sales tax
Thread Starter
nItIn
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 935
Likes: 0
From: Live in Philly, Work in New York
sales tax
<font color=red>ok, this is kinda long .. but I'd appreciate any feedback!</font>
so .. as some of you might know, I've been looking around for buyers for my CL-P. Well, I found one (lets call him X), who agreed to pay me 25.5 .. but the problem is that X called me back today saying, the sales tax on that purchase is gonna be 6.5% (he lives in minneapolis .. fotis/lloyd is this accurate?)
so anyways, all of a sudden X isnt too interested anymore. Makes sense, cuz that'll take him over 27K for a used CL-P w/o navi!
So I'm trying to figure out a way outta this problem. The only one idea I've been given is to do an in/out .. since my next car is gonna be a CL-S or a TL-S as well, I've been told that my dealer can cut me a break on the sales tax on my next car, and I'd be willing to go half/half with X on that break, basically instead taking advantage of the sales tax all by myself, bring his price for the car down by about $600/700
What do you guys think? Do you know any other way out of this sales tax mess? Is it true that he's gonna have to pay so much tax buying this car from me, even though I've already paid tax on the car?
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2001 CL - Nighthawk Black ext: Ebony int; Coming soon: '02 TL-S Wood Steering; Tints; Aftermarket Wood Trim
so .. as some of you might know, I've been looking around for buyers for my CL-P. Well, I found one (lets call him X), who agreed to pay me 25.5 .. but the problem is that X called me back today saying, the sales tax on that purchase is gonna be 6.5% (he lives in minneapolis .. fotis/lloyd is this accurate?)
so anyways, all of a sudden X isnt too interested anymore. Makes sense, cuz that'll take him over 27K for a used CL-P w/o navi!
So I'm trying to figure out a way outta this problem. The only one idea I've been given is to do an in/out .. since my next car is gonna be a CL-S or a TL-S as well, I've been told that my dealer can cut me a break on the sales tax on my next car, and I'd be willing to go half/half with X on that break, basically instead taking advantage of the sales tax all by myself, bring his price for the car down by about $600/700
What do you guys think? Do you know any other way out of this sales tax mess? Is it true that he's gonna have to pay so much tax buying this car from me, even though I've already paid tax on the car?
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2001 CL - Nighthawk Black ext: Ebony int; Coming soon: '02 TL-S Wood Steering; Tints; Aftermarket Wood Trim
on bin laden
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 4,696
Likes: 0
From: Bloomington, MN
yes - sales tax is 6.5% here ... unfortunately, i dont know how to mess w/the tax laws ...
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Black 2001 Type S
*Eibach Pro-Kit (Waiting to be installed)
*Xephyr Cold Air Intake
*PIAA 19169 Road Lamps
*Rockford 500a2 [FOR SALE]
*Pioneer 12" @ 400w (x2) [FOR SALE]
*77237-SOK-A02
---Still 2 rims not scratched---
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Black 2001 Type S
*Eibach Pro-Kit (Waiting to be installed)
*Xephyr Cold Air Intake
*PIAA 19169 Road Lamps
*Rockford 500a2 [FOR SALE]
*Pioneer 12" @ 400w (x2) [FOR SALE]
*77237-SOK-A02
---Still 2 rims not scratched---
Thread Starter
nItIn
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 935
Likes: 0
From: Live in Philly, Work in New York
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by fbazakos:
yes - sales tax is 6.5% here ... unfortunately, i dont know how to mess w/the tax laws ...
</font>
yes - sales tax is 6.5% here ... unfortunately, i dont know how to mess w/the tax laws ...
</font>
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2001 CL - Nighthawk Black ext: Ebony int; Coming soon: '02 TL-S Wood Steering; Tints; Aftermarket Wood Trim
FvCK KNvCKLE
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 2,368
Likes: 0
From: Detroit, MI.
Yeha, but the problem with his (X's) line of thinking is this. WE ALL PAY TAX. Say your MSRP was 30,810. And the dealer didn't negotiate down. Now add the 2002.65 and you paid 32,810.65 not 30,810. It sucks but it's a way of life. He is not getting a CL-P for 27,175 he is getting it for 25,500. The state of minnesota is getting the 1,700 dollars. not you.
