bigmark89

OK, so about 2months ago I put in XS Headers and I immediatley felt power. After a little while, the ECU reset itself and I got even more power. With just the headers I chirpped through 2nd which never happend when it was stock and I luved the extra power. About a week after the headers I decided to take the intake resonator out and for 15minutes of work I was also impressed with the little power(and sound) gain. I drove the car for a while and still felt the power, then I did my mid-muffler removal and magnaflow resonator replacement and loved the sound gain but no performance gain or loss(which I expected). A week after I did the exhaust mod I put in an intake and I reset my ECU. I loved the sound it made when Vtec kicked in and a little gain in power. A few days after the car just felt powerless, i mean it felt like stock again. No matter how hard I tried I barely chirpped my tires and I can clearly see the rpm's moving slower. I was fuckin pissed off, after spending the money and taking the time to install evrything the power dissapeared.

I started thinking about what the problem could be and I thought maybe my ECU robbed my power so I reset it again and it made no difference. So then I thought maybe its my IMRC, I had my friend rev it up while I was watching it to make sure it turned and it works fine. I decided to seafoam my car cuz the last time I seafoamed it I felt a little power gain, but nothing, no difference in power.

And now im utterly stumped and also quite angry that those mods where for naught. I enjoyed the power for about a month and now it reverted back to stock.

Im gonna look around and try to find a dyno shop in my area. I wanna take it and see what kind of numbers im putting down, what my A/F ratio is.


So I really need some help with this one guys. I'll take any help I can get. And anyone in the North Jersey area know of any good dyno shops?

Thanks Alot Guys
-Mark

StreetKA

iTrader: (8)

1/9 road Linden Wired Electronics they are good but not cheap wirednj.com

fuzzy02CLS

iTrader: (2)

Just cause your IMRC moves doesn't mean it's good under load or WOT.

bigmark89

So does that mean that under load or WOT it doesnt move? Or opens slowly? Can you explain a little more please.
And how would I go about checking it?

Thnx
-Mark

aznboi2424

iTrader: (10)

what magnaflow resonator did you use? and how was the sound difference? any droning on the highway?

i think what fuzzy means is that just because it moves, the butterfly plate might not open. but this would only be due to the cable breaking or something. i think the easiest way is to wait till the engine is cold and put your ear on the intake plenum, move the valve with your hand and you should hear the clink of the valve open.

bigmark89

Magnaflow 10414, 14"body, 4"round, 2.5"core with 2"inlet/outlet. It only drones between 2K and 3K rpm but i like it. And its a different type of drone than muffler drone, I cant really explain it but its differnt. I luv the way it sounds, when excelerating it sounds like a G35coupe up until about 4-4500K and after that you dont really notice any sound difference cuz the engine takes over.

-Mark

jproy

What he meant was, just because you saw the actuator move with the car sitting still, the actuator may not be working under the vibrations of load or may be working sporadically because of missing teeth on the plastic gear cog the brass pinion on the electric motor turns to pull the cable to open the IMRC. I had similar symptoms and mine was opening when I checked under the hood but I knew something wasn’t right. I replaced it anyway and the power was back. I tore open the old IMRC actuator and sure enough, right where the brass pinion sits on the cog when the IMRC is closed, two of the teeth were missing and under the vibrations of load (driving) the pinion couldn’t grab the good teeth on the cog and thus did not open the IMRC period. Keep in mind the IMRC and the VTEC are both good for an extra 20hp each and would certainly negate the power gain of your mods if just one of them was not working. You would know something was strange if either of them failed to operate.

If I were you, I would first check your oil level. Make sure the oil on the dipstick is at the right level, between the two dots at the end. If the oil is low, you may not get enough oil to the VTEC for it to open. It happened to me. She was at least a Qt. low. There was never any indication by the ECM, CEL, or OBD-2 that the oil was low. The electronic VTEC actuator solenoid was working but the oil wasn’t there to provide the hydraulics to engage the VTEC valves. I don't know if our cars will throw a CEL if the solenoid itself has failed.

Second, I would replace the IMRC actuator if you oil is not low. It’s cheap and is bound to fail at some point. IMRC actuator failure is quite common. I am sure there are people on this board that purchased there used car with a broken IMRC and dont even know what they are missing, 20 more hp. There is no CEL thrown for this either. That plastic cog just doesn’t cut it. Many of the Acura service techs don't even know what the IMRC is and don't ever check it. I had lots of experience with this when mine failed.

