Nashua_Night_Hawk

Here it is claims to be revolutionary....





http://www.speedoptions.com/articles...cbe1d73609fe3b

jimcol711

im not a big CAI beleiver as it is, i dont see how this could be any benefit, seems like they are trying to reinvent the wheel, its quite simple, a pipe and a filter, i dont think i beleive this helps, hell, i never beleived their dynos showing 13-15 hp...thats just silly.

ThoroDredCLS

I like the CAI aem currently offers. IF i am going to upgrade to anything it will be the comptech ice box. The V2 CAI seems like all it has over the current cai is bigger tubing. More air flow, but how much hp gain over the old one vs comptech Ice box??

Nashua_Night_Hawk

They claim it patent pending so at least it has to show some merits!

Zapata

Not a cai believer? Huh, you out of your mind? The gains aren't huge but they are gains, to deny it is plain ignorance.


If you know anything about CAI design, you'll know that the inlet plays a HUGE role in how much of benefit the CAI will give.

TypeSKid

I'm a big believer in the current AEM CAI I have.


If anyone can't notice the gains off this simple mod, ever so slight as they may be, you're an idiot.

The stock airbox is EXTREMELY restrictive. It also has a REALLY shitty tiny little filter.

The CAI allows the car to suck in MORE air, and forces it into the engine more effectively.

I don't have a bypass valve, nor do I need one. I don't plan on driving my CL thru 3 feet of water EVER.

It's rarely in the rain as it is anyhow.

ANYWAYS, the intake is essential to better performance. It compliments the headers VERY well.

This new version seems like just a marketing ploy. They've redesigned it to look more futuristic.


WHOOPD EEEE DOOOO, what does it all mean Basil? ----austin powers.

ThoroDredCLS

I don't know about you but I have been driving through the rain alot these days. Some of the areas I drive through have 2 if not 3 inches of puddles and spots. Not worried one bit. I just cleaned the cone to my cai sunday, and it even feels more responsive and louder.

jimcol711

say what you will, but i would be willing to bet that if you dyno a stock CL-S without the intake resonator and with a k&n drop in filter (that costs 40 bucks or less) and then dyno the same car with a CAI, AEM or Injen (which costs 200 + ) the dynos would be the same....MAYBE the CAI would give 1 or 2 more hp....but 1 or 2 hp is not with 160 bucks in my book. not to mention, the stock air box without the resonator and with a drop in filter is basically the same thing as an icebox and supposedly that thing gives more HP than the AEM CAI...so whatever, you guys keep your CAI and be happy with it, ill stick with my stock air box without resonator and ive got an extra 200 bucks in my pocket. to each his own

allmotor_2000

Couple of things here:

The plain-old CAI improves performance by:

(1) Keeping the air-filter (hence air-inlet) in an area that is relatively isolated from the engine-compartment - sucking in 'colder' air
(2) Equal-diameter (non-flexible) tubing allowing no flow restriction into the throttle-body
(3) Open air-filter (K&N) to further improve air-flow

The new CAI appears to do the following:

(1) Achieve (1) through (3) from above
(2) Create a resonance 'effect' by changing air-velocity (not volume... only a bigger throttle-body increase volume)

A stock air-box can nearly accomplish the gains of both systems by:

(1) Removing the resonator under the air-box. This is what actually impedes air-flow, not the box itself
(2) Connect a 4" hose to the bottom of the air-box and direct it to the front grill (if that doesn't get cold air... nothing will)
(3) Put a drop-in K&N filter

What this does it as follows:

(1) Fills the air-box with cold-air (there is a decent volume, although it could be better)
(2) There is hardly any air-flow restriction... you can fit your fist into the outlet of the air-box... not any smaller than the 3" CAI tubing
(3) Any 'venturi' or other effect created is completely negated by our intake-manifold design

The next step is to increase the throttle-body inlet opening by boring it our 3mm to 4mm and replacing the butterfly valve.

Scooter

they have GOT to get rid of the brackets!!!

anyone who understands physics knows the stress put on the pipe from driving can lead to problems...having the pipe anchored to the frame is IMO asking for trouble b/c there's no shock absorption...there needs to b some play in the pipe...i would love to see instead of a bracket a spring/shock device that can b anchored to the frame to absorb the shock

just my opinion tho

darrinb

aempower.com or autocarparts.com dont have the new v2 intake listed, where can i buy it from??

Scooter

CAI gives up to 7 - 10HP last thing i heard...a short ram prob gives 1 - 2HP

jimcol711

leaving the stock box without the intake resonator is NOT like a short ram at all....totally different setup...similar to icebox

mattg

thats what the rubber grommet is for. installed correctly the pipe can flex as needed.

people who have had problems have installed the intake incorrectly.

it's very simple really :o

ThoroDredCLS

Exactly

Zapata

again you need to look the data 1-2hp? What CAIs are you looking at? I'm not criticizing your decision BUT don't mis represent the facts.

