scalbert

I finally got the time to begin a port and polish (following in Mike's foot steps!!), along with port matching, of the intake manifold. I just got everything off including the injector bases. Pics are below of the tear down only. I will probably begin some of the porting tonight and finish it up tomorrow. Additional pics will follow.

But from what you can see below there is plenty of benefit to polishing. It is rough in there with plenty casting marks.

The following pics are of the V portion of the engine without the manifold in place:





Here is a close up of one of the head intake ports; you can see the two intake valves in there pretty clearly:



All of the parts on my garage floor:



Rear Injector Base:



Close up an injector base port; notice the rough surface and the casting marks:



Intake Manifold:



Close Up of the entry to the intake manifold from where the throttle body would attach; again, notice the casting marks:



Entrance into the front chamber:



One of the passages to the center plenum:



Runner entrance:



Close up of the Runner outlet to the injector base:



Bottom of the intake manifold where it attaches to the injector bases:



That is it, as if that wasn't enough, for now. I'll start a new thread on the during and after pics that another on putting everything back together. But the tear down was pretty easy, just over an hour. I expect the porting to take about two to three hours and then an hour to put it back together. So it could be done in an afternoon.

I did buy all new gaskets which cost me about $80 and then about $50 on various grit cartridge rolls. So for an afternoon's work and less than $150 you can easily do this your self. But you will need a good compressor and an air grinder...

astro

wow, I think I'll tackle it myself Steve...thanks for the pictorial!

acur8ly

iTrader: (1)

What kind of gains do u expect from doing this?

scalbert

I really have no clue, that will be determined though. I would hope for about 10 - 15 WHP, which I would be pleased with. If it is more, then all the better...

Zapata

Dumb observation..... porting and extrude/hone. What is the difference. I know what each does but are they the same thing?

scalbert

They end up doing the same thing, smoothing out the passages to allow for easier and greater flow. The hand porting and polishing is manual and the extrude honing is an automated process.

BTW, it is thought that extrude honing is better in general. But if care is taked and the work done diligently, a hand porting and loishing can acheive the same results. It just takes time...

allmotor_2000

From your time to dismantle, it seems the removal is pretty straightforward - any hiccups or pointers for the procedure?

Are you doing anything to the Throttle-Body?? Any enlargement would necessitate a bigger butterfly-valve - or are you leaving that as it is?

I think if/when you add the S/C, gains will be very impressive.

I have thought about this, but might go with Extrude Honing instead of the p/p.

Do you see any significant size difference between the runner diameter and the intake port?

Is it me... or does it look like there are velocity-stacks (like a venturi plate) on the intake runner (towards the plenum-side)?

scalbert

It was pretty easy. There were only two small issues; the TB gasket stuck the two together pretty well requiring them to be pried apart. The other was one of the bolts on the injector bases. It was the one all the way to passenger side on the front injector base. It is fairly well hidden and was a biatch to get out. But other than that everything was very easy.

I'm leaving the TB alone right now. I am considering shaping it a little at the outlet to match up with the manifold; but that would be all. I am not equipped to make a new throttle plate...

The runner ports all the way from the manifold, injector base to the head ports matched up pretty well. I'll touch them up a bit along with match the gaskets but there won't be too much to do here.

There are, what the manual calls, funnels at the entrance to the runners from the font and rear chamber. Is this what you are referring to??

Zapata

scalbert,
Thanks for the answer. I figured as much. How much untapped power do you think will be release as result of the work?

Mike

Nice pics Steve. Are you going to P&P the center plenum? That one bolt on the inject base was pretty tough to get at.

btw, my gas mileage has go to hell in a hand basket. can't keep my foot from burying the throttle but still...it's drinking like a frat boy

KavexTrax

Wow nice pics, especially in comparison to Mike's pics of his smoother-than-a-baby's-butt intake manifold chambers

Mike

same pic better lighting

scalbert

And much better camera!!!

Why did you pulls off the valve covers??

About polishing up the center chamber, I am planning on it. Not that I would see anything to be had from it; but since it is off and I have extra catridge rolls, I might as well.

xenon7

scalbert,
Looks like your are clearly on your way to some extra hp
and intake flow.
What gaskets did you end up changing? I was surpised to see 80 bones total- I usally get raped on gaskets from the dealer.