My money is on low oil or the IMRC actuator itself. Good luck. Jim

bigmark89

Well its not the oil, I did an oil change on monday so even if it was the oil I would have noticed the power kick back in after the oil change but there was no difference. So im gonna replace the IMRC, but before I go and order a new one im gonna take the one off my moms 03' TL-S and replace mine with it. If it makes a difference then I know I need to replace it with a new one.

EDIT: I was just thinking that when I replace mine with the one off my moms TL-S, if it does make a difference and I find out that it is the IMRC, I can just keep my moms and put mine on hers. I mean she NEVER goes into Vtec, I dont even think she takes it over 3500 RPM! so it doesnt matter if I put my malfunctioning one on hers

Thnx for the help guys Keep those responses coming!
-Mark

jproy

I would also make sure your VTEC solenoid is working. I have heard of a few cases where the switch on the block(solenoid) failed.

Dont screw your mother over! I cant believe you would even consider it! Are you really hurting for $75 that bad? Why wouldn't you want the new part on your car anyway? Hope it works out.

bigmark89

Lol, im not screwing her over, a bad IMRC wont actually hurt the car. You just lose some power after 4800rpm, and my mom never takes it near that. But i'll most likely just use hers to test out the IMRC and if I find out that its what causing the problem i'll just use hers until I get a new one and then put hers back on

I'll check out that vtec solenoid too

Thnx for the help jproy
-Mark

aznboi2424

iTrader: (10)

thats why i said to put your ear on the intake plenum so you can hear the butterfly plate turn over when you manually turn over the valve.

aznboi2424

iTrader: (10)

sorry to hijack your thread but your resonator has a 2.5" core. the 10444 has a 2" core. so im guessing the 10444 with thicker baffling would be quieter?

CleanCL

iTrader: (4)

I have a brand new IMRC I'm trying to sell if you are interested.

bigmark89

First of all, where do you plan on putting the resonator?
Are you gonna do wut I did and put it next to the cat? Or keep it in the stock location?

If you keep it in stock location even with the 2.5" core it isnt gonna make that much of a difference. I say get the 2.5" core and have it mounted half-way between the cat and the location of the origional mid-muffler. Cuz I put mine about 2" away from the cat, so if you put it down a bit in between the cat and old mid-muffler I think you'll get just the sound your looking for.

Heres a link to my thread https://acurazine.com/forums/2g-cl-2001-2003-50/resonator-placement-718928/

It would be a little quieter, it would have an extra 1/2" thick layer of that material they stuff it with to baffle noise. Also if you do go with this I recommend getting it with a 2 1/4" inlet/outlet so you save some money on having the shop have to expand the pipe to fit over the stock exhaust piping. So this way it will jst slide over the stock pipe and they'll weld it without having to make it bigger.

-Mark

bigmark89

I put my ear to the IM/Plenum and manually turned the IMRC. I listened very close but couldnt hear anything. It was a little noisey outside so maybe thats why I couldnt hear it, i'll go try again soon.

Also, where is the vtec solenoid on our cars? I know on older civics they are right in plain sight but im not sure where it is on our cars.
Anyone know?

-Mark

Echo42987

Not to thread jack, but did you ever make a video or sound clip of this yet?

aznboi2424

iTrader: (10)

there is a clip of the actuator in action in the 2G CL FAQ thread. go check it out. its under chad's FAQ or something.

if you turn it slowly it wont make a sound. turn it then release it so the plate bangs closed like how it would be if you drop below 3800. you should hear a slight tick.

yea, i saw how you put it next to the cat, which would make it noisier. i just plan to put it in the same location as the mid-muffler. so would you suggest the 2.5" core or the 2" core? and did you get the 2.25" in/outlet versus the 2"in/outlet?

bigmark89

Oh, I see. I was just turning it open and close, I wasnt releasing it from open and allowing it to close itself.

If you are planning on putting it in the stock location I would suggest going with the 2.5" core. I got the 2" inlet/outlet and when I took it to get installed they had to spread the inlet/outlet apart to allow it to slide over the exhaust piping. So if you just get the 2.25" inlet/outlet you would skip that step and save some money on the shop expanding them.

-Mark

aznboi2424

iTrader: (10)

alright cool. ill a couple of exhaust shops to see if they also suggest the 2.25".

the thing im worried about with the 2.5" core is that i dont want droning. you think it will drone or it will be ok? and yours only drones cause you put yours so close to your cat?

bigmark89

Im pretty sure that the only reason it drones is becuz its so close to the cat, I think if its in the stock location there wouldnt be any drone. But im not 100% sure about it, and its honestly not worth the money to do the 2" core in the stock location cuz the sound difference would be very minimal.