I have never seen a used car add that states the price after sales tax. NEVER. If X can't comprehend it, find another buyer. His expectations are too high. We all pay it, why should you take the hit.
The real problem here is the ability of the states to re-tax a vehicle every time it changes hands. You pay, X's pays, his brother pays in 3 years when he buys it from him. The whole thing stinks. I've always hated it.
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- As long as people will accept crap, it will be financially profitable to dispense it.
01 Type-S
Satin Silver/Ebony
Navigation-Spoiler-Muds-Wheel locks-35% Tint-PIAA wedges-V1 and remote
I have never seen a used car add that states the price after sales tax. NEVER. If X can't comprehend it, find another buyer. His expectations are too high. We all pay it, why should you take the hit.
The real problem here is the ability of the states to re-tax a vehicle every time it changes hands. You pay, X's pays, his brother pays in 3 years when he buys it from him. The whole thing stinks. I've always hated it.
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- As long as people will accept crap, it will be financially profitable to dispense it.
01 Type-S
Satin Silver/Ebony
Navigation-Spoiler-Muds-Wheel locks-35% Tint-PIAA wedges-V1 and remote
Race Director
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 10,121
Likes: 0
From: Overland Park, Kansas
This is not entirely true. There are lots of laws on the books that allow you to reduce the amount of the taxable purchase price by the amount of a [recent] trade-in vehicle or other factors.
Yes, a vehicle gets taxes over and over and over but if you buy a car out of state, you don't have to pay the sales tax on it [in some states] until later or never in which case, you'll have to answer to the law.
In Kansas, I believe that before you register the car and get your tabs, you must provide proof of payment of sales tax on a bill of sale. Really can't avoid that on a new car purchase....used car is a different story. Tax rate is 5 or 6 percent, you know the drill.
Being a former Minnesotan, I have a friend who purchase a vehicle out of state and never registered that car in Minnesota (still register in another state) and hasn't paid Minnesota one dime even though he's a Minnesota resident. People from WI, SD, ND, and IA living in Minnesota do it all the time.
BTW, a vehicle is personal property and subject to sales tax. It's no surprise to any adult.
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* 2001 Acura CL Type S * Blk/Blk * Navigator * Spoiler * Moonroof Visor * V1 *
* Since 3/31/2000 *
* Road Warrior *
Yes, a vehicle gets taxes over and over and over but if you buy a car out of state, you don't have to pay the sales tax on it [in some states] until later or never in which case, you'll have to answer to the law.
In Kansas, I believe that before you register the car and get your tabs, you must provide proof of payment of sales tax on a bill of sale. Really can't avoid that on a new car purchase....used car is a different story. Tax rate is 5 or 6 percent, you know the drill.
Being a former Minnesotan, I have a friend who purchase a vehicle out of state and never registered that car in Minnesota (still register in another state) and hasn't paid Minnesota one dime even though he's a Minnesota resident. People from WI, SD, ND, and IA living in Minnesota do it all the time.
BTW, a vehicle is personal property and subject to sales tax. It's no surprise to any adult.
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* 2001 Acura CL Type S * Blk/Blk * Navigator * Spoiler * Moonroof Visor * V1 *
* Since 3/31/2000 *
* Road Warrior *
Thread Starter
nItIn
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 935
Likes: 0
From: Live in Philly, Work in New York
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by kensteele:
This is not entirely true. There are lots of laws on the books that allow you to reduce the amount of the taxable purchase price by the amount of a [recent] trade-in vehicle or other factors.
...<snip>
In Kansas, I believe that before you register the car and get your tabs, you must provide proof of payment of sales tax on a bill of sale. Really can't avoid that on a new car purchase....used car is a different story. ....<snip>
</font>
This is not entirely true. There are lots of laws on the books that allow you to reduce the amount of the taxable purchase price by the amount of a [recent] trade-in vehicle or other factors.