BTW, I agree in terms of doing the final "hand polishing". It's
kind of like a jewler with that unfinished 2ct diamond.

scalbert

I purchase six gaskets total just in case. The throttle body gasket, the front and rear chamber to intake manifold gaskets, the manifold to injector bases gaskets and then the front and rear injector base to head gaskets.

It ended up being more than I expected; averaging about $14 per gasket. Plus, it looks like I could reuse some of the metal gaskets as my car has only 2700 miles on it right now. But I decided to play it safe and get gaskets.

Mike

I pulled the valve covers off b/c I was going to send the heads to Extrude, but my mechanic ran out of time.

ahh....that's probably a good thing....gas mileage being as sucky as it is.

Mike

Btw, I talked to a guy who builds racing engines. He said to leave the rear injector base rough in order to atomize the air into the heads.

scalbert

I question this a little. The injectors shoot into the heads, not the injector base. They practically shoot onto the back of the intake valves. This is where the swirl will occur as air enters the cylinder.

My thoughts are that the increased velocity will help the swirl effect as both air and fuel is pulled into the cylinder thus allowing for greater atomization.

But just my $0.02, I'll try it anyway just for the experience. Who knows, it might end up working out for the better.

Mike

Cool, I was just passing that tidbit along.

Btw, what tools are you going to use for the P&P? Post some pics of the tools and materials. It would also be nice to see the work as the manifold becomes progressively smoother.

ps:upgrade your camera

scalbert

Absolutely, and I welcome any input like that. Sometimes you just have to try something to beleive it. Plus, if it does turn out for the negative then I can certainly get just the bases and swap them out.

To help with some shaping I'll use a carbide tipped bit. But for the most part I will use standard aluminum-oxide cartridge rolls for 80% of the work ranging in grit from 80 - 320. I'll end with some polishing using flap wheels at about 600 grit.

http://www.mscdirect.com/PDF.process?pdf=873

scalbert

heheh, yea I know. It is actually a DV camera so the quality is as expected. I'll suck it up soon and get a real digital still camera. But my wife primarily uses here nice Nikon which has caused the delay, lack of need...

corpsdawg

Yup, i'm bringing back a very old thread. How many people have ported and polished their intake (lower and upper)? Any noticeable or measurable gains?

CivicB18B1

iTrader: (2)

i would like to know too

nbennettksu

iTrader: (2)

I picked up a cl-s upper IM, along with a 03 6spd TB... had them both sent off to get bored out/port/polish, and yes, noticeable gains... coming from a cl-p

jproy

I did it but I dont know what the gains were.

corpsdawg

I've heard different stories about the degree of difficulty of doing P&P yourself. I have all the tools, but has anyone done this themselves? Also, for those of you who sent yours off, what was about the cost and time to have them done?

typeR

i did mine along with eliminate the vsa , and sent out the thrttle body ... this is the type of mod that should be done near the end of all other mods

corpsdawg

Well i plan on staying NA, so if i had intake, headers, spacers and pulleys would this gain a significant amount? I may also consider getting the P2R plenums. How much did a shop charge you for the P&P? Did you send your TB off to kingmotorsport?

NSXNEXT

iTrader: (2)

IMO the cost to hp is soooo not worth it. I would guess maybe 5 hp gain. Are you also p&p the lowers? I did my lowers and it wasn't that hard to do. I used a combination of dremel and air tools.

Sinister5

cant wait to put mines on...... SHOTS OUT TO P2R RACING ON THIS ONE!!

corpsdawg

oh wow. How much did that run you? Tell us when you install them and how they feel

Sinister5

lol I lost count, I just remember that the spare upper IM and TB cost me $265 in the Black Market.

nbennettksu

iTrader: (2)

wtfuck you waiting on?

Sinister5

Doing a "special build", waiting for some parts to come from honda before she gets "open heart surgery"

nbennettksu

iTrader: (2)

badass, I was planning on doing hat. just couldnt wait any longer

Sinister5

shoot it took me like 2 months to get all that. Just take your time. While I took my time I ended up deciding to go with a whole new set up in addition to this so when Im done I will probally be the only one with my "special set up".

rjurado_1215

special project? ive done it already

Sinister5

what have you done?

SlickShiftNall6

iTrader: (4)

Sinister5- You had P2R p&p the whole upper intake mainfold, as well as the tb, and runners? Thats what its looks like. Please, Please do a dyno. I was looking into this as my next mods. Thanks.

sinfulj32

i port/polished the upper, no difference. maybe if the lower were done also