Nashua_Night_Hawk

I am using the rubber thing over a bolt on the injen... still the the bolt thread are now stripped and the now it is loose and moves freely and rattle a bit, but I should have ket the rubber neck there which I do not have now... mistake!

typeR

t first i thought he was crazy...but he hadnt said remove lower resonator yet and drop in K&N...i might even go so far as to say the gain might even be higher.... but yes at best a CAI would be 1-3 hp more than the above described...personally i like the sound of the stock box w/res removed better but to each his own

hotelniko14

i was using the AEM CAI, and felt a loss on low end torque, which i did not like. Switched to stock air box w/o resenator & K&N filter, got back the low end torque and hopefully gained a few HP on top end....

typeR

nail on the head my friend...like a muffler there is such a thing as too free flowing(i.e. remove mufflers) and torque loss noramlly will result....

jimcol711

CAI is for sound and for show....want to have equal gains and not have the hissing of the CAI and not lose the low end torque that you lose with a CAI?? simple:

leave stock air box
get K&N drop in filter
remove intake resonator

allmotor_2000

Note the dynamics of flow here. Our motors are all relatively 'tame' by racing standards. We don't need a 20" K&N with 5" piping - it will reduce horsepower. It's the volume or air available 'when needed' is the importnat concept here. Also important is the 'velocity'. Cold air IS important... a more dense intake charge results in better combustion ~= more hp!

I spent exactly $7.97 on my intake system and I bet I make more power than an AEM CAI (v1 or v2!).

Zapata

well all the questions and BS will be put to and end soon. I"m having my stock CLS dynod and then with the comptech ice box.

ZodiakTL

u guys are forgettint that one aspect of the CAI is the C(cold air).. sitting on dyno inside a shop with a fan blowing at the car is not quite the same as running down the road with cold air being crammed into the intake at 60mph... u cant really duplicate those results on a dyno.

jimcol711

dude, no one is getting air "CRAMMED" into the intake with a CL or TL...there is no DIRECT inlet of air such as on a RAM AIR vehicle where there is an opening on the hood or bumper for the DIRECT purpose of air induction, you can put a CAI on a CL-S or TL-S all you want but if you want air to be "CRAMMED" into your intake, you need to take out the roadlamp and fabricate some kind of cone that forces all the air that comes in through the road lamp opening into the CAI filter, now the other problem is that the CAI filter has rubber over the bottom of it so even if you did this, you STILL wouldnt be getting air "CRAMMED" directly into the intake, the air has to first hit the SOLID, FLAT surface of the bottom of the filter and then work its way around to the sides of the filter which is the actual filter element. if you want to see a TRUE Ram-Air set up, you need to look at some of the older muscle cars or even the Grand Prix GTX or the Trans AM has a functional RAM AIR set up. in any case, the bottom line is, no matter what CAI you use on a CL or TL there is no "force" behind the air going into the filter and there really is no way to get said "force" to "cram" the air in without totally going back to the drawing board and experimenting with putting holes in your hood or bumper or something like that.

ZodiakTL

u obviously don't have one installed. the filter is directly in the path of the air from the front and the bottom.. there are openings on the front of the TL-S under the fog-lights, maybe not on the CL-S with the road-lamps, as well as on the underside of the car, there are openings in the cover, and the filter is directly exposed. it may not be as affective as the older muscle cars, but a hell of a lot more effective then a stock setup or removing the resonator.

Zapata

Leave Jimcol alone.....he'd rather base all his opinions on buttdynos and how the car "felt" rather than hard data.

Kkranghkar

If you don't mind me asking, how's the $7.97 you spent distributed? I'm going to take out my resonator this weekend, and I was wondering what else I should do.

jimcol711

seriously you guys are great! but aparently you missunderstood me, i had an injen CAI, and the injen is designed so that the "butt" of the filter, if you will....the bottom of it, opposite where the hole is that goes into the CAI tube, that bottom portion is directly facing forward, so even if you tried to rig something up that "crammed" the air into the area of the filter, the air would be hitting that flat, abrubt surface of the bottom of the filter....now, tell me how that is going to help your times?? if anything, the stock air box with intake res. removed is BETTER than that setup because the air doesnt get obstructed by anything on the way into its final destination, the throttle body. this FACT is most likely why the comptech icebox will be more beneficial than any of the CAI setups, because there is like an open "horn" tube that lets air get forced directly into it and then up into the icebox and on to the engine where a CAI has any air hitting the flat, solid bottom of the filter....

hotelniko14

Am i the only one that had low end torque loss with CAI? It was very noticeable....

lou_RENAMED

I agree that taken out the resonator and adding a less restrictive air filter like k&N will give you added hp without any torque loss. Personally I think that the Ice-Box is a better system simply because of the cone filter instead of the flat panel filter. The cone filter lets air to enter from any angle increasing its "sucking power" while the Box creates a reservoir of "Cold Air" from the outside. Also I believe the intake pipe of the Ice Box is not as big as the AEM hence less possible torque loss. Another great advantage of the Ice-Box over the AEM is the distance the air has to travel before it actually enters the throttle body maybe a 1 1/2 feet while AEM 2 1/2 to 3 ft. Again I am no mechanic nor an engineer just simply an informed consumer.

