS

And there are sooo many other electrical things under the hood that are probably more closely connected to the wires...why didn't they short out to????

ChadT

A ground wire can't "short out" unless it gets hooked to something hot. The whole car is grounded. There is no way the grounding kit is causing this unless it wore through a wire that is a power wire or one of the ground wires has come loose. Tightening a ground wire shouldn't cost you anything if that's all it is. I'd check the main ground near the battery and make sure it's tight. Get them to explain to you EXACTLY how the grounding kit caused this.

NOLACLS

That is exactly what I think...it is not hooked to any hot wires at all...not loose...and didn't wear through anything...I just don't get how these wires could cause anything let alone isolate it to just the headlights...I mean no check engine light...nothing...you would think if it had "shorted" out something it would have made the check engine light come on...or something....

Any other insite very welcome!!

ChadT

It does sound a lot like a loose ground wire could be causing the problem but that should be a simple fix. Extra ground wires certainly wouldn't damage anything.

NOLACLS

So if one was loose you could tighten it up and the lights should work again...if so this is not the case...all the wires are tight and have been.

I still don't think its these wires that did something....arrhh it just burns me up when this happens....if it is the wires I don't mind shelling out the $$ to fix it...I am a reasonable man...but hell I just don't see it....

NOLACLS

I have a pic of what the lights look like if someone can host it

ChadT

If it's something other than a loose ground see if you can get the service manager to explain exacly how the ground wires are causing a problem with the headlights.

NOLACLS

I am...I still have not talked to the head service guy and he is the one saying no...so we will see...I have talked to the service guy that I always drop my car off to and I dont think he thinks its from the wires either...he said he will talk to the guy and get him to call me...I hope he can make the head guy see that its not the wires....because I really think they are....but if he shows me how it IS...and I mean show me...not just say it is....then I will gladly pay for it.

ChadT

Let us know what happens.

NOLACLS

Ohhh I will

proaudio22

I think the main advantage of a grounding kit like this is simply that it's better than the stock grounds. I almost think the same effect could be had by simply upgrading all the factory grounds (the big ones I mean - battery, block, etc).

Jens H.

The explanation given by the service writer sounds a bit funky because the service writer most likely is not a mechanic .SIMPLE thing is the headlamps are grounded where NOLACLS has his add on ground .Now if the service department sees that the lights are not working the first thing they check is the fuses the second is the grounds .Seeing that the grounds are modified from stock they return the grounds to stock and VOILA the lights are working .WHAT DOES THIS TELL YOU? the addon grounding kit created a problem .................what is so difficult to understand?

As far as the grounding kit goes??? well if you wanna blow a few bucks on a brightly colored bunch of wires that is perfectly fine with me .I said back then and I'll say it now ,you can do the same with spool of wire and a few connectors for a total cost of a about ten bucks and a two cans of beer.If your car as one person noted did actually show a reduction in stereo noise what does that tell you about the factory grounds ???? they were corroded and needed to be replaced .Adding another 10 pounds of wire solved a problem but did not actually fix the car the right way .

What the service writer said about "short circuit" is as we all know incorrect .You cannot short circuit a ground but what you can do is introduce resistance which will play havoc with the car's electrical system including the failure of the headlights .However what the service writer got accross is that the added grounds were causing the problem .Now he could have made it a lot easier if he had just said that instead of adding the "short circuit " bit but he probably figured this was easier than trying to explain Ohm's law to a customer .Simple problem simple solution and the lesson learned is ............if it ain't broke ,don't fix it

Jens

ChadT

Other than a factory ground wire that was damaged during installation of the kit or a loose screw holding a factory ground that was left loose from the installation of the grounding kit I don't understand what harm the kit could cause. None of the factory grounds are alterd, moved or replaced.

AkuraCLS

if thats the case, they why change it in the first place?

Jens H.

Take minute to read the original post and you will see what "harm " was caused by what seems to be a "harmless" mod.Like I said if it ain't broke don't go fixin it.

Jens

ChadT

So how exactly does the grounding kit cause a problem with the headlights?

NOLACLS

Ok...let me clear it up a bit...they did not say "short circuit"...they didn't say much...actually I didn't get my chance to talk to the service manager until almost 5 my time yesterday(he was supposed to call me after lunch). He just said that the tec told him the ground was messing up the lights. So he said no go on the change. When I talked to them they had not unscrewed anything...they did not unhook my ground wires and the lights started working...nothing like that. When I talked to the service manager I wanted him to tell me why they thought the lights were not working from the ground...because I still don't think its from that. I also don't see how the lights are grounded in my extra ground. The wire you see going to the headlights are not...the wire is grounded where the battery is grounded to the frame of the car under the plastic...its by the lights but not touching them at all. That is why I am having a hard time believing its the ground.