...<snip>
In Kansas, I believe that before you register the car and get your tabs, you must provide proof of payment of sales tax on a bill of sale. Really can't avoid that on a new car purchase....used car is a different story. ....<snip>
</font>
I really want this deal, and so am doing the legwork to save the guy some money so he'll buy my CL-P .. so I can get my CL-S
<font color=red>Keeping my fingers crossed -> ,.&.</font>
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2001 CL - Nighthawk Black ext: Ebony int; Coming soon: '02 TL-S Wood Steering; Tints; Aftermarket Wood Trim
[This message has been edited by nabster (edited 04-06-2001).]
Instructor
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 119
Likes: 0
From: NY, NY
My god people must I teach you everything 
When you are going to sell it to him, make him pay in cash After that give him a paper saying that you sold the car to him for like 10 Grand lower and explain in the same paper that something is wrong with the vehicle, like dead transmission or engine knock, just don't overdo it so it would not put the car into the salvage territory
If he can't pay cash, tell him to pay part of it in cash and that way he only has to pay taxes from the check part of the payment.
Just for the record, in case somone from IRS is watching these forums: I am personally against tax fraud
When you are going to sell it to him, make him pay in cash After that give him a paper saying that you sold the car to him for like 10 Grand lower and explain in the same paper that something is wrong with the vehicle, like dead transmission or engine knock, just don't overdo it so it would not put the car into the salvage territory If he can't pay cash, tell him to pay part of it in cash and that way he only has to pay taxes from the check part of the payment.
Just for the record, in case somone from IRS is watching these forums: I am personally against tax fraud
Trending Topics
Thread Starter
nItIn
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 935
Likes: 0
From: Live in Philly, Work in New York
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Arik:
My god people must I teach you everything When you are going to sell it to him, make him pay in cash After that give him a paper saying that you sold the car to him for like 10 Grand lower and explain in the same paper that something is wrong with the vehicle, like dead transmission or engine knock, just don't overdo it so it would not put the car into the salvage territory
If he can't pay cash, tell him to pay part of it in cash and that way he only has to pay taxes from the check part of the payment.
Just for the record, in case somone from IRS is watching these forums: I am personally against tax fraud</font>
My god people must I teach you everything
When you are going to sell it to him, make him pay in cash After that give him a paper saying that you sold the car to him for like 10 Grand lower and explain in the same paper that something is wrong with the vehicle, like dead transmission or engine knock, just don't overdo it so it would not put the car into the salvage territory If he can't pay cash, tell him to pay part of it in cash and that way he only has to pay taxes from the check part of the payment.
Just for the record, in case somone from IRS is watching these forums: I am personally against tax fraud
</font>
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2001 CL - Nighthawk Black ext: Ebony int; Coming soon: '02 TL-S Wood Steering; Tints; Aftermarket Wood Trim
Instructor
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 141
Likes: 0
From: Ventura County, CA
I heard a rumour -- hint hint-- that you can write a bill of sale for much smaller... he can show that to the dmv, pay taxes on that. At the same time you wrote the "discounted" bill of sale, you write a second agreement with the non-discounted amount. You tell him you want the original "discounted" bill of sale" back and you keep the originally agreed upon bill of sale as the real sell proof.
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2001 CL Type S w/ NAV & Spoiler. San Marino Red/Parchment int. Purchased 2/28/01.
http://albums.photopoint.com/j/AlbumIndex?u=1584587&a=12058921
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2001 CL Type S w/ NAV & Spoiler. San Marino Red/Parchment int. Purchased 2/28/01.
http://albums.photopoint.com/j/AlbumIndex?u=1584587&a=12058921
Instructor
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 119
Likes: 0
From: NY, NY
regarding my previous post on this topic. This idea works in NY like a charm. You should check what your local DMV uses to determine the price for the car. In NY they use the book value ONLY if the price seems ridiculous. Another thing that they sometimes do in NY is force you to take the car for inspection if there is claim that something is damaged, so check if your state does any of these things. You could also just say that you agreed to this price cuz you needed to sell it fast.