Six Shifter

Isn't it a bit premature to be singing the praises of a device that has yet to be released? It's one thing to speak in terms of "theoretical gains" based on a new design/product, but until the product is available to the masses, there is no real basis for comparison/contrast, is there? Not trying to flame, but just asking a logical question. I believe there were dyno's done on an early prototype, but according to Dean the ICEBOX won't be out until January due to redesign. Hence, can any data involving the ICEBOX really be considered valid? And therefore, shouldn't any comments about this be considered opinion/speculation/theory/etc?

lou_RENAMED

Who said the Ice-Box is not released the Accord is now available and I believe they were always out for the Integra. It is correct that it is not released for our car but the design is still the same. All I was mentioning are some of the advantages (design wise) that the Ice-Box has over the AEM CAI

Six Shifter

many pardons ... I mistakenly took the thread to be talking specifically about our cars, not other Honda's.

scalbert

Please stop spouting off your worthless BS. You act as though you know something but have no basis which to validate your claims. You also seem to dodge rebuttals which have solid data against your asinine claims.

Here is a dyno of a stock intake (less the resonator) and a modified AEM Accord V6 intake on an '01 CL-S. Keep in mind that along with the lower output of this AEM intake (since it was designed for the AV6) the dyno also is on a vehicle with a faulty IMRC actuator. At no point is there lower torque with modest gains throughout.

Please test something or at least KNOW something you are talking about before spouting off this drivel. I say this with irritation because I have supplied this before in response to other posts you have made on the same topic. You try to make statements based on conjecture which might hold some water if you had actual experience.

mattg

this calls for an

o snap its eric

got you there man.. but i still believe that just adding a k&n and without a resonator will pretty much have the same effect with less of a price.... but its JMO. and i like the sound of stock hehe

patsmere

I thought peak torque was from 3500-5500 rpms
or am I wrong. According to the dyno peak was at 2000-2500 rpms

NOVAwhiteTypeS

I actuallyl had this setup and on top of that I had a, yes, dryer hose run from the bottom of the airbox to the front of grill.

I did see a signaficant amount of gains but after I installed a Injen CAI i notied more gains up top. gains below vtec range was almost identical to the K&N/hose/resonator removed setup.

edgalang

Guys...one thing I found while lurking in the IS300.net forums is that the "accordian" like tubing on stock air boxes can be enough to drastically reduce HP. For IS300s anyways...if you are not comfortable using a short ram because of CARB certification, there is another (not so drastic) intake mod that only involves a replacement K&N drop in filter AND a straight through pipe. The straight through pipe has all of the nipples similar to the stock "accordian" tube and is tied down using connecting hoses (like in a CAI to intake manifold tube). The mod WAS in fact dyno proven, but the gains still was not higher than the short ram setup.

The key factors between a CAI and the stock air box is...

#1 temp of air comming in. Remove the resonator off the stock airbox and it *should achieve similar results...but the lower you get away from the engine bay, the colder air you get.

#2 How smooth the air goes in the intake. High end CAIs usually have velocity stacks to smooth out air flow (usually located in the filter head). Notice the open end tip of the icebox and how the edge is curved out like a horn? Just like a CAI...the icebox has a built in velocity stack to help with the air flow become less turbulent. It may not make a difference during a cruise...but the use of it increases as you go higher up in the RPM band where you require more air.

#3 Restrictive airflow. The more turbulence the air goes through the less HP you get. In an ideal world, you'd want the air to travel in as much of a straight line as possible. Unfortunately that's impossible so the best we can do is to try and reduce the amount of angles the air has to pass through, along with making sure the walls stay as consistent as possible.

What does this mean? Just like how a bi-pass filter reduces power for a CAI...keeping the stock "accordian" hose for a stock airbox (without resonator) does the same.

I'm sure there are many reasons why the manufacturer didn't install straight pipes to begin with (durability, sound and the ease of use in checking the air filter just to name a few) but this was in fact dyno proven. So...to those that would like to keep the stock look but increase HP for less $$$ maybe this could spark up a couple of ideas.