A little background on this service manager....this is the same guy that got mad at me and tried to charge me for a new tranny when I first came to him with a problem in my 01 CL-S...I knew for 100% fact that its was a wide spread issue but he wasn't having it...I mod the car I must race the car and I did the damage. Now I am the first one to say I did wrong and ill pay...but I knew this was not the case. SO after long long debates and calling the regional manager down we get to the bottom of it...it was a faulty tranny...and then the 01 proceeds to go back in 2 more times for a faulty tranny. He has also giving me slack about other strange problems (like on my 01 my driver side headlight had gone out with NO wires) that were ultimately seen to be a faulty car issue not my modding. He also gave me hell when I went with the actuator problem....twice....actuwhat...we see no codes and the car seems to run fine!

But here is the outcome of this...when I was talking to the service manager just simply trying to "understand" why they caused this problem (1 for my own knowledge and 2 for everyone else here that has these wires) he was starting to get a little mad...like usual..and then said...look...I will tell the tec to tear into it...and find exactly what the problem is...and then when he finds it...if its your problem you will pay for the part AND the time he spends looking (he will clock in and out) and if its not your problem we will fix it. I said will he use meters and testers to 100% find this problem...he said yes. SO I told him I will be there at 7am for them to start on this. I just wanted to get to the bottom of this to know what "really" happened. I got a call about 5 min later saying that the service manager went out there and tested some things real quick or whatever...and I didn't have to go in in the morning...HE IS GOING TO SWITCH THE LIGHT OUT UNDER WARRANTEE!

Now I am not 100% sure what he did or found...but part of me whats to ask...and part of me wants to leave well enough alone. I know if I ask he will take it as me trying to rub something in his face...but that is not the point...I just want to know what happened...if its the silly wires...I will take them off...I got them for free trying to let this guy get measurements for everyone else on here to buy. I still just don't see what happened...they were not loose...worn through or anything......it took 6 months from the wires going on to the light going out and I don't see how the lights directly were grounded by these extra wires...so I just wanted to know what happened.

NOLACLS

Here are a what my lights were doing.

fuzzy02CLS

iTrader: (2)

Why continue to go to this dealer? I'd just find another one. Maybe the bulb was out, or headlight had a short in it. Sounds to me they don't know what they are talking about, & hate mods. I know the feeling. Glad it worked out.

NOLACLS

This is the only acura dealer in the new orleans area. The service guy I dropped my car off to seems to think its the same problem I had on my 01...some transformer thing that is under the headlight.

bigman

it's this simple. anytime you mess with the electrical system on a car, the dealer can blame you fo any electrical problems.

NOLACLS

I just talked to my service guy at acura....they tested and found that the light problem was NOT caused by the grounding wires. I dont know what they did but that is what I was juat told


I knew it...thanks everyone for input good and bad

Jens H.

ok cool so life is good again.

Jens

NOLACLS

Yes sir it is...thanks for your insight Jens...even tho it was not on my side

ChadT

Cool! Good to hear it's fixed.

CO-CL-S

Won't they tell you what the problem was?

CO-CL-S

Won't they tell you what the problem was?

Edward'TLS

Because they made a mistake, there really was no problem with the grounding. The problem is the stupid technician/mechanic who didn't know how to fix Acura's.

EricL

I had a MORON at a Nissan dealership (years ago) tell me my Maxima barely passed smog due to poor grounding on the 92 models. The 02 sensor was replaced a few months later when the engine lamp came on. The next test came up super clean. The service manager offered to put on an expensive “grounding kit” just as an insurance (Yep, they were insuring their profits.)

So much for “needing” “extra” grounding; it passed both times, but barely passed with the "funky" 02 sensor.

Seems that grounding is the new "catch-all" for lazy techs...

I was waiting to see if someone was going to say the extra ground wires caused a "ground loop."

Edward'TLS

Speaking about ground loop, it is a nightmare for micro-electronics and RF (radio frequency)/microwave circuitries designers. The reason is that small current (milli-amps) flowing in the ground loop can cause small voltage potential difference (milli-volts) which may interfere with the normal opertion of low voltage car electronics.

But the car headlight (HID or tungsen or halogen) circuitry is a high current (many amps), relay-based system, and runs at at least +12V or above for HID. As long as the original factory headlight system grounding wires are not altered, any addition ground wire will have NO effect on the normal operation of the headlight system.

However, delicate electronics such as radios, stereos, engine computers, etc. may have a better chance of being affected by "extra" ground wires or different grounding points.

ChadT

Here's a good description of "ground loops" in case anyone is wondering. Doesn't sound like the grounding kit would create one as it doesn't connect directly to a power source at any point. I just skimmed through the article briefly though.

Grond loop