Instructor
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 141
Likes: 0
From: Ventura County, CA
A legal sale of assets is for anything of value. If you sold him the car for $1, that is a legal sale. If he writes two checks to seperate parties, who can prove it was for a car - maybe you sold him a car for a $1, and key fob for $25,000.... :-)
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2001 CL Type S w/ NAV & Spoiler. San Marino Red/Parchment int. Purchased 2/28/01.
http://albums.photopoint.com/j/AlbumIndex?u=1584587&a=12058921
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2001 CL Type S w/ NAV & Spoiler. San Marino Red/Parchment int. Purchased 2/28/01.
http://albums.photopoint.com/j/AlbumIndex?u=1584587&a=12058921
Instructor
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 119
Likes: 0
From: NY, NY
As I said it all depends on the state you are in and their laws. In NY for example and I know this for a fact, if you try to sell a 2001 CL for a $1 the DMV is going to go by book value and not by bill of sale. So it is better to find a reasonable price.
Learn to swim
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 1,685
Likes: 0
From: Reno NV
In cali, we do it all the time. Sell a car for say 5000 and write a bill of sale for 300 to take to the DMV. If you sell a 27k car for a dollar you will probably have to convince them it was a gift. Like it was suggested sell the car for 25.5k and write him a slip for 15k or so for the DMV.
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01 CL-S Black/Tan
Comptech Springs, V1
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01 CL-S Black/Tan
Comptech Springs, V1
Intermediate
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 41
Likes: 0
From: San Diego, California
In most cases, it is the buyer's responsibility to provide proof of payment of sales tax when registering their vehicle so I could be very careful screwing around with tax laws. Seller's could get into some deep trouble providing false information on their bill of sale. I've seen it happen before...
Advanced
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 95
Likes: 0
From: San Francisco, California, U.S.
For info,
I worked on a state fraud task force for 1 year in CALI and believe me DMV has investigators that search out vehicles that are sold way under blue book. Both the seller and the buyer are responsible. It is not worth paying all the penalties and interest if you get caught. You might be one of the few that gets away with it, then again........
Hope this helps.
Deckard
01 Silver CL-S
98 Silver interga GS
I worked on a state fraud task force for 1 year in CALI and believe me DMV has investigators that search out vehicles that are sold way under blue book. Both the seller and the buyer are responsible. It is not worth paying all the penalties and interest if you get caught. You might be one of the few that gets away with it, then again........
Hope this helps.
Deckard
01 Silver CL-S
98 Silver interga GS
Burning Brakes
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 1,211
Likes: 0
From: LONG ISLAND NY
arik and bladerunner are are both right. you can only do a $ 1 sales to an immediate relative and you have to fill out an affidavith. you can sell the car for a couple thou under , but that is it.
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01 BLK/BLK CL-S, FACTORY SPOILER, K/N DROP IN
98 INFINITI I30T
99 MAXIMA SE
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01 BLK/BLK CL-S, FACTORY SPOILER, K/N DROP IN
98 INFINITI I30T
99 MAXIMA SE
Race Director
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 10,121
Likes: 0
From: Overland Park, Kansas
Also remember that if the buyer is going to get a loan, you can't really hide the selling price in a bill of sale.
That being said, there's no way in hell I would commit any type of fraud for the sake of selling a vehicle. You don't know the buyer, suppose he goes ahead and admits to the scam before you even get a chance to do anything. He cops a plea for no jail time and then you wonder why a sheriff is pulling you over in your CL with a warrant in hand.
Stay away from criminal activity.....
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* 2001 Acura CL Type S * Blk/Blk * Navigator * Spoiler * Moonroof Visor * V1 *
* Since 3/31/2000 *
* Road Warrior *
That being said, there's no way in hell I would commit any type of fraud for the sake of selling a vehicle. You don't know the buyer, suppose he goes ahead and admits to the scam before you even get a chance to do anything. He cops a plea for no jail time and then you wonder why a sheriff is pulling you over in your CL with a warrant in hand.
Stay away from criminal activity.....
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* 2001 Acura CL Type S * Blk/Blk * Navigator * Spoiler * Moonroof Visor * V1 *
* Since 3/31/2000 *
* Road Warrior *
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