If you wanna play it safe, I say you get the 2" core and put it in the stock location, if it isnt loud enough then relocate it closer to the cat. Its gonna cost you more money in installation cuz your gonna be paying for 2 installations if you decide to take this route and end up switching the location a 2nd time.

But I truely think that a 2" core mounted a further up from the stock location, closer to the cat but not as close as I put mine would give you the sound your looking for.

Good Luck with whatever you decide to do
And remember that its about taking a chance, I was the first person here to do that to my exhaust and I didnt know what it would sound like, but I tried it and I loved the results.

-Mark

sinfulj32

there is nothing wrong with your car. i would not spend more money trying to fix it either.

our ecu is very sophisticated and will constantly cylce and adjust and we dont have any way to stop it. it never did it much before because you didnt have all the bolt ons you do now. now that your motor is breathing alot more air, the ecu tries to compensate for the added air by adjusting fuel and worst of all pulling timing. the timing pull is what you are feeling and you wont be able to avoid it, especially because there isnt any device to adjust ignition timing on our motor.

just drive the car.

pretty soon the car will pull again, you might even have some days where the car will pull really hard. on the other hand some days where it wont pull hard just as you explained.

it is one of the downsides of our cars but you'll eventually learn to gauge it. believe me it happens to the best of us.. im guessing you dont put alot of miles on your car, hence the reason the power hasnt come back yet. i tend to put alot of miles on my car therefore i see it happening more often.

aznboi2424

iTrader: (10)

Thanks for the help Mark. I think im gonna go with the 2.5" core. it should reduce the amount of drone that you talk about, while making an improvement over stock. the thing im worried about is getting the 2" core and it will sound stock. at least if the 2.5" drones a little, i could live with it or sell it easier then the 2".
I'll be tackling this during summer time.

bigmark89

Shit.... So pretty much what ur saying is that with my mods I was running leaner than stock so the ecu is adjusting itself to run richer, therefore reducing my power. And the ecu pulls timing when the car run lean to help prevent detonation?

Wouldnt a standalone override this? And be able to stay at the most beneficial A/F ratio? And by having the standalon control the A/F ratios, would that keep the stock ecu from pulling timing?

Thnx
-Mark

bigmark89

Your Welcome dude But yea, i think you'll be fine with a 2.5" core in the stock location

GL with it
-Mark

aznboi2424

iTrader: (10)

thanks, if i remember, ill let you know how it goes.
did you try the IMRC ping test yet?

bigmark89

I actually swapped mine with the one off my moms TL-S and took it for a spin. Even in the rain I definitely felt a difference, the car kept pulling all the way through 2nd gear where before, it pulled through 1st and then really felt sluggish after about 4000rpm in 2nd. So im pretty sure my IMRC wasnt working under load

-Mark

aznboi2424

iTrader: (10)

glad you solved your problem.

i dunno why it would work for this one but not your old one. they both flipped at 3800 when you revved it up

bigmark89

I was thinking the same thing, but maybe its like sinfulj32 said and it cycled today and pulled hard. Im just pissed that theres no controlling this 'cycle' that the ecu does, especially when it pulls timing

-Mark

fuzzy02CLS

iTrader: (2)

I don't agree with that. While true the car's ECU will learn new mappings for the additional power. Your car is not going to just feel flat, & then come & go.

If that was the case why do I dyno stock 216 & then 250 with my mods?
Why does my car feel so much more powerful then a stock car at all times?
My car never is sluggish & my power never just comes & goes. It's my daily & I drive it hard.

aznboi2424

iTrader: (10)

maybe its phycological (sp?) but i dont think switching out IMRC will do anything unless your other one didnt flip, which it did.

maybe you should dyno with the old IMRC and the new IMRC. :bulb:

poisx7

iTrader: (1)

THAT WILL BE THE NEXT LOGICAL OPTION.
TRY it if the $$$ i$ there........................................

sinfulj32

well if you changed the imrc and its way different, then your imrc probably was bust.

aznboi2424

iTrader: (10)

i still dont see how it "was broken" if it flipped at 3800.

Accord_V6_400m

iTrader: (1)

You guys just zip tie the IMRC that is supposedly broken open and see what happens, the loss in low end will make the difference feel that much greater too, since its open below 3800rpm, which isn't what your going for but just judge how it feels after 4000rpm regardless of how it feels before the open mode.

BigLizard

In checking the IMRC, you also have to make sure the cable is free moving when 3800 rpms hits. You can check that just by parking the car and keeping it in neutral while someone else checks to make sure the butterfly is opening and closing. The nut controls the tightness of the cable.

sinfulj32

+1